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Why Hate Scott Stevens?

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Old
05-13-2005, 12:04 PM
  #76
#66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marconius
Merciless & malevolent? Sounds like qualities that the NHL demands from it's players. If a player has a chance to take someone out with a clean, hard check and decides to lay off out of mercy, how do you think that goes over with the fans/coach/teamates. Players like that tend to get labelled as soft or not playing tough. The system, as it's set up now, demands that Steven's hits the way he does. Not only do his fans/coaches/teamates require it, but come contract time, what will give Stevens a better salary? If he can say I layed out several players with big, BIG hits last year? Or I had a chance to lay out some players but decided not to?


Hockey is a dangerous game, theres no doubt. High risk = high reward though. If an individual player, IE: Lindros, feels that playing the game within the rules willl be dangerous for him, then he should quit. Simple as that. If I'm on the ice and I know that Lindros has signed a new million dollar contract, despite his concussion history, that's his problem. He took the risk stepping on the ice, if he's not worried about his head, why should I be? Wheres Lindro's responsibility in all of this? If there is such a big threat of Lindros being handicapped for life he should man up and quit the game, instead of risking his life for a couple additional million, when he's set for life already.
So true. Anytime that anyone plays a contact sport, whether its NHL hockey or tackle football with your buddies, you put yourself at risk. Stevens, playing well with in the rules, should not have to lookout for others well being. IMO anyone that calls a him a cheap shot artist has sour grapes. I have more of a problem with players that can't take a clean hit like Messier, Lindros and some others. Even a player like McCabe, that corkscrews people to the ice five feet from the boards drive me nuts.

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05-13-2005, 01:25 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by FLYLine4LIFE
Just want to say also...just because I dont like Stevens, does not mean I dont think he is one of the best defenseman out there. I respect the way he plays in his zone but just not the way he goes out trying to injure players.
Stevens doesn’t need your respect. He hits hard and he hits clean and is going to the Hall of Fame. I never heard anyone claim the Lawrence Taylor or Ronnie Lott where dirty, just great hitters. And someone should have taught Lindros to skate with his dam head up.

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05-13-2005, 01:35 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by Lou is God
Wow, talk about sour grapes.
Nope, just facts, what is there to be sour about?

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05-13-2005, 01:37 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by Jovanovski = Norris
I think everyone is fair game in the proper situations but I do think someone with five major concussions should be let off a bit lightly.
Not in game seven of a semifinal match. Just maybe the Flyer organization rushed Lindros back to soon, when he should have been in the stands watching the game. No way can Stevens let up.

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05-13-2005, 01:48 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by 4check22
For the rest of you who just know ol' Scotty is out to hurt people, put down your PS2 and XBox controllers, pick up a stick and get on the ice. You might actually learn something about the game.
So funny but so true.

He shouldn't hit other players so hard he should just push him off the puck gently.


What next strap pillows to players shoulders so that they dont injure each other when they bump into one another by accidently.

Some people just dont understand contact sports.

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05-13-2005, 01:51 PM
  #81
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When I play(ed) I was a forward version of Stevens. I put 6 kids in the hospital with concussions during high school and tournament hockey in the span of two years. ALL clean hits, but they were hits on the best players and meant to sit them down and take them out for a bit. I understand where Stevens is comming from even as a Ranger fan. He's an incredible player and if I ever faulted him for his hits it'd make me a complete hypocrite. I love his game and tried to emulate it as much as possible as a defensive powerforward. I would always play left wing (we played a left wing lock type system) so I could swing back as the third d-man and just flat out destroy people comming down the ice.

On only one of those hits did I get called for a penalty. And that's because the fans almost started a riot (down in Medford, NJ at a 4-team tournament).

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05-13-2005, 01:58 PM
  #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jovanovski = Norris
1.) Based on precedence (cheapshot to Martin St. Louis).

2.) The fact that he was closer to the puck but targetted Naslund's head (though Naslund did duck a slight bit before the hit).

3.) The fact that Naslund didn't even have the puck and was not a scoring threat in his position.

4.) It was a highly physical and emotionally intense game.


I don't claim my conjecture is right but what transpired was a dirty and murky hit that gave Naslund a minor concussion.
None of those points prove intention one bit.

#1 means nothing. Precedence from ONE hit isn't precedence at all as far as I'm concerned.

#2 Moore didn't really target Naslunds head. If anything, Naslund's head targetted Moore's elbow. You've seen the replays.

#3 raises the point that Naslund wasn't a scoring threat--well shoot, he was in the neutral zone just like Lindros. I'd like to think that no one is a scoring threat in the neutral zone.

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05-13-2005, 02:00 PM
  #83
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I love big hits, and Stevens is a big time hitter. Legal. Clean.

But don't tell me that he doesn't knows that his hits could knock somebody's career out or give them PCS. C'mon how stupid do you think he is, he recognizes Lindros by face and knows who he is hitting. But its Lindros choice to come back and play and put himself at risk.

And for those who says "keep your head up"... how is this supposed to help you? When you're Paul Kariya heading up the ice with the puck and you see Stevens coming to hit you - you might not have time to get out of the way. The size difference is enormous. "Keeping your head up" allows you to brace but doesn't allow you to avoid the hit.

I respect Steven's ability and for his big hits. But punishing somebody with PCS is pretty brutal.

That being said, he is NOT in the same category as Bryan "Knee Killer" Marchment.

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05-13-2005, 02:00 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by Mr.Hunter74
So funny but so true.

He shouldn't hit other players so hard he should just push him off the puck gently.


What next strap pillows to players shoulders so that they dont injure each other when they bump into one another by accidently.

Some people just dont understand contact sports.
Sure, it's a contact sport but do you ever wonder why the players wear protective equipment? I'm going to make a wild guess here and say that the idea is to avoid serious injury. Causing serious injuries to players of the opposing team is not exactly the idea of the game. The idea is the score more goals than they do. The idea of a body check is to separate the player from the puck, right? Not to separate his head from his shoulders.

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Old
05-13-2005, 02:04 PM
  #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ensane
None of those points prove intention one bit.

#2 Moore didn't really target Naslunds head. If anything, Naslund's head targetted Moore's elbow. You've seen the replays.
Uh huh. I've seen the replay. That's like saying "that his money was targetted toward my hand sir!" I had no choice in taking the money! "Or her chest was inching towards my face - what am I supposed to do?"

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Old
05-13-2005, 02:06 PM
  #86
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And btw.

That hit on Naslund was beautiful.

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05-13-2005, 02:09 PM
  #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neogeo69
And for those who says "keep your head up"... how is this supposed to help you? When you're Paul Kariya heading up the ice with the puck and you see Stevens coming to hit you - you might not have time to get out of the way. The size difference is enormous. "Keeping your head up" allows you to brace but doesn't allow you to avoid the hit.

I respect Steven's ability and for his big hits. But punishing somebody with PCS is pretty brutal.

That being said, he is NOT in the same category as Bryan "Knee Killer" Marchment.
Maybe Kariya dumps the puck instead of carrying it up the ice, in which case Stevens has done his job exactly right. Or maybe Kariya takes the time to realize hes playing a sport in which behemoths like Stevens exist and understands that is one of the reasons he gets paid millions per year

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05-13-2005, 02:12 PM
  #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boucicaut
The idea of a body check is to separate the player from the puck, right? Not to separate his head from his shoulders.
Sometimes the 2 go hand-in-hand...

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05-13-2005, 02:13 PM
  #89
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Within the rules of the game of hockey, what Scott Stevens does is totally justifiable. He hits with his shoulder, he's not charging, he doesn't use his stick, he's doing his job. But it's all just a technicality.

What he does is pretty despicable. Hockey is a game and it's also a business. When he knocks out a guy like Eric Lindros, Shane Willis, Ron Francis, Paul Kariya etc. he's not only knocking a guy out of a game, but he's also putting their livelihood in jeopardy and he's seriously damaging their health.

I'm not even suggesting that he should be letting up on his competition, or to go easy on them. It's not about competition. There are literally thousands of games played in an NHL season and dozens of rushes in every game, and some of the times people have their head down. Very seldomly do those plays finish with a guy out cold with a concussion. When Scott Stevens really nails a guy, he's going the extra distance to injure. Sure he's doing it 'legally,' but I don't see how things could be worse if he had used his elbow.

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05-13-2005, 02:14 PM
  #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boucicaut
Sure, it's a contact sport but do you ever wonder why the players wear protective equipment? I'm going to make a wild guess here and say that the idea is to avoid serious injury. Causing serious injuries to players of the opposing team is not exactly the idea of the game. The idea is the score more goals than they do. The idea of a body check is to separate the player from the puck, right? Not to separate his head from his shoulders.
And Stevens isn't a headhunter. He locks onto the core to make firm contact and stop the player dead. Thus effectively separating the player form the puck.

To note Marcus Ragnarsson had about as many elbowing penalties last season as Scott Stevens has his entire career. 4. Stevens does not aim high.

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05-13-2005, 02:16 PM
  #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen
Within the rules of the game of hockey, what Scott Stevens does is totally justifiable. He hits with his shoulder, he's not charging, he doesn't use his stick, he's doing his job. But it's all just a technicality.

What he does is pretty despicable. Hockey is a game and it's also a business. When he knocks out a guy like Eric Lindros, Shane Willis, Ron Francis, Paul Kariya etc. he's not only knocking a guy out of a game, but he's also putting their livelihood in jeopardy and he's seriously damaging their health.

I'm not even suggesting that he should be letting up on his competition, or to go easy on them. It's not about competition. There are literally thousands of games played in an NHL season and dozens of rushes in every game, and some of the times people have their head down. Very seldomly do those plays finish with a guy out cold with a concussion. When Scott Stevens really nails a guy, he's going the extra distance to injure. Sure he's doing it 'legally,' but I don't see how things could be worse if he had used his elbow.
If Stevens would have his elbow up those players you mentioned would have shattered faces and potentially fractured skulls.

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Old
05-13-2005, 02:21 PM
  #92
Marconius
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen
What he does is pretty despicable. Hockey is a game and it's also a business. When he knocks out a guy like Eric Lindros, Shane Willis, Ron Francis, Paul Kariya etc. he's not only knocking a guy out of a game, but he's also putting their livelihood in jeopardy and he's seriously damaging their health.
Its the eqivalent of saying a boxer should hold up on the big punch. In boxing the idea is not to injure you're opponent, but to floor him for the count. Sometimes, though, when you floor him you end up injuring him. It's part of the risk of the livelihood.

Eric Lindros, Shane Willis, Ron Francis, Paul Kariya all understand the rules of the game and they all should be aware that they could be injured within the rules of the game. It's of the reasons they make such good money.

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05-13-2005, 02:23 PM
  #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen
Within the rules of the game of hockey, what Scott Stevens does is totally justifiable. He hits with his shoulder, he's not charging, he doesn't use his stick, he's doing his job. But it's all just a technicality.

What he does is pretty despicable. Hockey is a game and it's also a business. When he knocks out a guy like Eric Lindros, Shane Willis, Ron Francis, Paul Kariya etc. he's not only knocking a guy out of a game, but he's also putting their livelihood in jeopardy and he's seriously damaging their health.

I'm not even suggesting that he should be letting up on his competition, or to go easy on them. It's not about competition. There are literally thousands of games played in an NHL season and dozens of rushes in every game, and some of the times people have their head down. Very seldomly do those plays finish with a guy out cold with a concussion. When Scott Stevens really nails a guy, he's going the extra distance to injure. Sure he's doing it 'legally,' but I don't see how things could be worse if he had used his elbow.

We can say the same about every starting quarterback that got knocked out last year in the NFL. Please!

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05-13-2005, 02:41 PM
  #94
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And while we are at it, since many of you like to use hypothetical situations, name one player whose career was ended by Scott Stevens.

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05-13-2005, 03:13 PM
  #95
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Originally Posted by Matty
Yes. If you knew going into a hit that if you gave it yer all the opposing player may have his life adversly affected, wouldn't you let up a little? It doesn't mean you don't still put him on his arse and make him look the fool, it just means you don't do it with the intent to injure.
I think as fast as things happen out there that is too fine of a line to walk.

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05-13-2005, 03:13 PM
  #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neogeo69
And for those who says "keep your head up"... how is this supposed to help you? When you're Paul Kariya heading up the ice with the puck and you see Stevens coming to hit you - you might not have time to get out of the way. The size difference is enormous. "Keeping your head up" allows you to brace but doesn't allow you to avoid the hit.
Exactly how many big hits have you seen a small guy like Wayne Gretzky take? Not counting the Gary Suter cheap shot he took one big one early in his career against Toronto. Why? He had his head down coming across the middle. Funny how after that hit no one ever got a big clean hit on Gretzky including the likes of Stevens and Potvin. Why? Because his head was always up and he'd see you coming. Sure he gets bumped and checked, but never again was he lined up and drilled.

These are NHL players! Surely these guys can stickhandle without looking down! Especially the skill players. Keeping your head up allows you to react when you see the player coming. Change the angle or brace for the hit, suddenly stop and let him fly right by, pass it off or dump it in. Lots of options. Every single big hit you ever see is nearly always because someone had their head down or turned the wrong way (suicide pass).

If I'm a coach of a team in the playoffs and a player of mine laid off a hit he'd be riding pine.

And I agree with you. Knee hunting is infinitely worse, as are cheap hits from behind. Tactics that I have never, ever seen Stevens use.

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05-13-2005, 03:14 PM
  #97
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Originally Posted by tangible_faith
Why should he let up? There is no way at all that Stevens is a dirty player. If he would have held up on Lindros, there might have been a chance that Lindros would have beat him and went in to score. That could be a game winning goal to knock the team out. He is a big machine and hits harder because of it. He is arguably the most intimidating player in the NHL. If you wanna carry the puck over the blue line, you have to suffer the consequences. Because you knock someone or injure them with a clean HARD hit does not make you dirty. Slashing, hitting from behind and cheap shots are dirty.
Exactly.

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05-13-2005, 03:18 PM
  #98
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Originally Posted by Jason MacIsaac
I don't really care what people think about Stevens, he hits hard and legal. If he lets up then his intimination isn't where it is now making him a worse player, if you let up then you are playing the game the way it should be. Most people are mad because one of their players were victoms.....it is their own damn fault they got hit by Stevens in the first place...KEEP THE HEAD UP.
Couldnt have said it better my friend.

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05-13-2005, 03:23 PM
  #99
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[QUOTE=Jovanovski = Norris]...Stevens at least hits players who have possesion of the puck and hitting the puck-carrier is an acceptable thing to do (even demanded by some coaches)...QUOTE]

See: Kariya... He didn't have the puck. The actuall (only truely) debatable part of this hit was whether it was late or not.

Again, I think Stevens is a GREAT defenseman. One of the best in the league, captaining one of the best teams. I also think, however, that there is a difference between taking someone out of the play, and trying to hurt them. Laying out a guy who sees you comming is one thing, but blindsiding a guy at full speed I will never like, especially if you aim for their head.

(on a side note) I really wish Stevens didn't have Brodeur to handle the puck for him over the years. That goalie saves his dmen so many hits by getting the puck for them. Not taking anything away from either player, but I think Stevens would've been laid out a bunch of times by now if it weren't for Brodeur. (Face it, there's no way to hit him) But more reason to love Brodeur and his game.

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05-13-2005, 03:25 PM
  #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FLYLine4LIFE
Stevens is a cheapshot artist..if you want to admit it or not. He goes out he try to injure players in vulnerable situations...big man! To be honest...when I heard he was out with post-concussion syndrome the first thing i said to myself was, "Boy if theres one player who deserves that more then anyone its good old Scotty"


And yes..i am very biased being a Ranger fan and a huge Lindros fan.

People pity Forsberg when he gets hurt, but that ******* is a cheap shot artist with his stick, i've seen him do soo many slashes and spears with his damn stick and get away with it, its pathetic. That is why i hate that guy, regardless of his talents.

Stevens is one of my favourite defenseman, go find a defenseman that doesn't give a cheap shot, its apart of their position, same with goalies. I have never seen a defenseman that plays clean, if he did he wouldn't last in the NHL for more than a game. People can try to mention a defenseman that does, but chances are he's cross checked the hell out of a player in the lower back when all he had to do was pin him against the board, no such thing as a clean playing defenseman.

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