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Miscellaneous NHL Talk Part VI: The 2013 Playoffs Edition, Round 2

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Old
05-24-2013, 09:40 AM
  #426
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Originally Posted by RJ8812 View Post
I don't think anyone hates Richards

The hate for Carter is justified though
Even though I still always make the "Carter shot" (high and wide) joke a lot, I still like both guys and hope they still do well.

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05-24-2013, 10:28 AM
  #427
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I don't think anyone hates Richards

The hate for Carter is justified though
i don't think the carter hate is justified but we've all gone through this a million times so i'm just gonna stop right there. and while people don't openly hate on richards the fans booed him when he came back (even though they never booed gagne, rj and a couple other fan favorites that were moved at no fault of their own) and few fans on here have even gone as far as to say that he's washed up (even though he leads them in points in the post season).

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05-24-2013, 10:33 AM
  #428
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I really don't get all the Richards and Carter/Kings hate around here
Richards: Hyped as the next Bobby Clarke. Captain of the future. Leaves town with rampart rumors of binge drinking and ducking Flyer's events (and having a bored, 'can't wait to get the heck out of here' attitude). People can make excuses, but I saw him do this first hand (at a Flyer's carnival). A guy they clearly didn't want to trade, but did for *some* reason related to who he is.

Fans r teh disappointed, to say the least. Then after leaving the way he did-- (which let's face it-- he didn't trade himself) -- he celebrates all over our faces by winning a Cup. That burns people's chaps as it always does when a guy gets traded and has a ton of success elsewhere (which is a proud Philadelphia team tradition and a chronic blackmark on the teams here).

Then watching Flyer's fans glom onto the Kings to attempt to soak in some of what this city has been lacking (a championship from a team that doesn't play a boring sport) was a bit embarrassing. It was like watching a family member drunkenly flirt with a cousin at Thanksgiving.

Carter -- I'm too tired to get into it. It was how he played, then sulked after he was traded-- and the party boy nonsense. Hide and wide, and the choke during the cup run off a pass I would have slammed home with ease -- then listening to the parade of excuses for it.

I *was* a big Richards fan.

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05-24-2013, 10:46 AM
  #429
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Originally Posted by DownieFaceSoftener View Post
Carter -- I'm too tired to get into it. It was how he played, then sulked after he was traded-- and the party boy nonsense. Hide and wide, and the choke during the cup run off a pass I would have slammed home with ease -- then listening to the parade of excuses for it.


The strength of the pass was too strong to one-time and Campbell (I give him the most credit) and Niemi both made great plays to stop him. If Carter tries to one-time that pass, he flubs it, and for the rest of time we'd hear that Carter should have settled the puck first. He made the right play.

The timing of the play was ultimately unfortunate because a goal there probably sends the series back to Chicago, but the amount of hatred directed at Carter for that individual incident still baffles me today.

I'm happy for the success he's had in LA, but I would have rathered he had that success in Philly.

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05-24-2013, 10:55 AM
  #430
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Richards: Hyped as the next Bobby Clarke. Captain of the future. Leaves town with rampart rumors of binge drinking and ducking Flyer's events (and having a bored, 'can't wait to get the heck out of here' attitude). People can make excuses, but I saw him do this first hand (at a Flyer's carnival). A guy they clearly didn't want to trade, but did for *some* reason related to who he is.

Fans r teh disappointed, to say the least. Then after leaving the way he did-- (which let's face it-- he didn't trade himself) -- he celebrates all over our faces by winning a Cup. That burns people's chaps as it always does when a guy gets traded and has a ton of success elsewhere (which is a proud Philadelphia team tradition and a chronic blackmark on the teams here).

Then watching Flyer's fans glom onto the Kings to attempt to soak in some of what this city has been lacking (a championship from a team that doesn't play a boring sport) was a bit embarrassing. It was like watching a family member drunkenly flirt with a cousin at Thanksgiving.

Carter -- I'm too tired to get into it. It was how he played, then sulked after he was traded-- and the party boy nonsense. Hide and wide, and the choke during the cup run off a pass I would have slammed home with ease -- then listening to the parade of excuses for it.

I *was* a big Richards fan.
Basically this. Human psychology. The only reason most people cheered for the Kings is cause they were up against the Devils.

And the rest of you need to get off Jeff Carter's nuts. I wasn't a fan of his playoff uselessness for the Flyers. ****ing Aaron Asham scored more playoff goals than him in 2010. AND he cockblocked my friend in Sea Isle. How the **** are you gonna cockblock one of your fans? That's just dirt.

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05-24-2013, 11:37 AM
  #431
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There is no legitimate hockey reason to hate Carter. And I just can't care less about what he does in his free time. I'm here to watch hockey games, not gossip. That's what the Jennifer Aniston/Bradgelina magazines are for. I don't care what these people do with their free time, so long as it doesn't land them in jail or cripple them.

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05-24-2013, 11:42 AM
  #432
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
There is no legitimate hockey reason to hate Carter. And I just can't care less about what he does in his free time. I'm here to watch hockey games, not gossip. That's what the Jennifer Aniston/Bradgelina magazines are for. I don't care what these people do with their free time, so long as it doesn't land them in jail or cripple them.

I'm gonna hate Jeff carter some more just cause you said that.

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05-24-2013, 11:44 AM
  #433
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I'm gonna hate Jeff carter some more just cause you said that.


While you're at it, tell your friend he clearly needs to work on his game.

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05-24-2013, 11:50 AM
  #434
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
There is no legitimate hockey reason to hate Carter. And I just can't care less about what he does in his free time. I'm here to watch hockey games, not gossip. That's what the Jennifer Aniston/Bradgelina magazines are for. I don't care what these people do with their free time, so long as it doesn't land them in jail or cripple them.
Beef its Brangelina. Gosh don't you keep up with celebrities?

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05-24-2013, 12:02 PM
  #435
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
There is no legitimate hockey reason to hate Carter. And I just can't care less about what he does in his free time. I'm here to watch hockey games, not gossip. That's what the Jennifer Aniston/Bradgelina magazines are for. I don't care what these people do with their free time, so long as it doesn't land them in jail or cripple them.
you really think there's no legitimate hockey reason to dislike Carter?

-he was lazy
-he was over rated
-he constantly took low % shots from stupid angles which result in turn overs
-he constantly shot the puck into the goalie's chest
-constant choke jobs in the playoffs
-for a guy with his size, he barely ever used it
-he sulked when he got traded to Columbus, forcing them to trade him so he can be with his buddy

I really have no hate towards Richards. Sure, he was turning into a whiny little teenage girl his last year here and should not have been named captain at such a young age, but he was still a gamer. But Carter is a completely different story. Most of the people here that defend him are the same people that defend Bryzgalov.

The Richards trade was hard to swallow, but I understand why it was done. The Carter trade on the other hand, was one of the best moves this organization has made in the past 10 years. I was actually hoping we would trade Carter the year after our 2010 run (instead of Gagne). For one, we would have gotten a great return for him (a possible #1 goalie), and two, it was obvious he was not necessary for this team to succeed since he wasnt a big factor at all during the playoffs

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05-24-2013, 12:12 PM
  #436
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post


While you're at it, tell your friend he clearly needs to work on his game.
I don't think any of us could out game Carter. I don't think any of us could out game Kennedy as ugly as he is.

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05-24-2013, 12:13 PM
  #437
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Beef its Brangelina. Gosh don't you keep up with celebrities?
Haha. Clearly not.

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Originally Posted by RJ8812 View Post
you really think there's no legitimate hockey reason to dislike Carter?

-he was lazy
-he was over rated
-he constantly took low % shots from stupid angles which result in turn overs
-he constantly shot the puck into the goalie's chest
-constant choke jobs in the playoffs
-for a guy with his size, he barely ever used it
-he sulked when he got traded to Columbus, forcing them to trade him so he can be with his buddy

I really have no hate towards Richards. Sure, he was turning into a whiny little teenage girl his last year here and should not have been named captain at such a young age, but he was still a gamer. But Carter is a completely different story. Most of the people here that defend him are the same people that defend Bryzgalov.

The Richards trade was hard to swallow, but I understand why it was done. The Carter trade on the other hand, was one of the best moves this organization has made in the past 10 years. I was actually hoping we would trade Carter the year after our 2010 run (instead of Gagne). For one, we would have gotten a great return for him (a possible #1 goalie), and two, it was obvious he was not necessary for this team to succeed since he wasnt a big factor at all during the playoffs


These claims have all been disproven hundreds of times.

-Lazy players don't come back early to play through painful injuries. Lazy players also don't adjust their game so they get better at fighting for dirty goals around the net.
-If anything he was underrated. 35 goal scoring players who can play good defense at an affordable cap hit aren't common; yet Flyers fans always wanted him gone. There's a reason he got great value when traded.
-Yeah, and he also scored ~35 goals a year. Not all of them will go in. He's a shooter, that's his play style. That will happen to anybody who shoots a lot.
-Again, lots of players hit the goalie when they shoot. That's because the goalie is in position to get hit by the puck; goalies work hard to make sure that happens, it's their job. Not every shot taken is going to be a corner snipe, anybody who expects differently is unrealistic.
-Major injuries =/= choking. Interesting that he isn't "choking" now that he's healthy.
-He didn't lay huge hits often (MAYBE once or twice a season, tops), but he used his size on defense constantly...to force guys to the outside, run them into the boards, or poke the puck away. On offense he used it in front of the net.
- He sure did. Didn't affect the Flyers though, so I don't care much personally.

--I don't defend Bryzgalov, yet I defend Carter...but only because people like you apparently held him to a standard completely impossible for him to meet or surpass. It was always clear that lots of Flyers fans expected him to be Ovechkin or Lemieux, or something...and then they got mad when he was just Jeff Carter. I've said it several times, but he's never been a favorite player of mine. That doesn't stop me from recognizing that he was/is a very effective player, and it doesn't stop me from recognizing that almost all of the claims made against him are utterly absurd, or totally fabricated.

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05-24-2013, 12:36 PM
  #438
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Richards: Hyped as the next Bobby Clarke. Captain of the future. Leaves town with rampart rumors of binge drinking and ducking Flyer's events (and having a bored, 'can't wait to get the heck out of here' attitude). People can make excuses, but I saw him do this first hand (at a Flyer's carnival). A guy they clearly didn't want to trade, but did for *some* reason related to who he is.

Fans r teh disappointed, to say the least. Then after leaving the way he did-- (which let's face it-- he didn't trade himself) -- he celebrates all over our faces by winning a Cup. That burns people's chaps as it always does when a guy gets traded and has a ton of success elsewhere (which is a proud Philadelphia team tradition and a chronic blackmark on the teams here).

Then watching Flyer's fans glom onto the Kings to attempt to soak in some of what this city has been lacking (a championship from a team that doesn't play a boring sport) was a bit embarrassing. It was like watching a family member drunkenly flirt with a cousin at Thanksgiving.

Carter -- I'm too tired to get into it. It was how he played, then sulked after he was traded-- and the party boy nonsense. Hide and wide, and the choke during the cup run off a pass I would have slammed home with ease -- then listening to the parade of excuses for it.

I *was* a big Richards fan.
well i don't know what to say. there are so many things i don't agree with in this post

1. the next bobby clarke? sure people made comparisons but if anybody ever thought richards was gonna be a point producer like clarke then i don't know what to say, i guess you're expectations were way to high and completely unfounded so who's fault is that? as far as their playing styles are concerned it was an accurate comparison, if you made anymore out of it then that it isn't richards fault.

2. "rumors of binge drinking and ducking Flyer's events". there were no binge drinking or ducking event rumors that i'm aware of. it came out that he didn't want to get on board with lavi's whole "dry island" bull and that he was a party boy (even though pics and rumors of all that stopped after lupul left) but that is not binge drinking, please stop with the exaggerations.

richards may not have wanted to be at some of the fan events but to my knowledge he was mostly present and honestly i don't care what kind of person he was off the ice. even so the two times i met him (autographs) he seemed completely chill/normal. so if you had a crappy experience with him sorry but isn't it possible there were other factors you weren't aware of?

3. i'm happy they won a cup, just cause they left my favorite team doesn't mean i stop liking them as players. this whole "embarrassing" things, i can't see why. if fans still like the players why can't they root for the kings when the flyers are out of it? if you don't want to, thats your choice but it just sound like someone is a little sore to me.

4. yeah carter could of def handled the trade better but the carter hate was very strong way before his trade so whatever

5. the rest of the carter complaints can all be grouped into the fact that you and many other flyers fans seems to think all of carter's goals were empty netters/meaningless goals. as for the playoffs carter was often injured during that point of the season and still put up about .5ppg. sure that's not great but i guess foot injuries aren't a valid excuse, whatever. and yes i think arguing this subject is tiring and pointless so i'm just gonna stop there. bottom line is imo when healthy carter was a good goal scorer and an above average defensive center who played well for the flyers.

let me conclude by saying that i like the flyers return for both players but that this sourpuss attitude from flyers fans is getting ridiculous and frankly it's kind of embarrassing.

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05-24-2013, 12:48 PM
  #439
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if you are a big forward and your not smashing players into the 5th row you are soft and overrated. LOL
Jeff Carter could not win here. Ever. It was his job to score goals. to not get into fights, smash guys into oblivion, get suspended, ect ect. of course if he was a 10 goal scorer and had 300 PIMS people would of loved him.
Jeff Carter was guilty of one thing. he had the audacity to play hurt in the playoffs. Of course if he would of told the team he coudnt go he would of been crucified for being a ***** who cant play with pain.
With Carter goalies dont make great saves against him. Its Jeff Carter choking.
I am not the guys biggest fan, but the hate he still gets in really amazing. Some people cannot just let it go and move on.

oh and as far as this high and wide nonscense, I woud venture to guess that his misses rank right up there with the other goal scorers in the league.

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05-24-2013, 01:02 PM
  #440
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Originally Posted by FlyersFan61290 View Post
1. the next bobby clarke? sure people made comparisons but if anybody ever thought richards was gonna be a point producer like clarke then i don't know what to say, i guess you're expectations were way to high and completely unfounded so who's fault is that? as far as their playing styles are concerned it was an accurate comparison, if you made anymore out of it then that it isn't richards fault.
It is okay to use capitals. I was only talking about the climate that existed. I honestly don't recall what my expectations were-- only what subconsciously being conveyed to the fans.

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2. "rumors of binge drinking and ducking Flyer's events". there were no binge drinking or ducking event rumors that i'm aware of. it came out that he didn't want to get on board with lavi's whole "dry island" bull and that he was a party boy (even though pics and rumors of all that stopped after lupul left) but that is not binge drinking, please stop with the exaggerations.
S****y Bubbles, bruh. Do you live in the city? Around Old City or Center City? Just curious-- the partying was pretty well rumored. If you paid close enough attention you knew where the hangouts were (hint: bars). Hell, it was spoken about Preston and Steve show once in awhile (especially when the female interns went out with the Flyers). I'm not even being judgmental about it-- I binge drank at that age, but it rubs people wrong, and jobs don't like to hear about it. In regards to what I witnessed personally-- I saw him jump a barrier to avoid fans at the carnival. Maybe he had a reason-- but then you had guys like Briere who stayed with the fans until they were turning the lights off. Briere is a famously good guy-- where is the parade of people to say the same about Richie who don't sound like apologists? Pronger dealt with the media for a reason.

Quote:
3. i'm happy they won a cup, just cause they left my favorite team doesn't mean i stop liking them as players. this whole "embarrassing" things, i can't see why. if fans still like the players why can't they root for the kings when the flyers are out of it? if you don't want to, thats your choice but it just sound like someone is a little sore to me.
Sounds bandwagony. Logo. Not the players.

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Carter
Eh, I don't hate Carter, but there is some grounding in what was said about him. All shooters miss a lot, and he is brilliant in creating space for himself (I made a ton of posts about this), and he plays solid defense. He does play soft, he didn't appear to show up when needed, and choked on a really important shot, and always seemed to be injured at the worst times, which isn't really his fault. It still breeds annoyance with a player.

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05-24-2013, 01:18 PM
  #441
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The Richards and Carter trades were a midnight massacre that took the fans by surprise and have been debated ever since. The truth of the matter is that for some reason(s?) the Flyers' F0 decided to make those deals. Richards and Carter have had little to nothing to say about the Flyers organization since they left. Neither have the Flyers discussed the players in public. So far, it goes down as a business decision the causes of which we fans have no knowledge. Someday the truth about it all will come out but not yet. All that floats around instead are rumors and question marks.

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05-24-2013, 01:24 PM
  #442
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There is no legitimate hockey reason to hate Carter.
I don't hate him, he got us Jake and Coots. But I wish his playoff record with the Flyers wasn't awful, especially in 2010 because the Flyers were very close to a Cup. People always blame injuries for his lack of production, but was he really injured in five straight post seasons spread over six years?

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05-24-2013, 01:52 PM
  #443
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I don't hate him, he got us Jake and Coots. But I wish his playoff record with the Flyers wasn't awful, especially in 2010 because the Flyers were very close to a Cup. People always blame injuries for his lack of production, but was he really injured in five straight post seasons spread over six years?
I'm pretty sure he actually was. Aside from his rookie season there was always something. His sophomore season, perhaps not; I don't recall off the top of my head. But even then, it's not wise to pass judgement on a player's PO career based on their first 2 seasons. Even Pronger was considered a choker early on, and I believe Yzerman was as well. A few years ago I looked at several "clutch" guys, and for the most part players took a few seasons before their playoff performance matched their regular season performance. Giroux is a true anomaly in that regard. Around the time you'd expect Carter to start performing, based on how other players developed, he was injured.

I was fine with the return as well. I was against the trade because I didn't think we'd get sufficient value in return, therefore he'd be more of an asset on the team than off. Generally, teams that trade guys like Carter often don't get equivalent value back. That return actually was sufficient value, even before Couturier dropped to 8.

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05-24-2013, 01:59 PM
  #444
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It is okay to use capitals. I was only talking about the climate that existed. I honestly don't recall what my expectations were-- only what subconsciously being conveyed to the fans.
since you didn't say anything actually pertinent to the topic and you just want to be a bit of a tool, i just won't say anything.

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S****y Bubbles, bruh. Do you live in the city? Around Old City or Center City? Just curious-- the partying was pretty well rumored. If you paid close enough attention you knew where the hangouts were (hint: bars). Hell, it was spoken about Preston and Steve show once in awhile (especially when the female interns went out with the Flyers). I'm not even being judgmental about it-- I binge drank at that age, but it rubs people wrong, and jobs don't like to hear about it. In regards to what I witnessed personally-- I saw him jump a barrier to avoid fans at the carnival. Maybe he had a reason-- but then you had guys like Briere who stayed with the fans until they were turning the lights off. Briere is a famously good guy-- where is the parade of people to say the same about Richie who don't sound like apologists? Pronger dealt with the media for a reason.
yes i lived in the city and currently live right outside the city and yes they went out drinking like i said but i don't consider getting a buzz binge drinking. there is no way these guys went out and got drunk then with a hangover played as well as they did, there is no way anyone could convince me of that. so again rumors of drinking and partying yes but not "binging" which is consuming large quantities of alcohol over a short period of time for the express purpose of getting drunk in case you weren't aware.

i really don't have anything else to say about him off ice cause we don't know him personally and one experience when you don't know the circumstances means nothing especially considering my experiences to the contrary. i'm not saying he's a good guy but rumors of "ducking" events as you said in your first post is simply untrue.

and as far as pronger dealing with the media is concerned, who cares? pronger was obviously better at dealing with the media and did it ever occur to you that maybe the media would seek him out more often because of his personality or the fact that he's a future hall of famer/his pedigree?

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Sounds bandwagony. Logo. Not the players.
that's why i said when the flyers are out of it. and i guess you never rooted for a team cause they had a player you liked. nice try though

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Eh, I don't hate Carter, but there is some grounding in what was said about him. All shooters miss a lot, and he is brilliant in creating space for himself (I made a ton of posts about this), and he plays solid defense. He does play soft, he didn't appear to show up when needed, and choked on a really important shot, and always seemed to be injured at the worst times, which isn't really his fault. It still breeds annoyance with a player.
ok, wasn't a big carter fan but i just don't think he's treated fairly by flyers fans.

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05-24-2013, 02:10 PM
  #445
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I really don't get all the Richards and Carter/Kings hate around here
I really don't get why people care if there is Richards and Carter/Kings hate around here. They're not Flyers anymore. If it hurts you so much go be a Kings fan.

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05-24-2013, 02:12 PM
  #446
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Wow this thread I think just went back in time or something...

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05-24-2013, 02:14 PM
  #447
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Does not belong in this thread, but it's reported on Allhockey.ru that John Stevens is one of the candidates for Canucks coaching job.
Is there any merit to these reports?

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05-24-2013, 02:15 PM
  #448
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Originally Posted by CSKA1974 View Post
Does not belong in this thread, but it's reported on Allhockey.ru that John Stevens is one of the candidates for Canucks coaching job.
Is there any merit to these reports?
I hope the Canucks like cake!

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05-24-2013, 02:17 PM
  #449
CanadianFlyer88
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Bob McKenzie tweeted that he may get a look. It's pure speculation right now, given that the Kings' season is still in progress.

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05-24-2013, 02:23 PM
  #450
FlyersFan61290
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SCOREacek View Post
I really don't get why people care if there is Richards and Carter/Kings hate around here. They're not Flyers anymore. If it hurts you so much go be a Kings fan.
who said it hurts me? i just want to know the logic behind it. thanks for contributing though.

wow some of you guys can be extremely rude

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