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Roster/Trade/Etc Discussion Part VIII

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Old
06-18-2013, 02:53 PM
  #51
Eddie Shack
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Originally Posted by Professor John Frink View Post
Fasth makes more sense. At least from a Minnesota perspective. I imagine Backstrom would sign back with Minny for around 5 mil. Getting a potential #1 for under 3 million(especially with Minnesota's cap issues) seems to be a better fit. IMO
If I were Minny I would want Fasth over Hiller as well. But from a Ducks perspective I would offer Hiller. Their main need (according to posters) is a top 4 D man. We are fresh out of those for trade purposes (I don't think anybody sees Allen or Souray as such) so I thought the goalie angle might work. I don't really know how much Backstrom places money over staying but if the Wild see him leaving, Hiller could be a good short term solution that could turn into a longer one if both parties end up happy.

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06-18-2013, 03:38 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by Eddie Shack View Post
If I were Minny I would want Fasth over Hiller as well. But from a Ducks perspective I would offer Hiller. Their main need (according to posters) is a top 4 D man. We are fresh out of those for trade purposes (I don't think anybody sees Allen or Souray as such) so I thought the goalie angle might work. I don't really know how much Backstrom places money over staying but if the Wild see him leaving, Hiller could be a good short term solution that could turn into a longer one if both parties end up happy.
I guess my next question to you then would be this. Say Minny doesn't want Hiller for Clutterbuck but will trade you Fasth straight up for Clutterbuck. Would you make that deal?

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06-18-2013, 03:51 PM
  #53
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I guess my next question to you then would be this. Say Minny doesn't want Hiller for Clutterbuck but will trade you Fasth straight up for Clutterbuck. Would you make that deal?
Well, I could be severely tempted. My thinking goes like this...

Keeping Fasth allows us two full years to evaluate Andersen and Gibson. Assuming Fasth is still worth keeping after 2 years, we can resign him and decide better on what to do with Andersen and Gibson.

Keeping Hiller only gives us one year to decide what to do with Hiller, Andersen and Gibson. I'd hate re-signing Hiller after a year and then being stuck wanting to trade him with little to no market for him. I don't think Andersen or Gibson will show us enough next year to make long term commitments on either.

Therefore, I would prefer the 2 year window (that keeping Fasth provides) on how to proceed than only the one year window that trading Fasth would put us in. So as I think this out, I'd probably be less inclined to trade Fasth if that was the only offer.

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06-18-2013, 04:49 PM
  #54
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Rumor has it Clutterbuck may be available. With Backstrom a ufa and Harding's health a question mark would anybody be interested in offering Hiller for Cal?
I would do that trade. We would get 3 mil in cap space back and even more space if we end up not re-signing Lydman. We could go sign a shutdown d-man like Orpik. Our 3 d-lines would then be:

Beach - Lovejoy
Cam - Orpik
Souray - Sbisa/Vatanen/Allen

I also say we trade Allen, DSP or for picks so we get more cap space. We could use what we have left to help resign Bobby if that is the plan for the future. Or if we end up trading Bobby, we could use the cap space we have left from trading the above 3 mentioned plus the space we would get fro trading Bobby. With that we can go after a more skillful top 6 forward who would probably have a bit if a higher salary. Problem is, I just can't figure the top 6 forward we should go after. I mean, if that above trade (Hiller trade) went through, we would have Clutterbuck. Would you guys be happy with Clutterbuck in the top 6 or should we go get another forward? Again, I just dont know who that forward should be.

My 2 cents. What do you guys think?

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06-18-2013, 05:08 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by HetfieldMustaine22 View Post
I would do that trade. We would get 3 mil in cap space back and even more space if we end up not re-signing Lydman. We could go sign a shutdown d-man like Orpik. Our 3 d-lines would then be:

Beach - Lovejoy
Cam - Orpik
Souray - Sbisa/Vatanen/Allen

I also say we trade Allen, DSP or for picks so we get more cap space. We could use what we have left to help resign Bobby if that is the plan for the future. Or if we end up trading Bobby, we could use the cap space we have left from trading the above 3 mentioned plus the space we would get fro trading Bobby. With that we can go after a more skillful top 6 forward who would probably have a bit if a higher salary. Problem is, I just can't figure the top 6 forward we should go after. I mean, if that above trade (Hiller trade) went through, we would have Clutterbuck. Would you guys be happy with Clutterbuck in the top 6 or should we go get another forward? Again, I just dont know who that forward should be.

My 2 cents. What do you guys think?
Personally, I would be happy with CLutterbuck no matter where he was in the lineup. Granted I think the way he plays and his skillset are made for more of a 3rd line roll, issue then becomes what do you do with Cogliano or Winnik if we acquire CLutterbuck.

As far as your lineup goes. Orpik isn't a UFA until after next season so the Ducks just can't go out and sign him. No need to trade DSP for picks when you can just keep him on his two way deal in the AHL.

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06-18-2013, 05:11 PM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eddie Shack View Post
Well, I could be severely tempted. My thinking goes like this...

Keeping Fasth allows us two full years to evaluate Andersen and Gibson. Assuming Fasth is still worth keeping after 2 years, we can resign him and decide better on what to do with Andersen and Gibson.

Keeping Hiller only gives us one year to decide what to do with Hiller, Andersen and Gibson. I'd hate re-signing Hiller after a year and then being stuck wanting to trade him with little to no market for him. I don't think Andersen or Gibson will show us enough next year to make long term commitments on either.

Therefore, I would prefer the 2 year window (that keeping Fasth provides) on how to proceed than only the one year window that trading Fasth would put us in. So as I think this out, I'd probably be less inclined to trade Fasth if that was the only offer.
Understood. I appreciate you taking the time.

I guess the wildcard in the whole "what do you do with the goalies?" question is this. Is Anderson ready for a backup role? Should Anderson/Gibson split time in the AHL? Or are the Ducks better off dealing a goalie, letting Anderson backup thus giving Gibson full time duties in the AHL.

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06-18-2013, 05:50 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by Professor John Frink View Post
Understood. I appreciate you taking the time.

I guess the wildcard in the whole "what do you do with the goalies?" question is this. Is Anderson ready for a backup role? Should Anderson/Gibson split time in the AHL? Or are the Ducks better off dealing a goalie, letting Anderson backup thus giving Gibson full time duties in the AHL.
Well, I'm of the opinion we trade Hiller, give Andersen the back up job and Gibson the starters job in the A. I understand that is a bit risky and others don't want to take that chance. But my argument is that unless you trade for an established top tier goaltender (hardly ever happens) you will always be in a position of having to take a chance on somebody working their way up. Based on both their play last year I just don't see this being that big a risk. It's not like Hiller is a top tier goaltender anymore (assuming he was, pre vertigo). And as I stated earlier, it gives both Andersen and Gibson an excellent chance to move up and show what they can do at the next level. We need to know that for the future. Their development, or lack thereof is critical in planning our near term future.

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06-18-2013, 06:29 PM
  #58
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tim panaccio ‏@tpanotchcsn 20m
2 nhl sources tell csn flyers & ana talking of bobby ryan. Among scenarios being discussed: Coburn, 11th pick for ryan... More later
fwiw

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06-18-2013, 06:36 PM
  #59
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not quite sure what bob would be thinking with that deal, we get worse now with that deal no doubt. unless he plans to trade 11+26 for something which i highly doubt also.

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06-18-2013, 06:50 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by muckbin15 View Post
not quite sure what bob would be thinking with that deal, we get worse now with that deal no doubt. unless he plans to trade 11+26 for something which i highly doubt also.
I wouldn't really be able to say whether we'd actually get worse. I like Coburn and could see him at the very least matching the impact defensively we got from Ryan offensively this year.

That said, with the source coming out of Philly anyway, I'd assume it's more of a Philly starting offer. We'll see where we go from there.

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06-18-2013, 06:56 PM
  #61
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Yup. Seems like an incomplete trade offer, at this point. More of a "this is where we'd like to start" from Philadelphia. It could also be an attempt to keep Couturier or Schenn out of the deal, since Ryan won't get you Coburn, the 11th overall, and one of Couturier or Schenn.

Edit: With all that in mind, Coburn is near the top of my list of defensemen I'd (realistically) like to see in Anaheim.

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06-18-2013, 07:04 PM
  #62
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I'm wondering if Murray did that trade, then flipped the 11 and the 26th pick, how high would he be able to get in the draft? I'd have to think he could move up into at least the top 8, and potentially draft Monahan or someone. Wouldn't be against a move like that. Rather see Murray be aggressive this offseason

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06-18-2013, 07:05 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by AngelDuck View Post
I'm wondering if Murray did that trade, then flipped the 11 and the 26th pick, how high would he be able to get in the draft? I'd have to think he could move up into at least the top 8, and potentially draft Monahan or someone. Wouldn't be against a move like that. Rather see Murray be aggressive this offseason
Doubt it.

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06-18-2013, 07:09 PM
  #64
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I'm wondering if Murray did that trade, then flipped the 11 and the 26th pick, how high would he be able to get in the draft? I'd have to think he could move up into at least the top 8, and potentially draft Monahan or someone. Wouldn't be against a move like that. Rather see Murray be aggressive this offseason
Probably not all that high. The draft has the potential to be good throughout the 1st round, but there seems to be some serious talent up around the top 8. The 11th pick looks like it's just outside that area, where you'd be hoping someone drops to you.

On the other hand, if Murray is getting the 11th overall in a deal that involves Bobby Ryan, I'd venture to guess there is someone who Anaheim wants that won't be available to them at 26th.

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06-18-2013, 08:07 PM
  #65
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I'm wondering if Murray did that trade, then flipped the 11 and the 26th pick, how high would he be able to get in the draft? I'd have to think he could move up into at least the top 8, and potentially draft Monahan or someone. Wouldn't be against a move like that. Rather see Murray be aggressive this offseason
Somewhere between 5 and 8, and I'd be all for it. I'm guessing this organization would love to be in a position to add the other Lindholm, or possibly Sasha Barkov.

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06-18-2013, 08:09 PM
  #66
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Originally Posted by muckbin15 View Post
not quite sure what bob would be thinking with that deal, we get worse now with that deal no doubt. unless he plans to trade 11+26 for something which i highly doubt also.
I think Coburn would be a good partner for Cam but that's just my opinion. The draft pick is what must be included in a package for Ryan. If we make the right picks, this year at draft could potentially compare to the year we had at the draft in 2003.

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06-18-2013, 08:09 PM
  #67
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Probably not all that high. The draft has the potential to be good throughout the 1st round, but there seems to be some serious talent up around the top 8. The 11th pick looks like it's just outside that area, where you'd be hoping someone drops to you.

On the other hand, if Murray is getting the 11th overall in a deal that involves Bobby Ryan, I'd venture to guess there is someone who Anaheim wants that won't be available to them at 26th.
It's also a pretty deep draft, and that 26th pick will be worth something nice. Wouldn't be surprised to see a team like Carolina or Edmonton take that bait.

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06-18-2013, 08:12 PM
  #68
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Somewhere between 5 and 8, and I'd be all for it. I'm guessing this organization would love to be in a position to add the other Lindholm, or possibly Sasha Barkov.
Isn't Barkov expected to go in the top 4?

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06-18-2013, 08:16 PM
  #69
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Isn't Barkov expected to go in the top 4?
IIRC, Nashville loves Barkov and he is seen as basically a lock to go top 4. Top 4 will probably be:

COL - Jones
FLA - Mackinnon
TB - Drouin
NAS - Barkov


After that, who knows?

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06-18-2013, 08:17 PM
  #70
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Isn't Barkov expected to go in the top 4?
Absolutely, probably right at 4, but Filip Forsberg was too. Also, I meant to include Nashville's #4 pick in that range, although it might take a bit more. I could definitely see them being a team trading down to bulk up their prospect pool.

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06-18-2013, 08:18 PM
  #71
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Absolutely, probably right at 4, but Filip Forsberg was too. Also, I meant to include Nashville's #4 pick in that range, although it might take a bit more. I could definitely see them being a team trading down to bulk up their prospect pool.
That story about their pick being available should be taken with a grain of salt. Everyone says that at this time of year.

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06-18-2013, 08:29 PM
  #72
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I'd love Clutterbuck for the right price. There's not a lot of room in our bottom 6 but I'm sure we could find room for someone like him.

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06-18-2013, 08:29 PM
  #73
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It'd have to be on the 4th line. I can't see our org breaking up the third.

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06-18-2013, 09:03 PM
  #74
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That story about their pick being available should be taken with a grain of salt. Everyone says that at this time of year.
I didn't even realize it's a story, it just makes logical sense to me. IMO they could use some prospect depth, especially after getting Forsberg. They could also use a stud centerman, but Poile trading down would not surprise me one bit.

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06-18-2013, 09:08 PM
  #75
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I didn't even realize it's a story, it just makes logical sense to me. IMO they could use some prospect depth, especially after getting Forsberg. They could also use a stud centerman, but Poile trading down would not surprise me one bit.
There have been a few mentions from people in the league that the teams in that top 4 may shift position within that group, but that there is a very clear desire to stay in that range. There's a bit of a drop off past that point.

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