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2013 NHL Entry Draft Talk 9.0

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06-04-2013, 01:43 PM
  #926
Fozz
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Like I said, he's not going to make any of my top 5 list...but I do have him in my HM list though. For sure. I don't disregard the importance of 3rd liners, just believe that as great as this draft is, and as high as we are picking, I don't see Nastasiuk worth of a 25, 34, 36. Our own pick in the 2nd? Maybe but I have other names. My ideal spot for him would be 3rd round but will most definately be gone. Surely before our 36 and our own pick in the 2nd. So that's why he's not my list. I shouldn't do that, but I do every year. Try to predict who could be there around our pick. Reason why I have at least 10ish names per pick.....But like I said, I won't be mad, on the contrary. Will still believe we could have done more but again....all depends of who are still there. My list, even with 10 guys per pick, might be totally depleted, leaving Nastasiuk as the key guy to pick.
That will prove to be a very. very difficult task this year. It's not easy in any draft and next to impossible this year.

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06-04-2013, 01:44 PM
  #927
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I think there is now way we do not end up drafting one of Dauphin, Carrier or Poirier, because of our large array of 2nd rounders and the fact that these players are from Quebec and each have a very nice potential. And that is great.

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06-04-2013, 01:46 PM
  #928
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Originally Posted by ChesterNimitz View Post
Absolutely. Both Dickinson and Poirier have the type of elite skating ability that allows them to beat defenders wide on the rush. Their skills project well in the NHL. We should stay away from any player that has any question mark associated with their skating ability. This is not a draft where we should be reaching for a player that we hope will gain that necessary extra gear. It would be a crying shame if we miss out on the plethora of elite skaters who will be on the board when we pick in the first two rounds. Let the other teams take the projects.
Strange... I don't either Dickinson or Poirier has being elite skaters. They're not bad but certainly not elite by any stretch of the imagination.

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06-04-2013, 01:51 PM
  #929
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Originally Posted by Fozz View Post
To be honest WTK, I'm a little confused. You really like Dickinson but totally dislike Mantha. To me, they are very similar player, except that Mantha is a more talented scorer. Dickinson has potential and is a little more assertive but not that much from my viewing of him.
Dickinson will find a place in the league due to his defensive IQ. At the very worst, he can be a 3rd liner that chips in offensively. Nothing wrong with that. If Mantha doesn't get competitive, if he doesn't go where he needs to go, well, then you have something like Pierre Dagenais. At least in what I've seen from Dickinson, he'll cut to the net, he'll use his frame to protect the puck and he's a very adept stick handler.

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06-04-2013, 02:15 PM
  #930
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Originally Posted by Runner77 View Post
Don't see Compher's name come up a lot, here. Any thoughts on where he might fall?

Also, wondering whether someone like Hudson Fasching might interest the Habs.
I hear mostly 15-25 for Compher, not the biggest guy but plays a lot like Mike Richards, though he skates better. Highly competitive guy with skill, plays both ends and has been clutch for the US U18 team. I'm sure MB and TT like him.

Quote:
Originally Posted by VanNistelrooy View Post
For me in terms of POTENTIAL

1. Erne
2. Zykov
3. Mantha
4. Carrier
5. Gauthier
6. Poirier
7. Dauphin

really not sold on Dauphin
Dauphin is a real smart player a la Pat Bergeron, he isn't a guy fans will be doing cartwheels over but I see him being a very good and productive NHLer while a few guys who went in front of him will be playing pro in Europe or AHL/ECHL.

He's a guy I can't see the Habs passing on twice at #34 and 36.

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06-04-2013, 02:43 PM
  #931
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Originally Posted by Monctonscout View Post


Dauphin is a real smart player a la Pat Bergeron, he isn't a guy fans will be doing cartwheels over but I see him being a very good and productive NHLer while a few guys who went in front of him will be playing pro in Europe or AHL/ECHL.

He's a guy I can't see the Habs passing on twice at #34 and 36.
I really like the way Dauphin plays. I like the way he scores his goals. How he'll step up from behind the net or the corners and make room for himself in front of the net...

My questions regarding Dauphin are first regarding his skating. Will it be good enough at a higher level? Then, in the limited viewing I've seen he was really good around the net. Why doesn't he have more goals in the Q?

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06-04-2013, 02:46 PM
  #932
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Originally Posted by Erik Estrada View Post
I really like the way Dauphin plays. I like the way he scores his goals. How he'll step up from behind the net or the corners and make room for himself in front of the net...

My questions regarding Dauphin are first regarding his skating. Will it be good enough at a higher level? In the limited viewing I've seen he was really good around the net. Why doesn't he have more goals in the Q?
He's not a great skater nor very big, but I think once his body and skating are fully developped they should both be average and plenty good for a smart/competitive player.

He had 25 as a 17 year old rookie, not great but not bad either.

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06-04-2013, 03:00 PM
  #933
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Originally Posted by Monctonscout View Post
He's not a great skater nor very big, but I think once his body and skating are fully developped they should both be average and plenty good for a smart/competitive player.

He had 25 as a 17 year old rookie, not great but not bad either.
I think your comments underscore the concerns many have about Dauphin. "Not a great skater". He may develop into an "average" skater. Again, your hoping that he develops skating skills. My question is, in a draft that has so many NHL ready skaters who will be available when we draft, why would he be a consideration? Maybe in other draft years, he could be considered, but in this draft year, Dauphin would be a reach at 25, 34 or 36. Too many much better options. It is unnecessary to draft any players that have 'hopes' attached to them. Let some other team take the risk.

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06-04-2013, 03:05 PM
  #934
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Originally Posted by Fozz View Post
To be honest WTK, I'm a little confused. You really like Dickinson but totally dislike Mantha. To me, they are very similar player, except that Mantha is a more talented scorer. Dickinson has potential and is a little more assertive but not that much from my viewing of him.
Mantha is a pure goal scorer on RW and not much else
Dickinson is a smooth skating 6'2 center with nice play making ability.

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06-04-2013, 03:27 PM
  #935
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Laurent Dauphin or Emile Poirier ??? I will be very happy if we get Poirier


Last edited by Gaston Gingras: 06-04-2013 at 03:33 PM.
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Old
06-04-2013, 03:29 PM
  #936
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Originally Posted by ChesterNimitz View Post
I think your comments underscore the concerns many have about Dauphin. "Not a great skater". He may develop into an "average" skater. Again, your hoping that he develops skating skills. My question is, in a draft that has so many NHL ready skaters who will be available when we draft, why would he be a consideration? Maybe in other draft years, he could be considered, but in this draft year, Dauphin would be a reach at 25, 34 or 36. Too many much better options. It is unnecessary to draft any players that have 'hopes' attached to them. Let some other team take the risk.
His skating is average for kids being rated in the top 60. If it keeps developping normally, with his hockey sense to me it should be a non issue. The average top 60 player needs to improve his skating before playing in the NHL, it's not necessarily a weakness but the NHL pace is faster than junior/college. I don't see anything glaring about him that needs above average development to play NHL.

I think in a normal year he would be a solid pick at #25, this year he may fall to #34 or 36 because of the extra depth.

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06-04-2013, 03:59 PM
  #937
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Originally Posted by Monctonscout View Post
His skating is average for kids being rated in the top 60. If it keeps developping normally, with his hockey sense to me it should be a non issue. The average top 60 player needs to improve his skating before playing in the NHL, it's not necessarily a weakness but the NHL pace is faster than junior/college. I don't see anything glaring about him that needs above average development to play NHL.

I think in a normal year he would be a solid pick at #25, this year he may fall to #34 or 36 because of the extra depth.
My point is: why are we settling on average in a very strong draft where we will be drafting 3 times in the first 36 choices? Average skaters can be picked up in free agency. Here's our chance to hit a home run. Maybe even 2 or 3. We should not be satisfied with average. Not when such a description is applicable to such an important facet as skating. You can acquire size, toughness, etc. through free agency or trade. To acquire skill through free agency means allocating a significant portion of your cap space. If through trade, you will have to surrender significant assets. The cheapest means of acquiring skill is through the draft. If we compromise on this approach, it means a lost opportunity to greatly improve the core talent level of this team. So please, let's not accept average. Unless you are willing to wait another 20 years to win a Stanley Cup.

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06-04-2013, 04:14 PM
  #938
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChesterNimitz View Post
My point is: why are we settling on average in a very strong draft where we will be drafting 3 times in the first 36 choices? Average skaters can be picked up in free agency. Here's our chance to hit a home run. Maybe even 2 or 3. We should not be satisfied with average. Not when such a description is applicable to such an important facet as skating. You can acquire size, toughness, etc. through free agency or trade. To acquire skill through free agency means allocating a significant portion of your cap space. If through trade, you will have to surrender significant assets. The cheapest means of acquiring skill is through the draft. If we compromise on this approach, it means a lost opportunity to greatly improve the core talent level of this team. So please, let's not accept average. Unless you are willing to wait another 20 years to win a Stanley Cup.
Do you really think you will have prospects that are exceptionnal at everything in the second round? Every prospect have question marks or areas of his game where he's just average.

Dauphin seems to have an excellent hockey IQ and great work ethic and dedication. His skating his average. As far as I'm concern it's a lot easier to improve your skating than it is to improve your hockey sense or your work ethic.

Some prospects have exceptional skating but will have questionable hockey sense or or work ethic. Every prospects have things to improve and work on; it's what being a prospect means basically.

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06-04-2013, 04:44 PM
  #939
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Originally Posted by ChesterNimitz View Post
My point is: why are we settling on average in a very strong draft where we will be drafting 3 times in the first 36 choices? Average skaters can be picked up in free agency. Here's our chance to hit a home run. Maybe even 2 or 3. We should not be satisfied with average. Not when such a description is applicable to such an important facet as skating. You can acquire size, toughness, etc. through free agency or trade. To acquire skill through free agency means allocating a significant portion of your cap space. If through trade, you will have to surrender significant assets. The cheapest means of acquiring skill is through the draft. If we compromise on this approach, it means a lost opportunity to greatly improve the core talent level of this team. So please, let's not accept average. Unless you are willing to wait another 20 years to win a Stanley Cup.
I'd rather have a guy with average skating and above average HS then above average skating and average HS.

Not sure where you get that we can do better, I think if you can get a guy like that at #34 or 36 you're getting an extra 1st round pick. I think he can become a guy like Stepan, low end #1 or elite #2. To get value like that at #34 or 36 would be great.

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06-04-2013, 04:57 PM
  #940
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Originally Posted by ChesterNimitz View Post
My point is: why are we settling on average in a very strong draft where we will be drafting 3 times in the first 36 choices? Average skaters can be picked up in free agency. Here's our chance to hit a home run. Maybe even 2 or 3. We should not be satisfied with average. Not when such a description is applicable to such an important facet as skating. You can acquire size, toughness, etc. through free agency or trade. To acquire skill through free agency means allocating a significant portion of your cap space. If through trade, you will have to surrender significant assets. The cheapest means of acquiring skill is through the draft. If we compromise on this approach, it means a lost opportunity to greatly improve the core talent level of this team. So please, let's not accept average. Unless you are willing to wait another 20 years to win a Stanley Cup.
A weak skater could be very skilled, while a very good, very fast skater could have hands of stone. Skating can be improved, skill, not so much. Not saying I absolutely want Dauphin, but his skating stride and leg power can be improved, while his hockey IQ and hands are already pretty good, that's why he's envisionned as a late 1st to mid 2nd rounder. It's always just a matter of perceived potential.

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06-04-2013, 05:18 PM
  #941
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Originally Posted by Artie View Post
Ranking the top 10 forwards in NHL draft
Kyle Woodlief, special for USA TODAY Sports 2:15 p.m. EDT June 4, 2013
Probably makes more sense to give the link, rather then copy/paste the whole article here...

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports...eport/2388455/

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06-04-2013, 05:21 PM
  #942
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Don't know if this was posted already.

Comments from a scout who works for the Cape Breton Screaming Eagles:

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Le joueur le plus complet, qui sera un vrai régal pour un coach : Sean Monahan. L’équipe idéale pour lui serait Edmonton, mais je pense que Calgary va le choisir au 6e rang. Tout dépend de ce qui arrive à Nichushkin, la carte frimée du top 7.

Pour le CH, difficile de prévoir qui sera disponible à leur tour de parler. Ils doivent souhaiter que quelqu’un se trouvant dans leur top 10-15 soit toujours là au moment où ils sélectionneront. Je soupçonne que Morgan Klimchuk, un marqueur naturel, pourrait être encore disponible, ou Kerby Rychel, un autre excellent marqueur, et costaud en plus.

Pour la 2e ronde, quelques choix intéressants, sans ordre particulier : William Carrier, Keaton Thompson, Connor Hurley, Viktor Arvidsson, Marko Dano, Oliver Bjorkstrand.

La 2e ronde n’est pas aussi dégoulinante que d’habitude, mais encore là, ça reste à déterminer, puisque quelques équipes choisiront en première ronde des joueurs de soutien, et cela fera glisser en 2e ronde des joueurs talentueux.

Pour la 3e ronde, quelques suggestions : John Hayden, un solide gaillard qui ne marquera pas beaucoup, mais qui créera beaucoup d’espace sur la glace pour ses deux compagnons de trio. Le genre de gars que tu fais jouer avec Sebastian Collberg, par exemple. Yan-Pavel Laplante, très talentueux, mais sa blessure a fait en sorte qu’il est un peu en dessous du radar. Rushan Rafikov, un défenseur hargneux capable de transporter la rondelle. Et Peter Cehralik, joueur complet qui fonce au filet.

D’autres noms pour les 3e à 7e rondes : Roberts Lipsbergs, Adam Tambellini (quel beau patineur), et Dane Fox (que j’aimais bien l’an dernier, mais qui n’avait pas été repêché).
Thoughts?

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06-04-2013, 05:23 PM
  #943
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Originally Posted by Vasculio View Post
A weak skater could be very skilled, while a very good, very fast skater could have hands of stone. Skating can be improved, skill, not so much. Not saying I absolutely want Dauphin, but his skating stride and leg power can be improved, while his hockey IQ and hands are already pretty good, that's why he's envisionned as a late 1st to mid 2nd rounder. It's always just a matter of perceived potential.
Yeah, I agree with this 100%. There have been tons of players with great physical tools and skating that didn't amount to much because they can't process the game quick enough at the pro level. Scouts focus more on thing that you can't teach a player.

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06-04-2013, 05:31 PM
  #944
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Yeah, I agree with this 100%. There have been tons of players with great physical tools and skating that didn't amount to much because they can't process the game quick enough at the pro level. Scouts focus more on thing that you can't teach a player.
See Kreider, Chris

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06-04-2013, 06:20 PM
  #945
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See Kreider, Chris
Bad example, too young.

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06-04-2013, 06:33 PM
  #946
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I'd love to pick up Dano, ewww to Rychel.

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06-04-2013, 06:41 PM
  #947
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Originally Posted by Nitehowl View Post
Mantha is a pure goal scorer on RW and not much else
Dickinson is a smooth skating 6'2 center with nice play making ability.
I love how you describe Dickinson with qualities that could very well be attributed to Mantha. Watch:

Mantha is a smooth skating 6'4'' (!!) winger with nice play making and goal scoring ability.

Not saying that Mantha does not have flaws, but he's more than just a pure goal scorer.

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06-04-2013, 06:49 PM
  #948
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Yeah, I agree with this 100%. There have been tons of players with great physical tools and skating that didn't amount to much because they can't process the game quick enough at the pro level. Scouts focus more on thing that you can't teach a player.
So let me get this straight. You want the team to invest one of its top 3 picks in a player that has at best, average skating ability; is of only average size; only scored modestly in his draft year and was largely invisible at the U18 Championships because he has a high hockey IQ. You have more faith in IQ than I do. We can do better.

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Old
06-04-2013, 07:07 PM
  #949
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gaston Gingras View Post
Laurent Dauphin or Emile Poirier ??? I will be very happy if we get Poirier
I would love for the Habs to pick Poirier. I love the way he plays. He can skate, good vision and is feisty!

Oh and he can fight too.

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06-04-2013, 07:28 PM
  #950
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Originally Posted by gunnerdom View Post
I would love for the Habs to pick Poirier. I love the way he plays. He can skate, good vision and is feisty!

Oh and he can fight too.
Can't see the Habs passing on Poirier if he's still there at 34. Getting Poirier and Klimchuk at 34 and 36 is something I think I could live with.

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