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Nonis interested in Weiss

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Old
06-16-2013, 07:42 PM
  #176
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Kadri
Grabovski
Colborne
McClement

or

Weiss
Kadri
Colborne
McClement

I'd be fine with any combination of those 2. Bozak isn't going to settle for #3C money, and Grabovski cannot play a checking role, he's either top 6 forward or shipped out.

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06-16-2013, 07:48 PM
  #177
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Originally Posted by LeafsWantStanley View Post
Kadri
Grabovski
Colborne
McClement

or

Weiss
Kadri
Colborne
McClement

I'd be fine with any combination of those 2. Bozak isn't going to settle for #3C money, and Grabovski cannot play a checking role, he's either top 6 forward or shipped out.

I have a feeling Grabo and Kuli will go beast mode next season, given Carlyle is not making them check other team's top lines.

Bozak is not consistent and is pretty useless. Unless Bozak can become a faceoff wizard in the summer he should be let go.

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06-16-2013, 07:57 PM
  #178
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Originally Posted by leafstilldeath View Post

I have a feeling Grabo and Kuli will go beast mode next season, given Carlyle is not making them check other team's top lines.

Bozak is not consistent and is pretty useless. Unless Bozak can become a faceoff wizard in the summer he should be let go.
Keep hearing this until we lose a face-off or until there is a shootout.

Then again, he was good when he scored in game 5 with one arm. And until we coughed up the lead in game 7 when we could have dearly used his services. Short memories.

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06-16-2013, 08:00 PM
  #179
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Connolly 2.0. No thanks!

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06-16-2013, 08:14 PM
  #180
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Originally Posted by Duffman955 View Post
Proceed to 1st round exit.
Because Grabo's playoff contributions couldn't be duplicated by Weiss?

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06-16-2013, 08:28 PM
  #181
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Originally Posted by Smif View Post
The last couple seasons?? He was awesome for Florida last year and even better in the playoffs.
lol ya cause 4 points in 17 games and a -13 is "awesome" Also his team has only made the playoffs once in his entire tenure in the NHL. Could just be a flash in the pan. I still think he'd be an improvement over some of our roster and would welcome here, but only if it's a good deal. He's just to risky to demand 4-4.5 or over.

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06-16-2013, 08:32 PM
  #182
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Originally Posted by Hyperglide View Post
lol ya cause 4 points in 17 games and a -13 is "awesome"
Everyone non-Leafs is amazing it seems. If he was on our team, he'd be scapegoat ( ala Grabovski) and posters like myself would be defending him. Ideally, I don't want Bozak, Grabovski or Weiss on our team. We need consistent playoff performers who can perform in all situations.

The format we should be following:
Big #1C
Shut down C
Kadri
McClement

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06-16-2013, 08:38 PM
  #183
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Originally Posted by Interactif View Post
Surely Nonis has an idea of what Grabo is worth, he may be realizing it is not easy moving him with teams still in it for a UFA such as Bozak or Weiss.

Ideally you want something as opposed to nothing, I see Grabo as a salary swap with another team, are there 5.5 D men out there that need a change of scenery?
I don't think they would have any problem unloading Grabovski for value if they retained $1.5 of his salary. Not ideal but it eliminates the need to have him play himself back to a decent value, and they can start the season with the lineup they want to keep. Roy and Weiss at least did not have big seasons and any club signing them will be investing $5 million in players they expect to play like 11-12, or more like 10-11 in Roy's case. A $4 million Grabo who also wants them to forget this season should market reasonably well in comparison, especially to a club with cap concerns. A club like the Jets, who are not a mecca for attracting FAs might not even get a look from Roy/Weiss/Ribs so seem like a natural fit.

Trading him for an equally overpriced D man is a bit tricky. Shifting that much salary to the defense would probably force them to move Franson, who figures to be their second priciest D man, and was arguably a big part of last seasons success. Does a club that was fading as the season wound down want to make a deal that potentially messes with the clubs playoff mojo? Franson was one of only two defensemen on the club who had a strong year. I would not want him moved until had seen another player had stepped up to fill his shoes.

In an ideal scenario they would find a RHD with a physical game to complement Phaneuf, but I just can't see the likelihood of getting a defenseman back who is just coming off one bad year but with no age or injury issues. In all likelihood, they still need to eat some salary so they are offering a pure value as opposes to "a cripple for a cripple". This means they could deal for a player with an appropriate salary and not necessarily a large one) because they are selling an appropriate salary. The big machine ends up down $1.5 but in another year Army/Komi/Tucker are off the books so they have no "bad money" at all. At worst they have to defer a bit of salary to 14-15.

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06-16-2013, 08:49 PM
  #184
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Originally Posted by nuck View Post
I don't think they would have any problem unloading Grabovski for value if they retained $1.5 of his salary. Not ideal but it eliminates the need to have him play himself back to a decent value, and they can start the season with the lineup they want to keep. Roy and Weiss at least did not have big seasons and any club signing them will be investing $5 million in players they expect to play like 11-12, or more like 10-11 in Roy's case. A $4 million Grabo who also wants them to forget this season should market reasonably well in comparison, especially to a club with cap concerns. A club like the Jets, who are not a mecca for attracting FAs might not even get a look from Roy/Weiss/Ribs so seem like a natural fit.

Trading him for an equally overpriced D man is a bit tricky. Shifting that much salary to the defense would probably force them to move Franson, who figures to be their second priciest D man, and was arguably a big part of last seasons success. Does a club that was fading as the season wound down want to make a deal that potentially messes with the clubs playoff mojo? Franson was one of only two defensemen on the club who had a strong year. I would not want him moved until had seen another player had stepped up to fill his shoes.

In an ideal scenario they would find a RHD with a physical game to complement Phaneuf, but I just can't see the likelihood of getting a defenseman back who is just coming off one bad year but with no age or injury issues. In all likelihood, they still need to eat some salary so they are offering a pure value as opposes to "a cripple for a cripple". This means they could deal for a player with an appropriate salary and not necessarily a large one) because they are selling an appropriate salary. The big machine ends up down $1.5 but in another year Army/Komi/Tucker are off the books so they have no "bad money" at all. At worst they have to defer a bit of salary to 14-15.
It's an angle no one mentioned here yet, If Calgary were interested I would certainly flip him for a Dennis Wideman. Calgary are rebuilding though I can't see how or why they would want Grabo. Wideman on the otherhand would be a nice fit as a hard right shooting D men and a nice #2 to Phaneuf. 5M per tag for this player.

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06-16-2013, 09:00 PM
  #185
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Originally Posted by Hyperglide View Post
lol ya cause 4 points in 17 games and a -13 is "awesome" Also his team has only made the playoffs once in his entire tenure in the NHL. Could just be a flash in the pan. I still think he'd be an improvement over some of our roster and would welcome here, but only if it's a good deal. He's just to risky to demand 4-4.5 or over.
Last year as in this year is still going so not this year. Thought that was pretty obvious...

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06-16-2013, 09:06 PM
  #186
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anthrax442 View Post
There is no glass half empty on Bozak or not, he is NOT a 1C, he is NOT a 2C, he is BARELY a 3C, Not great defensively, or else other center not named Nazim wouldn't pick up his slack defensively. The only good thing that people kept muttering about Bozak this season was "look at his faceoff %". Well he got exposed in the playoffs, and the only thing he was useful on the 1st line, he sucked at.

So when people are saying we prolong mediocrity, this will happen if Bozak is re-signed. Weiss is a nice, safe option for a couple of years, that can not only manage on our 1st line, but actually make it better.
little harsh bro... There is nothing wrong with Bozak as a number 2 center at all. He got exposed in the playoffs because he was hurting, you're points a bit off base, give me something to back up what you are saying and we can talk. Simple saying he's not a number 2 center is silly considering he is responsible at both ends, and he has been on pace for 50 the past 2 seasons and hes a good face off guy.

What are the options Toronto has? A guy who plays in the AHL who is so inconsistent
it's laughable. Joe is not a capable 3rd or 4th line center yet because his skill set right now makes him otherwise invisible in a bottom 6 roll. And he's not good enough to play in a top 6 roll. So you Roll with Kadri as your main piece, cool what happens if he doesn't produce? who do you fall back on? Grabo? he has no chemistry with Phil so you roll big Joe as your number 1?

I would pickup Weiss in a heart beat and I would sign Bozak with out a second though if the price was right. Ideally I would like him back for around 2.5- 3 but you know he's going to get more then that.

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06-16-2013, 09:13 PM
  #187
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Originally Posted by Hyperglide View Post
lol ya cause 4 points in 17 games and a -13 is "awesome" Also his team has only made the playoffs once in his entire tenure in the NHL. Could just be a flash in the pan. I still think he'd be an improvement over some of our roster and would welcome here, but only if it's a good deal. He's just to risky to demand 4-4.5 or over.
How is 4 seasons in a row above 55 points with 1 28 goal campaign possibly a flash in the pan? He is coming off a season where he had to be shut down for wrist surgery, not to mention florida was awful this year. If the deal cheap and we can sign him 1-2 years I see no reason not to unless Nonis thinks another center can be had for cheaper (Stastny possibly?)

Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Chosen_One View Post
Everyone non-Leafs is amazing it seems. If he was on our team, he'd be scapegoat ( ala Grabovski) and posters like myself would be defending him. Ideally, I don't want Bozak, Grabovski or Weiss on our team. We need consistent playoff performers who can perform in all situations.

The format we should be following:
Big #1C
Shut down C
Kadri
McClement
The thing is we arn't getting a big consistent playoff performer. The best chance this team has at a #1 C is kadri, otherwise were going to have to give up substantial assets to get a prospect who could be the #1C playoff performer (or via draft of course). No one is giving players like that up, that's what you sacrifice when you decide to jump start the rebuild by trading for a winger. I'm still in favor of trying to get Stastny this offseason after the Av's have drafted. He's only 27 and has had 2 previous 70 point seasons.

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06-16-2013, 09:19 PM
  #188
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Originally Posted by JackJ View Post
Connolly 2.0. No thanks!
Why do people keep saying this? It's stupid they are not even the same kind of players. Buffalo fans warned us of how Connolly was, one minute he looks like he's a star then for 3/4 of the season he falls into a shell and goes out for a skate every now and then has another shift like he cares then goes back into his shell.

As for Weiss he averaged 77 games over his last 6 seasons. It's not really his fault the Panthers didn't put together a team that could get into the playoffs. Who seems like they are rebuilding every. You may think he would be a bad signing and that's your opinion but for god sake comparing Weiss to Tin man Tim is about as silly as it gets.

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06-16-2013, 09:22 PM
  #189
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Originally Posted by Anthrax442 View Post
There is no glass half empty on Bozak or not, he is NOT a 1C, he is NOT a 2C, he is BARELY a 3C, Not great defensively, or else other center not named Nazim wouldn't pick up his slack defensively. The only good thing that people kept muttering about Bozak this season was "look at his faceoff %". Well he got exposed in the playoffs, and the only thing he was useful on the 1st line, he sucked at.

So when people are saying we prolong mediocrity, this will happen if Bozak is re-signed. Weiss is a nice, safe option for a couple of years, that can not only manage on our 1st line, but actually make it better.
Sounds a little ridiculous, while he's defiantly not a 1st line player he could still be a valuable part to a team if he accepted a lower role. However I do agree with you about the mediocrity part, as long as Bozak is playing on the first line the team wont put as much effort into finding a legit center (assuming kadri cant be it) that will actually lead us to a cup. Weiss is a better player, but i wouldn't commit to anything long term.

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06-16-2013, 09:29 PM
  #190
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Chosen_One View Post
Everyone non-Leafs is amazing it seems. If he was on our team, he'd be scapegoat ( ala Grabovski) and posters like myself would be defending him. Ideally, I don't want Bozak, Grabovski or Weiss on our team. We need consistent playoff performers who can perform in all situations.

The format we should be following:
Big #1C
Shut down C
Kadri
McClement
Sweet so you got that formula down. Now please tell me what big number 1 centers are available that won't cost us the farm and more. And just what big #1 centers are available in general.

Same with a 2nd line shutdown center wonder what one of them would cost us? Again these guys seem to be a dime a dozen so I guess we can afford to just, put everything on hold until we are able to find one of or both of these players.

Should be easy.

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06-16-2013, 09:35 PM
  #191
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Originally Posted by LeafsWantStanley View Post
Kadri
Grabovski
Colborne
McClement

or

Weiss
Kadri
Colborne
McClement
Haha if Kadri has a Sophomore slump (which I really see happening) then we're screwed with that first lineup. I definitely prefer the second option

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06-16-2013, 09:38 PM
  #192
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Originally Posted by Joey24 View Post
Sweet so you got that formula down. Now please tell me what big number 1 centers are available that won't cost us the farm and more. And just what big #1 centers are available in general.

Same with a 2nd line shutdown center wonder what one of them would cost us? Again these guys seem to be a dime a dozen so I guess we can afford to just, put everything on hold until we are able to find one of or both of these players.

Should be easy.
I don't remember him saying it was easy.

However, that doesn't mean we should just sign anyone for the hell of it. I swear we go through this every summer.

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06-16-2013, 09:40 PM
  #193
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little harsh bro... There is nothing wrong with Bozak as a number 2 center at all. He got exposed in the playoffs because he was hurting, you're points a bit off base, give me something to back up what you are saying and we can talk. Simple saying he's not a number 2 center is silly considering he is responsible at both ends, and he has been on pace for 50 the past 2 seasons and hes a good face off guy.

What are the options Toronto has? A guy who plays in the AHL who is so inconsistent
it's laughable. Joe is not a capable 3rd or 4th line center yet because his skill set right now makes him otherwise invisible in a bottom 6 roll. And he's not good enough to play in a top 6 roll. So you Roll with Kadri as your main piece, cool what happens if he doesn't produce? who do you fall back on? Grabo? he has no chemistry with Phil so you roll big Joe as your number 1?

I would pickup Weiss in a heart beat and I would sign Bozak with out a second though if the price was right. Ideally I would like him back for around 2.5- 3 but you know he's going to get more then that.
Seems like too many people have a little love affair with Bozak, he is a great young guy, cool personality, a bit goofy, exactly how we like our hockey players. He is a very average player, one of those that comes up with better than average numbers playing on a good line enough to throw you off. I really don't think he is worth a lick more than 1.8 mil in the current NHL. He won't be a top 3 Center in any cup contending team, unless he finds a little niche that works for him. What worked for him this year was winning a good chunk of faceoffs and feeding them to Kessel. He can do a bit of of everything, and he is a good player for a rebuilding team, just like Macarthur. Nothing wrong with him either, but not a playoff guy.


It seems to me, there are not a lot of people here that remember Sundin in his early prime. Otherwise nobody would be saying Bozak is fine on the 1st line and he is fine for 4 million.

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06-16-2013, 09:41 PM
  #194
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Sweet so you got that formula down. Now please tell me what big number 1 centers are available that won't cost us the farm and more. And just what big #1 centers are available in general.

Same with a 2nd line shutdown center wonder what one of them would cost us? Again these guys seem to be a dime a dozen so I guess we can afford to just, put everything on hold until we are able to find one of or both of these players.

Should be easy.
Lol ya, let him dream though .

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06-16-2013, 09:43 PM
  #195
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Sounds a little ridiculous, while he's defiantly not a 1st line player he could still be a valuable part to a team if he accepted a lower role. However I do agree with you about the mediocrity part, as long as Bozak is playing on the first line the team wont put as much effort into finding a legit center (assuming kadri cant be it) that will actually lead us to a cup. Weiss is a better player, but i wouldn't commit to anything long term.
I really don't think it would be productive to give Weiss anything over 3 years. Regarding valuable piece. those come at a very low pricetag. Not 2.5 +

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06-16-2013, 09:52 PM
  #196
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Originally Posted by Anthrax442 View Post
Seems like too many people have a little love affair with Bozak, he is a great young guy, cool personality, a bit goofy, exactly how we like our hockey players. He is a very average player, one of those that comes up with better than average numbers playing on a good line enough to throw you off. I really don't think he is worth a lick more than 1.8 mil in the current NHL. He won't be a top 3 Center in any cup contending team, unless he finds a little niche that works for him. What worked for him this year was winning a good chunk of faceoffs and feeding them to Kessel. He can do a bit of of everything, and he is a good player for a rebuilding team, just like Macarthur. Nothing wrong with him either, but not a playoff guy.


It seems to me, there are not a lot of people here that remember Sundin in his early prime. Otherwise nobody would be saying Bozak is fine on the 1st line and he is fine for 4 million.
Or understand the concept of hockey....

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06-16-2013, 09:53 PM
  #197
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Lol ya, let him dream though .
Much better we should sign ANOTHER 2c for 6 plus. Formula for success there.

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06-16-2013, 09:58 PM
  #198
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Much better we should sign ANOTHER 2c for 6 plus. Formula for success there.
Better than signing a 3c for 5 plus.

And if Weiss was asking 6mil + he can go somewhere else

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06-16-2013, 10:10 PM
  #199
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Bozak is worth 3.25 mil as he could probably get 30-35 points in the 3rd line role and can pk, pp and take faceoffs. He is useful because he can band-aid any loss which is very valuable to any team.

I would like him at 3.5 mil or less and I wouldnt pay him a dime over 3.75

Weiss I wouldnt pay more than 5 mil

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06-16-2013, 10:14 PM
  #200
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Bozak is worth 3.25 mil as he could probably get 30-35 points in the 3rd line role and can pk, pp and take faceoffs. He is useful because he can band-aid any loss which is very valuable to any team.

I would like him at 3.5 mil or less and I wouldnt pay him a dime over 3.75

Weiss I wouldnt pay more than 5 mil
I would take Bozie at 4.
I would def take Weiss at 5m.

Given the choice of those two contracts I take Weiss.

That being said, I don't see how people can think Bozak is asking for 5 plus, and still think they're getting Weiss for that amount.

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