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Lindy Ruff named new Head Coach

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06-20-2013, 05:04 PM
  #126
5 Minute Major
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Originally Posted by Shady12 View Post
Also, any coach will wear out his welcome at some point. When you're with a team that long there are going to be some negative looking things that pop up. It's a feather in his cap that he was able to make it work with one organization for so long.
What you say about wearing out your welcome is true. Lindy Ruff is a quality coach. You guys will like him.

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06-20-2013, 05:31 PM
  #127
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Dregger also said that Torts interviewed extremely well. It's down to Torts and Ruff I believe, with Ruff having the inside track..

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06-20-2013, 06:20 PM
  #128
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Originally Posted by Dallasman View Post
Very much a rumor considering yesterday I read that Don Maloney said the Coyotes and Tippett were pretty much done a contract, just finalizing the dollars on the contract.

So take that for what it's worth.

It'll be Ruff or Blashill.
Yup thats why I said regarding tippett ("I personally dont think so").

Just repeating what she said and it did not seem to make sense to me either given what sarah maclellan was saying in the arizona republic about tippett having a deal in place with pheonix. Honestly it sounded like a few week old rumor, I do know two weeks ago listening to bob mackenzie on the radio he did say tippett would be the favorite in dallas and vancouver if he should be available, but it sounded like to bob he was going to stay in pheonix now. The only part i took away from it was willie was not likely getting a job offer.

Anyway sounds like you guys might have hired ruff today, i will head back to my own board where we can argue over our own coaching search yet.

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06-20-2013, 06:33 PM
  #129
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Originally Posted by sabrecrazy View Post
Sabre fan here...ruff is a good coach ....very revered in buffalo still...with talent he will make things happen....ruff was the scapegoat in buffalo....our gm should have been fired but for the sake of ruffs reputation it was good to get him out of the mess we have up there....I'm a native buffalonian living in Beaumont Tx my second team just became the stars...even considering 'the goal'....I will plan to make a game...Good Luck Lindy bring the cup to Dallas!
How the hell did you remember your login password?

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06-20-2013, 06:34 PM
  #130
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Originally Posted by ________ View Post
This season isn't the best to base it off, since Ruff was only in Buffalo for the first 17 games.

If you really wanted to consider it based on this season.
Under Ruff
17 games 5 goals 8 assists 13 points

After Ruff was gone
30 games 5 goals 13 assists 18 points



Roy was coming off the major injury to his leg and playing with the shoulder injury. That's the main reason for his lack of success his last season in Buffalo. Prior to leg injury he was a point per game player (35 points in 35 games) and 69 points in 80 games his last full season(Buffalo made playoffs this year). The year he had 80 points he overachieved, he settled into his normal of the 60-70 points the other years.

Stafford has had his problems with injuries and he's simply just a inconsistent winger. That's not really going to change no matter what the coach is.

Ruff does have his flaws, but player development isn't one of them.
One article I found mentioned.
Buffalo has the seventh most wins since 2005 and the third most goals scored only behind (Pittsburgh and Detroit)
Where you and your analysis fall short is in recognizing that player development also includes improving year over year and not just sustaining what is already below average production in terms of players like Ennis, Gerbe, Stafford etc. In a limited recent sample, Hodgson is yet another example where Ruff misused a young player and who started to thrive after he left. Myers could be an anomaly but he's seemingly failed to get more out of him too after an incredible rookie season.

Again, I'm not saying Ruff is poor at player development - he's good at bringing prospects into the team and quickly having them make an impact, but he largely fails in getting them to improve further or in many cases sustain that production. Injuries may play a part in some cases, but it was quite evident to me in the last few seasons that Ruff had lost touch with developing prospects and improving their games, focusing instead on trying to get more out of his veteran players.

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06-20-2013, 06:40 PM
  #131
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The best part about hiring Ruff is that he doesn't take **** from anyone and will ensure that players like Benn, Eriksson, Gogo, Robidas etc. give their all and lose the veteran sense of entitlement (not saying they all have it, but it becomes customary for a lot of players at a certain point). He's also a great personality and knows how to get under the skin of the opposition, effectively taking away the spotlight from his players at times.

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06-20-2013, 07:33 PM
  #132
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Originally Posted by Double 0 Loui View Post
The best part about hiring Ruff is that he doesn't take **** from anyone and will ensure that players like Benn, Eriksson, Gogo, Robidas etc. give their all and lose the veteran sense of entitlement (not saying they all have it, but it becomes customary for a lot of players at a certain point). He's also a great personality and knows how to get under the skin of the opposition, effectively taking away the spotlight from his players at times.
You can say the same thing about Torts too.

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06-20-2013, 07:35 PM
  #133
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Originally Posted by MetalGodAOD View Post
You can say the same thing about Torts too.
For sure, though I would say Ruff seems more intelligent and less abrasive than Torts (based off interviews, coaching tenure with one team, bench behaviour etc.). Ruff is also more nurturing with young talent than Torts is, where prospects can immediately find the doghouse with the latter and find it near impossible to escape.

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06-20-2013, 07:55 PM
  #134
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Originally Posted by Double 0 Loui View Post
For sure, though I would say Ruff seems more intelligent and less abrasive than Torts (based off interviews, coaching tenure with one team, bench behaviour etc.). Ruff is also more nurturing with young talent than Torts is, where prospects can immediately find the doghouse with the latter and find it near impossible to escape.
I don't disagree in principle, but I think both have shown good and bad with prospects. The only prospect Torts did that to was Kreider, and you can say the same thing about Ruff with Grigeienko. Both have shown the abilitiy to develop prospects who deserve the ice time, and both have doghoused young forwards.

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06-20-2013, 08:04 PM
  #135
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Originally Posted by MetalGodAOD View Post
I don't disagree in principle, but I think both have shown good and bad with prospects. The only prospect Torts did that to was Kreider, and you can say the same thing about Ruff with Grigeienko. Both have shown the abilitiy to develop prospects who deserve the ice time, and both have doghoused young forwards.
Torts was pretty harsh with Del Zotto after his rookie season too, but I guess in the end it made him a better overall defenseman.

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06-20-2013, 08:10 PM
  #136
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Torts' handling of DZ honestly is why I think he's a great developmental coach. He gave DZ so many chances until he literally played himself down to the AHL and Torts had no choice but to demote his for his own development. DZ came back next season as a much more complete player.

Torts loved DZ, probably more than he should. If anything DZ should be an example of him playing favorites, as he gave him multiple ropes to hang himself with, while not doing the same for players like Kreider.

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06-20-2013, 08:28 PM
  #137
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Del Zotto at this point is pretty much a Goligoski who possibly plays worse defense. Not sure that's something to praise Torts for.

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06-20-2013, 08:31 PM
  #138
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Double 0 Loui View Post
In a limited recent sample, Hodgson is yet another example where Ruff misused a young player and who started to thrive after he left.
How did Hodgson thrive after Ruff left?

The production for the players is right in line where it should be.

It's better to look at the players 26-31 age group for the long stretch of the development. Not every year is going to be great in terms of development, sometimes a step backwards is a good thing. It's a fine line. Sometimes you need to bring players along slowly, other times you can give them big minutes. The worst thing to do is just staple them to the bench completely.

Ruff does have his flaws when it comes to line matching stuff and other things. He's not perfect or anything, but he does give the younger players plenty of playing time and that's a good thing. lWith how coaches have shelf lives it's better to look over the long run in Buffalo and not just the last couple seasons. It just gets stale after awhile, no matter how good or great a coach is at things.
Of the veteran coaches available, he's just the right fit IMO for how the Stars are and the direction going forward.

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06-20-2013, 09:13 PM
  #139
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Originally Posted by Faidh ar Rud Eigin View Post
Del Zotto at this point is pretty much a Goligoski who possibly plays worse defense. Not sure that's something to praise Torts for.
And 23. He's had rough playoffs but he's much better than Goose defensively (that's not saying much, but he is).

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06-20-2013, 09:22 PM
  #140
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How did Hodgson thrive after Ruff left?

The production for the players is right in line where it should be.

Ruff does have his flaws when it comes to line matching stuff and other things. He's not perfect or anything, but he does give the younger players plenty of playing time and that's a good thing. lWith how coaches have shelf lives it's better to look over the long run in Buffalo and not just the last couple seasons. It just gets stale after awhile, no matter how good or great a coach is at things.
Of the veteran coaches available, he's just the right fit IMO for how the Stars are and the direction going forward.
Mistake on my part, I seem to have confused Grigorenko with Hodgson, but I knew it was a young player who was not brought along properly by Ruff. Agree to disagree on the production being in line with where it should be, I see more inconsistency and regression with Sabres players than with the majority of other NHL teams these past 5 or so years.

The bolded is exactly where the mistake lies in my view. Imo, we're not in need of a veteran coach to steady a ship of experienced players, but some new blood that has spent years developing and transitioning a pipeline of successful prospects in the AHL for the Wings.

If we were already a playoff team finding difficulty in getting past the first round or (to a lesser extent) just on the outside of the playoffs looking in every year needing to compete now, then Ruff would be the logical choice. However, we have a wave of young, "green" prospects coming in between Chiasson, Smith, Oleksiak, Morrow, Connaughton, Fraser and even Roussel and Dillon are just half-season vets. Thus, the more logical choice would be to hire Blashill who has a more proven track record of developing and working well with young players and helping to maximize their potential.

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06-20-2013, 09:24 PM
  #141
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Originally Posted by Faidh ar Rud Eigin View Post
Del Zotto at this point is pretty much a Goligoski who possibly plays worse defense. Not sure that's something to praise Torts for.
Del Z is much better the Gogo defensively, not sure what guy you've been watching. However, as Metal pointed out, it's still not saying much. It's difficult to argue that Del Z didn't become a better, more well-rounded player after his demotion and tough love from Torts.

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06-20-2013, 09:37 PM
  #142
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What was the relationship between Ruff and Briére when they were in Buffalo? Could Ruff get him back to the +70pts range or is Briere destined to be a 2C from now on??

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06-20-2013, 09:42 PM
  #143
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What was the relationship between Ruff and Briére when they were in Buffalo? Could Ruff get him back to the +70pts range or is Briere destined to be a 2C from now on??
If Briere's production continues along its current trajectory, he'll be lucky to have an NHL job next season. I don't mean that to insult Briere, but his production has been on a slide for a while now when he's not getting any younger. Very few players see their production increase late in their 30s.

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06-20-2013, 09:46 PM
  #144
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So I found the best thing ever on Twitter today.


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06-20-2013, 10:08 PM
  #145
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If Briere's production continues along its current trajectory, he'll be lucky to have an NHL job next season. I don't mean that to insult Briere, but his production has been on a slide for a while now when he's not getting any younger. Very few players see their production increase late in their 30s.
Ray Whitney says hello.

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06-20-2013, 10:11 PM
  #146
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Originally Posted by Double 0 Loui View Post
The bolded is exactly where the mistake lies in my view. Imo, we're not in need of a veteran coach to steady a ship of experienced players, but some new blood that has spent years developing and transitioning a pipeline of successful prospects in the AHL for the Wings.

If we were already a playoff team finding difficulty in getting past the first round or (to a lesser extent) just on the outside of the playoffs looking in every year needing to compete now, then Ruff would be the logical choice. However, we have a wave of young, "green" prospects coming in between Chiasson, Smith, Oleksiak, Morrow, Connaughton, Fraser and even Roussel and Dillon are just half-season vets. Thus, the more logical choice would be to hire Blashill who has a more proven track record of developing and working well with young players and helping to maximize their potential.
That's why I mentioned of veteran coaches. Overall Ruff's not my top choice. Blashill from the start of the search was my top option, after him was Dallas Eakins. I'd prefer to hire a NHL assistant or a AHL coach to a veteran coach. Blashill I just think of all the options has the highest upside and the best fit for long-term success.

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06-20-2013, 10:22 PM
  #147
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That's why I mentioned of veteran coaches. Overall Ruff's not my top choice. Blashill from the start of the search was my top option, after him was Dallas Eakins. I'd prefer to hire a NHL assistant or a AHL coach to a veteran coach. Blashill I just think of all the options has the highest upside and the best fit for long-term success.
100% agreed . I thought you were for Ruff, which is where my confusion stemmed. I wasn't clear, but when I was analyzing Ruff's player development, I was more so comparing him against the competition, which imo, should be Blashill.

You raised some very good points about Ruff being good enough with player development that we shouldn't be too concerned if he is hired though. So thanks for that.

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06-20-2013, 10:47 PM
  #148
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So I found the best thing ever on Twitter today.

That is fantastic.

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06-20-2013, 10:53 PM
  #149
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So I found the best thing ever on Twitter today.

Auto Win

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06-21-2013, 12:59 AM
  #150
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I'm hoping we hire either Torts or Ruff as head coach, and Blashill as an associate coach, best of all worlds, two assistant or maybe Blashill as an associate coach even with red wings experience, a head coach and an assistant with NHL head coach experience, and it still leaves a spot for a defensive coach of ruffs choice. To me this would be the best scenario possible.

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