HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Central Division > Winnipeg Jets
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Why the heck didn't we make a move on Schneider?

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
07-01-2013, 05:09 PM
  #1
Resurrection
Registered User
 
Resurrection's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,118
vCash: 50
Why the heck didn't we make a move on Schneider?

If we offered Burmi + our 1st rounder you're telling me the Canucks woulnd't have taken it? What a ridiculously low asking price. Even if it took This years 1st a 3rd and next years 2nd or something like that, HOW do we not make this move? My god the Devils fleeced the Canucks and were no closer to having a legit #1 guy.

I am frustrated beyond all else about that, I don't care about reaching for Morrissey.

Resurrection is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-01-2013, 05:15 PM
  #2
DespoticNewt
Registered User
 
DespoticNewt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Country: Canada
Posts: 11,721
vCash: 50
Who's to say that Chevy wasn't in on it? The 9th pick is far more sexy than 13, and Burmi's Russian agent came out and said all of that rumour nonsense before the draft. You think the Nucks would pick Burmi after all of that?

>_>;

DespoticNewt is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
07-01-2013, 05:17 PM
  #3
allan5oh
Adv stats blowhard
 
allan5oh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 8,391
vCash: 50
^---- that's basically it. There's an assumption out there that if one GM did something, our GM should be able to do it as well. What if Vancouver thought Dallas was going after Horvat, and they really wanted him? Mike Gillis also stated he wanted a top 10 pick this year. We just didn't have the assets.

allan5oh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-01-2013, 05:23 PM
  #4
Resurrection
Registered User
 
Resurrection's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,118
vCash: 50
Didn't have the assetts? We picked 4 spots away. That's nothing in the 1st round outside the top big 4. As the Canucks GM which do you consider more valuable? Pick 9 in this years draft, or pick 13, pick 43, and a 2nd rounder next year? Please. I think this is a case of Chevy being enamoured with our starting goaltender.

Resurrection is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-01-2013, 05:23 PM
  #5
Huffer
Registered User
 
Huffer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 10,918
vCash: 50
If Luongo isn't happy in Vancouver, why don't we see if Gillis likes Pavs and trade them Pavs for Luongo with the Canucks keeping 1 million of Luongo's salary?

Huffer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-01-2013, 05:24 PM
  #6
BigTuna49
#WPGWHITEOUT
 
BigTuna49's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: ATL
Country: Scotland
Posts: 24,479
vCash: 84
Who cares honestly?

BigTuna49 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-01-2013, 05:26 PM
  #7
allan5oh
Adv stats blowhard
 
allan5oh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 8,391
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Resurrection View Post
Didn't have the assetts? We picked 4 spots away. That's nothing in the 1st round outside the top big 4. As the Canucks GM which do you consider more valuable? Pick 9 in this years draft, or pick 13, pick 43, and a 2nd rounder next year? Please. I think this is a case of Chevy being enamoured with our starting goaltender.
That's the problem. We don't know, because this information is unavailable. Also consider we'd have $8 million tied up in tenders.

allan5oh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-01-2013, 05:30 PM
  #8
GoldenJet89
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 605
vCash: 500
exactly. who cares.

if Pav's doesnt do well this year, there will be other goalies available. There are always guys being pushed by newcomers and teams that will have to let a good goalie go.. if we really need one we will find one.

were not a team thats in a position to give up assets for anything at this point. let alone the assets it would have taken to get schneider

i dont like pavelec, but i've come to accept were pretty much stuck with unless we sign a cheaper backup that ourperforms him, or one of our kids develops quickly and earns the job... cause nobody will take him from us on his current contract.

GoldenJet89 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-01-2013, 05:30 PM
  #9
BigTuna49
#WPGWHITEOUT
 
BigTuna49's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: ATL
Country: Scotland
Posts: 24,479
vCash: 84
Quote:
Originally Posted by Resurrection View Post
Didn't have the assetts? We picked 4 spots away. That's nothing in the 1st round outside the top big 4. As the Canucks GM which do you consider more valuable? Pick 9 in this years draft, or pick 13, pick 43, and a 2nd rounder next year? Please. I think this is a case of Chevy being enamoured with our starting goaltender.
Well let's use some common sense here.

First of all, you're not a scout, so you can't go around acting like guys are really worth nothing outside of the big 4. I mean, you can say it, but it doesn't really mean anything.

Second, the 9th pick is much more likely to become a better NHLer then the 13th pick. There's a good chance VAN was targeting Horvat so that's why they made the move. They were probably very high on the kid.

Third, the 43rd and next year's 2nd are much more likely to become nothing then an actual NHLer. Not a ton of value in those picks.

Fourth, why are we assuming anything with Chevy? Did you talk to him personally? Why make outrageous assumptions about something you or any of us likely know nothing about. It just makes your post look silly.

BigTuna49 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-01-2013, 05:37 PM
  #10
Resurrection
Registered User
 
Resurrection's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,118
vCash: 50
[mod]

I'll tell you what Duke I will indulge you when you answer my question from a couple months ago.

At what age is it ok to consider Pavelec a subpar goaltender? When has he been given enough time? 27? 28? 30? Answer this question you have dodged 3 or 4 times at least and I will answer you post.
Please and thanks.


Last edited by Hank Chinaski: 07-01-2013 at 08:58 PM. Reason: don't alter quotes
Resurrection is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-01-2013, 05:43 PM
  #11
BigTuna49
#WPGWHITEOUT
 
BigTuna49's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: ATL
Country: Scotland
Posts: 24,479
vCash: 84
Quote:
Originally Posted by Resurrection View Post
I'll tell you what Duke I will indulge you when you answer my question from a couple months ago.

At what age is it ok to consider Pavelec a subpar goaltender? When has he been given enough time? 27? 28? 30? Answer this question you have dodged 3 or 4 times at least and I will answer you post.
Please and thanks.
I might take your questions half serious if you didn't blindly ignore every one of my posts, like you just did. Doesn't even have anything to do about Pavs and you go off your own topic just to whine about something.

Calling Chevy out for something that no one on this board knows about is an ignorant thing to do.

BigTuna49 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-01-2013, 05:43 PM
  #12
PaperRockChamp
Registered User
 
PaperRockChamp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Wpg
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,357
vCash: 50
There's a good chance they wanted Schneider out of the Conference, not just their division. I would not want to offer or beat what Edmonton had offered.

PaperRockChamp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-01-2013, 05:55 PM
  #13
Resurrection
Registered User
 
Resurrection's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,118
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duke89 View Post
I might take your questions half serious if you didn't blindly ignore every one of my posts, like you just did. Doesn't even have anything to do about Pavs and you go off your own topic just to whine about something.

Calling Chevy out for something that no one on this board knows about is an ignorant thing to do.
This isn't chicken and the egg friend. This started in a Pavelec discussion thread a while back and you ducked my question. I will happily answer your post if you answer my question I'm sure I've asked you 3 times maybe 4. Here I will ask again. If you have any integrity whatsoever it's a very easy question to answer.

At what age do you consider Pavelec a bust and not starting goaltender material? 27? 28? 29? 30? 32? What age. For the love of god it's such an easy question why won't you answer it?

Resurrection is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-01-2013, 05:59 PM
  #14
Sweech
Alles zu seiner Zeit
 
Sweech's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Hamilton, Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,974
vCash: 5239
Not sure there's a great move to be made there to be honest. The trade market for teams interested in Pavelec may have been totally non-existent. We couldn't handle both salary cap wise.

The whole topic requires a whole lot of "ifs".

Sweech is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-01-2013, 06:00 PM
  #15
sully1410
#VinegarStrokes
 
sully1410's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Calgary, Alta.
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,647
vCash: 72
Meh. I didn't really think it would happen. If I was Gillis I would have dropped Lu for scraps before I traded Schneider. Just me though. I guess they got a really good future asset out of it though. Fast forwards the rebuild.

sully1410 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-01-2013, 06:04 PM
  #16
garret9
AKA#VitoCorrelationi
 
garret9's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 13,389
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sweech View Post
Not sure there's a great move to be made there to be honest. The trade market for teams interested in Pavelec may have been totally non-existent. We couldn't handle both salary cap wise.

The whole topic requires a whole lot of "ifs".
Would love,love,love Schneider on the teams.
It would be a HUGE boost to us.
But, Sweech is 100% right here.
If Chevy didn't even make a phone call or inquiry, ya that's a failure on Chevy, but not getting a deal to workout for the Jets is not.
We will never know about the previous part.

garret9 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-01-2013, 06:13 PM
  #17
BigTuna49
#WPGWHITEOUT
 
BigTuna49's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: ATL
Country: Scotland
Posts: 24,479
vCash: 84
Quote:
Originally Posted by Resurrection View Post
This isn't chicken and the egg friend. This started in a Pavelec discussion thread a while back and you ducked my question. I will happily answer your post if you answer my question I'm sure I've asked you 3 times maybe 4. Here I will ask again. If you have any integrity whatsoever it's a very easy question to answer.

At what age do you consider Pavelec a bust and not starting goaltender material? 27? 28? 29? 30? 32? What age. For the love of god it's such an easy question why won't you answer it?
What in the hell does my post in this thread have to do with Pavelec? Please enlighten us all. I made a comment why we didn't go after Schneider and all you want to do is turn this into a Pavelec thread.

BigTuna49 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-01-2013, 06:15 PM
  #18
YWGinYYZ
Global Moderator
.
 
YWGinYYZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 17,694
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duke89 View Post
What in the hell does my post in this thread have to do with Pavelec? Please enlighten us all. I made a comment why we didn't go after Schneider and all you want to do is turn this into a Pavelec thread.
All Pavelec, all the time, my friend.

Without being a fly on the wall, who the heck knows what took place. Chevy could have inquired and got turned down. Without being there, it's all speculation.

YWGinYYZ is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
07-01-2013, 06:24 PM
  #19
Resurrection
Registered User
 
Resurrection's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,118
vCash: 50
I guess my whole reasoning for this post was that I understand that there are mitigating circumstances. But for the most part, when a trade occurs it's a pretty reasonable process for us fans to go thru and ask "could my team have acquired this player for the cost paid" and to follow up if the answer was no "what more would I, as a fan, would have wanted my team to give up".

I think that most Jets fans would love to have Scheider. He's a better goaltender than Pavelec and a proven winner that can get a team to a playoff or at least not sabotage a good team getting there. I think most people would say "yes lets do it".

Second part of the all this then becomes "would I pay the same price or higher". For me it's a yes, pick 13 and pick 9 to me are interchangable, and in my outsider opinion I think Vancouver would value our pick next year higher than the Devils pick as we are likely viewed as a lottery team again.

Would the Canucks agree to a deal with us? That's an unknown and a moot point becuase I'm not asking that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Duke89 View Post
What in the hell does my post in this thread have to do with Pavelec? Please enlighten us all. I made a comment why we didn't go after Schneider and all you want to do is turn this into a Pavelec thread.
This is a thread talking about possibly trading for a #1 goaltender. How is Pavelec, our current "#1" not a valid thing to bring up? More importantly I refuse to take your posts seriously until you have the balls to answer a simple question asked of you likely 6 times now.

Let's try again.

How many more seasons, and at what age will you consider Pavelec a failure as a #1 goaltender?

Resurrection is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-01-2013, 06:27 PM
  #20
YWGinYYZ
Global Moderator
.
 
YWGinYYZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 17,694
vCash: 50
Would I like Schneider in Winnipeg? Yes please. Do we know whether or not the Jets tried, and were turned down? Nope. Is he now in NJ? Yep. So, I move on.

I am looking forward to one of our prospects taking the bull by the horns at some point. I would also like to see either A) Noel trust his backup more or B) Chevy to find another reasonably priced backup that can challenge Pavs and that Noel trusts. Also: I don't like the idea of tying up 8M+ in goalies, to be honest.

YWGinYYZ is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
07-01-2013, 06:31 PM
  #21
BigTuna49
#WPGWHITEOUT
 
BigTuna49's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: ATL
Country: Scotland
Posts: 24,479
vCash: 84
Quote:
Originally Posted by Resurrection View Post
I guess my whole reasoning for this post was that I understand that there are mitigating circumstances. But for the most part, when a trade occurs it's a pretty reasonable process for us fans to go thru and ask "could my team have acquired this player for the cost paid" and to follow up if the answer was no "what more would I, as a fan, would have wanted my team to give up".

I think that most Jets fans would love to have Scheider. He's a better goaltender than Pavelec and a proven winner that can get a team to a playoff or at least not sabotage a good team getting there. I think most people would say "yes lets do it".

Second part of the all this then becomes "would I pay the same price or higher". For me it's a yes, pick 13 and pick 9 to me are interchangable, and in my outsider opinion I think Vancouver would value our pick next year higher than the Devils pick as we are likely viewed as a lottery team again.

Would the Canucks agree to a deal with us? That's an unknown and a moot point becuase I'm not asking that.



This is a thread talking about possibly trading for a #1 goaltender. How is Pavelec, our current "#1" not a valid thing to bring up? More importantly I refuse to take your posts seriously until you have the balls to answer a simple question asked of you likely 6 times now.

Let's try again.

How many more seasons, and at what age will you consider Pavelec a failure as a #1 goaltender?
Well, the top part is what this thread is actually about. The bottom part is just another excuse to whine about Pavelec. You seriously need to let that **** go. You're posts just come across as childish. I'm not talking about Pavelec to someone who just jumps to conclusions and makes blind assumptions like you did in your 2nd post with regards to Chevy. We don't know what did or didn't happen. I gave you my reasoning as well as others and yet all you want to do is ***** about Pavelec to me. I don't see you attacking other posters because they gave an opinion as to why we didn't go after Schneider.

BigTuna49 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-01-2013, 06:36 PM
  #22
Resurrection
Registered User
 
Resurrection's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,118
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duke89 View Post
Well, the top part is what this thread is actually about. The bottom part is just another excuse to whine about Pavelec. You seriously need to let that **** go. You're posts just come across as childish. I'm not talking about Pavelec to someone who just jumps to conclusions and makes blind assumptions like you did in your 2nd post with regards to Chevy. We don't know what did or didn't happen. I gave you my reasoning as well as others and yet all you want to do is ***** about Pavelec to me. I don't see you attacking other posters because they gave an opinion as to why we didn't go after Schneider.
It's a discussion board. The whole point of the place is to make assumptions and your own judgements and talk with people about their own sets of assumptions judgements and what not.

I'll try the polite approach.

Hey Duke, thanks for your reply. While I respectfully disagree with your post, I will be ever so joyed if you could do me the pleasure of answering a question I have attempted to get an answer from you in the past. How many more seasons of Pavelec being a 904-906 goaltender will it take before you concede he isn't a solution to our problems in net? At what age is it ok to consider him a failed experiment? He's 26 come the new season. Is 27 ok? 28? 30?

I'd be delighted to hear your opinion.

Resurrection is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-01-2013, 06:48 PM
  #23
cheswick
Non-registered User
 
cheswick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Peg City
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,656
vCash: 232
Personally don't think scheinder has done enough to earn all the praise and hoopla he gets.

cheswick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-01-2013, 06:52 PM
  #24
GermanJetsFan
Beaver Jedi
 
GermanJetsFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Darmstadt, GER
Country: Germany
Posts: 5,743
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by cheswick View Post
Personally don't think scheinder has done enough to earn all the praise and hoopla he gets.
So do I... but on the other side, I'm confident he will be as good as people hope.

GermanJetsFan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-01-2013, 06:53 PM
  #25
sully1410
#VinegarStrokes
 
sully1410's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Calgary, Alta.
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,647
vCash: 72
I don't think Chevy made a move for Schneider. I think he has confidence in Pavelec going forward and both him
and Noel are fine with him as this team gets more and more competitive. Noel even went as far to say that he has faith that Pavs could back stop this team to a championship team. I've read all the stats on Pavelec, and it is definitely compelling. I see where they get the conclusions about him from...

The problem I have with it is this...nobody else seems to see it. Chevy gave him a long term contract, everyone on the team thinks he's the answer going forward. Two years in a row now he's gotten the three stars award ...none of this adds up.

Do we seriously think that we
are the only people that follow the advance stats? Chevy, Noel, Zinger...these aren't dumb people, they obviously know all of his stuff. Why the show of confidence. Not to mention Mark Chipman who has been around hockey and owned a hockey team for forever now.

I have a hard time believing that the people on this board are the only people that see a flaw in the Pavelec answer.

Unless there is something that we are not seeing...

sully1410 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:08 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2015 All Rights Reserved.