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2013 Draft Thread: "Shoo-in for Nichushkin"

View Poll Results: Draft goes Jones/Mackinnon/Drouin/Barkov/Nichushkin/Nurse. Who should they take?
Monahan 138 73.02%
Lindholm 51 26.98%
Voters: 189. You may not vote on this poll

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05-24-2013, 11:01 AM
  #576
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Quote:
Originally Posted by s7ark View Post
I am really hoping this is the case. Stauffer's list with Lazar and Horvat ahead of Lindholm scared me.
Those two are the exact type of players we need and are missing on this team. Why in the world would that scare you?

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05-24-2013, 11:12 AM
  #577
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
Those two are the exact type of players we need and are missing on this team. Why in the world would that scare you?
Because there is every possibility that there will be players like them available to us with our 1st in next years draft, whereas we likely won't be drafting high enough to get a guy like Lindholm again in the near future.

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05-24-2013, 11:20 AM
  #578
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
Those two are the exact type of players we need and are missing on this team. Why in the world would that scare you?
Because these are the types of players available in the 15-30 range every year. You never take them 7th overall.

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05-24-2013, 11:22 AM
  #579
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Originally Posted by dustrock View Post
Re the comments on faceoffs, I get that it's not the be-all, end-all, yet I look at players like Datsyuk, Bergeron, Richards, Thornton, etc., and teams that have overall great faceoff stats (Boston, LA, SJ), and to me it's an advantage overall.

If Lindholm was 58% last year that's pretty great considering he was playing against men.
Where did that number come from and any chance we have the numbers of how many faceoffs he took this year? I was under the impression that Lindholm played RW all year for Brynas

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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
Those two are the exact type of players we need and are missing on this team. Why in the world would that scare you?
Completely agree. The fact that people are acting like it would be the end of the world if we drafted Lazar or Horvat is very sad. These guys bring exactly what we lack in a position we have no depth in and are some of the safest draft picks out there. I have no doubt in my mind these guys would be excellent 2C's while playing with highly skilled wingers and bringing that physical edge we need.

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05-24-2013, 11:34 AM
  #580
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Originally Posted by Soundwave View Post
Hmm, I wonder if the Oilers aren't talking up this kid for a reason.
This is what Lowetide said on his show yesterday. He said the oilers would run up to the podium if Lindholm was available. I posted tht in here and got flames because apparently "Lowetide knows nothing".

He brought up that MacT has been scouting Sweden for the Oilers before he was moved up so he definitely has him on the radar.

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05-24-2013, 11:35 AM
  #581
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Originally Posted by Kyle Brodziak View Post
Where did that number come from and any chance we have the numbers of how many faceoffs he took this year? I was under the impression that Lindholm played RW all year for Brynas


First off, bookmark the below link. It is a really good Swedish stats site once you get the hang of it.

Second he was 58%, problem is that's on 67 draws.



http://stats.swehockey.se/Teams/Info...am/2892#Brynäs IF

Teammate Johnathan Grannstrom is decent on the draw at 55%. Just about leads the league and pims as well.

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05-24-2013, 11:35 AM
  #582
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Originally Posted by s7ark View Post
Because there is every possibility that there will be players like them available to us with our 1st in next years draft, whereas we likely won't be drafting high enough to get a guy like Lindholm again in the near future.
So you want to put off filling holes for another year?

Quote:
Originally Posted by magnoctophas View Post
Because these are the types of players available in the 15-30 range every year. You never take them 7th overall.
Feel free to name one player that is comparable to Lazar that went 15-30 last year.

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05-24-2013, 11:40 AM
  #583
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
So you want to put off filling holes for another year?



Feel free to name one player that is comparable to Lazar that went 15-30 last year.
13. Radek Faksa
14. Zemgus Girgensons
20. Scott Laughton
26. Brendan Gaunce

Name one player in 2012 from 15-30 that compares to Lindholm.

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05-24-2013, 11:40 AM
  #584
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Originally Posted by DousedInOil View Post
This is what Lowetide said on his show yesterday. He said the oilers would run up to the podium if Lindholm was available. I posted tht in here and got flames because apparently "Lowetide knows nothing".

He brought up that MacT has been scouting Sweden for the Oilers before he was moved up so he definitely has him on the radar.
He has know ties to the team so why would he know who the Oilers would draft was my point. He's the last guy from the media that I'd take his word for who the Oilers will take.

Not saying he knows nothing about prospects, but he has no better idea who the Oilers would take than you would or myself.

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05-24-2013, 11:44 AM
  #585
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Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
He has know ties to the team so why would he know who the Oilers would draft was my point. He's the last guy from the media that I'd take his word for who the Oilers will take.

Not saying he knows nothing about prospects, but he has no better idea who the Oilers would take than you would or myself.
Fair enough. I thought he had some connections.

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05-24-2013, 11:50 AM
  #586
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
So you want to put off filling holes for another year?
Do you really expect this year's pick to jump in and fill a hole?

And when did you start wanting to draft for current need over bpa?

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05-24-2013, 11:52 AM
  #587
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Originally Posted by s7ark View Post
Because there is every possibility that there will be players like them available to us with our 1st in next years draft, whereas we likely won't be drafting high enough to get a guy like Lindholm again in the near future.
Thats a good point but I just feel like if we were trying to draft a #1 C, the difference between Lindholm and Lazar is huge but trying to draft a center to fill the role we need of a physical #2C, the difference isnt as big. I would always take Lindholm before Lazar but if Lindholm and Monahan are gone, then I have no problems with reaching for Lazar or Horvat for that matter. They will already be playing with highly skilled wingers on the 2nd line so I don't see offensive upside being the biggest concern for us. I see the biggest concern being physicallity and two way play for our 2C.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trafalgar Law View Post
Because these are the types of players available in the 15-30 range every year. You never take them 7th overall.
This is wrong. Those type of players can be found from 1-30 in the first round, it's just the offensive upside that scouts see that makes the difference. We took Gagner 6th overall and he was rated there by the scouts because of his offensive upside. It doesn't mean he would make a bigger impact as a 2C like other guys selected later in rounds with not as much offensive upside would make.

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05-24-2013, 11:55 AM
  #588
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Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
First off, bookmark the below link. It is a really good Swedish stats site once you get the hang of it.

Second he was 58%, problem is that's on 67 draws.



http://stats.swehockey.se/Teams/Info...am/2892#Brynäs IF

Teammate Johnathan Grannstrom is decent on the draw at 55%. Just about leads the league and pims as well.
Awesome! Thanks my friend

I think 67 is still a decent indicator, especially against men. I was expecting his faceoffs to be less playing on the wing

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05-24-2013, 12:01 PM
  #589
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You guys sure are underrating Horvat and Lazar. These guys would be top 10 picks in most other years and may actually be top 10 picks this year.

They are both sure-fire NHLers. The only question is if they are 3rd liners or better. When the success rate for 1st rd picks is 65% - getting a sure thing should be appealing to most fans. Combine that with all the things these two would bring (that help teams win) and we should be happy getting one of them.

Most of you have been asking for players like these and blame our current lack of success on not having them and want to pay through the nose for players like them (Backes for example) but drafting our own Backes/Bergeron/Brown/Doan/M. Richards type player would be end of the world?

If Monahan is gone I have no problem getting one of Horvat or Lazar

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05-24-2013, 12:02 PM
  #590
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Originally Posted by Trafalgar Law View Post
Because these are the types of players available in the 15-30 range every year. You never take them 7th overall.
exactly... lazar is a dime a dozen type of player... there are players like him available in the 10-15 range pretty much every year.... we aren't likely to be picking 7th overall again next year, or with any luck, in the foreseeable future

BPA, BPA, BPA, BPA... a million times, BPA

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05-24-2013, 12:02 PM
  #591
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Originally Posted by doubledown99 View Post
You guys sure are underrating Horvat and Lazar. These guys would be top 10 picks in most other years and may actually be top 10 picks this year.

They are both sure-fire NHLers. The only question is if they are 3rd liners or better. When the success rate for 1st rd picks is 65% - getting a sure thing should be appealing to most fans. Combine that with all the things these two would bring (that help teams win) and we should be happy getting one of them.

Most of you have been asking for players like these and blame our current lack of success on not having them and want to pay through the nose for players like them (Backes for example) but drafting our own Backes/Bergeron/Brown/Doan/M. Richards type player would be end of the world?
Monahan/Lindholm sound likely they project more to be in that range of players you cited than Lazar/Horvat. I have heard Patrice Bergeron comparisons to Lindholm several times. That's nice that they would be top 10 picks in other draft years, but we're picking in this one and if we're keeping the pick, we owe it to ourselves to take the BPA honestly.

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05-24-2013, 12:06 PM
  #592
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I wonder which fans outside Edmonton think is a bigger stretch.

Lazar to the oilers at 7 or Shinkaruk to the flames at 6?

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05-24-2013, 12:06 PM
  #593
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Originally Posted by Soundwave View Post
Monahan/Lindholm sound likely they project more to be in that range of players you cited than Lazar/Horvat. I have heard Patrice Bergeron comparisons to Lindholm several times.
I think Horvat is a carbon copy of P. Bergeron. Horvat is on the ice all the time in all situations.

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05-24-2013, 12:06 PM
  #594
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Awesome! Thanks my friend

I think 67 is still a decent indicator, especially against men. I was expecting his faceoffs to be less playing on the wing
The only issue with the site is you can't just click on a players name to get more detail. I find myself going back and forth just to see a couple things.

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05-24-2013, 12:08 PM
  #595
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trafalgar Law View Post
I think MacT's comments yesterday were a smokescreen for Elias Lindholm.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dustrock View Post
It boggles the mind that Mac T wouldn't at least be considering him. I agree that it could very well be a smokescreen.
I think a lot of what he said was a smokescreen. Too many little inconsistencies between the different things he said. Like wanting to sign Gagner long-term but refusing to name him as a part of the 6 core players (fwiw, I think his top 6 are the big 4 plus Schultz and Klefbom).

Regardless, I'll still be shocked if we actually use the pick. Only way it happens IMO is if someone falls to 7 that they had ranked too high to pass up. Fully expect Bettman to take the podium when its our turn to select.

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05-24-2013, 12:09 PM
  #596
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And Lazar really does look like Brown/M. Richards.

IATL maybe you want to weigh in here with your thoughts on Lazar and type of player u think he is?

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05-24-2013, 12:15 PM
  #597
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
Those two are the exact type of players we need and are missing on this team. Why in the world would that scare you?
Because it's harder to get a Lindholm/Monahan than it is to get a Horvat/Lazar.

Getting a 1/2C is much tougher than a 2/3C. Those are guys you can sign in UFA.

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05-24-2013, 12:18 PM
  #598
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Originally Posted by Kyle Brodziak View Post
Where did that number come from and any chance we have the numbers of how many faceoffs he took this year? I was under the impression that Lindholm played RW all year for Brynas



Completely agree. The fact that people are acting like it would be the end of the world if we drafted Lazar or Horvat is very sad. These guys bring exactly what we lack in a position we have no depth in and are some of the safest draft picks out there. I have no doubt in my mind these guys would be excellent 2C's while playing with highly skilled wingers and bringing that physical edge we need.
Really? I know their style of play in an amateur junior league is conducive to that thought, but what about their draft year numbers projects these guys as "excellent 2C's" to you? Neither are point/game. Horvat IMO is more impressive than Lazar with his offensive abilities. But neither have that 6'2-6'3 frame that all the elite 2-way C's (other than the exceptions that are Datsyuk/Zetterberg - you're very unlikely to be getting that kind of strength in players you draft in this draft) like Kesler/Backes/Bergeron have. They're undersized. May not be a problem in the CHL - hell it wasn't for Gagner in his draft year either - but it could pose an issue in the NHL.

I think there's a 50/50 chance these guys end up as either a 2C or a 3C.

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05-24-2013, 12:21 PM
  #599
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
So you want to put off filling holes for another year?



Feel free to name one player that is comparable to Lazar that went 15-30 last year.
http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p...php?pid=128062

Quote:
Laughton is two-way center whose primary skills are on the defensive side of the ledger. He is a hard-worker with a consistent approach to the game and plenty of smarts. Laughton is not a highly skilled player and it remains to be seen how he'll develop in this area, but he should be an effective third-line player with some potential for second-line duty.
Similar style, similar point production.
Hell, he even got some time up with the big club last year and didn't actually look too bad from what I remember.

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05-24-2013, 12:23 PM
  #600
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Originally Posted by DousedInOil View Post
13. Radek Faksa
14. Zemgus Girgensons
20. Scott Laughton
26. Brendan Gaunce

Name one player in 2012 from 15-30 that compares to Lindholm.
None of those are like Lazar. Sorry.

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