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Phaneuf 11th in Norris voting

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Old
06-17-2013, 09:56 PM
  #126
The Naz
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Originally Posted by Bomber0104 View Post
Like that of a stepfather and his red headed stepson.
That's completely false.

One thing you can say about Dion, he is always polite and friendly when interviewed. You make it seem like he's John Tortorella. I understand some don't like him for the mistakes that cost us, but making crap up doesn't help your debate.

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06-17-2013, 09:58 PM
  #127
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Originally Posted by The Naz View Post
That's completely false.

One thing you can say about Dion, he is always polite and friendly when interviewed. You make it seem like he's John Tortorella. I understand some don't like him for the mistakes that cost us, but making crap up doesn't help your debate.
Just saying the media likes to beat up on Dion.. lol

A lot of people don't like him because of the way he plays hockey...not because of some false personal grudge that doesn't exist. That's what I call making crap up.

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06-17-2013, 10:03 PM
  #128
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Originally Posted by Bomber0104 View Post
Just saying the media likes to beat up on Dion.. lol

A lot of people don't like him because of the way he plays hockey...not because of some false personal grudge that doesn't exist. That's what I call making crap up.
I don't see a lot of the media harping on him. Maybe I'm wrong. I also won't consider writers like Simmonds to be media. They don't tell a story like it is, rather the way want to whine about it.

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Old
06-17-2013, 10:03 PM
  #129
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Originally Posted by Lebanese Leaf View Post
I could see both Rielly and Gardiner surpassing him on our depth chart. That is not a knock against Phaneuf, because I fully see him as a top 15 Dman in the league. But Rielly and Gardiner just have that kind of an upside, and that would leave us in a pretty damn good position.
Rielly maybe. I don't think there's any chance Gardiner will ever be as good as Dion.

Just my two cents though.

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06-17-2013, 10:05 PM
  #130
Bomber0104
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Originally Posted by The Apologist View Post
Rielly maybe. I don't think there's any chance Gardiner will ever be as good as Dion.

Just my two cents though.
Nothing wrong with having our Dustin Bfyuglien with Duncan Keith..

I just don't think he deserves a pay raise.

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06-17-2013, 10:12 PM
  #131
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Top 20 isn't bad at all.

This year he ranked 11th.

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bA3LN_8hjM8.

Vaive and Ludzik on collapse, and Phaneuf.
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06-17-2013, 10:19 PM
  #132
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Originally Posted by Duffman955 View Post
Looks like real hockey people think Phaneuf is a legit #1Dman

If you read these boards you would think he is comparable to Redden. What intelligent posters we have.


Professional Hockey Writers' Association?

Are you serious?

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06-17-2013, 10:19 PM
  #133
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beauchemin was 4th, and some of you guys are having a hardon on a guy who was voted 11th.

LOL

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06-17-2013, 10:19 PM
  #134
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Originally Posted by Dreakmur View Post
That has nothing to do with what I said...

Doughty faced tougher competition for ice time. LA's blue line is way better than Toronto's, and that means Darryl Sutter had more options outside of Doughty.
Oops, misinterpreted what you wrote, my bad.

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06-17-2013, 10:40 PM
  #135
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Originally Posted by Wendelstache View Post
beauchemin was 4th, and some of you guys are having a hardon on a guy who was voted 11th.

LOL
Yeah, Beauchemin had a good year but it was probably his best season in the nhl at age 33. I'd take Dion over him without even thinking about it. The # ranking doesn't really matter, there's better players who were behind him and worse infront.

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06-17-2013, 10:42 PM
  #136
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So there are 10 better defencemen on other teams?

Not hard to believe is it?

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06-17-2013, 10:46 PM
  #137
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Originally Posted by Durrr View Post
Yeah, Beauchemin had a good year but it was probably his best season in the nhl at age 33. I'd take Dion over him without even thinking about it. The # ranking doesn't really matter, there's better players who were behind him and worse infront.
Exactly... but that goes both ways.

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06-17-2013, 10:49 PM
  #138
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Originally Posted by Dreakmur View Post
Exactly... but that goes both ways.
Sure? But yet then you have stats and people who actually know hockey that support the player. Everything about Dion's stats point to him being a top 15 defencemen.

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06-17-2013, 10:50 PM
  #139
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Originally Posted by Durrr View Post
Sure? But yet then you have stats and people who actually know hockey that support the number
No they don't.

In fact, mostly everyone on this board hates a good number of the writers and make long winded rants against the media coverage of the Leafs and their lack of understanding of hockey.

These are writers, not hockey people. They largely don't understand what's going on.

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06-17-2013, 10:57 PM
  #140
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Originally Posted by Bomber0104 View Post
No they don't.

In fact, mostly everyone on this board hates a good number of the writers and make long winded rants against the media coverage of the Leafs and their lack of understanding of hockey.

These are writers, not hockey people. They largely don't understand what's going on.
Not all writers are complete idiots like the ones in Toronto. What makes a fans perspective have anymore weight then writer who makes a living off of hockey? Plus it's not all beat writers, analysts make up part of the voters. ANYWAYS I wasn't talking about the writers, I was talking about real hockey people like GM's and coaches. You really think that if Dion would be made available through trade or free agency that there wouldn't be a huge market waiting to make offers(even if it was for a #2 D)?

Leafs have there best season in 9 years with an intense playoff run but fans still need to crap on all there players, insisting it's mediocre. Who the hell cares if you don't see Dion as a top 10 defencemen in the league, hes going to get a raise and extension regardless because that's what he's worth.

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06-17-2013, 11:05 PM
  #141
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Originally Posted by Durrr View Post
Sure? But yet then you have stats and people who actually know hockey that support the player.
You can't have it both ways here. If you are going to criticize the voters for having guys ahead of Phaneuf, you have to accept that there might be guys behind that should be ahead.

Phaneuf is better than PK Subban, but that doesn't mean I think he should have won the Norris.

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Everything about Dion's stats point to him being a top 15 defencemen.
If they did, it would only be evidence that stats don't tell the whole story.

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06-17-2013, 11:06 PM
  #142
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Originally Posted by Durrr View Post
Not all writers are complete idiots like the ones in Toronto.
Right.

Hockey writers by and large write very simple things and don't really understand what's going on versus that of the coach they consistently ask stupid questions to.

Quote:
What makes a fans perspective have anymore weight then writer who makes a living off of hockey?
Some fans are interested in hockey because they genuinely like hockey as opposed to writers who greedily realize writing about hockey makes more than covering soccer, tennis, and other sports. The NHL HQ (non hockey people...business people) has the decision of who gets their trophy and the whole process gets some sort of input from the media as part of their outreach program (marketing).

Quote:
Plus it's not all beat writers, analysts make up part of the voters.
They are all writers and they don't really know much at all compared to people who played the game like a coach or GM.

Quote:
ANYWAYS I wasn't talking about the writers, I was talking about real hockey people like GM's and coaches. You really think that if Dion would be made available through trade or free agency that there wouldn't be a huge market waiting to make offers(even if it was for a #2 D)?
Last time he was traded, he was traded for peanuts.


Last edited by Bomber0104: 06-17-2013 at 11:12 PM.
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Old
06-17-2013, 11:12 PM
  #143
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Originally Posted by Dreakmur View Post
You can't have it both ways here. If you are going to criticize the voters for having guys ahead of Phaneuf, you have to accept that there might be guys behind that should be ahead.

Phaneuf is better than PK Subban, but that doesn't mean I think he should have won the Norris.



If they did, it would only be evidence that stats don't tell the whole story.
I fully said that in my original post, you just quoted half of it.

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06-17-2013, 11:15 PM
  #144
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Originally Posted by Bomber0104 View Post
Right.

Hockey writers by and large write very simple things and don't really understand what's going on versus that of the coach they consistently ask stupid questions to.



Some fans are interested in hockey because they genuinely like hockey as opposed to writers who greedily realize writing about hockey makes more than covering soccer, tennis, and other sports. The NHL HQ (non hockey people...business people) has the decision of who gets their trophy and the whole process gets some sort of input from the media as part of their outreach program (marketing).



They are all writers and they don't really know much at all compared to people who played the game like a coach or GM.



Last time he was traded, he was traded for peanuts.
In my OP I was talking about GM's and coaches lol, which is why he gets praise from both here, and will be extended + raised in kind. Stajan and white wern't exactly peanuts at the time... Stajan was coming off a 55 point season and on pace for 60 at the time and White was always pretty solid.


Last edited by Durrr: 06-17-2013 at 11:32 PM.
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Old
06-17-2013, 11:18 PM
  #145
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Beauch was good in Toronto too. Toronto fans are just merciless on their defenseman though.
Excellent post and spot on. There are no requirements for hockey fans to know and understand the game and its players in order to root for a specific team. This evident here on a semi regular basis. There will always be Leaf fans complaining about a player regardless of how well they do as individuals and as a team,

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Old
06-17-2013, 11:21 PM
  #146
Durrr
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Originally Posted by New Liskeard View Post
Excellent post and spot on. There are no requirements for hockey fans to know and understand the game and its players in order to root for a specific team. This evident here on a semi regular basis. There will always be Leaf fans complaining about a player regardless of how well they do as individuals and as a team,
thisthisthis except i'd rather have gardiner and lupul


Last edited by Durrr: 06-17-2013 at 11:29 PM.
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Old
06-17-2013, 11:35 PM
  #147
Duffman955
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Very few defensemen bring the full package of offense, defense and physical play that Dion does.

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06-17-2013, 11:40 PM
  #148
Dreakmur
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Originally Posted by Duffman955 View Post
Very few defensemen bring the full package of offense, defense and physical play that Dion does.
Dion doesn't bring that package....

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Old
06-17-2013, 11:45 PM
  #149
Duffman955
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Originally Posted by Dreakmur View Post
Dion doesn't bring that package....
Yes he does.

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Old
06-17-2013, 11:46 PM
  #150
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dreakmur View Post
Dion doesn't bring that package....
Coulda fooled me

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