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Minnesota Wild - New York Rangers

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Old
06-25-2013, 02:46 AM
  #1
JC704
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Minnesota Wild - New York Rangers

Simple hockey trade for both teams.

Minnesota Wild Receive:
Michael Del Zotto

New York Rangers Receive:
Devin Setoguchi

Minnesota are looking to acquire Defenseman, preferably those already established in the NHL and probably players who are approaching their primes. The Rangers have a need for a good young RW. Not entirely sure how Minnesota's Wing depth is after a trade like this, but I can see something like this working.

The Rangers have McDonagh, Staal, Del Zotto and Moore on the left side at the moment. Del Zotto was always paired with Staal, until the postseason when Staal got hurt and he was occasionally paired with McDonagh. I love Del Zotto and would hate to see him go, but with the emergence of Stralman's unexpected growth and play since we acquired him last year, I think a trade like this could benefit both sides.

My lineup would look like this after the trade:

Hagelin-Stepan-Nash
Kreider-Brassard-Callahan
Clowe-Miller-Setoguchi (Assuming Clowe resigns)
Zuccarello-Boyle-Pyatt (Assuming Zucc signs)

Dorsett/Powe/Asham as extras

McDonagh-Girardi
Staal-Stralman
Moore-McIlrath

Eminger as extra

Lundqvist
Biron

Hoping JT (who I thought was good in his brief stint this season) and McIlrath can make the team during camp.

I think Del Zotto could slide in nicely with the Wild, wherever. It would give them Suter, Brodin and MDZ on the left side.

This is my first proposal and I see how many people get eaten alive here, so I just wanted to throw some rational idea out there. What do MIN/NYR fans think?

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06-25-2013, 02:56 AM
  #2
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I like this offer, and would certainly do it even though I like Seto. Nice to see someone who actually acknowledges handiness and what side each d-man plays on rather than ignore it or not even think about it. However, Brodin actually played on the right side the entire year while alongside Suter even though Brodin is a lefty.

Replacing Seto's production wouldn't be easy, but hopefully Coyle could step up and at least help with the loss. I've stood by Seto through all of his ups and downs with us, unlike many Wild fans who have wanted him traded. He's really developed a physical edge and was second only to Clutterbuck in hits for us this season.

I don't think Ranger fans will like this proposal much since Del Zotto has higher trade value, but I do this as a Wild fan even though it means trading away one of my favorite current Wild players. We'd have a very nice top 4 with Suter, Brodin, Del Zotto, and I'd say Gilbert, but he's likely to be traded or bought out in the next couple weeks so I don't know who plays on the right side of Del Zotto. Spurgeon I guess, though I wouldn't be too happy about Spurgeon getting top 4 minutes.

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06-25-2013, 03:00 AM
  #3
Sharppi
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Because I'm hesitant but excited, the value is there. Good proposal. Is MDZ physical?

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06-25-2013, 03:03 AM
  #4
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Oh, and I forgot to mention, Seto can play both wings, not just RW. He's played LW a number of times for us the past two seasons.

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06-25-2013, 03:19 AM
  #5
Rando Strange
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I agree with Billy Mays. I also like Devin, but this is a deal that would be hard to refuse. This would also make the probable trade/buyout of Gilbert an easier pill to swallow. While I'm sure a lot of people will inevitably bring up the decline of Seto's goal output from '08-'09. Ignoring or not realizing the fact that he has become a more well rounded hockey player. I think this is a trade good for both parties. I think it would be good for Devin. No proof, but I get the feeling he still is not happy playing in Minnesota. He'd be a good fit with New York and Vignault's coaching style.

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06-25-2013, 03:27 AM
  #6
JC704
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Billy Mays Here View Post
I like this offer, and would certainly do it even though I like Seto. Nice to see someone who actually acknowledges handiness and what side each d-man plays on rather than ignore it or not even think about it. However, Brodin actually played on the right side the entire year while alongside Suter even though Brodin is a lefty.

Replacing Seto's production wouldn't be easy, but hopefully Coyle could step up and at least help with the loss. I've stood by Seto through all of his ups and downs with us, unlike many Wild fans who have wanted him traded. He's really developed a physical edge and was second only to Clutterbuck in hits for us this season.

I don't think Ranger fans will like this proposal much since Del Zotto has higher trade value, but I do this as a Wild fan even though it means trading away one of my favorite current Wild players. We'd have a very nice top 4 with Suter, Brodin, Del Zotto, and I'd say Gilbert, but he's likely to be traded or bought out in the next couple weeks so I don't know who plays on the right side of Del Zotto. Spurgeon I guess, though I wouldn't be too happy about Spurgeon getting top 4 minutes.
Has he really? I only saw Minnesota in the playoffs. Didn't watch them enough, so I had no idea he developed a physical game. I know he's a natural RW, but it does help he can play both wings. I think with AV, the offense can get a little more creative than it was under Torts.

Also, I think the value is as close to even as you can get. Defenseman are valued a bit more, but the Rangers have done such a good job at drafting and developing Defensemen since the last lockout that even if it is tough to move such a good player like MDZ (who is personally one of my favorites tbh), in this case, I think it would be worth it. Hearing all the positive stuff you said about Seto only reenforces my desire for him.

I also had absolutely no idea Brodin was paired with Suter for as long as he was. I only thought that was a temporary thing. If that's the case, then Del Zotto would slide nicely on your 2nd pairing. He is due a raise, but I don't think he will cost more than say, $3.5 million. Especially with the cap going down, it might even be a little less.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharppi View Post
Because I'm hesitant but excited, the value is there. Good proposal. Is MDZ physical?
On the outside you wouldn't think he's physical, but he's very physical. Not as physical as some of the other players, but, Del Zotto definitely plays with enough of an edge. I think when he plays physical in his own end, he actually plays better. Some D tend to get out of position going for a hit, but Del Zotto uses hid body at good times in his own end. It's pinching in the other team's end and picking his spots there that he needs to (generously) "work on."

One thing that the Rangers also have done well the last 5-7 years is bringing up players and not have them be afraid of being physical out there.

Del Zotto is a player who is only getting better. Judging by the Rangers forum, you would think he's dreadful, but that's certainly not the case, nor why I want to trade him. I was just thinking about this the other day. Seto, was always one of my favorite secondary players, even on the Sharks. Rangers need a good, youngish Winger who can score 15-20 goals a season. Minnesota needs a good, youngish Defenseman who can play a good two-way game. I think it's a win-win for both teams. Value aside, this is HF, so if somebody wants to add and "even" it out for both parties, be my guest.

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06-25-2013, 03:48 AM
  #7
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Originally Posted by JC704 View Post
Has he really? I only saw Minnesota in the playoffs. Didn't watch them enough, so I had no idea he developed a physical game. I know he's a natural RW, but it does help he can play both wings. I think with AV, the offense can get a little more creative than it was under Torts.
Downside to Seto is his consistency. Much like Shark fans told us, he is indeed very streaky. Hi might go on a 7 game point streak where he pots 5 goals but then he'll disappear for the next 10 games.

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06-25-2013, 04:01 AM
  #8
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No. Never liked Setoguchi. Makes no sense for the Rangers. Del Zotto like so many puck carrying defenseman the Rangers had was made to play to his weaknesses by dumb Torts. He was never allowed to be offensive. He will only get better with AV as coach. Rangers have players like Kreider and Fast that need ice time which Setoguchi will take up.

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06-25-2013, 04:07 AM
  #9
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As a Wild fan, I'd do this. Especially if we don't get Cullen back, as Seto was pretty much useless without him. His production sans Cullen can be replaced, but what he could potentially produce with Cullen would be harder. However, we really need a good 2nd pairing defenseman more than we need Seto.

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06-25-2013, 05:24 AM
  #10
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no knock on Seto who I think is a very good player, I just think that if the Rangers are trading a defenceman like MDZ, they would want a bit more than just Seto.

over the last 4 years they have been averaging about the same in terms of overall production and offensive defenceman today carry a bit more value that a simple one for one swap with an equally producing forward.

The basis of a deal I think is there. Just not sure that the Rangers are getting the proper value back.

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06-25-2013, 05:46 AM
  #11
thadd
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I wouldn't do this if I were New York. MDZ is way more consistent of a play IMO. I think New York takes too much of a risk with this deal.

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06-25-2013, 05:46 AM
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Not a terrible offer. I like Seto. But, I would like to see the non-Tortorella MDZ first.

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06-25-2013, 06:04 AM
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThisYearsModel View Post
Not a terrible offer. I like Seto. But, I would like to see the non-Tortorella MDZ first.
That's a good point. AV may be a defense first kinda guy, but he isn't as stingy as Torts. I'd be shocked if a handful of Rangers didn't have significantly increased offensive stats next season.

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06-25-2013, 07:41 AM
  #14
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Not a horrible offer. Doubt Sather would do this.

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06-25-2013, 07:45 AM
  #15
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Yeah, definitely a good trade, the value is there and the need is there for both sides. I'd do this in a heartbeat, which probably means that some NYR fans would want a bit more. I'm struggling to think of anything minor yet useful for NYR though, as they're stacked on both offense and defense.

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06-25-2013, 07:54 AM
  #16
iamitter
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It's not a bad offer (certainly is a little more valuewise leaning to the Wild) but I don't see us making this trade. We have lots of "maybe" forwards who could step it up and our success next season depends on their performance. Not so much when it comes to dmen.

I could see a defenseman getting dealt this off-season from us, but I don't think it would be for Setoguchi. I like that he's a right handed shot, though.

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06-25-2013, 07:56 AM
  #17
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God no. Not even close.

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06-25-2013, 08:03 AM
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Seto is set to become a UFA next year. He had a great year in 2008-09, but hasn't been anything special since then. He's a 3rd line player.

Seto has 63 points over the last 2 seasons. MDZ has 62. That might be far value if MDZ wasn't a dman. MDZ is 3 years younger and 3 years from UFA status.

It will take a lot more than 1 year of Seto to get MDZ.

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06-25-2013, 08:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GAGLine View Post
Seto is set to become a UFA next year. He had a great year in 2008-09, but hasn't been anything special since then. He's a 3rd line player.

Seto has 63 points over the last 2 seasons. MDZ has 62. That might be far value if MDZ wasn't a dman. MDZ is 3 years younger and 3 years from UFA status.

It will take a lot more than 1 year of Seto to get MDZ.
Well, in 11-12, Minnesota was really struck with injuries, and this was a shortened season.

To be honest, Setoguchi is at his best when he is the "worst" player on his line. He can be in the right place at the right time, has a very good shot with a quick release and can drive the net. As others mentioned, he is also surprisingly physical.

With that said, he is also streaky.

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06-25-2013, 08:49 AM
  #20
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Originally Posted by Puhis View Post
Yeah, definitely a good trade, the value is there and the need is there for both sides. I'd do this in a heartbeat, which probably means that some NYR fans would want a bit more. I'm struggling to think of anything minor yet useful for NYR though, as they're stacked on both offense and defense.
Good one. Our offense borders on downright pathetic at times. You would think for a team that had Nash, Richards, & Gaborik at one point we would be fine... not the case.

Then again I don't know if it was a case of the Tortorellas.

The reason this trade works for us because we need more offense. Its just that we need an offensive guy who out produces the defenseman we are trading

Overall it really is a solid proposal from a needs perspective. Just need a bit more in terms of value.

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06-25-2013, 08:59 AM
  #21
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Originally Posted by Puhis View Post
Well, in 11-12, Minnesota was really struck with injuries, and this was a shortened season.

To be honest, Setoguchi is at his best when he is the "worst" player on his line. He can be in the right place at the right time, has a very good shot with a quick release and can drive the net. As others mentioned, he is also surprisingly physical.

With that said, he is also streaky.
This isn't helping the case

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06-25-2013, 09:31 AM
  #22
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A 3rd line RW doesn't really fit what the Rangers are looking for. Between Nash, Callahan and Setoguchi, we'd have way too much money tied up in the RW, and Carl Hagelin would still be our top LW. Nothing against Hags, he's just not a first line guy.

The fact that Seto is a group III next summer and already makes $3M is a bit tough to swallow. Ultimately I think the Rangers will try to add someone who is an RFA to be, or has some term left on his deal.

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06-25-2013, 02:16 PM
  #23
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A 3rd line RW doesn't really fit what the Rangers are looking for. Between Nash, Callahan and Setoguchi, we'd have way too much money tied up in the RW, and Carl Hagelin would still be our top LW. Nothing against Hags, he's just not a first line guy.

The fact that Seto is a group III next summer and already makes $3M is a bit tough to swallow. Ultimately I think the Rangers will try to add someone who is an RFA to be, or has some term left on his deal.
Fair enough. I look at Setoguchi more like a solid 2nd liner to have if you have other good players in your Top 6 and with Hagelin and Stepan breaking out, Brassard playing well down the stretch and Callahan and Nash, it would be another forward to add to the fold with Clowe and Kreider giving us better depth. Sometimes it's not necessarily about positional strength, but what other players can do with each other. Look at Bickell in Chicago for starters. Hagelin may not be a 1st Line LW in terms of value and that's just fine because he's a fun player to have, but when paired with Stepan and Nash, he definitely played like one.

But of course, I too though would love to see what MDZ can do without Tortorella first. Maybe I low-balled MDZ's value a bit at first, but Wild fans seem to be pretty much in agreement that in terms of value, it's probably Setoguchi + a relatively small something for Del Zotto.

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06-25-2013, 02:49 PM
  #24
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Originally Posted by JC704 View Post
Fair enough. I look at Setoguchi more like a solid 2nd liner to have if you have other good players in your Top 6 and with Hagelin and Stepan breaking out, Brassard playing well down the stretch and Callahan and Nash, it would be another forward to add to the fold with Clowe and Kreider giving us better depth. Sometimes it's not necessarily about positional strength, but what other players can do with each other. Look at Bickell in Chicago for starters. Hagelin may not be a 1st Line LW in terms of value and that's just fine because he's a fun player to have, but when paired with Stepan and Nash, he definitely played like one.

But of course, I too though would love to see what MDZ can do without Tortorella first. Maybe I low-balled MDZ's value a bit at first, but Wild fans seem to be pretty much in agreement that in terms of value, it's probably Setoguchi + a relatively small something for Del Zotto.
Setoguchi, IMO, is the ultimate complimentary forward. If you give him a couple of linemates who can set him up and create space, he'll put up respectable numbers. Aside from that one 30 goal year in San Jose, he's really wound up as an average to below-average 2nd line winger. That's not the kind of player I'd move Del Zotto for. For all of the crap he gets, he's still a 23 year old PMD who easily slots in on the 2nd pairing and has loads of room to grow.

I'm fully on board with the concept that chemistry trumps the "line x" moniker, but I'd like to see us have at least one other proven forward on the left side. Outside of Hagelin, we have Kreider who is unproven, and Clowe who might not even be a Ranger to start the year.

I just think we could do better than Setoguchi and a small addition for a player like Del Zotto.

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06-25-2013, 02:54 PM
  #25
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I'd like a little added but ultimately not a horrible hockey trade.

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