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Maple Leafs should trade Phil Kessel

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06-07-2013, 05:27 PM
  #151
Bomber0104
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I agree

"In Nonis we trust", as there should be a price point at which it becomes too much money and walking as a UFA is certainly not an option either worth considering.
I guess it depends how each party views Kessel's importance to the overall composition of the team. He is certainly a very good PP player but that is only one aspect of the game itself, as their are many even-strength and penalty-kill minutes to play where his effectiveness dramatically drops off.

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06-07-2013, 05:30 PM
  #152
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Ridiculous.

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06-07-2013, 05:36 PM
  #153
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trade him for matt Duchene, cause that's where his buddy will be going , bozak.
we get a # 1 center, PPG center.
if we don't sign him( bozak), he will bolt to follow his friend.

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06-07-2013, 05:46 PM
  #154
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Kessel and his agent are not going to give the biggest and most desperate market in the league a discount; certainly not going to forego the chance to test free agency. He's going to get paid near league max and the Leafs would be beyond stupid to pony up. He'll be a rental for somebody in March.

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06-07-2013, 05:55 PM
  #155
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Originally Posted by Bomber0104 View Post
I guess it depends how each party views Kessel's importance to the overall composition of the team. He is certainly a very good PP player but that is only one aspect of the game itself, as their are many even-strength and penalty-kill minutes to play where his effectiveness dramatically drops off.
Lol, in terms of players who played 15+ minutes a game at even-strength, Kessel was 12th in the league in even strength points per 60 minutes.

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06-07-2013, 06:02 PM
  #156
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Originally Posted by Gatorade View Post
Kessel and his agent are not going to give the biggest and most desperate market in the league a discount; certainly not going to forego the chance to test free agency. He's going to get paid near league max and the Leafs would be beyond stupid to pony up. He'll be a rental for somebody in March.
I guess it depends on how you define "near league max". League max would be a little over 12 million a year (20% of the cap for an individual) for 8 years. I don't think he'll get near that. I think he'll come in just below Getzlaf and Perry at about 7.5 to 8 million for 8 years.

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06-07-2013, 06:02 PM
  #157
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I say he gets 7 mil, same as Spezza.

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06-07-2013, 06:07 PM
  #158
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Originally Posted by LeafOfBread View Post
Lol, in terms of players who played 15+ minutes a game at even-strength, Kessel was 12th in the league in even strength points per 60 minutes.
Yet was the biggest contributor of his line being scored on MORE...hence the drop off in effectiveness. On the PP you don't have to defend or fight all that much if you have puck possession which is why Kessel is great there. Even strength you do.

If he's performing in the top 10 for PP he should be payed like one ($8 plus)...but he should also be deducted for being a defensive liability (subtract $1.5 million)...so he should get around $6.5 with some term and security.

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06-07-2013, 06:08 PM
  #159
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Originally Posted by Gatorade View Post
Kessel and his agent are not going to give the biggest and most desperate market in the league a discount; certainly not going to forego the chance to test free agency. He's going to get paid near league max and the Leafs would be beyond stupid to pony up. He'll be a rental for somebody in March.
Why should he take a discount? The last team he was with tried to lowball him. All he wanted was market value. He proved to be worth more than that. Why shouldn't he get market value again?

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06-07-2013, 06:09 PM
  #160
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Why are we giving the Star any attention?

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06-07-2013, 06:10 PM
  #161
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Originally Posted by Bomber0104 View Post
Yet was the biggest contributor of his line being scored on MORE...hence the drop off in effectiveness. On the PP you don't have to defend or fight all that much if you have puck possession which is why Kessel is great there. Even strength you do.
Care to prove that point? Before you tell me something stupid, this will involve you going back and watching every goal against and telling us which ones were his fault.

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06-07-2013, 06:12 PM
  #162
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Originally Posted by eyeball11 View Post
Care to prove that point? Before you tell me something stupid, this will involve you going back and watching every goal against and telling us which ones were his fault.
Who is worse on the Leafs for defensive and physical effort?

Can't believe this even needs to be said.

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06-07-2013, 06:13 PM
  #163
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Obviously no one is untouchable in the right deal, but to say the Leafs "should" trade Kessel is ridiculous. If we can get a legitimate # 1 C in return we'd obviously have to consider it, but I doubt a deal like that is out there. Kessel is right at the bottom of the list of players the Leafs "should" trade, the only people below him in my eyes are Rielly, and maybe Kadri.

Thestar's sports section is a joke.

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06-07-2013, 06:17 PM
  #164
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Originally Posted by Bomber0104 View Post
Who is worse on the Leafs for defensive and physical effort?

Can't believe this even needs to be said.
Short answer: you don't care to prove it.

Colour me surprised.

Love those blanket statements.......

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06-07-2013, 06:19 PM
  #165
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Kessel needs to stay.

Hopefully we sign him at 7 mil for 8 years. Lock up that stud muffin.

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06-07-2013, 06:23 PM
  #166
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Originally Posted by eyeball11 View Post
Short answer: you don't care to prove it.

Colour me surprised.

Love those blanket statements.......
It's pretty unanimous that Kessel is one of the worst defensive and least physical players in the league. Unless you seem to think many Leafs occupy such parameters then I don't know how you could accuse Lupul and Bozak, two players who most consider capable defensively and physically, of being worse than him. Because Kessel is so uninvolved, it forces Lupul and Bozak to tighten up even more.

$6.5 is a reasonable raise for someone who stepped up his game.

Remember we paid $5.5 for a 36 goal scorer at 21 years of age. A $1M - $1.5 raise plus long term security is a heck of a raise.

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06-07-2013, 06:26 PM
  #167
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MacKinnon could be that future #1 center that Leafs have been seeking his Mats left.

If MacKinnon became like John Taraves, could you not see the value to move offense from the wing to address the center ice position?
Not really. Kessel was over a PPG this season and is an excellent playoff performer too. You're just trading one huge piece for another.

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Most top line NHL centers are obtained by teams drafting and developing them and seldom trading them.
Exactly. Trying to trade Kessel for the same player at centre probably isn't going to happen.

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Kessel has 1 year left on a contract that could see him become a UFA one year from now, and walk away leaving the Leafs with nothing.. So are you prepared for that potential outcome, or giving Kessel whatever he wants to stay the best possible outcome all things considered as well as trade?.
The Leafs can afford to pay whatever. Kessel is not going to walk away leaving the Leafs with nothing, that is a fictional scenario that isn't going to happen.

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Originally Posted by Bomber0104 View Post
If that is what happens, I am sure Nonis will give himself other options to use as leverage against Kessel...such as trading him.
Keep on hoping, I guess.

But why should Nonis balk at paying Kessel a top salary? He is a top player, even you realize that now.

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06-07-2013, 06:29 PM
  #168
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Originally Posted by Bomber0104 View Post
It's pretty unanimous that Kessel is one of the worst defensive and least physical players in the league. Unless you seem to think many Leafs occupy such parameters then I don't know how you could accuse Lupul and Bozak, two players who most consider capable defensively and physically, of being worse than him. Because Kessel is so uninvolved, it forces Lupul and Bozak to tighten up even more.

$6.5 is a reasonable raise for someone who stepped up his game.

Remember we paid $5.5 for a 36 goal scorer at 21 years of age. A $1M - $1.5 raise plus long term security is a heck of a raise.
When you make the statement "the biggest contributor of his line being scored on MORE" the onus is on you to prove it. If you want to have an intelligent discussion, you need to look at the actual evidence. That means looking at goals against he was on the ice for and evaluating who made the mistakes. Many of you will be very surprised when you do this and compare it to +/-.

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06-07-2013, 06:34 PM
  #169
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Keep on hoping, I guess.

But why should Nonis balk at paying Kessel a top salary? He is a top player, even you realize that now.
Well as a Leafs fan, my first instinct is to always hope the team gets better. As for Phil Kessel, based on his somewhat tumultuous past I wouldn't be surprised to see him and his agent take the Leafs to the cleaners which I would regret to see as a Leafs fan. At a reasonable price re-signing Kessel is worthwhile, since he's boosted his point totals. At an excessive price it might be worthwhile to see if another team will bite that bullet and fill multiple holes in the roster.

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06-07-2013, 07:03 PM
  #170
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Kessel has gone out of his way to praise Bozak in interviews. To be honest, It bothers me. I do believe he was in the past sending a message to Leafs Management with these statements, at the very least Maple Leafs management would have taken notice.

Bozak in turn is kept on a first line wth Kessel, possibly the worst #1 center in the NHL. Bozak now wants 5 million? Predictable player in that he passes to Kessel 90% of the time, good on draws, his point production was well below his linemates. Signing Bozak to long term big money will set this team back 5 years.

If Bozak goes, I wonder if Kessel morale drops?

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06-07-2013, 07:15 PM
  #171
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Originally Posted by Bomber0104 View Post
Yet was the biggest contributor of his line being scored on MORE...hence the drop off in effectiveness. On the PP you don't have to defend or fight all that much if you have puck possession which is why Kessel is great there. Even strength you do.

If he's performing in the top 10 for PP he should be payed like one ($8 plus)...but he should also be deducted for being a defensive liability (subtract $1.5 million)...so he should get around $6.5 with some term and security.
I said even strength, I wasn't talking about PP.

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06-07-2013, 07:33 PM
  #172
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What a pile of BS...

The star is brutal, just brutal.

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06-07-2013, 07:35 PM
  #173
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The common sentiment that "you can't win a cup with Kessel" is just moronic.

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06-07-2013, 08:02 PM
  #174
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Originally Posted by Bomber0104 View Post
Well as a Leafs fan, my first instinct is to always hope the team gets better. As for Phil Kessel, based on his somewhat tumultuous past I wouldn't be surprised to see him and his agent take the Leafs to the cleaners which I would regret to see as a Leafs fan. At a reasonable price re-signing Kessel is worthwhile, since he's boosted his point totals. At an excessive price it might be worthwhile to see if another team will bite that bullet and fill multiple holes in the roster.
Huh? Kessel is clearly worth $7-8 million per. In the regular season, his offensive zone starts were around 45%, and he was going up against higher competition than say, Corey Perry. Despite that, he produced more than Corey Perry.

Don't get me wrong here, I'd take Crosby over Kessel, but the standards being used are not consistent. Once the 'Sauga boy produces like Kessel, despite being very sheltered, he'll probably receive >$8 million. These discussions are seriously getting irritating.

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06-07-2013, 08:04 PM
  #175
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What a joke newspaper. They use to be creditable.

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