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MacArthur/Grabbo played least minutes last night.Bench them for play-off opener?

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04-21-2013, 10:57 AM
  #51
ITM
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Grabovski has had to deal with a number of issues that have likely proved overwhelming in their aggregate. I'm not buying a Grabo/Carlyle rift. I think both understand what's going on -- whatever it is. And I think both have matured past petty behaviours that may have had reality in Montreal and Anaheim...but not in Toronto.

I think Carlyle is managing the bench just fine, and I think the atmosphere of a Toronto biting at the bit to get into the playoffs coupled with this city's fever pushing them on, MacArthur and Grabovski (and the kind of passionate, enthusiastic, physical play they're capable of) could turn out to be catalysts.

Besides, those old ghosts of worry and fear have been left behind, right?



Forth, Leafs Nation.

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04-21-2013, 10:58 AM
  #52
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Originally Posted by thatshype View Post
Who's sitting besides them, though? Hamilton? Do we have any other forwards in the pressbox currently?
Frattin/Colborne.

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04-21-2013, 10:58 AM
  #53
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I don't care I won't wave credentials around or say much more, I will just let you kids watch it play out this team sucks defensively except on the PK. With proper management and acquisitions it could be a contender though.

Needed was legit 2d ie. JBo, 3D and a Kipper type tender even if in backup capacity, with a legit 2c or 1c to replace Bozak up top.

I post from phone exclusively it's not easy

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04-21-2013, 11:04 AM
  #54
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Originally Posted by ITM View Post
Grabovski has had to deal with a number of issues that have likely proved overwhelming in their aggregate. I'm not buying a Grabo/Carlyle rift. I think both understand what's going on -- whatever it is. And I think both have matured past petty behaviours that may have had reality in Montreal and Anaheim...but not in Toronto.

I think Carlyle is managing the bench just fine, and I think the atmosphere of a Toronto biting at the bit to get into the playoffs coupled with this city's fever pushing them on, MacArthur and Grabovski (and the kind of passionate, enthusiastic, physical play they're capable of) could turn out to be catalysts.

Besides, those old ghosts of worry and fear have been left behind, right?



Forth, Leafs Nation.
Carlyle is about 10 games behind the beat of his team. See the Holzer experiment and corresponding slump, See recent Grabo elevated play and lack of reward to play him with mates to succeed also currently winning put outplayed largely relying only on Reims.

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04-21-2013, 11:08 AM
  #55
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Originally Posted by theremedial View Post
I don't care I won't wave credentials around or say much more, I will just let you kids watch it play out this team sucks defensively except on the PK. With proper management and acquisitions it could be a contender though.

Needed was legit 2d ie. JBo, 3D and a Kipper type tender even if in backup capacity, with a legit 2c or 1c to replace Bozak up top.

I post from phone exclusively it's not easy
You just added like 20 million to the payroll with those additions and earlier you were talking about not playing Komisarek to get a draft pick as poor asset management and in turn crippling our development and future. How do you go about acquiring all those pieces (1c, 2d, 3d, 2g) and not give up our future??

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04-21-2013, 11:14 AM
  #56
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Originally Posted by theremedial View Post
Carlyle is about 10 games behind the beat of his team. See the Holzer experiment and corresponding slump, See recent Grabo elevated play and lack of reward to play him with mates to succeed also currently winning put outplayed largely relying only on Reims.
I don't think that's the timber of Carlyle's management though - not rewarding for a game or two or excessively rewarding for games well-played.

After the Reimer win against Montreal and asked to comment on Reimer's great play, I think Carlyle nipped the tone of effsuive praise in the bud by saying (paraphrased), "Goalies are supposed to stop pucks." Obviously implying, credit where credit is due, but let's cut the drama, this is professional hockey...That's the expected level of professionalism.

I agree. Nothing more and nothing less. Pats on the back when needed. But I'm not about to criticize when we have a spot clinched. Something went wrong I guess, Remedial...

We're in the playoffs

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04-21-2013, 11:15 AM
  #57
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You just added like 20 million to the payroll with those additions and earlier you were talking about not playing Komisarek to get a draft pick as poor asset management and in turn crippling our development and future. How do you go about acquiring all those pieces without (1c, 2d, 3d, 2g) and not give up our future??
Komisarek was great under this system, everyone saw it who really watched the games. That there could have been a 2nd or upgrade at deadline. Connolly whatever you could have maybe squeezed him in in case of injury but whatever. I wouldn't care about playoffs this year if I were the Leafs he made it but many assets got devalued in the process, ones that could have been traded to make a contender going forth. Frattin Gards and Grabos values are way down now and Connolly Komisarek Mac are worthless while Bozak is only worth what you pay him.

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04-21-2013, 11:18 AM
  #58
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Clarke needs to get angry he played much better when he was on edge, he's not the worst just doesnt play to his pay

Grabo is still a good player just doesnt really fit on this team , replace him with Dave Bolland

Bozak ( as long as he doesnt want the 5m plus that Dreger runoured)
Kadri
Bolland
McClememt
That sounds more like a playoff mentality than regular season.

The leafs have had a good regular without a lot of scoring contribution from these guys. I wouldn't want to play Toronto in the first round of the playoffs.

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04-21-2013, 11:19 AM
  #59
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If thats your belief fine and dandy bro. Carlyle seems to differ is his thinking and i certainly don't buy that for one minute.

Mac 1 point last 13 games and Grabo has 2 points in the last 12 games. They need to be sent a message that its not acceptable i think.
RC around 10 games left last year, made some changes in the way we played. He said we would not only depend on scoring on the rush but by an effective dump and chase game. All these advanced stats guys that proclaim puck possession as the golden stat do no notice how Crosby plays, or even how the good teams do. The puck is not on Crosby's stick for a second before he finds someone open and makes an extraordinary play.

Grabo is incapable of adjusting his game to this approach, last 10 games of last year we went to a more dump and chase system, and Grabo has been lost since. He's just a guy that skates 100MPH without a clue what he is doing out there, I was reading the GDT last night from posters that said good shift Grabo, but at the end of the puck possession or puck hogging he just gave the puck away. That's not good puck management, you dump it in deep and start the cycle again. He and Mac are clearly not getting the message of what Carlyle's system demands, safe mins, and dumping it deep.

The result, in the most important game of the year, was a benching in the 3rd period. Clearly their value to the team are one of in and outers, closer to 'Out' at the end of the season I surmise.

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04-21-2013, 11:23 AM
  #60
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That sounds more like a playoff mentality than regular season.

The leafs have had a good regular without a lot of scoring contribution from these guys. I wouldn't want to play Toronto in the first round of the playoffs.
I would most playoff teams got better the leafs suck defensively,they are incomplete and for that alone when good teams play with playoff intensity against them defensively they will probably be a couple steps behin the play. Gunner is great normally and he is still 2nd best on the team with that hip, that alone is a problem. If we lose Gunner to injury in a hard playoff everything else crumbles soon after.

Word to the wise 1st round opposition, play gunner hard put him out thereby exposing Phaneuf and walk the rest of the way. It's that easy tactically to defeat the leafs because the depth at D they have defeats them the rest of the way.

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04-21-2013, 11:30 AM
  #61
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I would most playoff teams got better the leafs suck defensively,they are incomplete and for that alone when good teams play with playoff intensity against them defensively they will probably be a couple steps behin the play. Gunner is great normally and he is still 2nd best on the team with that hip, that alone is a problem. If we lose Gunner to injury in a hard playoff everything else crumbles soon after.

Word to the wise 1st round opposition, play gunner hard put him out thereby exposing Phaneuf and walk the rest of the way. It's that easy tactically to defeat the leafs because the depth at D they have defeats them the rest of the way.
You celebrate 4:20 to much or what?

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04-21-2013, 11:32 AM
  #62
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Originally Posted by leafspring View Post
You celebrate 4:20 to much or what?
Just wait you'll see. Do you remember what playoff hockey even is?

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04-21-2013, 11:35 AM
  #63
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You celebrate 4:20 to much or what?
Armchair Coach's cannot be happy for what has worked this year, but let's put Grabo the black hole with Kessel mentality because a Stanley Cup winning coach doesn't know better. Give your head a shake at times when I post here.

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04-21-2013, 11:39 AM
  #64
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Armchair Coach's cannot be happy for what has worked this year, but let's put Grabo the black hole with Kessel mentality because a Stanley Cup winning coach doesn't know better. Give your head a shake at times when I post here.
We will just see what the "sports writers" say and coaches do to the leafs come first round. Unless Reims stands on his head or they out score the defensive issues it won't be pretty.

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04-21-2013, 11:44 AM
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Just wait you'll see. Do you remember what playoff hockey even is?
I can remember the last time i forgot bro.

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04-21-2013, 11:46 AM
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We will just see what the "sports writers" say and coaches do to the leafs come first round. Unless Reims stands on his head or they out score the defensive issues it won't be pretty.
Seriously though, Carlyle just expressed teams have keyed in on some things he was using successfully this season and changes are coming.

Its adjustment time i guess for lack of a better term.

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04-21-2013, 11:48 AM
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I can remember the last time i forgot bro.
Make you a friendly bet Gunner is played hard and dirty come first round. Also Reims is run a few times and the opposition will do anything to get their top line on against Bozak and Kessel, Just remember those things.

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04-21-2013, 11:51 AM
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Make you a friendly bet Gunner is played hard and dirty come first round. Also Reims is run a few times and the opposition will do anything to get their top line on against Bozak and Kessel, Just remember those things.
Yes, it's called playing hockey.

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04-21-2013, 11:55 AM
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I'm usually not one for ad hominems, but it honestly feels like we have a quasi-literate Glenn Healy in this thread...

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04-21-2013, 11:58 AM
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Yes, it's called playing hockey.
Thanks for coming out, at put my opinions out there and I back my claims in bold. I am don't mince words I say what I think and how I think things will pan out. The Leafs are flat out too weak on the back end to do anything. They made the playoffs fantastic feel good short story. I am happy as well, just, I have little expectations since the deadline and Nonis did Fack all to better a team on D who has 3 PPG guys up front, shameful inaction. I have not seen a Leafs team with 3 PPG guys in my life and to not go for it and make some deals was a bad decision.

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04-21-2013, 12:02 PM
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I'm usually not one for ad hominems, but it honestly feels like we have a quasi-literate Glenn Healy in this thread...
Go Leafs Go we are the best team lets win the cup wooooo party. I am on a phone and don't care about that crap no time.

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04-21-2013, 12:03 PM
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Make you a friendly bet Gunner is played hard and dirty come first round. Also Reims is run a few times and the opposition will do anything to get their top line on against Bozak and Kessel, Just remember those things.
Its a culmination. They have been owned to a degree that is extreme these last few games i know. They have a style that allows shots from the perimeter though as a concept of the system. Yes, it has been a concern to me also.

I'll take that bet and raise you a cheer.

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04-21-2013, 12:17 PM
  #73
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Its a culmination. They have been owned to a degree that is extreme these last few games i know. They have a style that allows shots from the perimeter though as a concept of the system. Yes, it has been a concern to me also.

I'll take that bet and raise you a cheer.
I want them to do well, I do and think Burke if here would have made moves at the deadline. Nonis was fired from Vancouver because of this stuff, ask on their boards. He is a little too cautious for my liking. We really needed help at D bad. It's not all perimeter shots, it's also unsuccessful long pass in the neutral zone. They played best at short game utilizing burst speed to penetrate the zone. Grabo and Kessel are masters of this but Grabs is out of the equation playing with nobodies in particular. Kadri and Lupul are also great but that's about it. It's almost sickening watching they terrible cycle habits. No winger around the boards on the opposite side hinging, electing to sit high. We lose possession constantly that way / cross ice passes and wayyyyy to many fancy behind the back bs. They need back to the basics as they getting back to their pond hockey roots.

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04-21-2013, 12:40 PM
  #74
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I want them to do well, I do and think Burke if here would have made moves at the deadline. Nonis was fired from Vancouver because of this stuff, ask on their boards. He is a little too cautious for my liking. We really needed help at D bad. It's not all perimeter shots, it's also unsuccessful long pass in the neutral zone. They played best at short game utilizing burst speed to penetrate the zone. Grabo and Kessel are masters of this but Grabs is out of the equation playing with nobodies in particular. Kadri and Lupul are also great but that's about it. It's almost sickening watching they terrible cycle habits. No winger around the boards on the opposite side hinging, electing to sit high. We lose possession constantly that way / cross ice passes and wayyyyy to many fancy behind the back bs. They need back to the basics as they getting back to their pond hockey roots.
I see that stuff too and the lack of pressure forcheck has gotten to the point where it completely goes away for extended stretches in the game. The system has been adjusted to by other teams also. They get that out of sync at times they only adjust when they get back after a intermission. I see all that stuff and more too.You are absolutely right to contend that you can't have such a large dependancy on your goalie.

Wrinkles have shown that need to be addressed.

Nonis for his part has some significant cap options available that some teams in the play-off company would give their right toe for though.Nonis said he would be patient and most were/seemed cool with that. Being a first crack in years organization play-off team with the draft/develope/promote option standing prominent seems like i great idea to me.

You like your asset management respected also by your comments on Carlyle possibly minimizing their potential by not playing them or demoting certain players.Nonis has been protecting assets management for you and we succeeded in obtaining a play-off spot.

The bigger picture will become clearer with this play-off giving another level to evaluate.

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04-21-2013, 12:47 PM
  #75
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I see that stuff too and the lack of pressure forcheck has gotten to the point where it completely goes away for extended stretches in the game. The system has been adjusted to by other teams also. They get that out of sync at times they only adjust when they get back after a intermission. I see all that stuff and more too.You are absolutely right to contend that you can't have such a large dependancy on your goalie.

Wrinkles have shown that need to be addressed.

Nonis for his part has some significant cap options available that some teams in the play-off company would give their right toe for though.Nonis said he would be patient and most were/seemed cool with that. Being a first crack in years organization play-off team with the draft/develope/promote option standing prominent seems like i great idea to me.

You like your asset management respected also by your comments on Carlyle possibly minimizing their potential by not playing them or demoting certain players.Nonis has been protecting assets management for you and we succeeded in obtaining a play-off spot.

The bigger picture will become clearer with this play-off giving another level to evaluate.
I accept this, thanks for putting it in words people who don't understand cell phone.

It will be a good test to see what they need to do in the future. I really just hate losing assets for below value because you have to try and make it in other ways or else other teams out improve you.

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