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Old
05-20-2013, 06:53 PM
  #726
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Originally Posted by live playoff hockey View Post
Why is MDZ available?

It is well documented that Kassian had a rough year, but the potential is obviously there and he has shown signs of being the PWF we all want.
We have seen shifts from Kassian. That's it. Not periods, not games but shifts.

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Old
05-20-2013, 07:00 PM
  #727
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I'm still on as Drouin as the player we probably need most in the top thirty.

However, moving up with a 7-8 pick for Zadorov, and using our pick for Mantha (I'm calling it now, even if our pick is moved or we get into the teens). I have a feeling Nurse, who may still be around in the latter half of the top ten according to scouting reports, might be gone sooner with Carolina probably needing a defender more then a forward.

What could we give to Calgary, Edmonton, Buffalo, or New Jersey for their pick? Nashville or Carolina if they want to surrender another first (both were moved last season, which is why I exclude them).

Zadorov or Nurse and Mantha is a good haul in the first round, and while the defenders might not be able to break into our line up (with our lefty depth and all), Mantha looks like he could be ready for 3rd line duties.

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Old
05-20-2013, 07:01 PM
  #728
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Originally Posted by LiquidSnake View Post
Nash and Gaborik are one dimensional players. Richards won a cup with LA and was solid in the playoffs while the Flyers are a non playoff team.
Are you saying Kesler is better than those guys? They are different players, but you should wash out your koolaid container ever so often. Kesler is not the Monster player, is no all-star, and can't carry a team offensively for more than a couple games in a row. I just don't get the man-crush, but then again we are the nation that has immortalized Trevor...

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05-20-2013, 07:09 PM
  #729
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Originally Posted by Danny34 View Post
I don't know, he played pretty well with Hamhuis, wouldn't mind keeping those two together!
that leaves Edler-Bieksa... :puke:

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Old
05-20-2013, 07:12 PM
  #730
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cogburn View Post
I'm still on as Drouin as the player we probably need most in the top thirty.

However, moving up with a 7-8 pick for Zadorov, and using our pick for Mantha (I'm calling it now, even if our pick is moved or we get into the teens). I have a feeling Nurse, who may still be around in the latter half of the top ten according to scouting reports, might be gone sooner with Carolina probably needing a defender more then a forward.

What could we give to Calgary, Edmonton, Buffalo, or New Jersey for their pick? Nashville or Carolina if they want to surrender another first (both were moved last season, which is why I exclude them).

Zadorov or Nurse and Mantha is a good haul in the first round, and while the defenders might not be able to break into our line up (with our lefty depth and all), Mantha looks like he could be ready for 3rd line duties.
If we draft 7 or 8, I'd be very angry if we did not take Sean Monahan or Hunter Shinkaruk.

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Old
05-20-2013, 07:21 PM
  #731
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Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
If we draft 7 or 8, I'd be very angry if we did not take Sean Monahan or Hunter Shinkaruk.
Monahan would be nice, but while we have two potential top six prospects (Jensen for sure, Gaunce as an elite 3/good 2 guy) that are still likely to make the NHL in a similar time frame, we have Sauve and Corrado, who both project to be middle pairing at best, on defense.

Shinkaruk is a talented guy two, but with Lindholm and Barkov available in the 10 ten, and Lazar and Horvat who might crack the top 10 too, I think the two defenders I mentioned would be better choices.

Edit: What I forgot to say is I expect Monahan to be gone when Calgary gets to him, and well, we'd have to overpay for that pick.

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Old
05-20-2013, 07:29 PM
  #732
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Originally Posted by Nuckles37 View Post
I'm hoping that under a new coaching staff Bieksa wont be allowed to play as a 4th forward.

If we could get Bieksa and Edler to play well defensively...HNNNNGGGGHHHH
I think there needs to be a new stipulation in the coach's contract. "You are not allowed to pair Edler and Bieksa together under any circumstances. Injuries? Try Burrows on defense first."

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Old
05-20-2013, 07:29 PM
  #733
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I would think the Preds would have a lot of interest in Kesler, Kesler for their 1st and Forsberg, that's in line with what Carter and Richards got.

Sens would have interest in Bieksa, Bieksa for Turris - they have Zibanejad on the raise and could make Turris replaceable for a guy like Bieksa, who Sens have a need for.

Sedin Sedin Burrows
Forsberg Turris Kassian
Higgins (Gaunce?) Hansen

Edler Garrison
Hamhuis Tanev
(Alberts?) Corrado

Schneider

This puts us in a spot to draft Mackinnon or Barkov and really gives us a future well staying competitive now.

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Old
05-20-2013, 07:38 PM
  #734
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cogburn View Post
Monahan would be nice, but while we have two potential top six prospects (Jensen for sure, Gaunce as an elite 3/good 2 guy) that are still likely to make the NHL in a similar time frame, we have Sauve and Corrado, who both project to be middle pairing at best, on defense.

Shinkaruk is a talented guy two, but with Lindholm and Barkov available in the 10 ten, and Lazar and Horvat who might crack the top 10 too, I think the two defenders I mentioned would be better choices.

Edit: What I forgot to say is I expect Monahan to be gone when Calgary gets to him, and well, we'd have to overpay for that pick.
Monahan and Shinkaruk both project as 1st or 2nd line forwards. That's something the Canucks desperately need in the system. Our defense is signed long-term to high contracts with NTC's. We also have several good defensive prospects (not including Sauve whom I don't think projects as an NHL defenseman at all anymore). I'd rather draft BPA and go for one of the high end forwards rather than yet another defenseman. Although, unless something seriously changes with our development process whoever we draft at forward we'll probably end up ruining or dealing away anyhow.

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Old
05-20-2013, 07:46 PM
  #735
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iFan View Post
I would think the Preds would have a lot of interest in Kesler, Kesler for their 1st and Forsberg, that's in line with what Carter and Richards got.

Sens would have interest in Bieksa, Bieksa for Turris - they have Zibanejad on the raise and could make Turris replaceable for a guy like Bieksa, who Sens have a need for.

Sedin Sedin Burrows
Forsberg Turris Kassian
Higgins (Gaunce?) Hansen

Edler Garrison
Hamhuis Tanev
(Alberts?) Corrado

Schneider

This puts us in a spot to draft Mackinnon or Barkov and really gives us a future well staying competitive now.
Obviously that's a rebuilding team, but why not go full retard and move Burrows and Edler too? I'm not being sarcastic here, but if we're investing so heavily in getting our rookies starter, Burrows being replaced by Jensen and Edler by Sauve simply speeds the rebuild somewhat. Plus, I think combined, we could still get a second top 5 pick and another prospect who projects a year or two away.

If we decided to rebuild in dramatic fashion, I'd like to move Edler and Luongo too, and any other moving part that might net us a return.

Quote:
Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
Monahan and Shinkaruk both project as 1st or 2nd line forwards. That's something the Canucks desperately need in the system. Our defense is signed long-term to high contracts with NTC's. We also have several good defensive prospects (not including Sauve whom I don't think projects as an NHL defenseman at all anymore). I'd rather draft BPA and go for one of the high end forwards rather than yet another defenseman. Although, unless something seriously changes with our development process whoever we draft at forward we'll probably end up ruining or dealing away anyhow.
I agree that both project to be very good, but someone later like Lazar or even Mantha (bigger, younger...) isn't exactly expected to be a bust either.

As for the NTC bit with the defenders, I do fully expect Edler to be moved before his NTC. Thats how I postulate we get the pick in the first place. Garrison, Hamhuis, Bieksa and Tanev is great, but Bieksa is already in his thirties and plays a physical game...when one of the two defenders are ready for top pairing minutes, Bieksa, and possibly others, could be wearing down.

And I'd argue Nurse is the BPA at 7-8-9, if he makes it, and Zadorov is equal to Monahan.

Differences of opinions I guess.

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Old
05-20-2013, 08:00 PM
  #736
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Only thing with trading Edler is he'll be very tough to replace, we'd need a younger top pairing D man coming back who can can move the puck, maybe Blues would swap Edler for Shattenkirk, I think they need help on the left side and we could use the help on the right side Shattenkirk is a few years younger so he can grow with the team. So D pairings would be

Hamhuis Shattenkirk
Garrison Tanev
Alberts Corrado

I don't see Gillis tanking it, he'll want this team to be as competitive as possible and even in our new tougher division we should still be in a playoff spot, we'd be better than Oilers, Calgary and Yotes not as good as LA or Sharks, Ducks would be debatable. Turris has really taken some steps forward and becoming solid defensively and would be a solid #2 center, I'm not sure how ready Forsberg is but we could bri up Jensen in replace of him or do some linen juggling

Sedin Sedin Kassian
Burrows Turris Jensen
Forsberg (Barkov) Hansen
Higgins (Gaunce)

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Old
05-20-2013, 08:06 PM
  #737
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Barkov is a consensus 4th overall pick, and Nashville surrendered their first last year.

What do we offer them?

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Old
05-20-2013, 08:11 PM
  #738
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cogburn View Post
Barkov is a consensus 4th overall pick, and Nashville surrendered their first last year.

What do we offer them?
Kesler, they would have a need for him and I could see them very high on him given his type of play and strong defensively and that Kesler destroyed them in the playoffs, their first and Forsberg would be very comparable to Schenn(5th overall) and Simmons. This would give us some solid centers moving forward with Barkov, Turris and Gaunce moving into the future with after the Twins but also let's them all develop while the Sedins are still here.

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Old
05-20-2013, 08:21 PM
  #739
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Originally Posted by iFan View Post
Kesler, they would have a need for him and I could see them very high on him given his type of play and strong defensively and that Kesler destroyed them in the playoffs, their first and Forsberg would be very comparable to Schenn(5th overall) and Simmons. This would give us some solid centers moving forward with Barkov, Turris and Gaunce moving into the future with after the Twins but also let's them all develop while the Sedins are still here.
Losing Kesler = total rebuild to me.

Even if we don't aim to tank next year, if we move Kesler, I feel we're better off trading all tradable assets for futures.

Burrows
Edler
Bieksa

Blow it up.

It makes the Sedins our core, and we would then have to replace anyone else without a NMC. I'd make an exception for Hansen I think, but everyone else I'd want gone to do this thing properly.

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Old
05-20-2013, 08:26 PM
  #740
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Originally Posted by thepuckmonster View Post
Does it count as hockey?

Debatable.
But you mention trade him for a guy like Hemsky and you guys will go nuts. Hemmer only has a year on his deal.

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Old
05-20-2013, 08:31 PM
  #741
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Originally Posted by Cogburn View Post
Losing Kesler = total rebuild to me.

Even if we don't aim to tank next year, if we move Kesler, I feel we're better off trading all tradable assets for futures.

Burrows
Edler
Bieksa

Blow it up.

It makes the Sedins our core, and we would then have to replace anyone else without a NMC. I'd make an exception for Hansen I think, but everyone else I'd want gone to do this thing properly.
There's no way Gillis or the owners will allow a full rebuild it would be a transition, they'd want to to get younger and still want to make the playoffs. Even with those trades we'd have Barkov, Turris and Gaunce making up are future centers which is pretty solid and brings in size for the top 9 centers with all being sound defensively, wingers aren't too bad moving forward Forsberg, Kassian and Jensen all bring size and skill and their solid defensively. We have Edler signed for 6 more years and he's a #1 I don't see the big reason to trade him we can keep him seeing how Garrison is solid on the right side him and Tanev would be great right side D man and Edler and Hamhuis on the left side is as good as it gets and Schneider in net makes this a tough team to score against.

Honestly I'd rather move the twins than Kesler but Sedins don't have the value to speed up this transition. Kesler could bring back a lot and really quicken this up. I wouldn't be against moving Burrows for a younger scorer


Last edited by iFan: 05-20-2013 at 08:38 PM.
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Old
05-20-2013, 08:37 PM
  #742
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Originally Posted by Verviticus View Post
now why would you care about a 4-7 game sample

edit: lol 4 in 6 isnt better than 3 in 4
Marc-Anderi Gragani ha 7 points I'm his 1 at playoff season to put things into perspective. Though I agree Cizikas and Martin are ideal 4 th liners. Don't know if I'd move Bieksa for them but they are quality bottom 6 players.

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Old
05-20-2013, 08:38 PM
  #743
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There's no way Gillis or the owners will allow a full rebuild it would be a transition, they'd want to to get younger and still want to make the playoffs. Even with those trades we'd have Barkov, Turris and Gaunce making up are future centers which is pretty solid and brings in size for the top 9 centers with all being sound defensively, wingers aren't too bad moving forward Forsberg, Kassian and Jensen all bring size and skill and their solid defensively. We have Edler signed for 6 more years and he's a #1 I don't see the big reason to trade him we can keep him seeing how Garrison is solid on the right side him and Tanev would be great right side D man and Edler and Hamhuis on the left side is as good as it gets and Schneider in net makes this a tough team to score against.

Honestly I'd rather move the twins than Kesler but Sedins don't have the value to speed up this transition. Kesler could bring back a lot and really quicken this up.
While I agree that trading the Sedins and Kesler will "quicken this up," I imagine we would fundamentally disagree on what the result of this quickening would be.

Of course, I can take some relief in the fact that Gillis would not do this...

Because he is a professional.

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Old
05-20-2013, 08:53 PM
  #744
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Kesler
Edler

for

Weber
Forsberg/1st

We might have to add, but that would be so tempting.

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Old
05-20-2013, 09:05 PM
  #745
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Originally Posted by mooped View Post
Kesler
Edler

for

Weber
Forsberg/1st

We might have to add, but that would be so tempting.
I take that and run. This is coming for a person who calls Kesler his favourite player and owns his jersey. Weber is one of the only players in the league I'd trade Kesler+ for.

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Old
05-20-2013, 09:09 PM
  #746
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Originally Posted by Cogburn View Post
Losing Kesler = total rebuild to me.

Even if we don't aim to tank next year, if we move Kesler, I feel we're better off trading all tradable assets for futures.

Burrows
Edler
Bieksa

Blow it up.

It makes the Sedins our core, and we would then have to replace anyone else without a NMC. I'd make an exception for Hansen I think, but everyone else I'd want gone to do this thing properly.
If that happened I think the Sedins would just go back to Sweden & we'd be screwed.
The twins are untradeable & have said they'd like to finish their careers back in Sweden.
I think they'll stick around as long as they think we have a shot to win, start gutting the team & they'll just be gone.

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Old
05-20-2013, 09:37 PM
  #747
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would this work?

sedins/loui eriksson. *given their chemistry in the tournament)
trade edler to dallas. straight up.
lou:gones for picks/prospects
ballard:gone

sign boyd gordon/matt hendricks for 4th line duty. faceoff specialist. and the rest of the lineup filled with rookies.

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Old
05-20-2013, 09:42 PM
  #748
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Originally Posted by mooped View Post
Kesler
Edler

for

Weber
Forsberg/1st

We might have to add, but that would be so tempting.
You would think Nashville would expect Kesler + Edler for Weber alone.

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Old
05-20-2013, 10:03 PM
  #749
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You would think Nashville would expect Kesler + Edler for Weber alone.
Uh, no.

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Old
05-20-2013, 10:14 PM
  #750
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Even in the middle of the year I thought we could get a 2nd for Ballard... how did we not move him at the deadline?

Now you almost want to give him a chance under a new coach.

--------------------------------------

I wonder if NSH would do Schroeder for Blum straight up. Blum seems like surplus goods there but would fill a need here.

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