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Dan Bylsma Hot Seat Pt. III | Shero pushing for Bylsma extension

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06-11-2013, 07:04 PM
  #126
66-30-33
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Originally Posted by Davos Seaworth View Post
So did I hear that right from a friend, Madden says Tippett will be coming?
That's him hoping.

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06-11-2013, 07:05 PM
  #127
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Originally Posted by 66-29-33 View Post
That's him hoping.
So that means no Tippett then

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06-11-2013, 07:08 PM
  #128
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Originally Posted by Davos Seaworth View Post
So that means no Tippett then
If there is no decision by the 30th i say he's a UFA coach.

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06-11-2013, 07:13 PM
  #129
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Originally Posted by Jules Winnfield View Post
The stuff about Tippett not being a candidate to come here are funny.

I think Tippett is looking for the right job to say peace out to Phoenix to. If he was 100% staying in Phoenix, he'd already be re-signed by now. Does anyone think Tippett wants to go through this rigamarole every year with will the team be in Phoenix? Will they be in Seattle? Will they be in Quebec? He has a wife and two teenage kids. I'm sure the family would love to know where they're going to be for a while.

Tippett is one of the best coaches in the league. I'd put him at #2 right behind Babcock. The only reason he was out in Dallas was because Niewendyk took over at GM and wanted to bring in his own guy as coach.

It might be a pipe dream, but I'd love to see Tippett with Tocchet and King as the assistants. Those guys pretty much cover all the bases.
Tippett's "desire to remain in Phoenix" has the ring of everything Marian Hossa always says when he's a free agent.

I think he likes his situation but also wants to see if the right job opens up before he re-signs with a company that he doesn't even know where it's going to be in 3 years. Whether that's us is anybody's guess.

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06-11-2013, 07:19 PM
  #130
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lol if the Pens fire Dan he will have a job as head coach on another team almost instantly
So what? The issue isn't whether he's a good NHL coach in general. The issue, specifically, is whether he's right for this team.

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06-11-2013, 07:20 PM
  #131
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Tippett's track record with youth isn't great. It's even worse with offensive talent. His track record with goaltenders is outstanding. He's not the right fit for this team, imo, but I suppose he might be a good enough coach to make the right adjustments in both our team and his own coaching philosophy. Personally, I don't believe a defense-first coach is the right fit for a Crosby-Malkin-led team. But he's not the worst candidate either.

As for getting rid of Bylsma's assistants but keeping Disco Dan, wasn't Mike Yeo supposedly the problem too? The assistants mean nothing if you keep the head honcho.

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06-11-2013, 07:20 PM
  #132
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I'm guessing that there will be a stream for the conference on the website?
I really hope so. I want to watch.

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06-11-2013, 07:21 PM
  #133
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Originally Posted by Sideline View Post
How is Tippett with young players? One of my biggest frustrations with Bylsma is his unwillingness to let young guys work through mistakes while vets get all year long to look terrible before they get benched.
If you can play, Tippett plays you. He's been able to bring in Ericksson, Ott, and Ekman-Larsson to contribute all at a young age. Yandle was 22 or 23 when he was playing for Tippett and continued his success from the year before he came on board. He had no issues playing Brunnstrum when Dallas signed him.

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06-11-2013, 07:24 PM
  #134
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I think it's important that Shero looks a tiny bit in the mirror before making any player or coaching decisions.

It essentially starts with Ray, and he has to decide once and for all what kind of identity he wants the Penguins to have. Wanting a team that's "Hard to play against" does not mean you only do it in THEORY in terms of the personnel you pick up without taking other things into consideration.

In THEORY, Brenden Morrow SHOULD have made our team tougher, but message posters like us who pay 20 bucks a month for Gamecenter and watched the occasional Dallas game knew that THEORY was all that was. Same thing with Murray, who would provide a lot of toughness and physicality while significantly slowing down our d-corps. Iginla was a mistake, and came with a heavy warning from a lot of Flames fans who were very objective with their analysis of him and said that his play had been slipping for YEARS. I don't want to hear anything about which side he played on, because while that certainly didn't help, I don't think the negative impact the position switch had was as significant as some people want to believe.
1. IMO, making the Pens tougher to play against should start and end with making Sid and Geno tougher to play against. Until you give them the type of help they'd need to dictate against anyone, not just the bottom feeders, but also against a team like Boston where you need help, it doesn't matter who the other names are on the team or how big they are. The Pens won't be tough to play against. The team is Sid and Geno. Exploit the advantage. For the first time since 2008, exploit it.

2. Speaking of which, I do agree about Ray Shero. Too many moves are made in a bubble without considering how and with whom they'd work. Iginla this year. Morrow. I remember Ponikarovsky. Always the same ****. Decent players, with little or no consideration as to where they'd fit (or situations where organization and coaching staff aren't on the same page).

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06-11-2013, 07:25 PM
  #135
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Originally Posted by Waffle Fries View Post
Well, that's why I said nobody should read anything either way into there being no news.

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06-11-2013, 07:26 PM
  #136
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Originally Posted by Jules Winnfield View Post
If you can play, Tippett plays you. He's been able to bring in Ericksson, Ott, and Ekman-Larsson to contribute all at a young age. Yandle was 22 or 23 when he was playing for Tippett and continued his success from the year before he came on board. He had no issues playing Brunnstrum when Dallas signed him.
Tippet also brings them along the right way. I read this article about him two-three years ago where he shields the rookies. They play a little more in home games where he has the last change, etc.

All smart things that DB should do...

You have the last change at home. Get the rookies in for a favorable shift, etc.

We wasted Despres and BB this year, they needed to get more experience and now we'll listen to people ***** when they have a bad stretch about this being their "SECOND" year....

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06-11-2013, 07:28 PM
  #137
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Originally Posted by KIRK View Post
1. IMO, making the Pens tougher to play against should start and end with making Sid and Geno tougher to play against. Until you give them the type of help they'd need to dictate against anyone, not just the bottom feeders, but also against a team like Boston where you need help, it doesn't matter who the other names are on the team or how big they are. The Pens won't be tough to play against. The team is Sid and Geno. Exploit the advantage. For the first time since 2008, exploit it.

2. Speaking of which, I do agree about Ray Shero. Too many moves are made in a bubble without considering how and with whom they'd work. Iginla this year. Morrow. I remember Ponikarovsky. Always the same ****. Decent players, with little or no consideration as to where they'd fit (or situations where organization and coaching staff aren't on the same page).
With due respect, what other idiot coach would have a just-acquired Iginla playing left wing for the first time in his career, in a shortened season with a short training camp, with a new team in a new Conference amid Cup expectations, and all the while having him playing a complementary/hard-working role instead of a sniping role on a scoring line?

I really have no issue with Shero on that one. Iginla is ALL Disco Dan.

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06-11-2013, 07:28 PM
  #138
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Originally Posted by Jag68Sid87 View Post
Tippett's track record with youth isn't great.
Like who?

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Originally Posted by Jag68Sid87 View Post
It's even worse with offensive talent.
Tippett has consistently had weak offensive talent on his teams. Take Malkin and Crosby off the Pens and Tippett has been working with less than that in Phoenix. The last time he had a team with some talent, they finished 2nd in the Western Conference in goals. Doesn't sound too weak to me.

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Originally Posted by Jag68Sid87 View Post
His track record with goaltenders is outstanding.
Correct. Another good reason to get him here. Not only in regards to the goaltending but getting the forwards and D back to fundamentals to support the goaltender.

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Originally Posted by Jag68Sid87 View Post
He's not the right fit for this team, imo, but I suppose he might be a good enough coach to make the right adjustments in both our team and his own coaching philosophy. Personally, I don't believe a defense-first coach is the right fit for a Crosby-Malkin-led team. But he's not the worst candidate either.
He's not Kevin Constantine or Tortorella with the Rangers. He gets mislabeled a lot because of what he has to work with in Phoenix. His two best offensive players are defensemen. His top forward is Radim Vrbata...

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06-11-2013, 07:29 PM
  #139
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Originally Posted by Waffle Fries View Post
It's also the only news that we've had


Also, does Burkle usually attend these meetings?

Cause when Burkle shows up, there's usually some serious **** going down
Not sure Burkle showed or phoned in (don't think the article says), but he is not usually involved in these things. I read Andrew Conte's book. Only two times he inserted himself into the process, as reported by the book, were initial talks about Hossa (if we think we can win, then let's go for it) and talks from January 2008 about what was wrong with the Pens (he wanted answers, to know, among other things, what plans there might be for a coaching change . . . Shero said 'no plans, always looking for a trade to make the team better'.

So, yes, if Burkle is involved, then some serious **** is going down, and Ray Shero better have some had some good answers today about a lot of things, and not just the coach.

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06-11-2013, 07:30 PM
  #140
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Originally Posted by Jag68Sid87 View Post
Tippett's track record with youth isn't great. It's even worse with offensive talent. His track record with goaltenders is outstanding.
Goodbye Fleury, hello Smith? Smith is proven in Tippetts system, Fleury will never be proven in any system untill he can sort himself out. Shero builds around Dmen, so i can't see why he wont be that good of a fit for us if we get the right D.

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06-11-2013, 07:30 PM
  #141
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They actually do have a coaches meeting scheduled this week sometime as Friedman reported on Satellite Hot Stove.

Found it odd the head honchos met with Shero before the coaches meeting has happened. Says to me, changes may be coming or maybe it was just a checkup to make sure hanging on to this guy was the right direction to go...

We'll find out soon enough.

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06-11-2013, 07:31 PM
  #142
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Originally Posted by Jag68Sid87 View Post
With due respect, what other idiot coach would have a just-acquired Iginla playing left wing for the first time in his career, in a shortened season with a short training camp, with a new team in a new Conference amid Cup expectations, and all the while having him playing a complementary/hard-working role instead of a sniping role on a scoring line?

I really have no issue with Shero on that one. Iginla is ALL Disco Dan.
Oooh, oooh, I know this one . . .

BTW, that one specifically wasn't a big issue with Shero, which is why I referenced the idea that management and coaches need to be on the same page, which IMO makes it partially, although in this case not close to predominantly, on management.

EDIT: That said, even on Sunday, that idiot was insisting that Iginla was used in the way 'best' for the team. That alone should be grounds for determination. I just look at all of these guys, Geno among others, accepting blame for the defeat, and you know who's the one guy who can't even admit that maybe he could have done one thing, even the smallest thing better? You guessed it . . . Bylsma.

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06-11-2013, 07:32 PM
  #143
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Originally Posted by Jules Winnfield View Post
Like who?



Tippett has consistently had weak offensive talent on his teams. Take Malkin and Crosby off the Pens and Tippett has been working with less than that in Phoenix. The last time he had a team with some talent, they finished 2nd in the Western Conference in goals. Doesn't sound too weak to me.



Correct. Another good reason to get him here. Not only in regards to the goaltending but getting the forwards and D back to fundamentals to support the goaltender.



He's not Kevin Constantine or Tortorella with the Rangers. He gets mislabeled a lot because of what he has to work with in Phoenix. His two best offensive players are defensemen. His top forward is Radim Vrbata...
I would love to know what James Neal thinks of him. To a lesser degree Brenden Morrow.

He's not Constantine or Tortorella, but Tippett's teams play a VERY PASSIVE game. Sure, he might adjust. Joel Quenneville's teams were not like Chicago's teams. So I guess the question becomes: is Dave Tippett another Joel Quenneville waiting to happen? Personally, I don't think so but the jury is still out.

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06-11-2013, 07:34 PM
  #144
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I think he'll make a great coach for USA. Those games hardly ever involve defense. A players coach is a good choice in that instance. Team defense & adjustments don't win gold metals. They're pretty much all-star games.
Plus, bigger ice surface, no clutch and grab . . . agreed.

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06-11-2013, 07:37 PM
  #145
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I would love to know what James Neal thinks of him. To a lesser degree Brenden Morrow.
Neal scored 24 goals for Tippett as a 21 year old rookie. Morrow scored 34 the last year he was there and Tippett was there.

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06-11-2013, 07:38 PM
  #146
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But the Olympics aren't at all like All-Star Games. There's pressure. Big time pressure. The likes of which can only be experienced in the final two rounds of the playoffs.

Bylsma coaching USA is a wet dream for all other participating countries.

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06-11-2013, 07:38 PM
  #147
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Originally Posted by Jules Winnfield View Post
Tippett has consistently had weak offensive talent on his teams. Take Malkin and Crosby off the Pens and Tippett has been working with less than that in Phoenix. The last time he had a team with some talent, they finished 2nd in the Western Conference in goals. Doesn't sound too weak to me.
Yeah, I mean who is the best talent he's ever coached offensively? Mike Ribeiro? An aging Mike Modano? I think he'd also maybe loosen up a bit with this type of offensive talent.

I wonder what kind of relationship Billy G. has with him.

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Not sure Burkle showed or phoned in (don't think the article says), but he is not usually involved in these things. I read Andrew Conte's book. Only two times he inserted himself into the process, as reported by the book, were initial talks about Hossa (if we think we can win, then let's go for it) and talks from January 2008 about what was wrong with the Pens (he wanted answers, to know, among other things, what plans there might be for a coaching change . . . Shero said 'no plans, always looking for a trade to make the team better'.

So, yes, if Burkle is involved, then some serious **** is going down, and Ray Shero better have some had some good answers today about a lot of things, and not just the coach.
The article said he was there.

And even with the lockout he stayed out until he felt he needed to step it.

Just seems to me if Burkle was there it's pretty serious.

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06-11-2013, 07:39 PM
  #148
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Neal scored 24 goals for Tippett as a 21 year old rookie. Morrow scored 34 the last year he was there and Tippett was there.
Which is why I'd like to hear what they had to say about him as a coach, which won't happen unless Bylsma's gone AND Tippett refuses to sign an extension with Phoenix.

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06-11-2013, 07:41 PM
  #149
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Yeah, I mean who is the best talent he's ever coached offensively? Mike Ribeiro? An aging Mike Modano? I think he'd also maybe loosen up a bit with this type of offensive talent.

I wonder what kind of relationship Billy G. has with him.



The article said he was there.

And even with the lockout he stayed out until he felt he needed to step it.

Just seems to me if Burkle was there it's pretty serious.
I'd hope he'd make us play aggressive with our team. Instead of playing passive, we'd play the same system but aggressive. We got the talent to do it.

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06-11-2013, 07:41 PM
  #150
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Tippet also brings them along the right way. I read this article about him two-three years ago where he shields the rookies. They play a little more in home games where he has the last change, etc.

All smart things that DB should do...

You have the last change at home. Get the rookies in for a favorable shift, etc.

We wasted Despres and BB this year, they needed to get more experience and now we'll listen to people ***** when they have a bad stretch about this being their "SECOND" year....
****, screw the rookies. I'd have been impressed if DB could've gotten a favorable matchup for Sid or Geno at home.

To answer the more specific question, guys like BB and Despres would've played more for a Tippett. I don't know that he's a great teaching coach, but he's got far more faith in pedigree than Bylsma. What would help is if he could persuade Dave King to come along for the ride (not sure he would . . . he's 66, stepped down a year ago as an assistant to work with the Yotes young players in some player personnel capacity). His other guy, I believe, is David Playfair, although I don't know anything about him.

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