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KHL after Sochi Games

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05-17-2013, 07:34 AM
  #1
vorky
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KHL after Sochi Games

As we know, KHL has been talking about "radical changes" after Sochi Games 2014. Lets discuss it.

My scenario 1 (not only one)

KHL will separate itself from IIHF/FHR, then will held regular season and play off during IIHF World Championship (if this is still taken place in May).

Other scenarios are possible.

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05-17-2013, 07:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vorky View Post
As we know, KHL has been talking about "radical changes" after Sochi Games 2014. Lets discuss it.

My scenario 1 (not only one)

KHL will separate itself from IIHF/FHR, then will held regular season and play off during IIHF World Championship (if this is still taken place in May).

Other scenarios are possible.
If that's a case, then IIHF should move WC in late August/early September...

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05-17-2013, 08:01 AM
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Why would KHL stretch into May?

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05-17-2013, 08:32 AM
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Originally Posted by ozo View Post
Why would KHL stretch into May?
To have more than 52 games in regular season? Look, you need 60 days for play-off, that can not be changed if you dont want to play best of 5 series. So, league need to finish regulars in early March to be able to finish play offs until WC in May. Right? But, KHL does not like this model, KHL needs more games in regulars than 52. KHL does not have 12-16 teams as euro leagues, but 28 and will have 30. Solution is to move WH Championship to February/August etc (which IIHF would not like to do, right?) or to play Gagarin Cup play offs during WH Championship in May (what is not problem for KHL).

If you follow KHL for a year or two, you must know it. KHL wants more games in regulars. Only Q is how to achieve it.

You can claim that WH Championship is popular in Russia, Russians love it and want to have their best squad, so no chance KHL to stop the best players from WH Championship. That is true, but this is FHRs job, not KHLs. You know, there is an battle among them within russian hockey. Just remember how KHL was created.. long story.

Btw, what will euro federations (especially Finns) and IIHF say if this scenario comes true? No NHLers, no KHLers... why to held WH Championship?

KHL leadership is not naive as many ppl would like to think. These guys dont give up.

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05-17-2013, 08:34 AM
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The only confirmed changes are going to 28 meter wide rinks and probably lifting the foreign limit ban on players from countries with a KHL club.

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05-17-2013, 08:40 AM
  #6
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Originally Posted by ozo View Post
Why would KHL stretch into May?
Regular season currently ends in February/March and is only 50-60(?) games. I don't see a longer season fitting in Europe. Players are already spending a lot time away from their families during the season(many Finnish players don't have their families with them in Russia, they refuse to move), I don't think extending the season more will make the league more attractive to foreign players(basic salaries would have to increase at least).

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05-17-2013, 08:47 AM
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The only confirmed changes are going to 28 meter wide rinks and probably lifting the foreign limit ban on players from countries with a KHL club.
You cant know that,i for one would like more than a 52 games a season.If it means WC`s quality goes to *******,oh well its a bush championship anyway.

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05-17-2013, 08:47 AM
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Originally Posted by vorky View Post
To have more than 52 games in regular season? Look, you need 60 days for play-off, that can not be changed if you dont want to play best of 5 series. So, league need to finish regulars in early March to be able to finish play offs until WC in May. Right? But, KHL does not like this model, KHL needs more games in regulars than 52. KHL does not have 12-16 teams as euro leagues, but 28 and will have 30. Solution is to move WH Championship to February/August etc (which IIHF would not like to do, right?) or to play Gagarin Cup play offs during WH Championship in May (what is not problem for KHL).
.
But it would be a problem for some national teams. Imagine for example, with what players would Latvia play at WC if Dinamo Riga reaches, let's say conferences semifinal and that series goes to seven games !?

Same goes for Kazahstan, elevator team between D1 and Elite. Knowing that D1 is earlier in calendar, that would hit them hard.

I am very curious to see what kind of changes will be after Sochi.


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05-17-2013, 08:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CroHabitant View Post
But it would be a problem for some national teams. Imagine for example, with what players would Latvia play at WC if Dinamo Riga reaches, let's say conferences semifinal and that series goes to seven games !?

Same goes for Kazahstan, elevator team between D1 and Elite. Knowing that D1 is earlier in calendar, that would hit them hard.

I am very curious to see what kind of changes will be after Sochi.

I`d suggest you look how much players were in our NT this wc from Dinamo Riga compared to players from other KHL clubs
For us it wouldnt be too much of diaster,we i think could still scrap some players.

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05-17-2013, 09:00 AM
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Just stop playing EHT. It's a completely boring 4 team competition. Or at least let non-Russian teams play during EHT breaks. Without EHT you could have an additional 10-12 games per season. So KHL could easily have 64 regular season matches.

PS:

These are long schedule breaks in the case of Ak Bars Kazan of 2012-13 season or better said on all these dates theoratically games could have been played:

03.11.-13.11.
08.12.-19.12.
09.01.-16.01.
02.02.-12.02.


10 + 11 + 7 + 10 = 38 days = 12 more games


Last edited by Vicente: 05-17-2013 at 09:07 AM.
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05-17-2013, 09:07 AM
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Originally Posted by BalticWarrior View Post
You cant know that,i for one would like more than a 52 games a season.If it means WC`s quality goes to *******,oh well its a bush championship anyway.
Yes, as you said, KHL did not confirmed it. I dont know how anybody can consider rumours as facts (confirmed).

Quote:
Originally Posted by CroHabitant View Post
But it would be a problem for some national teams. Imagine for example, with what players would Latvia play at WC if Dinamo Riga reaches, let's say conferences semifinal and that series goes to seven games !?

Same goes for Kazahstan, elevator team between D1 and Elite. Knowing that D1 is earlier in calendar, that would hit them hard.

I am very curious to see what kind of changes will be after Sochi.

Yep, that would be problem, dont like it. On ther other hand I see KHLs attitude. They want more games, want to negotiate with IIHF, KHL needs more games to attract players/media/tv deals. Players want to play more games. So, if IIHF does not want the change, KHL have no problem - only that play offs can be held during WC. You know how it works, if you are strong enough and your opponent does not want to negotiate with you, you (KHL) can play "hard". Simple. Really, KHL leadership is not bunch of clowns as FHR and others.

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05-17-2013, 09:11 AM
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Btw why not have the WC in June? Other European leagues could have more games as well or start in October instead of September if they don't want to have more games. This would be also better for NHL players.

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05-17-2013, 09:17 AM
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For all your supposed "we don't have to blindly copy NHL" stance this certainly fees pretty much hypocritical. Why the hell KHL would need more than 50 game regular season? It's not like KHL is self sustaining league so there's no real need for the additional pennies these games would bring in. Longer season simply will render each individual game more meaningless.

But yeah I agree, EHT must go. That tournament really makes no sense and it kills league momentum for no real gain. Also have to mention that I would dig mid-season WC, the only con probably is that IIHF wouldn't want to hold all tier tournaments at the same time as lower tiers would lose the little attention they currently get and we would loose NHL players completely.

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05-17-2013, 09:33 AM
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One very interesting question also would be who would you play against in these additional games? Look at the NHL. They have 82 games. Okay. But they play every year against the same teams almost all their games... Only 18 of 82 games are played against the other conference. That is barely a united league but two seperate leagues whose winners face each other in Stanley Cup finals. Then we wouldn't need a eurowide KHL either if teams from the Western part of the continent would never or only once every couple of years play in the East of Russia... Maybe then better idea really would be a Western European laegue and KHL for Eastern Europe and the winners of both face in Gagarin Cup finals lol.

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05-17-2013, 09:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ozo View Post
For all your supposed "we don't have to blindly copy NHL" stance this certainly fees pretty much hypocritical. Why the hell KHL would need more than 50 game regular season? It's not like KHL is self sustaining league so there's no real need for the additional pennies these games would bring in. Longer season simply will render each individual game more meaningless.
Money. What is not today can be tommorow. This your attitude is like Euros vs NHL PTA - "just give up, we dont need NHL to pay more." No, KHL is not like that.

If you really think KHL is ready to give up any opportunity to earn money, you should make a research. I am sure you remember main idea of KHLs revenues.. to have income from tv rights, because we have A) small arenas and B) fans can not afford to pay $$$$ for tickets. It was originally said in 2009 or 2010 if I remember. And??? More games=more revenues? Just a math

Quote:
But yeah I agree, EHT must go. That tournament really makes no sense and it kills league momentum for no real gain. Also have to mention that I would dig mid-season WC, the only con probably is that IIHF wouldn't want to hold all tier tournaments at the same time as lower tiers would lose the little attention they currently get and we would loose NHL players completely.
Does KHL care? Why should KHL care?

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05-17-2013, 10:31 AM
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Originally Posted by Vicente View Post
Btw why not have the WC in June? Other European leagues could have more games as well or start in October instead of September if they don't want to have more games. This would be also better for NHL players.
No one cares about hockey in June in Europe. It would also clash with the football's European Championship and World Cup tournaments. Plus e.g. in Finland June is guaranteed vacation period or no-games (teams still train a little on and off-ice) for players (agreement between SM-Liiga and PA), I would imagine it's the same in Sweden where they have even longer vacations than in Finland. Players would be heavily against it.

By the way EHT is going to change after next season.

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05-17-2013, 11:04 AM
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Originally Posted by Jussi View Post
No one cares about hockey in June in Europe. It would also clash with the football's European Championship and World Cup tournaments. Plus e.g. in Finland June is guaranteed vacation period or no-games (teams still train a little on and off-ice) for players (agreement between SM-Liiga and PA), I would imagine it's the same in Sweden where they have even longer vacations than in Finland. Players would be heavily against it.

By the way EHT is going to change after next season.
We could have top division WC every two years and not in Olympic years. Let's say 2019, 2021, 2023 etc etc. We would never have a hockey WC the same year as any of the Olympic tournaments or Football WC / EC.

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05-17-2013, 11:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Vicente View Post
We could have top division WC every two years and not in Olympic years. Let's say 2019, 2021, 2023 etc etc. We would never have a hockey WC the same year as any of the Olympic tournaments or Football WC / EC.
We can't have Worlds every two years due to the promotion relegation system and lower divisions. The main tournament also funds all those lower division tourneys that don't make money.

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05-17-2013, 11:31 AM
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If the KHL really hopes to become a good alternative to the NHL, wouldn't it be smart to avoid repeating all the mistakes the NHL did? Why expand too fast and dilute the product? Why treat the players like machines and require them to play an unhealthy amount of games? Why completly disregard the rest of the hockey world? Those mistakes have been done already, why not start something new?

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05-17-2013, 11:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stv11 View Post
If the KHL really hopes to become a good alternative to the NHL, wouldn't it be smart to avoid repeating all the mistakes the NHL did?
Yes, it would

Quote:
Why expand too fast and dilute the product?
KHL needs "space" for euro players who dont like living in Russia, so new euro clubs. There is still a lot of high talent all over the world.

Quote:
Why treat the players like machines and require them to play an unhealthy amount of games?
Who says that KHL wants to play 82+ games? KHL says it is too much, at the same time 52 is too less.

Quote:
Why completly disregard the rest of the hockey world? Those mistakes have been done already, why not start something new?
KHL offered IIHF to change WCs schedulling. KHL offered euro federations/IIHF a help with negotiations with NHL about PTA. I dont consider that as mistake. If IIHF does not like the offers, it is its choice, the same choice KHL has - to play Gagarin Cup during WC.

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05-17-2013, 12:06 PM
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KHL fans yesterday: "NHL playoffs during May? Impertinence! Longer schedule = $ more important than the World Championship? Greedy ****!"
KHL fans today: "Let's extend the schedule, KHL needs more money, who cares for the World Championship."

How times change.

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05-17-2013, 12:07 PM
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Move the world championship to june and you'll have to play it without Sweden. Noone will care about it here.

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05-17-2013, 12:18 PM
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Move the world championship to june and you'll have to play it without Sweden. Noone will care about it here.
Nor Finland. People are too busy vacationing and spending time at their summer homes.

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05-17-2013, 12:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Theokritos View Post
KHL fans yesterday: "NHL playoffs during May? Impertinence! Longer schedule = $ more important than the World Championship? Greedy ****!"
KHL fans today: "Let's extend the schedule, KHL needs more money, who cares for the World Championship."

How times change.
Curious how it's fans of teams that didn't succeed at the latest tournament.

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05-17-2013, 01:01 PM
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how do you see the prague situation developing? i don't it think the market is big enough for three pro clubs at this level. who is going to prevail? will lev became sparta and play under that name in khl ?

what would then happen to slavia?

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