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Bernier trade in offseason?

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06-14-2013, 04:20 PM
  #576
etherialone
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DT didn't have the same support/developmental system that DL has built but I do agree that players would have likely been rushed or forced into situations that wouldn't have been as conducive to their success.

So what you said but with the added DL was given more support to succeed.


DT remains employed in hockey and has yet to be a successful GM for another team. You would think that he would have by now considering that he has remained employed in hockey since he was fired as GM of the Kings.


EVEN TRUEST STORY!


Last edited by etherialone: 06-14-2013 at 04:22 PM. Reason: I LIKE UNDERLINING.
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06-14-2013, 04:22 PM
  #577
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Originally Posted by BigBrown View Post
Definitely. Out of the (new) conference at the very minimum. Moving him to the Oilers or Flames will lead to us cursing his name every damn season.
Third'd. I usually don't place a great deal of credence to the "make sure you deal your valuable asset to a place he can't bite you," but I suspect the Kings will ultimately regret any trade that keeps Bernier in their (new) division --regardless of what comes back the other way...

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06-14-2013, 04:37 PM
  #578
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Originally Posted by The Dingo View Post
Kopitar was drafted by the previous admin, but he was developed by Lombardi and Co. Kopitar would be 1/4 of the player he is now if DT and co were still in charge.
This is confusing, because Kopitar is 1/4 the player "he is now", (under this administration) compared to 365 days ago. Or maybe 1/2. Perhaps 3/5. But less than 3/4. Hoping he becomes at least 4/5 the player he was, 365 days ago.

Hope his knee fully heals and whatever else ills him physically or otherwise fully recovers.

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06-14-2013, 04:37 PM
  #579
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Originally Posted by Peter James Bond View Post
This is confusing, because Kopitar is 1/4 the player "he is now", (under this administration) compared to 365 days ago. Or maybe 1/2. Perhaps 3/5. But less than 3/4. Hoping he becomes at least 4/5 the player he was, 365 days ago.

Hope his knee fully heals and whatever else ills him physically or otherwise fully recovers.
I am hoping he becomes 7/5 of the player he was in 11-12

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06-14-2013, 05:03 PM
  #580
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Originally Posted by The Dingo View Post
If DT and the old regime weren't cleaned out :


Quick would have busted and would have had the same career path as Storr, Volkov, Yeats, Campbell, Nogues, Chouinard , Bach, Marsters, Grahn, Huet onlyhad success when he left and Montreal developed him, Laplante, Munce, Zaba, Danny Taylor, Fukufuji.

Dustin Brown's offense would be much closer to Cal Clutterbucks or even lower.

Kopitar would be back in Europe.


Even truer story
Is this sarcastic?

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06-14-2013, 05:03 PM
  #581
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TSN on Bernier, nothing really new but some tidbits:

http://t.co/PN3Po4CtJq

Said they've reached out to around 10 teams in order to get a feel for the market, they're likely to try and get a deal done before the draft and that he's highly regarded around the league.

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06-14-2013, 05:05 PM
  #582
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Originally Posted by Tonellisghost View Post
DT didn't have the same support/developmental system that DL has built but I do agree that players would have likely been rushed or forced into situations that wouldn't have been as conducive to their success.

So what you said but with the added DL was given more support to succeed.


DT remains employed in hockey and has yet to be a successful GM for another team. You would think that he would have by now considering that he has remained employed in hockey since he was fired as GM of the Kings.


EVEN TRUEST STORY!
This is correct. AEG did not put DT in a position to succeed back then. It was only when they could see success was imminent that they supported the Kings. That imminent success was mostly brought in by DT. Taylor had to rush people because he was not getting any cash to bring in the real players.

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06-14-2013, 05:06 PM
  #583
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigBrown View Post
TSN on Bernier, nothing really new but some tidbits:

http://t.co/PN3Po4CtJq

Said they've reached out to around 10 teams in order to get a feel for the market, they're likely to try and get a deal done before the draft and that he's highly regarded around the league.
That says draft picks are in play.

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06-14-2013, 05:11 PM
  #584
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Originally Posted by no name View Post
That says draft picks are in play.
How do you figure?

edit: duh, since it's before the draft.

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06-14-2013, 05:13 PM
  #585
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Ten teams eh? Any guesses who you guys think they might be? I am going to say it's the following clubs:

NY Islanders
Philadelphia Flyers
New Jersey Devils
Calgary Flames
Edmonton Oilers
Florida Panthers
Colorado Avalanche
Toronto Maple Leafs
Tampa Bay Lightning
Minnesota Wild

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06-14-2013, 05:25 PM
  #586
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Originally Posted by Ziggy Stardust View Post
Ten teams eh? Any guesses who you guys think they might be? I am going to say it's the following clubs:

NY Islanders
Philadelphia Flyers
New Jersey Devils
Calgary Flames
Edmonton Oilers
Florida Panthers
Colorado Avalanche
Toronto Maple Leafs
Tampa Bay Lightning
Minnesota Wild
I'd add Winnipeg/Buffalo and subtract Colorado/Tampa. Ryan Miller is in his contract year and seems likely to move at some point. Don't think Enroth is starter material and I'm not sure about Matt Hackett. Winnipeg seemingly hit on a couple of late round goalies in the 2012 Draft, but their depth in goal isn't great.

I don't doubt that the Kings/Devils have talked about Bernier (if not a couple years), but just don't think the Devils have the assets available.

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06-14-2013, 07:17 PM
  #587
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ziggy Stardust View Post
Ten teams eh? Any guesses who you guys think they might be? I am going to say it's the following clubs:

NY Islanders
Philadelphia Flyers
New Jersey Devils
Calgary Flames
Edmonton Oilers
Florida Panthers
Colorado Avalanche
Toronto Maple Leafs
Tampa Bay Lightning
Minnesota Wild
Good list.

I'd remove Tampa and add Winnipeg, though.

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06-14-2013, 07:34 PM
  #588
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Originally Posted by no name View Post
This is correct. AEG did not put DT in a position to succeed back then. It was only when they could see success was imminent that they supported the Kings. That imminent success was mostly brought in by DT. Taylor had to rush people because he was not getting any cash to bring in the real players.
That is partly true.

It could also be argued that DT's drafting successes came as the result of his listening to our chief scout at the time (AM) and that he (dt) had little to nothing to do with it. Just saying.

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06-14-2013, 08:12 PM
  #589
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Originally Posted by Butch 19 View Post
?? And Dave Taylor says, "hey, I'm just sitting here!!"

("and even I would have taken Couture instead of Hickey... )


The backbone of this teams success, even all these years later, was brought here by Dave Taylor. true story
True, but the success is all Lombardi development plan. Case in point, Bernier. He was drafted by Lombardi the year before he cleaned house when Al Murray was still head of scouting. He showed success, then faltered as we know. Lombardi was the only one to step up and say he needs time to develop in the minors when EVERYONE ELSE, including Lieweke was saying the opposite. Had Taylor still been GM, I have no doubt in my mind Bernier would've stayed,then he'd have been another goalie bust and probably been traded within 3 years for a 5th round pick. Quick also falls into this too. They were developed the right way, paid their dues, and never rushed.

Brown is another example of players being rushed before they're ready.He'd have been a much better player earlier in his career had he stayed in juniors , then a season or two in Manchester. The best thing to happen to his career was the lockout when he got to play in the AHL.


Last edited by kingsfan28: 06-14-2013 at 08:38 PM.
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06-14-2013, 08:13 PM
  #590
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Originally Posted by Tonellisghost View Post
That is partly true.

It could also be argued that DT's drafting successes came as the result of his listening to our chief scout at the time (AM) and that he (dt) had little to nothing to do with it. Just saying.
I never buy into this. There are certain GM's that delegate more than others, but ultimately you don't get to that position by other people doing your job. The GM's push the buttons at the end of the day.

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06-14-2013, 08:22 PM
  #591
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I never buy into this. There are certain GM's that delegate more than others, but ultimately you don't get to that position by other people doing your job. The GM's push the buttons at the end of the day.
Like the timeout button in 2003?

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06-14-2013, 10:12 PM
  #592
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The philosophy of the entire organization was just wrong during Dave Taylor's tenure. The same old crap of bringing in mercenaries year after year, and the attitude of just make the playoffs and anything can happen was lame. Year after year of trying to catch lightning in a bottle.

Lombardi had a plan, stuck with it, and even though the Kings finished 8th the year they won the cup, you always get the feeling that success is planned for and expected.

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06-14-2013, 11:49 PM
  #593
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Originally Posted by kingsfan28 View Post
True, but the success is all Lombardi development plan. Case in point, Bernier. He was drafted by Lombardi the year before he cleaned house when Al Murray was still head of scouting. He showed success, then faltered as we know. Lombardi was the only one to step up and say he needs time to develop in the minors when EVERYONE ELSE, including Lieweke was saying the opposite. Had Taylor still been GM, I have no doubt in my mind Bernier would've stayed,then he'd have been another goalie bust and probably been traded within 3 years for a 5th round pick. Quick also falls into this too. They were developed the right way, paid their dues, and never rushed.

Brown is another example of players being rushed before they're ready.He'd have been a much better player earlier in his career had he stayed in juniors , then a season or two in Manchester. The best thing to happen to his career was the lockout when he got to play in the AHL.
All true points, but DT was not allowed to fail as DL was. DT was given direction to "win now," while DL was told "tear the team down to what you need and rebuild."

Two vastly different work place environments / expected levels of success.

p.s. ...and didn't LaBarbera have plenty of time to succeed in the minors? Remember when we thought EVERYONE was gonna claim him off waivers when we tried to send down the "future franchise goalie"? Good times indeed!!

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06-15-2013, 06:19 AM
  #594
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p.s. ...and didn't LaBarbera have plenty of time to succeed in the minors? Remember when we thought EVERYONE was gonna claim him off waivers when we tried to send down the "future franchise goalie"? Good times indeed!!
Wrong way around. It was coming UP that people thought he would get claimed off waivers during 06-07, when the Kings had a rash of goalie injuries and used every other goalie in the system IIRC except Labarbera to avoid having to recall Labs since he would have been eligible for re-entry waivers (which was half-salary and Labs was having an MVP season in AHL). Re-entry waivers are now gone in new CBA. Labarbera had cleared waivers earlier that year. He had also played rather impressively pre his "personal time" in January of the 05-06 season, from Sept-Jan when Mathieu Garon and Jason Labarbera were arguably the best tandem in the league.

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06-15-2013, 08:26 AM
  #595
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Jonathan Bernier will finally escape Jonathan Quick's shadow in L.A. A source told ESPN.com Friday that the Los Angeles Kings have spoken with about 10 clubs about Bernier’s availability. It wouldn’t surprise me if he’s traded before or at the draft.
I know you guys posted a video link but this is what Lebrun wrote in his article yesterday. http://espn.go.com/blog/nhl/post/_/i...and-whos-going

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06-15-2013, 10:25 AM
  #596
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Its gonna hurt to lose Bernie unless we get a nice fat return. I know he's going to go on and be a great starter...

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06-15-2013, 10:47 AM
  #597
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Originally Posted by Holden Caulfield View Post
Wrong way around. It was coming UP that people thought he would get claimed off waivers during 06-07, when the Kings had a rash of goalie injuries and used every other goalie in the system IIRC except Labarbera to avoid having to recall Labs since he would have been eligible for re-entry waivers (which was half-salary and Labs was having an MVP season in AHL). Re-entry waivers are now gone in new CBA. Labarbera had cleared waivers earlier that year. He had also played rather impressively pre his "personal time" in January of the 05-06 season, from Sept-Jan when Mathieu Garon and Jason Labarbera were arguably the best tandem in the league.
All I was trying to say re JLB is that here the Kings had a "good to great goalie" (remember his Manchester stat threads?) that was not rushed into the NHL, yet when he finally got here, he still sucked out loud.

.... and Garon gets waaaaay too much **** around here, while JLB is an after thought. There was a time that JLB was "supposed" to pass Garon in skill level.

Ah yes, Jan 2006 - maybe the last time the Kings were in first in their division this late in the season. They had no D in front of Garon, yet DL picked a goalie at #11... now 7 years later "we hope we get lucky" and that pick can be traded to get us another 1st round pick...? Does that seem like a step forward?

Bernier (almost) ranks up there with Hickey (at least JB has trade value).

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06-15-2013, 11:13 AM
  #598
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Its gonna hurt to lose Bernie unless we get a nice fat return. I know he's going to go on and be a great starter...
Good thing GMs across this league feel this way too as opposed to the abomination proposals I'm hearing in the trade rumors section

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06-15-2013, 11:17 AM
  #599
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I hope the Kings create a bidding war and can pull off something like this:

Bernier + Martinez (or Muzzin or Ellerby) + #57 overall:

for

Matt Read + Flyers #11 overall.

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06-15-2013, 11:23 AM
  #600
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Good thing GMs across this league feel this way too as opposed to the abomination proposals I'm hearing in the trade rumors section
I doubt most of those derps have even seen a game he's played. He's legit and saved our ass(es) many a time this past season. I think his value is quite high, as do other GM's. I really hope we can get someone like Strome/Nino/Couturier/Yakupov/Paajarvi/Eberle for him. We can do better than Read IMO...

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