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2013 NHL Draft Thread III (6/30, 3PM EDT)

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Old
05-31-2013, 11:22 AM
  #501
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xoggz22 View Post
Some names that I think would be targets....

Neidereiter (NYI)
Burmistrov (WPG)
Brayden Schenn (PHI)
Jennsen(VAN)
Paajarvi(EDM)
Seguin(BOS)
Stepan(NYR)
Kreider(NYR)
Voracek(PHI)
Johansson(WSH)
Stewart(STL)
Eller(MON)
JVR(TOR)

I'm not saying they are available and some would cost a pretty penny (likely) but they fit the probable mode and based on some situations could be available. I don't know enough about "ready" prospects to add those but every one of these players would help the CBJ and could be part of the future core.
Good list, although as you say, and as I suggested re: Silvferberg, I don't know why some of those players' current teams would trade them (Nino). And, I'd expand the list to include some older (relative term) guys like Ryan and Stastny.

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05-31-2013, 11:36 AM
  #502
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Originally Posted by SuperGenius View Post
what if it were Johansen in place of Murray? Johansen + two firsts for MacKinnon? Crazy?
Predictably I'll dissent from the prevailing wisdom and say this is not crazy. But it's pointless, I think the promise of a steady d-man like Murray to a poor defensive team was one of the few ways we could ever hope to get Mackinnon.

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Beyond crazy. Flat-out stupid. You don't give up a potential #1C and two firsts for a potential #1C. That's bad asset management
You've reduced the players to archetypes where Johansen = Mackinnon. Then of course it looks stupid.

My guess is that Mackinnon >>> Johansen.

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05-31-2013, 11:37 AM
  #503
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Originally Posted by Xoggz22 View Post
Some names that I think would be targets....

Neidereiter (NYI)
Burmistrov (WPG)
Brayden Schenn (PHI)
Jennsen(VAN)
Paajarvi(EDM)
Seguin(BOS)
Stepan(NYR)
Kreider(NYR)
Voracek(PHI)
Johansson(WSH)
Stewart(STL)
Eller(MON)
JVR(TOR)

I'm not saying they are available and some would cost a pretty penny (likely) but they fit the probable mode and based on some situations could be available. I don't know enough about "ready" prospects to add those but every one of these players would help the CBJ and could be part of the future core.
Stewart makes the most sense, and St.Louis could be in a salary pickle. He's already a first-line winger, and would be a huge upgrade on our current group of wingers. I'm intrigued by Eller and Burmistrov but they're not going to be upgrades on Arty-Dubi-Johan up the middle.

I think the price for Stewart might be a couple first rounders, certainly if he gets signed to a good deal.

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05-31-2013, 11:51 AM
  #504
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Originally Posted by major major View Post
Stewart makes the most sense, and St.Louis could be in a salary pickle. He's already a first-line winger, and would be a huge upgrade on our current group of wingers. I'm intrigued by Eller and Burmistrov but they're not going to be upgrades on Arty-Dubi-Johan up the middle.

I think the price for Stewart might be a couple first rounders, certainly if he gets signed to a good deal.
Man....I think you really hit on something here. Adding Stewart would be awesome. Now that's an upgrade. He always kinda reminded me of the Milan Lucic of the West. Plus he would fit in with our grinding, physical style perfectly.

But TWO firsts....ugh. How about a first and Savard? Some team will take Savard right? Somebody has to be out there....

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05-31-2013, 12:20 PM
  #505
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That is why he would be pretty far down on my list of players to trade for. We already have a lot of forwards like that. We need someone who is good offensively.
I think he has the ability, and the fact that he hasn't proved it in the NHL might drive down the price that someone will pay to get him.

My question is this. Is Burmistrov better right now, and will he continue to be better, than whoever is likely to be picked at #27, 29, or 30? I don't know how many guys around the league hit every one of these marks that would be available for that price.

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05-31-2013, 12:31 PM
  #506
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Colorado says they'd move down if right offer is made. Florida says the same. If this is more than posturing, #CBJ could be in business.

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05-31-2013, 12:33 PM
  #507
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Originally Posted by Mayor Bee View Post
I think he has the ability, and the fact that he hasn't proved it in the NHL might drive down the price that someone will pay to get him.

My question is this. Is Burmistrov better right now, and will he continue to be better, than whoever is likely to be picked at #27, 29, or 30? I don't know how many guys around the league hit every one of these marks that would be available for that price.
To me, it isn't about if he would be better than that pick. It is if he is better, for our team, than someone else we could trade for. I just don't think he is an upgrade over what we have. I would rather trade a little more to get someone who is.

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05-31-2013, 12:41 PM
  #508
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Originally Posted by Double-Shift Lassť View Post
Good list, although as you say, and as I suggested re: Silvferberg, I don't know why some of those players' current teams would trade them (Nino). And, I'd expand the list to include some older (relative term) guys like Ryan and Stastny.
No argument from me on this. The only player on my list with a long term contract is Sequin. I don't see Boston moving him but if ever there was a fit in Columbus it would be him in my opinion. Boston is aging and doesn't have a lot of depth. Picks and possible young d-man might be intriguing.

I didn't add players like Ryan, Silfverberg, Noesen, Zijanebad and many others because I thought the list would get too long. Simplly offering some ideas of target players. I think Philly has some real issues coming up and while I don't see them moving Jake back to the CBJ wouldn't he be something with this team? I'm also a fan of Schenn who is playing too low in the Philly lineup and could be a scorer in Columbus.

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05-31-2013, 12:43 PM
  #509
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Originally Posted by major major View Post
Stewart makes the most sense, and St.Louis could be in a salary pickle. He's already a first-line winger, and would be a huge upgrade on our current group of wingers. I'm intrigued by Eller and Burmistrov but they're not going to be upgrades on Arty-Dubi-Johan up the middle.

I think the price for Stewart might be a couple first rounders, certainly if he gets signed to a good deal.
Yes, I mentioned Stewart some time ago but it got no traction in here. I'm sure the lists will change and we'll be surprised at some of the names we hear leading up to the draft and free agency, then again when camps open and close....

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05-31-2013, 12:49 PM
  #510
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Originally Posted by RDriesenUD View Post
To me, it isn't about if he would be better than that pick. It is if he is better, for our team, than someone else we could trade for. I just don't think he is an upgrade over what we have. I would rather trade a little more to get someone who is.
I'll preface this by saying I don't really know any more about Burmistrov than what I read or have seen when Atlanipeg has played the CBJ. What I gather is he's a smaller version of Johansen (defensively responsible but hasn't shown the offense, good at faceoffs and has OK, if not ideal size to play in the NHL). I have also heard he beats to his own drum and had a hard time with Noel last year.

That being said, his value is not that high right now and what if WPG offered Burmistrov and #13 for Johansen? Would you do that? Would anyone do that? Now you have a replacement, young, potential top 6 center and another pick to parlay. Johansen is likely the best player in the deal and you do lose that top line potential (I don't think Burmistrov has top line potential) but he may fit in.

Again, I'm not advocating it but more opening up the discussion. I'm a Johan fan but that might be tough to pass up especially if we could then move up to get a guy like McKinnon.

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05-31-2013, 01:23 PM
  #511
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ok, piggy backing off Xoggz....

Joey for Burmi and 13th

then

Nikitin and 19th for 7th

then

7th, 14th, ??? for 2nd?

2nd - MacKinnon
13th -Mantha/Pulock
27th - Forward Depth

is it out landish? of course...realistic? probably not...but like said above...just for discussion...


Last edited by Fro: 06-06-2013 at 10:12 AM.
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05-31-2013, 01:30 PM
  #512
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Originally Posted by Xoggz22 View Post
No argument from me on this. The only player on my list with a long term contract is Sequin. I don't see Boston moving him but if ever there was a fit in Columbus it would be him in my opinion. Boston is aging and doesn't have a lot of depth. Picks and possible young d-man might be intriguing.

I didn't add players like Ryan, Silfverberg, Noesen, Zijanebad and many others because I thought the list would get too long. Simplly offering some ideas of target players. I think Philly has some real issues coming up and while I don't see them moving Jake back to the CBJ wouldn't he be something with this team? I'm also a fan of Schenn who is playing too low in the Philly lineup and could be a scorer in Columbus.
Huh?

Well, technically everyone is aging..

But Hamilton is 19.
Seguin
Krejci 27
Rask 26
Boychuk 29
Marchand 25
Seguin 21
Horton 29
Lucic 24
Bergeron 26

Not sue what you mean with depth, prospect pool? Maybe not. In NHL? Yes they do have.

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05-31-2013, 02:44 PM
  #513
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Originally Posted by Fro View Post
ok, piggy backing off Xoggz....

Joey for Burmi and 13th

then

Nikitin and 19th for 7th

then

7th, 14th, ??? for 2nd?

is it out landish? of course...realistic? probably not...but like said above...just for discussion...
*Twitch* this is horrible

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05-31-2013, 03:02 PM
  #514
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Originally Posted by Xoggz22 View Post
I'll preface this by saying I don't really know any more about Burmistrov than what I read or have seen when Atlanipeg has played the CBJ. What I gather is he's a smaller version of Johansen (defensively responsible but hasn't shown the offense, good at faceoffs and has OK, if not ideal size to play in the NHL). I have also heard he beats to his own drum and had a hard time with Noel last year.

That being said, his value is not that high right now and what if WPG offered Burmistrov and #13 for Johansen? Would you do that? Would anyone do that? Now you have a replacement, young, potential top 6 center and another pick to parlay. Johansen is likely the best player in the deal and you do lose that top line potential (I don't think Burmistrov has top line potential) but he may fit in.

Again, I'm not advocating it but more opening up the discussion. I'm a Johan fan but that might be tough to pass up especially if we could then move up to get a guy like McKinnon.
Only if it was done to help us move up and get MacKinnon too.

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05-31-2013, 03:05 PM
  #515
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Originally Posted by Fro View Post
ok, piggy backing off Xoggz....

Joey for Burmi and 13th

then

Nikitin and 19th for 7th

then

7th, 14th, ??? for 2nd?

is it out landish? of course...realistic? probably not...but like said above...just for discussion...
So, Johansen, Nikitin, 14th, and 19th for Burmistrov, 2nd, and 13th? No thank you.


Last edited by RDriesenUD: 06-01-2013 at 12:17 AM.
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05-31-2013, 04:31 PM
  #516
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So, Johansen, Nikitin, 14th, and 19th for 2nd and 13th? No thank you.
In a heartbeat.

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05-31-2013, 04:37 PM
  #517
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So, Johansen, Nikitin, 14th, and 19th for 2nd and 13th? No thank you.
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Originally Posted by EspenK View Post
In a heartbeat.
Put me down as surprised.


NOT.

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05-31-2013, 04:48 PM
  #518
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Put me down as surprised.


NOT.
Let me explain.

We have a bunch of centers who are capable shut down guys with another apparently in the pipeline. We do not have a Toews, Kopitar, Bergeron, Krejci not to mention Crosby or Malkin. MacKinnon would give us someone in that strata. And no I don't see Joey getting there.

13th is better than 14th.

Nikitin is probably our most expendable D-man. It weakens the depth a bit but you gotta give to get.

So at the end of the day we would be betting that MacKinnon will develop and be better than Joey. I'll take the over on that one.

And we lose the 19th pick which is a crap shoot anyway.

I'm sure you're still not surprised.

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05-31-2013, 05:17 PM
  #519
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05-31-2013, 05:23 PM
  #520
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what if it were Johansen in place of Murray? Johansen + two firsts for MacKinnon? Crazy?
I trade Johansen before Murray at this point. MacKinnon was unreal at the Memorial Cup, and showed that he is the type of player that steps his game up when it matters most.

Imagine bringing back our entire team next year (minus Johansen), but adding Murray and MacKinnon. Boone Jenner could develop into exactly what Ryan Johansen has proven to be already, and we could still wind up with a similar player with our remaining first round pick. MacKinnon is a game changer, I really believe that ... but so is Murray, and you can't give him up without knowing exactly what you have.

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05-31-2013, 05:54 PM
  #521
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I trade Johansen before Murray at this point. MacKinnon was unreal at the Memorial Cup, and showed that he is the type of player that steps his game up when it matters most.

Imagine bringing back our entire team next year (minus Johansen), but adding Murray and MacKinnon. Boone Jenner could develop into exactly what Ryan Johansen has proven to be already, and we could still wind up with a similar player with our remaining first round pick. MacKinnon is a game changer, I really believe that ... but so is Murray, and you can't give him up without knowing exactly what you have.
I agree that I would trade Johansen and not Murray for MacKinnon, but I just can't add 2 firsts as well.

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05-31-2013, 05:58 PM
  #522
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So, Johansen, Nikitin, 14th, and 19th for 2nd and 13th? No thank you.
2nd, 13th, and Burmistrov

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05-31-2013, 06:08 PM
  #523
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Let me explain.

We have a bunch of centers who are capable shut down guys with another apparently in the pipeline. We do not have a Toews, Kopitar, Bergeron, Krejci not to mention Crosby or Malkin. MacKinnon would give us someone in that strata. And no I don't see Joey getting there.

13th is better than 14th.

Nikitin is probably our most expendable D-man. It weakens the depth a bit but you gotta give to get.

So at the end of the day we would be betting that MacKinnon will develop and be better than Joey. I'll take the over on that one.

And we lose the 19th pick which is a crap shoot anyway.

I'm sure you're still not surprised.
Let's look at it this way.

The 13 & 14 wash, yes I know they don't really but close.

So we're trading Johansen, Nikitin, & the 19th for McKinnon. I know you, and others, do that in a heartbeat. I'm just not that convinced.

But then I'm not a scout. Nor have I seen any of these potentials in person, nor have I studied hours of tape. Best I can do is say I've read some scouting reports, and watched some highlights and a little live on TV. So can't say I'm really qualified to say with any veracity what should or should not be done. I think there are a lot posters here that, if they will admit it, aren't in a much better position than I am.

I'm just not as assured as many of you are that somehow a single 18/19 yr. old is the salvation of this franchise. And maybe salvation is too strong a word, I just think we need to quit looking for magic beans and work more on the step by step method. Smacks too much of Dougie for my taste.

It's still fun to discuss, and just for the record, I'm not surprised. I don't agree, but at the same time I also don't find your position totally untenable.

To be continued....

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05-31-2013, 06:09 PM
  #524
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2nd, 13th, and Burmistrov
Well, that would certainly get my attention.

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05-31-2013, 06:20 PM
  #525
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Well, that would certainly get my attention.
Yep

I missed the Burmistrov part. Just kind of airmailed it.

The three first rounders to make it possible to consider the kind of multiple moves described.

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