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Where can Miller go?

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06-24-2013, 11:46 AM
  #426
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Originally Posted by Soapy3PO View Post
At the moment, the Sabres could improve everywhere. Defense was just an example, I wanted to know the Isles defensive prospects.
I agree. In fact, I'd say the team's biggest need isn't a position but positive possession players. They need guys who limit the puck being in their zone and increase the puck being in the opposing zone. There are different types of players who can contribute to that, from two-way defensemen who are sound defensively and move the puck to great forechecking wingers.

Our NHL roster and pipeline look fairly OK on paper at defense but we saw this group struggle horribly in reality. It's a bit different with Leopold and Regehr gone, Pysyk and others added... but still. We could easily stand an upgrade to the roster or pipeline.

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06-24-2013, 11:57 AM
  #427
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Originally Posted by Rob Paxon View Post
I agree. In fact, I'd say the team's biggest need isn't a position but positive possession players. They need guys who limit the puck being in their zone and increase the puck being in the opposing zone. There are different types of players who can contribute to that, from two-way defensemen who are sound defensively and move the puck to great forechecking wingers.

Our NHL roster and pipeline look fairly OK on paper at defense but we saw this group struggle horribly in reality. It's a bit different with Leopold and Regehr gone, Pysyk and others added... but still. We could easily stand an upgrade to the roster or pipeline.
I totally agree with the second part. Our defense isn't that bad when you look at the lineup on paper but when they get on the ice.. doesn't look so pretty. I mean we have Myers, a Calder trophy winning defenseman, Ehrhoff, who was good in his time for San Jose and Vancouver and Pysyk, a top prospect. What could go wrong?

We need an upgrade. I don't agree with a full rebuild in the first place and I would like a few defenseman who've already been around the league on this team.

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06-24-2013, 11:59 AM
  #428
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There is also some talk afoot that Luongo has stated he'll take the walk-away waiver option simple to go somewhere to play. I haven't read up on it all that much, but at a cursory glance, basically both parties agree to walk away from the deal. I'd be curious to see if Vancouver goes that route if they continue to find no one to take on that massive, massive deal.
It is possible...but that would be career suicide for Gillis,

He has stated all along that he will not move Luongo unless he adds a piece to the roster that can have an immediate impact. That might be a 3rd line player at this point...but it would be better than nothing.

Honestly, I think the Canucks should seriously be considering shopping Schneider. They will get much more for him and their window to win is now...not 5 years from now. Move Schneider to a team like Philly for Simmonds or Couturier. Move Edler for a top six winger to play with Kesler....profit.

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06-24-2013, 12:01 PM
  #429
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There is also some talk afoot that Luongo has stated he'll take the walk-away waiver option simple to go somewhere to play. I haven't read up on it all that much, but at a cursory glance, basically both parties agree to walk away from the deal. I'd be curious to see if Vancouver goes that route if they continue to find no one to take on that massive, massive deal.
Players need to be waived before they are bought out.

Interesting thought I just had when I typed that:

A team who has cap space could claim Briere. Couldn't they?

Why wouldn't the Islanders do something like this? Can't imagine Briere would be to happy about it. He is making $3M next season and $2M the year after, plus forgoes the freedom of choice that goes along with UFA.



Edit: I just assumed Islanders always gets to claim first (ie always behind us in the standings). My Sabre world will really get turned upside down if the Oilers ever finish in front of us.

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06-24-2013, 12:02 PM
  #430
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Michael Russo ‏@Russostrib 6m

Backstrom deal appears close with #mnwild http://www.startribune.com/sports/blogs/212775051.html

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06-24-2013, 12:03 PM
  #431
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Originally Posted by Beerz View Post
Michael Russo ‏@Russostrib 6m

Backstrom deal appears close with #mnwild http://www.startribune.com/sports/blogs/212775051.html
queue everyone mistakenly believing this improves Miller's trade value

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06-24-2013, 12:08 PM
  #432
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Originally Posted by Jame View Post
queue everyone mistakenly believing this improves Miller's trade value
Sorry, but there's no way the Bernier trade didn't help even if completely marginally. This obviously helps too, as long as Minnesota wouldn't have been interested anyhow, otherwise it requires a more complex market analysis.


Last edited by Paxon: 06-24-2013 at 12:21 PM.
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06-24-2013, 12:19 PM
  #433
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Try this one. Miller to St Louis for Halak and Ty Rattie. St Louis goes all in for one year. We deal with Halak for one year and get Rattie as a cookie.

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06-24-2013, 12:20 PM
  #434
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Originally Posted by toejam56 View Post
Try this one. Miller to St Louis for Halak and Ty Rattie. St Louis goes all in for one year. We deal with Halak for one year and get Rattie as a cookie.
Why in god's name are people trading Miller for other goalies? Get something that helps you build the cup winner down the road. You might as well just let him walk for this package.

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06-24-2013, 12:26 PM
  #435
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Originally Posted by Soapy3PO View Post
Ehrhoff, who was good in his time for San Jose and Vancouver
He has also been terrific as a Sabre, though you seem to be implying otherwise.

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06-24-2013, 12:26 PM
  #436
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Originally Posted by toejam56 View Post
Try this one. Miller to St Louis for Halak and Ty Rattie. St Louis goes all in for one year. We deal with Halak for one year and get Rattie as a cookie.
There are some legit concerns imo about how effectively Rattie can transfer his ridiculous WHL production to the NHL, but I'd definitely do this. It doesn't hurt that I've always really liked Halak, though right now he may have close to negative value due to what seems like will become chronic/degenerative injury issues. At any rate, he only has 2 years left on his deal IIRC which means he can help bridge the goaltender situation and if he gets hurt we're not really any worse off than the expected plan of Enroth+Hackett/Leggio.

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06-24-2013, 12:29 PM
  #437
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He has also been terrific as a Sabre, though you seem to be implying otherwise.
No, not at all. Ehrhoff has been one of my favorite players for a while now. I love the effort he puts in every game.

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06-24-2013, 12:31 PM
  #438
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Originally Posted by haseoke39 View Post
Why in god's name are people trading Miller for other goalies? Get something that helps you build the cup winner down the road. You might as well just let him walk for this package.
Ty Rattie is the return... the kid who's scored 231 points in his last 2 regular seasons in the WHL. Halak is necessary for the deal to work for St Louis, and he acts as a stopgap. It's not like Halak is costing us value in the return, he probably has close to neutral value. Add in a 3rd or something if it's necessary.

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06-24-2013, 12:33 PM
  #439
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Originally Posted by haseoke39 View Post
Why in god's name are people trading Miller for other goalies? Get something that helps you build the cup winner down the road. You might as well just let him walk for this package.
OK...Miller to St Louis for Rattie (nice prospect) and take Halak because it is what it costs to get Rattie.

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06-24-2013, 12:35 PM
  #440
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Originally Posted by toejam56 View Post
Try this one. Miller to St Louis for Halak and Ty Rattie. St Louis goes all in for one year. We deal with Halak for one year and get Rattie as a cookie.
Why would Buffalo want Halak? Enroth and Hackett are most likely our goalies next season.

I like Rattie though. Just get rid of Halak and ya got yourself a decent proposal IMO.

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06-24-2013, 12:41 PM
  #441
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Originally Posted by Soapy3PO View Post
Why would Buffalo want Halak? Enroth and Hackett are most likely our goalies next season.

I like Rattie though. Just get rid of Halak and ya got yourself a decent proposal IMO.
I includes Halak because St Louis would want to dump him as their bonus. Halak has one year left. Play him if he is capable...bury him in Rochester if you have to.

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06-24-2013, 01:01 PM
  #442
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Cross another team off: Minnesota re-signs Backstrom to a three-year deal.

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06-24-2013, 01:04 PM
  #443
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Originally Posted by Rob Paxon View Post
Sorry, but there's no way the Bernier trade didn't help even if completely marginally. This obviously helps too, as long as Minnesota wouldn't have been interested anyhow, otherwise it requires a more complex market analysis.
teams SIGNING old goalies
teams TRADING FOR young goalies

neither impact :
teams TRADING FOR old goalies (the least desirable path for any team)

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06-24-2013, 01:12 PM
  #444
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Miller
16th overall

for

Korpikoski
12th overall
Conditional 2nd (is PHX makes playoffs in 2013-14)

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06-24-2013, 01:15 PM
  #445
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Originally Posted by toejam56 View Post
I includes Halak because St Louis would want to dump him as their bonus. Halak has one year left. Play him if he is capable...bury him in Rochester if you have to.
Makes sense but if I were Darcy on the phone with Doug Armstrong, I would try and make a deal excluding Halak.

We don't need him and keeping him down in the AHL isn't good. The guy has great talent that shouldn't be wasted in a developmental league.

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06-24-2013, 01:15 PM
  #446
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
teams SIGNING old goalies
teams TRADING FOR young goalies

neither impact :
teams TRADING FOR old goalies (the least desirable path for any team)
Supply and demand is more complex than that and not all forces in a market impact each other directly but they still impact each other. If there are a couple teams that would have a shared interest in Bernier AND Miller/Backstrom then anything to do with either group of goalie or a team seeking one of those groups will impact the market. Is it not conceivable there's a team that would have interest to some degree in both Miller and Backstrom? Even if there was a strong preference for one over the other? Is it not conceivable that there were teams interested in either Bernier OR Miller... we certainly had been counting teams that've been linked with Bernier among the possible Miller destinations.

I understand your point but as happens you are far too absolute in your stance. I'd rather just say you're wrong here and be done with it. Do these moves have a huge impact on Miller's market? Probably not, possibly where a few teams are concerned. It certainly has a huge impact on the likelihood of Toronto, a team that was after Luongo and tried to trade for Kiprusoff, taking Miller; the same Toronto team that ultimately went the completely other direction and traded for Bernier. The Islanders seem a reasonable destination for Miller, yet were apparently hot on Bernier.

Minnesota would have made sense as a destination for Miller yet they signed Backstrom, so how does that not affect the market for Miller? Backstrom is completely comparable to Miller.

Finally, it's absolutely absurd for you to say singings and trades do not impact each other WHEN WE'RE TALKING ABOUT COMPARABLE PLAYERS. There's no way you really believe that, so let's not pretend.

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06-24-2013, 01:16 PM
  #447
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zip15 View Post
Miller
16th overall

for

Korpikoski
12th overall
Conditional 2nd (is PHX makes playoffs in 2013-14)
I wonder if Phoenix is on Miller's No Trade list or not.

The proximity to SoCal would be a reason why it wouldn't.

The ownership uncertainty and the fact that they don't appear to have the financial resources to really compete moving forward are reasons why it would be.

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06-24-2013, 01:18 PM
  #448
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Originally Posted by LegomyLeggio View Post
I wonder if Phoenix is on Miller's No Trade list or not.

The proximity to SoCal would be a reason why it wouldn't.

The ownership uncertainty and the fact that they don't appear to have the financial resources to really compete moving forward are reasons why it would be.
I'd also throw in a year of stats in Tippett's system would be a reason to go there. A great season could vastly increase his options going forward.

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06-24-2013, 01:19 PM
  #449
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Soapy3PO View Post
Why would Buffalo want Halak? Enroth and Hackett are most likely our goalies next season.

I like Rattie though. Just get rid of Halak and ya got yourself a decent proposal IMO.
While I'm OK going into the season with Enroth + Hackett there's no need to force Hackett in.

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06-24-2013, 01:20 PM
  #450
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zip15 View Post
Miller
16th overall

for

Korpikoski
12th overall
Conditional 2nd (is PHX makes playoffs in 2013-14)
I'm not feeling this one. Didn't Korpikoski have a lackluster season this year? Correct me if I'm wrong.

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