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Head Coach Vacancy Pt IV — Rangers get permission to speak to Ruff

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Old
06-07-2013, 10:50 AM
  #551
JeffMangum
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Originally Posted by Richter Scale View Post
So... Bylsma's failings are because of his personnel.

Torts' failings were because of... NOT his personnel!! Cuz Torts sucks.

Got it. Brilliant.
K, just put words in my mouth. I never said the roster didn't need work.

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Old
06-07-2013, 11:01 AM
  #552
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http://www.theonion.com/articles/joh...screami,32726/

didnt know where else this would go... i didnt know what to make of it at first, then i noticed it was from The Onion. made much more sense.

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06-07-2013, 11:08 AM
  #553
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Originally Posted by Brian Boyle View Post
K, just put words in my mouth. I never said the roster didn't need work.
Which is kind of my point. You were one of the more reasonable of the "fire Torts" crowd, but despite recognizing the flawed roster, still thought he should be fired (and said this before there was significant speculation that he had "lost the room").


So to recap:

- Torts has flawed roster. But he should be fired anyway (because presumably he is more to blame than his roster?).

- Bylsma has flawed roster. But you're now defending him as if he is a good coach (or at least not a bad one; the assumption being that he is not more to blame than his roster). Though you haven't said either way (at least that I've seen) whether Bylsma should be fired - the implication I'm getting from you is that he shouldn't be, but if he is, he would be on your radar screen as a candidate for NYR.


Double standard much? At least be consistent.

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06-07-2013, 11:08 AM
  #554
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Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
My gut says there were more players than just Hank, but if that's the case that means this core has run two coaches out of town in the last 4 years. That's.. a bit disconcerting.
I don't think the core "ran" Renney out of town...the incompetence of that roster simply led to it happening, it was inevitable.

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06-07-2013, 11:09 AM
  #555
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Originally Posted by Richter Scale View Post
So to recap:

- Torts has flawed roster. But he should be fired anyway (because presumably he is more to blame than his roster?).

- Bylsma has flawed roster. But you're now defending him as if he is a good coach (or at least not a bad one; the assumption being that he is not more to blame than his roster). Though you haven't said either way (at least that I've seen) whether Bylsma should be fired - the implication I'm getting from you is that he shouldn't be, but if he is, he would be on your radar screen as a candidate for NYR.


Double standard much? At least be consistent.
I think Bylsma should be fired. But I don't think he's the main problem, and I don't think Penguins fans realize how bad their defense is.

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06-07-2013, 11:17 AM
  #556
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06-07-2013, 11:28 AM
  #557
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Originally Posted by Punxrocknyc19 View Post
I'm expecting AV to be named the coach. I've expected it all along. And I'm okay with that, although I think Eakins is a better fit and that the Rangers are missing out big time on him (if they indeed hire AV).

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06-07-2013, 11:28 AM
  #558
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Not thrilled with that but its a hell of a lot better than Mark Messier.

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06-07-2013, 11:31 AM
  #559
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Vigneault is the top candidate, but has yet to be interviewed. Diligent work as always by the organization.

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Old
06-07-2013, 11:39 AM
  #560
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Originally Posted by OverTheCap View Post
Vigneault is the top candidate, but has yet to be interviewed. Diligent work as always by the organization.
Haha. So true. Was in an article posted in one of the previous Head Coaching threads but he was on Rangers short list in 2002 and wasn't interviewed before Trottier got hired.

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Old
06-07-2013, 11:46 AM
  #561
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Originally Posted by Brian Boyle View Post
I don't think the core "ran" Renney out of town...the incompetence of that roster simply led to it happening, it was inevitable.
That team quit on Renney. I've never seen a group of players collectively give up like that.

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06-07-2013, 11:50 AM
  #562
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Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
That team quit on Renney. I've never seen a group of players collectively give up like that.
Yeah. That Flyers game where Richards scored shorthanded 3 on 5 was one of the most embarrassing games I've ever seen as a Ranger fan. I think it was 5-1 halfway through the 2nd at home and I honestly thought it could have gotten much uglier because the Flyers were skating circles around the Rangers and the Rangers didn't give a ****.

EDIT - Here's the highlights of that game. It was actually 5-0 before the Rangers got on the board. Watching the effort of some of these guys on the goals is still embarrassing.


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06-07-2013, 11:54 AM
  #563
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Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
That team quit on Renney. I've never seen a group of players collectively give up like that.
I always felt that coup was spearheaded by Gomez and Zherdev.

But, yes, there were certainly others involved.

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06-07-2013, 11:56 AM
  #564
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
I always felt that coup was spearheaded by Gomez and Zherdev.
Two of the hardest working guys to ever pull on the Ranger sweater.

I'll get killed for this, but I would give Renney an interview.

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Old
06-07-2013, 11:58 AM
  #565
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Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
That team quit on Renney. I've never seen a group of players collectively give up like that.
That core sucked anyway. Only players that remain are Hank, Staal, Girardi, and Callahan.

Personally, I never thought this team truly quit on Tortorella. They still played hard, blocked shots, etc. The 08-09 team was a bunch of pansies, period.

Who knows what really went on in those breakup day interviews with Sather. Maybe the players did ***** and moan like a couple of whiny brats, or maybe they laid out their problems with Torts in a professional, intelligent manner.

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06-07-2013, 12:02 PM
  #566
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Originally Posted by OverTheCap View Post
Vigneault is the top candidate, but has yet to be interviewed. Diligent work as always by the organization.
I know what your saying but I don't think it's wrong to have a top candidate going into the coaching search. Doesn't mean that's the guy they are going to pick.

I do think it's crazy that Torts was let go last week and the Rangers are waiting to interview people. Sather's vacation in California has trumped the search for the next head coach. THAT to me is the issue in all this. Why can't the Rangers interview candidates this week? Next week the Rangers could be in competition with the Penguins for a Head Coach. Lets say Vigneault is the top choice for both the Rangers and Penguins job why would he pick the Rangers over the Penguins?

The fact that the Rangers aren't in a rush to name somebody leads me to believe they are either waiting for Tippett and they think Messier is the 2nd best candidate. Tippett stays with the Coyotes then they name Messier the coach. If Vigneault really was the #1 choice, the guy they think will take them to the Stanley Cup Dolan AND Sather would have been on a plane to Vancouver interviewing Vigneault the day they fired Torts. Maybe even before they fired Torts.....

If the Rangers think Vigneault is the right man for the job they have a funny way of showing it....


Last edited by Son of Steinbrenner: 06-07-2013 at 12:08 PM.
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Old
06-07-2013, 12:04 PM
  #567
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Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
Two of the hardest working guys to ever pull on the Ranger sweater.

I'll get killed for this, but I would give Renney and interview.
Me too....Renney is a good coach and knows how to treat the players like professionals. Is he perfect? Of course not but what coaching candidate is?

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06-07-2013, 12:11 PM
  #568
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
Two of the hardest working guys to ever pull on the Ranger sweater.

I'll get killed for this, but I would give Renney and interview.
Yeah, some real horses you can get behind

Who the hell was Gomez to demand anything, plus the team was winning regardless of their gripes. One day they just shut it down and brought the team with them. Though I agree with BRB, that core was not what it is today.

BB, I don't think this team quit on themselves, they still would take shot after shot in the pads and in some case in the face for one another. Torts is a different story.

SOS, good point about Vigneault, but with these coaches interviewing with multiple teams the schedule is gonna make the process take awhile. Though I wouldn't discount your theory either.

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06-07-2013, 12:13 PM
  #569
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I think AV is Torts-lite. That would be a lateral move by the organization.

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06-07-2013, 12:16 PM
  #570
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Originally Posted by Bluenote13 View Post
BB, I don't think this team quit on themselves, they still would take shot after shot in the pads and in some case in the face for one another. Torts is a different story.
Fair point. These players have pride in themselves to win games, I don't think they need a coach like Tortorella to tell them to do that. I think, if they truly did quit on Tortorella, that was one of the problems. This team is used to putting it all on the line to win it every night, they didn't need a guy who could barely strategize (in their opinion, and in mine) barking at them at the end of every shift. They looked like a team without guidance out there, especially on the PP in game three.

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06-07-2013, 12:18 PM
  #571
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Me too....Renney is a good coach and knows how to treat the players like professionals. Is he perfect? Of course not but what coaching candidate is?
I would too.

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06-07-2013, 12:27 PM
  #572
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Originally Posted by Son of Steinbrenner View Post
Me too....Renney is a good coach and knows how to treat the players like professionals. Is he perfect? Of course not but what coaching candidate is?
Wasn't a fan of his coaching style. We brought in Torts to give a players a kick in the ass and also to open up things with his style of play which eventually turned into the sit back and block shots system of today. When Torts first took over for Renney, it was refreshing because they had 2 or 3 guys forechecking hard which was vastly different from Renney who had his guys sit back.

Great guy and he did a good job with the teams after the lockout but I don't think he's the right coach for this team.

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06-07-2013, 12:29 PM
  #573
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I'm convinced Renney does not have the ability to become angry. While that is an impressive and admirable human quality, I want to see a coach lace into an official or player every now and then when it's deserved. I think the only time I can remember him getting visibly pissed off was in a game against Chicago where the refs were just pitiful. Won that game too even with all the lopsided calls.

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06-07-2013, 12:31 PM
  #574
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Originally Posted by Brian Boyle View Post
Fair point. These players have pride in themselves to win games, I don't think they need a coach like Tortorella to tell them to do that. I think, if they truly did quit on Tortorella, that was one of the problems. This team is used to putting it all on the line to win it every night, they didn't need a guy who could barely strategize (in their opinion, and in mine) barking at them at the end of every shift. They looked like a team without guidance out there, especially on the PP in game three.
They didn't quit, they tuned him out to a degree, I don't claim to have all the facts, just looked that way on/off the ice.

Guidance, that's a good word going forward. The next coach doesn't have to be buddy buddy or treat the players with kid gloves, but he'll have to be a leader and someone who can give that extra push towards improvements that Torts didn't utilize or maybe just didn't want to adapt to.

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06-07-2013, 12:33 PM
  #575
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Originally Posted by Richter Scale View Post
Which is kind of my point. You were one of the more reasonable of the "fire Torts" crowd, but despite recognizing the flawed roster, still thought he should be fired (and said this before there was significant speculation that he had "lost the room").
Why can't the coach and the roster both be at fault? Why must it be one or the other? Some people believe that Torts was no longer the best coach for this team, but that doesn't mean they thought the roster was perfect.

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