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Brent Seabrook

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Old
05-22-2013, 02:23 PM
  #76
habs03
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Originally Posted by Habsawce View Post
I kind of wish Seabrook was a LHD because it would make more sense to trade for him since MTL needs a #2 defenseman real bad. Becuase he's RHD he would not be playing with Subban which wouldn't overly help.

Obviously a player of his caliber would help the club and I would definitely love to have him on MTL. I guess he would have to play with Markov or Gorges and Emelin or Tinordi would play with Subban.
Honestly I don't think it would be a problem, even if he was a LD him and Subban would be a good fit, IMO Gorges would be a perfect fit to play with Seabrook, would give the Habs a perfect 2nd pair, maybe sign a UFA Dmen to play with Subban until Tinodri is ready for those minutes.

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05-22-2013, 03:15 PM
  #77
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Honestly I don't think it would be a problem, even if he was a LD him and Subban would be a good fit, IMO Gorges would be a perfect fit to play with Seabrook, would give the Habs a perfect 2nd pair, maybe sign a UFA Dmen to play with Subban until Tinodri is ready for those minutes.
Markov-Subban
Gorges-Seabrook
Bouillon-Tinordi
Beaulieu

Once Emelin comes back he can slot in with Markov and move Tinordi up with Subban and Bouillon to the bench.

Yeah, I guess I could get behind that.

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05-22-2013, 03:30 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup View Post
Ideal world the Hawks getting a #2 C + 2nd pairing type dman would be great return

I am just thinking (Maybe overreacting) to what the Hawks should do if the falter vs Wings here in 2nd round

Core has failed 3 straight years and a shakeup wouldn't be unreasonable (Along with coaching change)
Not in the bag, but I still likes yer chances.

You should have done Olsen for Boyle while we had the chance!

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05-22-2013, 03:38 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by CaptainCally View Post
Girardi + (+?) For Seabrook? Want a 2C, we'll throw in former Conn Smythe winner Brad Richards
Agree, the bold makes sense.
Rangers get better righty D who at least has some shot and QB skills, but Hawks get better shot blocker and overall defensive D presence, and depending upon the +/-, cap room.

OP, I join CapnCally's query, pls fill in the blanks:

Girardi + ____________ for Seabrook + ____________

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05-22-2013, 04:58 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by Habsawce View Post
Markov-Subban
Gorges-Seabrook
Bouillon-Tinordi
Beaulieu

Once Emelin comes back he can slot in with Markov and move Tinordi up with Subban and Bouillon to the bench.

Yeah, I guess I could get behind that.
Yup

Now that would be a legit D core, mix of size, grit, and offence

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05-23-2013, 08:52 AM
  #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup View Post
Ideal world the Hawks getting a #2 C + 2nd pairing type dman would be great return

I am just thinking (Maybe overreacting) to what the Hawks should do if the falter vs Wings here in 2nd round

Core has failed 3 straight years and a shakeup wouldn't be unreasonable (Along with coaching change)
In the OP you clarified the priority was the C, not the D.

Just out of curiosity, mindful Rangers want to start juggling salary for cap and will need to move vets, and you have LOTS of young assets,

in addition to the cheaper replacement Girardi
what do you add to Seabrook

if Stepan goes the other way? Obviously, must be mass overpayment for our true 1C who is coming off post ELC deal and we like Brassard esp. for the $$$.

Or would you rather keep a slew of prospects and we add Boyle for your 4C, and you bump up to promote from within?

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05-23-2013, 09:21 AM
  #82
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Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup View Post
Hawks get ripped off
Real bad. I would think the Hawks would want Strome or Nelson in a package deal for Seabrook. I'm a huge fan of Nelson and Strome so it would def be tough to see one of them go, but at the same time the Isles need a top 2-4 dman pretty bad especially a Right-Handed Defenseman. Not sure what I would offer for him though.

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05-23-2013, 10:43 AM
  #83
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Originally Posted by Habsawce View Post
Plekanec would be exponentially more valuable to Chicago moving forward than Gardiner. Chicago already has Leddy and Keith, no real room for Jake although I think he's a heck of a player.
I don't think he would. In fact, I don't think Chicago would have any interest in moving Seabrook for a deal around Plek...

Chicago is tight against the cap this year, and it won't be getting better any time soon. Even after buying out Olesz, they will have less than $6M in cap room to re-sign Leddy and Kruger, bring in a backup goalie, and replace Bickell, Stalberg and Handzus. It won't be impossible, especially if they can replace players internally, but they don't have a lot of flexibility.

In other words, this isn't the type of team that can spend $5M on a player that was on pace for his third straight season under 60 points.

IF (and big if) the Hawks were to trade a player like Seabrook, they would want to plug a hole and save cap space. I think they would be looking for more of a Frans Nielsen or Bryan Little (assuming his salary doesn't go up too much) even if they aren't as good as Grabovsky.

Heck, if Montreal wants to make a play, Lars Eller could be a better chip than Grabovsky given his bargain salary. It would take a lot more than Eller, but I think Chicago would say no to any deal involving Grabovsky that wasn't completely lopsided.

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05-23-2013, 11:41 AM
  #84
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Originally Posted by kasper11 View Post
I don't think he would. In fact, I don't think Chicago would have any interest in moving Seabrook for a deal around Plek...

Chicago is tight against the cap this year, and it won't be getting better any time soon. Even after buying out Olesz, they will have less than $6M in cap room to re-sign Leddy and Kruger, bring in a backup goalie, and replace Bickell, Stalberg and Handzus. It won't be impossible, especially if they can replace players internally, but they don't have a lot of flexibility.

In other words, this isn't the type of team that can spend $5M on a player that was on pace for his third straight season under 60 points.

IF (and big if) the Hawks were to trade a player like Seabrook, they would want to plug a hole and save cap space. I think they would be looking for more of a Frans Nielsen or Bryan Little (assuming his salary doesn't go up too much) even if they aren't as good as Grabovsky.

Heck, if Montreal wants to make a play, Lars Eller could be a better chip than Grabovsky given his bargain salary. It would take a lot more than Eller, but I think Chicago would say no to any deal involving Grabovsky that wasn't completely lopsided.
1--Plekanec is far better than Grabovski. Also, Montreal doesn't have Grabovski to offer.

2--Chicago has gone with lesser lights at the #2 center position and it has not helped them. #2 center is their biggest area of need next to Goaltending, depending upon which Hawks fan you speak to.

3--Plekanec would be an amazing force on their 2nd line, stabilizing their biggest offensive need, adding an incredible component to their defensive capability, and bringing in a veteran presence.

4--How many 50+ point 2nd line centers who are Selke caliber defensively do you think are available?? Plekanec was 23rd in points this season among all centers. He was 29th the year before. There are 30 teams in the NHL. He is scoring at a better clip than some useless plug.

5--Think about this: Plekanec is able to get 50+ points consistently while playing with wingers that will never be close to the calibre of Sharp and Kane while also shutting down other teams' best offensive forwards. Who the heck else can do that?

I do not want to trade Plekanec because MOST Montreal fans realize how absolutely integral a player like him is to a team. I understand Chicago's cap situation AND the reality that they would not want to trade Seabrook. However, Plekanec IS the EXACT type of player Chicago SHOULD target as their 2nd line center IF Seabrook were being dangled as the trade bait. He is far better than Grabovski, Gagner, and almost every other 2nd line center out there due to what he has done offensively and defensively throughout his career.

Eller would also be a valuable piece to center a deal around for Seabrook if Chicago could get Montreal to add the right pieces that work for both teams to make such a deal. I just think you are way under valuing Plekanec and wanted to explain why.

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05-23-2013, 11:49 AM
  #85
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Originally Posted by kasper11 View Post
I don't think he would. In fact, I don't think Chicago would have any interest in moving Seabrook for a deal around Plek...

Chicago is tight against the cap this year, and it won't be getting better any time soon. Even after buying out Olesz, they will have less than $6M in cap room to re-sign Leddy and Kruger, bring in a backup goalie, and replace Bickell, Stalberg and Handzus. It won't be impossible, especially if they can replace players internally, but they don't have a lot of flexibility.

In other words, this isn't the type of team that can spend $5M on a player that was on pace for his third straight season under 60 points.

IF (and big if) the Hawks were to trade a player like Seabrook, they would want to plug a hole and save cap space. I think they would be looking for more of a Frans Nielsen or Bryan Little (assuming his salary doesn't go up too much) even if they aren't as good as Grabovsky.

Heck, if Montreal wants to make a play, Lars Eller could be a better chip than Grabovsky given his bargain salary. It would take a lot more than Eller, but I think Chicago would say no to any deal involving Grabovsky that wasn't completely lopsided.
Just a little addition:

Plekanec would have been 3rd on your team in scoring this year. 5th two years ago. 5th 3 years ago. Consider who he was playing with and compare the quality of those team mates to the 2nd line players Chicago has. Now try and tell me he would still be getting "only" 50+ points per season. Put that man with Sharp and Hossa, or Kane and Sharp, or whatever combination of top 5 other players you have on Chicago and it would be just terrifiying to play against.

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05-23-2013, 11:52 AM
  #86
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Imagine Plekanec-Hossa killing penalties?

Glad they're in the west if this were to happen!

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05-23-2013, 01:25 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by Drydenwasthebest View Post
1--Plekanec is far better than Grabovski. Also, Montreal doesn't have Grabovski to offer.

2--Chicago has gone with lesser lights at the #2 center position and it has not helped them. #2 center is their biggest area of need next to Goaltending, depending upon which Hawks fan you speak to.

3--Plekanec would be an amazing force on their 2nd line, stabilizing their biggest offensive need, adding an incredible component to their defensive capability, and bringing in a veteran presence.

4--How many 50+ point 2nd line centers who are Selke caliber defensively do you think are available?? Plekanec was 23rd in points this season among all centers. He was 29th the year before. There are 30 teams in the NHL. He is scoring at a better clip than some useless plug.

5--Think about this: Plekanec is able to get 50+ points consistently while playing with wingers that will never be close to the calibre of Sharp and Kane while also shutting down other teams' best offensive forwards. Who the heck else can do that?

I do not want to trade Plekanec because MOST Montreal fans realize how absolutely integral a player like him is to a team. I understand Chicago's cap situation AND the reality that they would not want to trade Seabrook. However, Plekanec IS the EXACT type of player Chicago SHOULD target as their 2nd line center IF Seabrook were being dangled as the trade bait. He is far better than Grabovski, Gagner, and almost every other 2nd line center out there due to what he has done offensively and defensively throughout his career.

Eller would also be a valuable piece to center a deal around for Seabrook if Chicago could get Montreal to add the right pieces that work for both teams to make such a deal. I just think you are way under valuing Plekanec and wanted to explain why.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Drydenwasthebest View Post
Just a little addition:

Plekanec would have been 3rd on your team in scoring this year. 5th two years ago. 5th 3 years ago. Consider who he was playing with and compare the quality of those team mates to the 2nd line players Chicago has. Now try and tell me he would still be getting "only" 50+ points per season. Put that man with Sharp and Hossa, or Kane and Sharp, or whatever combination of top 5 other players you have on Chicago and it would be just terrifiying to play against.
For the record, I'm an Isles fan, not Hawks. Pleks would have been 4th on my team in scoring.

And everything you say about how Pleks may perform with Chicago could be true, but that doesn't go to my point. I never said he would be bad with Chicago or not a good fit. My point was that Chicago is a team in a cap crunch, and spending $5M for their 5th best forward is probably not a good allocation of resources.

Yes, Plekanec would probably score a lot with Kane and Hossa. But so would a lot of other forwards. Pleks may score more, but probably not enough to justify moving Seabrook. That's why I suggested Eller. Pleks may score 10 more points, but for a team against the cap that isn't enough to justify the salary. Chicago was already the 5th highest scoring team in the league. Why move Seabrook to make the forward group even stronger?

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05-23-2013, 01:39 PM
  #88
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For the record, I'm an Isles fan, not Hawks. Pleks would have been 4th on my team in scoring.

And everything you say about how Pleks may perform with Chicago could be true, but that doesn't go to my point. I never said he would be bad with Chicago or not a good fit. My point was that Chicago is a team in a cap crunch, and spending $5M for their 5th best forward is probably not a good allocation of resources.

Yes, Plekanec would probably score a lot with Kane and Hossa. But so would a lot of other forwards. Pleks may score more, but probably not enough to justify moving Seabrook. That's why I suggested Eller. Pleks may score 10 more points, but for a team against the cap that isn't enough to justify the salary. Chicago was already the 5th highest scoring team in the league. Why move Seabrook to make the forward group even stronger?
Hawks have trouble scoring the playoffs the last two years, Dave Bolland couldn't score at all this year with Kane and Sharp. The last cup team without 2 really good top centers was? IDK because it was a long time ago. #2 center is a big need. The value of Plek for Seabs is very fair for both teams IMO. Chicago won't really be in a cap crunch after the buyouts

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05-23-2013, 02:08 PM
  #89
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Imagine Plekanec-Hossa killing penalties?

Glad they're in the west if this were to happen!
almost as good as Toews-Hossa killing penalties....like we have right now

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05-23-2013, 03:52 PM
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almost as good as Toews-Hossa killing penalties....like we have right now
I'd rather keep Plekanec anyway, he's vital to the team.

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05-23-2013, 11:28 PM
  #91
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Brent Seabrook

He's had a terrible year in Chicago, and it would send a huge message to the rest of the core to see one of them moved.

After this year, I doubt there's a GM in the league who wouldn't say his value has dropped, but we all know what he can be when he plays well. Top pairing, physical defenseman with some offensive ability.

Just wanted to see what some offers might be if he were in fact on the block.

Hawks' general needs:

#2 Center or prospect with at least #2C upside. Bigger the better, two-way game or physicality preferred over pure offense.
A solid defenseman to fill the hole that he'll leave (not 100% necessary, Hawks can bring up someone)
Goaltending improvements will be listened to

In general, the roster just isn't good enough. Any players that will improve the roster will be listened to, but ones that will fill needs will be listened to more.


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05-23-2013, 11:33 PM
  #92
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You misspelled brookbank

But the leafs and habs should be interested for sure

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05-23-2013, 11:35 PM
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You misspelled brookbank

But the leafs and habs should be interested for sure
Brookbank is bad, but he wasn't expected to be good. Just to eat up some ice time in case of an injury. Seabrook was expected to be the 2nd best defenseman on the Blackhawks and was terrible.

I don't see why Toronto would be interested, Seabrook doesn't provide much Phaneuf doesn't already give them. Montreal, perhaps.


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05-23-2013, 11:35 PM
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Plekanec and Diaz and that's a lot for how Seabrook has played but I think he can bounce back and I think Josh Gorges would be a perfect partner for him.

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05-23-2013, 11:37 PM
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Toronto fans have said they need a top pairing D Unless they're searching for an enstrom.... Speedy sort of guy

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05-23-2013, 11:39 PM
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Toronto fans have said they need a top pairing D Unless they're searching for an enstrom.... Speedy sort of guy
I could be wrong but I think leafs are looking for a defensive dmen with good positioning to play with Dion, don't think him and Seabrook would be a good pair.

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05-23-2013, 11:43 PM
  #97
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Plekanec and Diaz and that's a lot for how Seabrook has played but I think he can bounce back and I think Josh Gorges would be a perfect partner for him.
If this return came back for Seabrook I'd be pretty satisfied. Pretty fair value, I think it's more than he should get for how he's played but not quite as much as his potential earns. Which I think is what the value for a player that had a down year should be.

Saad-Toews-Hossa
Sharp-Plekanec-Kane
Bickell-Bolland-Shaw
Hayes-Kruger-Frolik

Keith-Hjalmarsson
Leddy-Oduya
Rozsival-Diaz

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05-23-2013, 11:51 PM
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I don't see why Toronto would be interested, Seabrook doesn't provide much Phaneuf doesn't already give them. Montreal, perhaps.
After Phaneuf, there are no solid top 4 options without question marks. Gunnarsson has been injured much of his tenure, Franson is still a PP specialist, Gardiner is young and proving himself. A defensive top 4 guy is probably as big a need as a top centre is, for the Leafs.

But given that you're looking for a top 6 centre, not sure the Leafs would have the expendable assets to give. Sideways move type of deal if they gave up Kadri.

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05-23-2013, 11:54 PM
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Originally Posted by HawkinMI View Post
If this return came back for Seabrook I'd be pretty satisfied. Pretty fair value, I think it's more than he should get for how he's played but not quite as much as his potential earns. Which I think is what the value for a player that had a down year should be.

Saad-Toews-Hossa
Sharp-Plekanec-Kane
Bickell-Bolland-Shaw
Hayes-Kruger-Frolik

Keith-Hjalmarsson
Leddy-Oduya
Rozsival-Diaz
It almost makes to much sense, fits both teams needs, Bergevin probably knows Seabrook well from his Hawks days, and Gauither probably putting in a good word to Bowman on Plekanec

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05-23-2013, 11:56 PM
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After Phaneuf, there are no solid top 4 options without question marks. Gunnarsson has been injured much of his tenure, Franson is still a PP specialist, Gardiner is young and proving himself. A defensive top 4 guy is probably as big a need as a top centre is, for the Leafs.

But given that you're looking for a top 6 centre, not sure the Leafs would have the expendable assets to give. Sideways move type of deal if they gave up Kadri.
I guess that's true.

Kadri wouldn't be what the Hawks are looking for. I'm sure Toronto would like to keep hold of him after how hard they worked to groom him into what he's become. You're right about the Leafs not really having what the Hawks are looking for, closest would be Grabovski but his combination of production and contract would not be in the Hawks' radar.

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