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Tatar with a Gordie Howe hat trick

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Old
05-05-2013, 10:37 AM
  #1
yave1964
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Tatar with a Gordie Howe hat trick

Nice game for the Griffins last night, a 7-0 romp over Houston. In the game Tomas Tatar led the way with two goals, an assist and a fight in the third period. Which begs the question:

Why is he in Grand Rapids in the first place? He is a man among boys, unlike Brunner or Nyquist he can and will mix it up, does he have bad breath or something? Did he say something mean about Babcocks wife? I just don't get it.

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05-05-2013, 10:46 AM
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Originally Posted by yave1964 View Post
Nice game for the Griffins last night, a 7-0 romp over Houston. In the game Tomas Tatar led the way with two goals, an assist and a fight in the third period. Which begs the question:

Why is he in Grand Rapids in the first place? He is a man among boys, unlike Brunner or Nyquist he can and will mix it up, does he have bad breath or something? Did he say something mean about Babcocks wife? I just don't get it.
Daniel needs his minutes.

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05-05-2013, 10:51 AM
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Originally Posted by yave1964 View Post
Nice game for the Griffins last night, a 7-0 romp over Houston. In the game Tomas Tatar led the way with two goals, an assist and a fight in the third period. Which begs the question:

Why is he in Grand Rapids in the first place? He is a man among boys, unlike Brunner or Nyquist he can and will mix it up, does he have bad breath or something? Did he say something mean about Babcocks wife? I just don't get it.
It's the breath.

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05-05-2013, 10:53 AM
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No question he should in the NHL next year. He's waited long enough and he's been very productive in the AHL. Plus, he was solid when he was up this year. You don't want players dictating their own terms but you also don't want teams being too stuck in their ways and basically let talent waste away.

This team seems to value experience with diminished skills over untapped potential. Who here would rather see an old ass Dan Cleary or Mikael Samuelsson playing over a guy like Tatar? I can't imagine there are many if any. This can't continue. If this year and last year are the kind of playoff runs (or lack there of) they're trying to preserve just so the streak doesn't, they're wasting our time.

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05-05-2013, 11:21 AM
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No question he should in the NHL next year. He's waited long enough and he's been very productive in the AHL. Plus, he was solid when he was up this year. You don't want players dictating their own terms but you also don't want teams being too stuck in their ways and basically let talent waste away.

This team seems to value experience with diminished skills over untapped potential. Who here would rather see an old ass Dan Cleary or Mikael Samuelsson playing over a guy like Tatar? I can't imagine there are many if any. This can't continue. If this year and last year are the kind of playoff runs (or lack there of) they're trying to preserve just so the streak doesn't, they're wasting our time.
I agree with what you're saying. But to the bolded part, why not?


Last edited by GoAwayDanCleary: 05-05-2013 at 11:58 AM.
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05-05-2013, 11:45 AM
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I am not sure how Tatar was going to change the result last night, but at least the OP mentioned Tatar, over Nyquist and Brunner.

Does the team really need Nyquist AND Brunner AND Tatar in the line up?

When 8 took himself off last night, a lot of people go their wish. Nyquist and Brunner (and yes 37) got shifts with Z & D. Did it make a difference.

As near as I can tell 13, 40 and whoever was rotating in did not register a single shot (either on goal or missed).

Everyone loves to dog Clearly and yes he is 2 steps slower than he used to be, and is not the ideal net presence guy, but he eats up a lot of minutes against tough competition without being a liability, which in turn allows you to try and gain an edge on the 3rd line with a different look or feel.

With a healthy Helm and/or Bertuzzi then maybe we can let 11 sit in the press box. But given what MB has to work with at this point, I don't see anyone stepping up and taking the minutes and competition that Cleary is without being a potential big liability.

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05-05-2013, 11:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Shoalzie View Post
No question he should in the NHL next year. He's waited long enough and he's been very productive in the AHL. Plus, he was solid when he was up this year. You don't want players dictating their own terms but you also don't want teams being too stuck in their ways and basically let talent waste away.

This team seems to value experience with diminished skills over untapped potential. Who here would rather see an old ass Dan Cleary or Mikael Samuelsson playing over a guy like Tatar? I can't imagine there are many if any. This can't continue. If this year and last year are the kind of playoff runs (or lack there of) they're trying to preserve just so the streak doesn't, they're wasting our time.
Bang on.

I think this team team has been wasting a lot of people's time in recent years -- especially the prospects' time

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05-05-2013, 11:53 AM
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Originally Posted by TKB View Post
I am not sure how Tatar was going to change the result last night, but at least the OP mentioned Tatar, over Nyquist and Brunner.

Does the team really need Nyquist AND Brunner AND Tatar in the line up?

When 8 took himself off last night, a lot of people go their wish. Nyquist and Brunner (and yes 37) got shifts with Z & D. Did it make a difference.

As near as I can tell 13, 40 and whoever was rotating in did not register a single shot (either on goal or missed).

Everyone loves to dog Clearly and yes he is 2 steps slower than he used to be, and is not the ideal net presence guy, but he eats up a lot of minutes against tough competition without being a liability, which in turn allows you to try and gain an edge on the 3rd line with a different look or feel.

With a healthy Helm and/or Bertuzzi then maybe we can let 11 sit in the press box. But given what MB has to work with at this point, I don't see anyone stepping up and taking the minutes and competition that Cleary is without being a potential big liability.
Such faulty logic.

You play the best roster you possibly can, under most circumstances.

This has become a team that has good young talent to put in there, which has been better than the veteran talent. Eaves? Sammuelsson? Cleary?

It's not like these guys have to displace Robataille, Larionov, and Draper.

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05-05-2013, 11:59 AM
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Originally Posted by TKB View Post
I am not sure how Tatar was going to change the result last night, but at least the OP mentioned Tatar, over Nyquist and Brunner.

Does the team really need Nyquist AND Brunner AND Tatar in the line up?

When 8 took himself off last night, a lot of people go their wish. Nyquist and Brunner (and yes 37) got shifts with Z & D. Did it make a difference.

As near as I can tell 13, 40 and whoever was rotating in did not register a single shot (either on goal or missed).

Everyone loves to dog Clearly and yes he is 2 steps slower than he used to be, and is not the ideal net presence guy, but he eats up a lot of minutes against tough competition without being a liability, which in turn allows you to try and gain an edge on the 3rd line with a different look or feel.

With a healthy Helm and/or Bertuzzi then maybe we can let 11 sit in the press box. But given what MB has to work with at this point, I don't see anyone stepping up and taking the minutes and competition that Cleary is without being a potential big liability.
I think you're dead wrong.
guys like Cleary ARE a liability on scoring lines. I can deal with Cleary as the netfront guy on a 2nd PP unit.

But he's a play killer at 5-on-5.


If Abdelkader is suspended -- here's the line up I want for game 3 (with no Tatar, because I don't think this team is going to call him up, though they should.

Bertuzzi Datsyuk Brunner --
Nyquist Zetterberg Samuelsson
Filppula Franzen Cleary
Eaves Emmerton Tootoo

If Bert can't handle it --- Bump Cleary up to line one and Bert to line 3. or 4

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05-05-2013, 12:09 PM
  #10
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Originally Posted by yave1964 View Post
Nice game for the Griffins last night, a 7-0 romp over Houston. In the game Tomas Tatar led the way with two goals, an assist and a fight in the third period. Which begs the question:

Why is he in Grand Rapids in the first place? He is a man among boys, unlike Brunner or Nyquist he can and will mix it up, does he have bad breath or something? Did he say something mean about Babcocks wife? I just don't get it.
Is there youtube?

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05-05-2013, 12:09 PM
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Originally Posted by TKB View Post
I am not sure how Tatar was going to change the result last night, but at least the OP mentioned Tatar, over Nyquist and Brunner.

Does the team really need Nyquist AND Brunner AND Tatar in the line up?

When 8 took himself off last night, a lot of people go their wish. Nyquist and Brunner (and yes 37) got shifts with Z & D. Did it make a difference.

As near as I can tell 13, 40 and whoever was rotating in did not register a single shot (either on goal or missed).

Everyone loves to dog Clearly and yes he is 2 steps slower than he used to be, and is not the ideal net presence guy, but he eats up a lot of minutes against tough competition without being a liability, which in turn allows you to try and gain an edge on the 3rd line with a different look or feel.

With a healthy Helm and/or Bertuzzi then maybe we can let 11 sit in the press box. But given what MB has to work with at this point, I don't see anyone stepping up and taking the minutes and competition that Cleary is without being a potential big liability.
he's a liability on both offense (obvious) and defense. many times this year the man he's supposed to cover is to quick for him, and when he is slightly out of position, he no longer has the wheels to make up for it. like stuart last year, his reputation is still carrying him. he is now a poor defensive player as well.

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05-05-2013, 12:11 PM
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Is there youtube?
Game highlights in the Griffins thread

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05-05-2013, 12:13 PM
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TKB
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Such faulty logic.

You play the best roster you possibly can, under most circumstances.

This has become a team that has good young talent to put in there, which has been better than the veteran talent. Eaves? Sammuelsson? Cleary?

It's not like these guys have to displace Robataille, Larionov, and Draper.
THe best roster is the one that you provides (or hopes) to provide your best edge in line match-ups.

If you lose a 1/2 goal spread (speculative and exaggerated, but making a point) by playing Cleary on the 2nd line, but gain a 3/4 goal spread by keeping scoring talent on 3rd line against lower competion....how is that not a better roster?


We can argue all day long about whether Cleary on 2nd line actually does this (Hell I don't even know that is does), but it amazes me that nobody sees (or admits to seeing ) the logic.

What is NOT debatable, is that the Wings have lived up to expectations, given the roster so I don't know how Babcock gets faulted.

Could they have done better? Possibly but again that is speculative. The Wings are in the playoffs and for now "on-serve" with the Ducks, thus you can not call MB's line-up choice a failure.

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05-05-2013, 12:20 PM
  #14
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Originally Posted by RedWingsNow View Post
I think you're dead wrong.
guys like Cleary ARE a liability on scoring lines. I can deal with Cleary as the netfront guy on a 2nd PP unit.

But he's a play killer at 5-on-5.


If Abdelkader is suspended -- here's the line up I want for game 3 (with no Tatar, because I don't think this team is going to call him up, though they should.

Bertuzzi Datsyuk Brunner --
Nyquist Zetterberg Samuelsson
Filppula Franzen Cleary
Eaves Emmerton Tootoo

If Bert can't handle it --- Bump Cleary up to line one and Bert to line 3. or 4
I don't mind the line-up, but you are taking out alot of PK time without Andersson. I know you have other s who can fill it, but if Andersson can take that time I think it is a big plus.

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05-05-2013, 12:23 PM
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Originally Posted by TKB View Post
THe best roster is the one that you provides (or hopes) to provide your best edge in line match-ups.

If you lose a 1/2 goal spread (speculative and exaggerated, but making a point) by playing Cleary on the 2nd line, but gain a 3/4 goal spread by keeping scoring talent on 3rd line against lower competion....how is that not a better roster?


We can argue all day long about whether Cleary on 2nd line actually does this (Hell I don't even know that is does), but it amazes me that nobody sees (or admits to seeing ) the logic.

What is NOT debatable, is that the Wings have lived up to expectations, given the roster so I don't know how Babcock gets faulted.

Could they have done better? Possibly but again that is speculative. The Wings are in the playoffs and for now "on-serve" with the Ducks, thus you can not call MB's line-up choice a failure.
Ah, ok.

So they made the playoffs and lived up to expectations.

No point in trying or winning anymore.

And yes, we understand that having a guy like Cleary WAS on the second line can be beneficial to the overall make up of the team. It's not right now, at least in my, and many others fans opinions. Add in the fact that he's out on the start of many PP's when a guy like Tatar could be, and it's pretty sad.

Hell, through this I'm not even saying Tatar SHOULD be in over Cleary, but he SHOULD be in over a guy like Sammy, who's not game shape, and Eaves, who brings no dynamic to the team. He should also be in over Emmerton, but Emmerton wins 1 of every 4 faceoffs and is from St. Thomas Ontario, so, that goes to show you why he's in.

Playoffs is all about depth scoring. Tatar brings that, and he's tenacious.

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05-05-2013, 12:23 PM
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I don't mind the line-up, but you are taking out alot of PK time without Andersson. I know you have other s who can fill it, but if Andersson can take that time I think it is a big plus.
Without a doubt Andersson is better than Emmerton.

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05-05-2013, 12:26 PM
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Originally Posted by yave1964 View Post
Nice game for the Griffins last night, a 7-0 romp over Houston. In the game Tomas Tatar led the way with two goals, an assist and a fight in the third period. Which begs the question:

Why is he in Grand Rapids in the first place? He is a man among boys, unlike Brunner or Nyquist he can and will mix it up, does he have bad breath or something? Did he say something mean about Babcocks wife? I just don't get it.
griffins dont' play til may 10. would love to see a nyquist-andy-tatar third line for game 4.

z-dats-brunner
clears-flip-franzen
nyquist-andy-tatar
eaves-emmerton-sammy

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05-05-2013, 01:04 PM
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I don't mind the line-up, but you are taking out alot of PK time without Andersson. I know you have other s who can fill it, but if Andersson can take that time I think it is a big plus.
Yeah, put Andersson in for Emmerton.
Not a big deal, IMO.
Andersson's PK protection was pretty bad on the first goal yesterday, but he has a faceoff advantage

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05-05-2013, 02:27 PM
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Yeah, put Andersson in for Emmerton.
Not a big deal, IMO.
Andersson's PK protection was pretty bad on the first goal yesterday, but he has a faceoff advantage
Guy has the weirdest stride I've ever seen. Seriously looks like he just learned to skate.

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05-05-2013, 02:49 PM
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Originally Posted by yave1964 View Post
Nice game for the Griffins last night, a 7-0 romp over Houston. In the game Tomas Tatar led the way with two goals, an assist and a fight in the third period. Which begs the question:

Why is he in Grand Rapids in the first place? He is a man among boys, unlike Brunner or Nyquist he can and will mix it up, does he have bad breath or something? Did he say something mean about Babcocks wife? I just don't get it.
Babs like his men thick. And Tatar just doesn't have that thickness that Babs digs.

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05-05-2013, 03:00 PM
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2 out of 3 games the Wings offense struggles. It's pretty clear that's a major issue. Tatar, while not a savior, has more offensive instincts than many. It's a shame he's not playing.

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05-05-2013, 04:04 PM
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simple answer- detroit is easy to play against

we make life very easy for other teams defncemen, in particular in the playoffs when the checking is so much tighter and everyone finishes every hit like you're suppossed to.

we simply lack the ability to lean on players and make life a living hell for them, make them scared to go into the corners, make them second guess their decisions and inevitably forcing them to make a mistake that we capitalize on

its been the same identifiable problem for 1000 days now, has been repeatedly pointed out by babcock and has bene deliberately and intentionally ignored.

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05-05-2013, 04:05 PM
  #23
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Figured this would turn into a he should be on the team thread and he should be.

But just so you know the AHL reviews all scoring plays. He didn't touch the puck on the rebound it was spiked away by an Aeros player then Pare scored. It was a generous home scorer so he is likely to lose the Gordie Howe hat trick because they will in all likelihood rescind his assist from last nights game.

Really everyone showed up, it was utter dominance top to bottom, Mrazek became just the 10th goalie in the history of the AHL (it's a long history too) to have a shutout in a winner take all game. Very impressive and Tatar played with the fire he showed when first called up for the first time in a little while good to see. The way he was hitting and the fight was a show for the Wings in my opinion, he was about as physical as I have seen him play, also more willing to play in the middle of the ice. Really an awesome game with everything on the line.

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05-05-2013, 04:07 PM
  #24
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Babs like his men thick. And Tatar just doesn't have that thickness that Babs digs.
That should be the theme of Flashy's next GDT

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05-05-2013, 04:19 PM
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Bang on.

I think this team team has been wasting a lot of people's time in recent years -- especially the prospects' time

I can understand if they don't want guys playing as 19 or 20 year olds. Datsyuk played at 23, Zetterberg at 22, Kronwall at 23...Tatar will be 23 next year. I think he's "ripe". Either play him or trade him.

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