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It's over, now let's fix it. Keyboard GMs unite.

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Old
05-14-2013, 09:58 PM
  #176
Bure
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Re-sign Riberio and play him with ovechkin. Sign/trade for a scoring winger to play with Backstrom. So we can have a one two punch and not get completely shut down if our top line is struggling.

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05-14-2013, 10:01 PM
  #177
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My vote is Backstrom for a legitimate 1st line scorer. He's on a nice contract that other teams would love to have. I'd feel terrible for many reasons about losing him but it seems necessary. How else can we acquire a top 6 scorer?

If it isn't Backstrom them we have to give up more futures along with guys like MoJo, Laich, Brouwer. Basically all the forwards would have to be trade bait.

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Re-sign Riberio and play him with ovechkin. Sign/trade for a scoring winger to play with Backstrom. So we can have a one two punch and not get completely shut down if our top line is struggling.
Or just get the scorer for Ribs. Either way I agree. But IMO, if we want to get a scorer competent enough to take the load of OV when the 1st line is struggling, we could very well have to give up Green or Backstrom. However, there might be some group of Majo and a 2nd/3rd line forward or whatever combination to get that top 6 scorer.

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05-14-2013, 10:02 PM
  #178
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I think they have to entertain trading Green right now. Unless Backstrom has other issues, I think they have to keep him.

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05-14-2013, 10:03 PM
  #179
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Quality centers are so tough to find though.

I'd trade green while his value is decent.

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05-14-2013, 10:19 PM
  #180
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Nathan Horton would be absolutely perfect.

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05-14-2013, 10:40 PM
  #181
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Originally Posted by caps4cup View Post
Nathan Horton would be absolutely perfect.
RH shot, so there's no spot. If he were left handed, he'd be a perfect fit.

Thinking about it more, unless there's some movement out, really no winger is a good fit. There's not enough cap room.


Last edited by NobodyBeatsTheWiz: 05-14-2013 at 10:46 PM.
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05-14-2013, 10:45 PM
  #182
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Originally Posted by CapitalsCupFantasy View Post
I think they have to entertain trading Green right now. Unless Backstrom has other issues, I think they have to keep him.
Who do they replace Green with though? Too often, he's the only way they breakout of the zone.

Trading him just opens one major hole to fill another. Instead of being short one top-4 defenseman, the team will be short two.

I think they need to trade from the wings and prospect pool to strengthen the defense and/or center spots.

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05-14-2013, 10:50 PM
  #183
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Originally Posted by NobodyBeatsTheWiz View Post
RH shot, so there's no spot. If he were left handed, he'd be a perfect fit.

Thinking about it more, unless there's some movement out, really no winger is a good fit. There's not enough cap room.
I know it's not ideal but Fehr did play on that line. If Horton was LH, it would seem too perfect IMO. Still a great fit.

And as for other posts saying to trade Green... Hell no. You don't trade a guy that could easily be a 25g 80p Dman next year, especially when we are talking about adding offense. He's also our only legit PMD back there. Not even taking into consideration his point totals, the loss of his puck movement on the breakout and regroup alone would hurt tremendously.

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05-14-2013, 11:05 PM
  #184
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It's true, Green's upside is ridiculous now that he's regained his form and actually learned to protect himself.

So if we can't trade Backstrom/Green, we gotta work with packaging MoJo + any of the grinders, I'd still throw Erat in there but McPhee won't so soon, Neuvy, and futures.

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05-14-2013, 11:16 PM
  #185
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Originally Posted by NobodyBeatsTheWiz View Post
You'll be disappointed if you're expecting a direct replacement. Hendricks doesn't come close to Gordon defensively.
No doubt about that. Gordon is an elite PKer and an elite defensive forward. Among the best in the business. I expect he will get paid that way too. We've also got Kyle Chipchura who is half decent defensively, not generally used on the PK despite being a likely candidate for third unit duty, but is a relentless forechecker, usually a willing fighter, and really surprisingly good with the gloves off.

I'm hoping Hendricks could be half way between these two players in all ways. Not an elite defensive forward but not just half decent. A good one. Not an elite PKer but not a guy who's failed to establish himself in the role. Just a good PKer. Not invisible on the forecheck but not a hound on it either. Maybe not the best fighter, but a guy who will at least give it a go. Also not a guy who will command more than two million bucks a year to anchor the 4th line but not necessarily a minimum wage guy who will happily take any one way contract you give him.

I see Hendricks as potentially right in between Gordon and Chipchura. Which is probably just what we need. A wee bit less specialized and a wee bit more appropriately priced.

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05-14-2013, 11:19 PM
  #186
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No doubt about that. Gordon is an elite PKer and an elite defensive forward. Among the best in the business. I expect he will get paid that way too. We've also got Kyle Chipchura who is half decent defensively, not generally used on the PK despite being a likely candidate for third unit duty, but is a relentless forechecker, usually a willing fighter, and really surprisingly good with the gloves off.

I'm hoping Hendricks could be half way between these two players in all ways. Not an elite defensive forward but not just half decent. A good one. Not an elite PKer but not a guy who's failed to establish himself in the role. Just a good PKer. Not invisible on the forecheck but not a hound on it either. Maybe not the best fighter, but a guy who will at least give it a go. Also not a guy who will command more than two million bucks a year to anchor the 4th line but not necessarily a minimum wage guy who will happily take any one way contract you give him.

I see Hendricks as potentially right in between Gordon and Chipchura. Which is probably just what we need. A wee bit less specialized and a wee bit more appropriately priced.
Is there any reason Gordon wasn't traded at the deadline? Unavailable/no interest?

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05-14-2013, 11:27 PM
  #187
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Originally Posted by Halpysback View Post
Is there any reason Gordon wasn't traded at the deadline? Unavailable/no interest?
No idea. I'm sure there would've been interest, but didn't hear of any rumored offers at all.

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Originally Posted by rt View Post
I'm hoping Hendricks could be half way between these two players in all ways. Not an elite defensive forward but not just half decent. A good one. Not an elite PKer but not a guy who's failed to establish himself in the role. Just a good PKer. Not invisible on the forecheck but not a hound on it either. Maybe not the best fighter, but a guy who will at least give it a go. Also not a guy who will command more than two million bucks a year to anchor the 4th line but not necessarily a minimum wage guy who will happily take any one way contract you give him.

I see Hendricks as potentially right in between Gordon and Chipchura. Which is probably just what we need. A wee bit less specialized and a wee bit more appropriately priced.
Pretty much this. A affordable jack of all trades that can hopefully knocks out two birds with one stone. Hendricks doesn't necessarily have to have an absolute advantage in any particular skill over whom he's replacing, just needs to be serviceable in giving us what we'd like in a 4th line role while also providing some added financial flexibility (which is always in short supply for us). And any offense he provides whether it be in regulation or the SO is just a bonus.


Last edited by IPreferPi: 05-14-2013 at 11:35 PM.
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05-14-2013, 11:34 PM
  #188
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Originally Posted by Halpysback View Post
Is there any reason Gordon wasn't traded at the deadline? Unavailable/no interest?
Elliotte Friedman said he was unavailable and that the Coyotes wanted to keep him.

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Old
05-14-2013, 11:41 PM
  #189
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Originally Posted by IPreferPi View Post
Pretty much this. A affordable jack of all trades that can hopefully knocks out two birds with one stone. Hendricks doesn't necessarily have to have an absolute advantage in any particular skill over whom he's replacing, just needs to be serviceable in giving us what we'd like in a 4th line role while also providing some added financial flexibility (which is always in short supply for us). And any offense he provides whether it be in regulation or the SO is just a bonus.
The issue you'll run into with Hendricks is the salary flexibility, I'd think. If he hits the market, I bet he looks for a deal closer to the $2M mark than the $1M mark. In that situation, an AHL call-up probably offers as much value for money.

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05-14-2013, 11:46 PM
  #190
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Originally Posted by NobodyBeatsTheWiz View Post
The issue you'll run into with Hendricks is the salary flexibility, I'd think. If he hits the market, I bet he looks for a deal closer to the $2M mark than the $1M mark. In that situation, an AHL call-up probably offers as much value for money.
Well we'll see. If he wants $2 million I'd rather just give Gordon that money. But I don't think there is a team is actually going to give a 34 year old career 4th liner who's not an elite faceoff ace/defensive forward like Gordon or Gaustad that type of money, with the cap going down and whatnot. Probably would top out at a 1.25 million offer for Hendricks.

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05-15-2013, 12:00 AM
  #191
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Originally Posted by Ref9 View Post
You know he was one of the guys along with his fellow countryman I had in mind as moving when I was writing my comments. If you look at the 2014 Capgeek projected free agents at center, there are some real attractive options.

Malkin, Evgeni C PIT 26 $8,700,000 2014 (UFA)
Thornton, Joe C SJS 33 $7,000,000 2014 (UFA)
Datsyuk, Pavel C DET 34 $6,700,000 2014 (UFA)
Stastny, Paul C COL 27 $6,600,000 2014 (UFA)
Sedin, Henrik C VAN 32 $6,100,000 2014 (UFA)
Bergeron, Patrice C BOS 27 $5,000,000 2014 (UFA)
Jokinen, Olli C WIN 34 $4,500,000 2014 (UFA)
Legwand, David C NAS 32 $4,500,000 2014 (UFA)
Pavelski, Joe C SJS 28 $4,000,000 2014 (UFA
If we could somehow get Datsyuk, that'd be great.

He's old now, but he still looks like one of the most overall valuable players to me. Kuznetsov to Datsyuk to Ovechkin!

I'm dreaming, I know.

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05-15-2013, 12:11 AM
  #192
Maruk moustache
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Yeah I guess for Mr. Datsyuk it's Detroit or Russia. Oh well. http://www.*******************/artic...on-245210.html

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05-15-2013, 12:15 AM
  #193
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Put Ovechkin back on the left and you have room for Horton. **** this slavish left-right adherence with a rake. Which one of Kunitz/Dupuis/Neal is a right shot? Which one of Brown/Williams is a left shot? Is Vanek useless playing on his off wing?

Call up Orlov and put him on his off side too. Worst case we win more hockey games.

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05-15-2013, 12:18 AM
  #194
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Pretty crazy that Pascal Dupuis is the highest point scoring FA winger (in goals as well) as of right now. If we're going the FA route, David Clarkson, Michael Ryder, or Nathan Horton would be the ones I'd target to be our 2nd leading goal scorer next season behind OV.

I think we're better off trading for that piece.

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05-15-2013, 12:43 AM
  #195
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Why not Dupuis? He's shown the ability to put the puck in the net given a good opportunity.

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05-15-2013, 01:10 AM
  #196
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I really think PIT will resign him, if not he'll get overpaid and I'm not sure if he'd go to a rival team like the Caps. But then again Talbot walked away to the Flyers so who knows in that regard.

Another reason I wouldn't take Dupuis is because he doesn't have the track record of being able to put up 20+ goals consistently. Horton and Ryder have great records to prove that they can put up 20-30 goals every year. Dupuis' 1st time hitting 20+ was last year in a full season where he got 25. This year he got 20 again in a short season. I'll give him props there but I don't fully buy it. He's been helped immensly by playing alongside Crosby and that's the main reason he's gotten that production lately. On the Caps, he'd drown in our sea of grinders and we wouldn't be able to tell the difference between him and Brooks Laich.

Horton is a gamechanger. It'd be nice to snag him.

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05-15-2013, 01:20 AM
  #197
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I don't think there is any simple fix, like sell A, obtain a player like B, and that'll somehow cure us.

We need better cap & asset management and better performance out of our top players -- these are our main systemic problems.

Cap management is what allows you to field a deep team that puts opponents on their heels in playoffs, and can overcome individual scoring droughts. We had ~5.5m worth of defensemen just sitting on the bench because of poor management.. (and actually we had another 9m were injured in Erat and Laich, so basically the team was at 80-85% strength (relative to cap) at the end there, so actually not a terrible performance overall if you think about it). And that's not even counting players that played but were overpaid.

As far as top players we have a separate painful issue. I've never been a fan of Ovi-Backstrom pairing, and this series was (another) nail in the coffin. However, for this I kind of blame the coaches more. Neither Backstrom nor Ovi exhibit a high work rate. I think Backstrom is simply not very athletic; Ovi coasts between somewhat rare bursts. There is no player in the universe with the work-rate to offset those two enough for a high-intensity playoff game. Ovi and Backstrom need to be on separate lines with higher-energy linemates, before even getting to specifics. I mean a top line that can get regularly pinned in its own zone in playoffs is a joke.. But I dunno what we can expect here. Coaches need to figure it out; and GM needs to provide more options for experimentation.

I guess the core is a bit mentally fragile, but they've never had the support of a truly deep team to help carry them over the hump to get that confidence and experience. I think a shakeup for the sake of a shakeup is pointless. We need a deeper team all around, and for out top line to be a top line at ES. All moves involving roster players need to be viewed through this prism.

But as fans, at this point, I think it's like BobRouse has said recently, we just have to stop stressing out about things that are here to stay for the conceivable future. We know what Leonsis & McPhee are at this point. All we can hope for is that they are capable of at least slowly learning something about building a winning team. I think we can be a bit more optimistic about Oates, though I am pretty disappointed at lack of adjustment against Rags. But he comes across like someone capable of learning, plus he should have a good rapport with players. And then there's always luck, puncher's chance, whatever.

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05-15-2013, 02:13 AM
  #198
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I can agree with everything you said. Backstrom isn't very athletic and seems to be getting slower every year, maybe it's the injuries. Regardless, they don't complement each other in today's game because both are kind of lazy. Our 1st line has no boardplay whatsoever. That line relies solely on the rush and it's easy to defend now. Defensively you can't rely on Backstrom and the D to do everything but it seems we can't expect OV and MoJo to become defensive helpers. There are a lot of different angles to look at. Either way it does somewhat fall on the coaches. Both OV and Nicky are big enough to be efficient along the boards but they don't support each other. OV just doesn't seem to want to be around the boards and then Nicky is left with a soft MoJo to generate a cycle to create space for OV. It doesn't work and never will. All 3 need to be doing the work behind the net and even then MoJo just doesn't suit that style. The coaches needs to adjust this somehow.

Now the reason I think Backstrom is somewhat expendable is because it's much more worth it to find complementary active players for OV rather than for Backstrom. Backstrom seems lazy overall, whereas OV simply misuses his energy but has a ton more upside.

It's probably just more simple to play Ribs with OV and let the hustling/grinding 2nd line wingers play with Backstrom but we still need that scoring depth for the 2nd line.

You can tell the core is mentally fragile because they know they're the ones that ultimately need to get it done and everyone looks up to them to do it. Every since they got into the league they've been forced into that role and are learning how to deal with it the hard way by actually doing it. They never got to grow under veterans consistently. Federov and Arnott took them under their wings when they were here but that wasn't long enough. These guys will be 30 by the time they can truly figure out what it takes to win and how to keep their minds in check.

As for our cap-management, that's all on McPhee. I can't see him fixing this either. Hopefully Oates can influence him to make the right moves.


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05-15-2013, 05:03 AM
  #199
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Ah, how I'd love these lines:

Ovechkin-Backstrom-Erat
Laich-Ribeiro-Horton
Brouwer-Perreault-Fehr
Chimera-Beagle-Hendricks

Scuderi-Green
Alzner-Carlson
Orlov-Oleksy

Holtby
-Insert veteran goalie here-

That'd be good, if we had the cap space.

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05-15-2013, 05:20 AM
  #200
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Ranger fan coming in peace: I think your coach needs to go. Oates stood like quiet like a church mouse for the series. I know torts is a clown of a coach, but Oates has to show some emotion. The team should see some passion from their coach. If he had expressed some fire maybe things would have gone different. Wash was the more talented team in this series.

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