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Trade Rumors and Proposals Thread XXI: MacT's Summer Of Fun

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Old
06-15-2013, 02:20 PM
  #26
Fixed to Ruin
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Originally Posted by nexttothemoon View Post
I'm not sure why more teams don't go after acquiring young European goalies in the 22-27 year old range.

It's long been known that the Europeans seem to do a really solid job at developing goalies (arguably better than in North America)... so to sign/poach goalies from over there once they've developed for several years... until their early/mid-twenties, seems like a prudent way to acquire legit talent in net.

The alternative is to roll the dice and draft 17/18 years olds and never really know what you are going to have for many years.

Last 10 goalies Oilers have drafted:

Tuohimaa, Perhonen, Bunz, Roy, Pitton, Bjurling, Dubnyk, Fisher, Deslauriers, Markkanen

Would the Oilers have simply been better off using those picks on forwards/dmen and acquiring goalies by other means... trades/UFA signings, overseas goalie signings? Likely yes.
This.

One guy I really like playing in europe right now is Roman Will. He's had excellent numbers in CZE for a long time. Played one year in the Q with a weak Moncton Wildcats team and did very well. I thought this guy would be perfect to be the starter in Stockton of the ECHL and work his way up. He would give good competition with Bunz down in Stockton.

I like this guy alot. He looks big in the net, has a good level of compete and good athleticism. He's 21 now.

Here's some vids and stats.

This game was against the Sea Dogs (A team with Coyle, Huberdeau, Jurco and Beaulieu). He made 45/46 saves.


How about a sick save against MacKinnon


http://www.eliteprospects.com/player.php?player=70390

http://ca.sports.yahoo.com/blogs/jrh...143826979.html

How did this guy not get drafted is a mystery to me. Especially to the Oilers who have no depth in goal.

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06-15-2013, 02:29 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by nexttothemoon View Post
I'm not sure why more teams don't go after acquiring young European goalies in the 22-27 year old range.

It's long been known that the Europeans seem to do a really solid job at developing goalies (arguably better than in North America)... so to sign/poach goalies from over there once they've developed for several years... until their early/mid-twenties, seems like a prudent way to acquire legit talent in net.

The alternative is to roll the dice and draft 17/18 years olds and never really know what you are going to have for many years.

Last 10 goalies Oilers have drafted:

Tuohimaa, Perhonen, Bunz, Roy, Pitton, Bjurling, Dubnyk, Fisher, Deslauriers, Markkanen

Would the Oilers have simply been better off using those picks on forwards/dmen and acquiring goalies by other means... trades/UFA signings, overseas goalie signings? Likely yes
.
Been saying this for years. The goalie position is a crapshoot. Therefore the best approach is a bullet approach where you scout this heavily and recruit potential unsigned goalies. Why waste picks on this?

Its classic though of how this org thinks. They landed one superstar goalie, Fuhr, through the draft and because that worked they've been doing it ever since. That its a poor strategy with little return on investment seems not to matter to this org.

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06-15-2013, 02:41 PM
  #28
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It seems like the Oilers find two guys they like and just stick with them come hell or high water.

Dubnyk/Deslauriers then Bunz/Roy.

I'm more of a believer of drafting minimum one goalie every year. If every 5 years i get a starter then great. If you find two or three guys in a 5 year span then you got trade bait for other needs elsewhere. Then you complement that with Euro signings.

Who would you rather be the Ducks with Hiller, Fasth and Gibson / Detroit with Howard and Mrazec or the Flyers who like to chase rainbows with Bryzgalov & Mason because they have never developed a goalie since probably Hextall.

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06-15-2013, 02:52 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by Seedling View Post
Thread title should be Summer of Sam Gagner or summer of Samwise.
MACT

PRESENTS

SummerSlam '13


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06-15-2013, 04:00 PM
  #30
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Any word on whether or not the Oilers are going to extend Fedun? From all accounts he had a very good season in OKC.

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06-15-2013, 04:01 PM
  #31
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I think we should establish that Bickell won't be leaving the Hawks at this point, so there's not much sense in pencilling him in to a mock lineup. They will likely move Bolland to create the space. Anyway, here's what I'd like to see MacT (realistically) do.

- trade Hemmer + 2014 3rd rder for Z Smith. Don't know if he is good enough to be a 3rd line C, but he could be Campbell level quality 4th line C. This deal was agreed upon by Sens fans on the trade board.

- trade ANH 2nd + 2014 2nd for Orpik. A variation of this was proposed by a Pens fan. Gives us a stay at home vet with playoff experience and a cup ring.

- sign Stalberg. 4 years 10 mil. Hasn't had a very good playoff run, but he's a grittier version of Paajarvi that can put up 20 goals from the 3rd line.

- sign Matt Cullen. 2 years, 7.5 mil. Quality veteran C, excellent face off guy and an Oiler killer in the past. Not sure if he'd come here or not. Sure Minny would like to re-sign him, but that is pending a Heatley buyout, etc.

- trade one of Marincin/Musil/Gernat for Peverley. Hasn't had the greatest season, but is a versatile forward who is a face off winning machine. Should bounce back in a more established role here.
- give Eager another shot. The guy reportedly responded well to his AHL demotion, if he can play nastier yet responsibly (no dumb penalties) he could be an excellent 4th liner.

-get a vet backup on the cheap. Nabokov? Can't see him getting more than a mil.

Lineup:

Hall-Gagner-Yak
Peverley (takes draws)-Nuge-Ebs
Paajarvi-Cullen-Stalberg
Eager-Smith-Brown
xtra F Smyth, Petrell

Smid-J Schultz
Orpik-Petry
Klefbom/N Schultz/Belov

Dubie
Nabokov
I wouldn't trade Marincin for Peverley. Too much upside after an awesome first pro season for him to be traded for a third liner (even if he is quite a versatile one).

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06-15-2013, 04:02 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by Jimmi Jenkins View Post
Any word on whether or not the Oilers are going to extend Fedun? From all accounts he had a very good season in OKC.
I'd bank on it. Local boy that they've already invested two years in, and he's developing well. All signs point to yes.

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06-15-2013, 04:04 PM
  #33
Jimmi McJenkins
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Originally Posted by Psycho Dad View Post
I'd bank on it. Local boy that they've already invested two years in, and he's developing well. All signs point to yes.
I suspect that as well, I wonder if they can go 3 years with him, I think it would make for a good investment.

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06-15-2013, 04:37 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by Jimmi Jenkins View Post
If the Oilers are still looking in Europe for a goaltender, here's a few with some solid numbers

Christian Engstrand

Bernhard Starkbaum

Dominik Furch

Stanislav Galimov

I like the Russian kid the best, I think he could be a find.
a fluke of the highest order. Galimov is simply not very good.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Usual_Suspect View Post
Willis suggests:
Bernhard Starkbaum
Konstantin Barulin
Benjamin Conz


http://blogs.edmontonjournal.com/201...-could-pursue/
Barulin is not available, he has a long-term deal just short of $4m/yr after taxes and isn't going anywhere.

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06-15-2013, 05:00 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by Jimmi Jenkins View Post
I suspect that as well, I wonder if they can go 3 years with him, I think it would make for a good investment.
Is he waiver eligible next season? I would hope not, he seems like a guy that could use more seasoning at the AHL level and some experience at the NHL level next season, but I don't see him starting on the team out of camp at this point.

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06-15-2013, 05:14 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by Jimmi Jenkins View Post
Any word on whether or not the Oilers are going to extend Fedun? From all accounts he had a very good season in OKC.
I'd go for a two year deal

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06-15-2013, 05:14 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by devils4cup View Post
It seems like the Oilers find two guys they like and just stick with them come hell or high water.

Dubnyk/Deslauriers then Bunz/Roy.

I'm more of a believer of drafting minimum one goalie every year. If every 5 years i get a starter then great. If you find two or three guys in a 5 year span then you got trade bait for other needs elsewhere. Then you complement that with Euro signings.

Who would you rather be the Ducks with Hiller, Fasth and Gibson / Detroit with Howard and Mrazec or the Flyers who like to chase rainbows with Bryzgalov & Mason because they have never developed a goalie since probably Hextall.
Fasth was a Free Agent signing. You're kind of arguing against your own point here.

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06-15-2013, 05:17 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
BBO, just regarding your comment on Klefbom you put him as the 6th most important player in this core going forward.

Sorry if this had been previously discussed but can you name all the names preceding him and also where you now see J Schultz after his year in pro. With Schultz I think being really illustrative of the error in assuming the players acumen at this level.

Thing is, with Klefbom we won't know until he's here, what he looks like and where he fits here.
If I had to rank the top 6 in terms of importance to the team in the future it would be:

RNH, Hall, Yakupov/J. Schultz, Eberle, Klefbom, Petry, Smid/Marincin/Gagner (if he's still here), Paajarvi.

RNH will be one hell of a two way player and the QB on our PP. Hall is the heart and soul of the team. Nail brings a bit of both elements from he first 2 but not as polished defensively as RNH. Schultz IMO has only shown glimpses of his talent at the NHL level and will blow some doors off the next couple of seasons. Eberle brings high end skill and has IMO been the glue that holds the young players together starting with his friendship with Hall and now RNH and Schultz. Then you have Klefbom who IMO stands to be a tremendous shutdown D that will help Schultz get the best out of his abilities because he will know that he has a rock behind him when he jumps into the play.

That is how I rank the top 6. Now naturally I am not as big of a Gagner fan as you are so you probably have him firmly in your top 6, that's your opinion but it is not shared by me. IMO to get there he has to show the ability to provide the same kind of offense as a guy like Eberle for a few years in a row (he did it last year so another year like that if Eberle doesn't rebound should do it) and he needs to get better on D and on draws since he plays the most important forward position out there.

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Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
So Klefbom would exceed an established NHL center, in Gagner, before playing a single NHL game. Not to mention this being stated as "pretty obvious".

As for the bolded I note this grace is afforded to a player that is popular but has rarely been granted to a player that his spent his entire time here impacted by the bolded and who persevered.

Finally, this is hfboards. A mere year ago Petry or Smid would've been looked at as can't lose core of great value. But time here tends to reveal limitations and particularly in challenging positions like D, G, or C. Lets see what we got here before assuming it. I think its a little cynical to put a prospect over established useful veterans before one game is played.
Well TBH I don't see Gagner as a core piece and I do see Klefbom as a potential core piece. So do I rank the guy that after 6 years IMO isn't part of the core or do I take a chance that the other guy could be when he's all of 2 years removed from the draft? It all comes down to our views on Gagner, you likely see him as a surefire core player while I don't. Neither of our opinions much matter as it will be management that ultimately makes that decision.

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It's it's pretty obvious that it's Hall, Nuge, Yakupov, Eberle, Schultz, and then Klefbom.

Justin Schultz pretty much showed us he has the potential to be a well above average offensive defensemen. I don't think anyone with realistic expectations was dissapointed. I for one was pleased and surprised by his play. Sure he tailed off defensively in the last 15 games or so, but that's to be expected given the general disarray of our schemes and the veteran support or lack their of we have. Not even to mention the conditioning issues, that are likely to have occured given the odd condensed schedual, and the lack of legitimate practices.
I am VERY much so looking forward to what our D can do without a crackpot defensive system. Perhaps even Gagner will look much better in that regard with Krueger out of the picture. In a lot of ways IMO Krueger set this team back last season, I for one am very glad that he was removed and that we added a guy like Eakins.

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06-15-2013, 05:54 PM
  #39
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Any word on whether or not the Oilers are going to extend Fedun? From all accounts he had a very good season in OKC.
Seems like a no brainer. Teams always qualify guys like this. Fedun's a real prospect, could be that solid all around guy that helps the bottom of the roster.

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06-15-2013, 06:05 PM
  #40
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How about Ales Hemsky and ANH 2nd for Dan Hamhuis and Vancouvers 3rd.

Would anyone do this?

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06-15-2013, 06:09 PM
  #41
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How about Ales Hemsky and ANH 2nd for Dan Hamhuis and Vancouvers 3rd.

Would anyone do this?
Absolutely, but not a chance the Canucks would.

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06-15-2013, 06:21 PM
  #42
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How about Ales Hemsky and ANH 2nd for Dan Hamhuis and Vancouvers 3rd.

Would anyone do this?
In a heartbeat. Not sure why Vancouver would add a pick considering our side isn't adding enough to begin with.

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06-15-2013, 06:21 PM
  #43
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How about Ales Hemsky and ANH 2nd for Dan Hamhuis and Vancouvers 3rd.

Would anyone do this?
Canucks fans will destroy your proposal.

I'd do it obviously as an Oiler fan.

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06-15-2013, 06:35 PM
  #44
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Seems like a no brainer. Teams always qualify guys like this. Fedun's a real prospect, could be that solid all around guy that helps the bottom of the roster.
Yes. Having players like Klefbom, Marincin and Fedun fill in for injuries instead of the the Teubert's and Plante's shows the growing depth of the Oilers defence pool. This is a step in the right direction for the organization.

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06-15-2013, 06:45 PM
  #45
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I see a team like PHX that has extra dmen. A deal with them for one of their dmen with Hemsky going the other way would make sense. Klesla or Morris coming back to EDM.

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06-15-2013, 06:55 PM
  #46
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Originally Posted by Cloned
Apparently there's a rumour floating around about a change in the hockey operations of the Flames. Ken King is apparently going to focus on Calgary's arena project (let's see how long theirs takes), and a "high level NHL exec" is going to come in in his place. And apparently the owners are souring on Feaster and he may be fired.

Oh, and apparently the high level NHL exec is none other than the Shanabanner himself.
Good call Cloned

@TSNBobMcKenzie
NHL VP Brendan Shanahan in CGY yesterday for dinner/conversation with CGY prez Ken King. No job offer was made but there was discussion.

@TSNBobMcKenzie
As @dowbboy and others reported previously, CGY may be looking to hire someone to head up their hockey operations.

@JSportsnet
It appears the Flames are looking at changing the structure of their hockey operations. Might be looking for a President of Hockey Ops.

@JSportsnet
Shanahan confirmed that he was in Calgary, but would not comment further on the meeting or its contents

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06-15-2013, 06:57 PM
  #47
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I see a team like PHX that has extra dmen. A deal with them for one of their dmen with Hemsky going the other way would make sense. Klesla or Morris coming back to EDM.
Would Gagner + Hemsky (1/2 price) + 2014 1st get Gormely + 12 overall pick (Horvat) ?

Rundblad is apparently threatening to sign in KHL so maybe he could be added to deal for super cheap as well

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06-15-2013, 07:23 PM
  #48
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Would Gagner + Hemsky (1/2 price) + 2014 1st get Gormely + 12 overall pick (Horvat) ?

Rundblad is apparently threatening to sign in KHL so maybe he could be added to deal for super cheap as well
No thanks, I don't want an unproven D-man if I'm dealing Gagner.

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06-15-2013, 08:21 PM
  #49
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When did this happen? I recall during the CHI-DET series on CBC that they mentioned he said he'd prefer to stay in CHI if possible. I'd say Bickell gets 3.5-4 mil, which they can do easily. After they compliance buyout Montador and Olesz (4.95 mil freed up), they will be at roughly 57.8 mil, with Bickell (let's say 3.75) and Leddy (let's say 2.25), they'd be 63.8 mil and only needing a backup goalie.

They don't HAVE to trade Bolland, but Shaw has outperformed him and the money could be spent better elsewhere in rounding out the roster. As for 2nd line C, Sharp can fill that role as he was playing C for them just 3 seasons ago. Bolland is really overrated if you ask me, and that money could be better spent elsewhere.
Of course he would rather stay in Chi all things being equal. It is money that will make him move. If you look at the lineups for tonight he's not even in the top 6, so unlikely Chi will shell out 3.5-4 mil a year to keep him.

Here is the quote:

Quote:
Bickell laughed when asked whether he'd be willing to give the Blackhawks a hometown discount. He is making $600,000 this season and is expected to receive a hefty raise due to his playoff performance, which has included eight goals and five assists in 17 games and has him in the running for the Conn Smythe Trophy.

"I don't know about that," Bickell said of giving the Blackhawks a hometown discount. "We'll see. We're just concentrating on the finals. Me and my agent will come together, and we'll negotiate that at the end of the season."
http://espn.go.com/blog/chicago/blac...ign-with-hawks

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06-15-2013, 08:34 PM
  #50
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Special teams and goaltending were the only things that the Oilers didn't do terribly at this year. I'd rather see the money spent fixing the rest of the team. Dubnyk is a decent starter, probably somewhere in the middle third.

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