HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > New Jersey Devils
Notices

Not this again... Devils in financial trouble?

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
06-17-2013, 10:09 AM
  #51
Kensu
Registered User
 
Kensu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: New Jersey
Country: United States
Posts: 2,946
vCash: 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by CerebralGenesis View Post
was just about to post this

the same newspaper that put up pictures of people on the front page and assumed they were the terrorists because they just fit the description.

Kensu is offline  
Old
06-17-2013, 10:10 AM
  #52
TheRightWay
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 1,490
vCash: 505
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zajacs Bowl Cut View Post
the Post has been publishing legitimately false information all the time.

plus, he does not site his sources in the article like you indicated.

Where the hell did I say anything about citing sources in the article. The previous poster implied that the New York Post can just absolve itself of any fault because it has a "source" regardless of how reliable it was. Which is categorically false.

Please show me examples of the New York Post running with a story for over a year that was not true. The whole Boston Marathon thing was a major embarrassment for them and they're caught up in a libel suit because of it. And that's from a single incident. If the New York Post got caught publishing false and defamatory information over multiple years it would effectively shut down the organization for good. You think they're risking that for the sake of writing some articles about a hockey team in New Jersey?

TheRightWay is offline  
Old
06-17-2013, 10:10 AM
  #53
BenedictGomez
1995/2000/2003
 
BenedictGomez's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: PRNJ
Country: United States
Posts: 26,255
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Brovalchuk View Post
If I owed you $10 and we agreed that I would pay you July 1st, and today you asked if you could get that money now, If I give it to you Im not loaning you anything. I am giving you money you already are going to receive at a time before you were to originally receive it.
It is different. The funding is altered, because since you're getting money earlier than you are entitled to it, you would now be required to pay interest on the money that was originally entitled to you on the later (original) date interest free. Unless of course you have some knowledge that the NHL is advancing this money to the Devils interest-free, but as I said, I doublt that's the case.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NJDevs26 View Post
And an equal number of doom and gloomers like yourself that latch on to every little rumor as proof positive of being in Chapter 11.
I am hardly a "doom and gloomer", I'm just not a ostrich with my head in the sand. I'm neither an optimist, nor a pessimist, but a realist.

The ridiculous posters are the ones who say, "New York Post" blah, blah, blah, and dismiss every article this guy writes, and latch onto every tiny nuance when he's not 100% correct. What those posters also dont understand, is that financial investigative reporting like this is never going to be 100% correct. It's not like writing about the aftermath of the Boston Bomber or any other news event. Nothing is ever public, and the details will change along the way. He could write a story on June 1 that is 100% correct, and on July 1 95% of the details he wrote about have changed. The fanboys in this thread will then say, "See, I told you he was wrong!" - not understanding how this crap works.

Nevertheless, whether people want to quibble over the details of what Kosma is right about and what he's wrong about, the fact remains that if the Devils are missing multi-million dollar loan payments less than 6 months after a complete financial restructuring? Not Good.

BenedictGomez is offline  
Old
06-17-2013, 10:11 AM
  #54
Scottyk9
Goals? Please!
 
Scottyk9's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: East Rutherford, NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 24,901
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Scottyk9
I rather the NHL just take control of the team for right now. We are a NYC market who's won championships so they won't entertain the thought of moving us. The Nhl proved with Phx they will supply the club with enough funds to compete. I love what JVB has done for us but he's obviously having issues and the cloud of uncertainty is going to make this a very unattractive place to play. Now I know what patty meant when he expressed that the team may have hesitations to bring him back...wasn't talking about lou he meant jvb

Scottyk9 is offline  
Old
06-17-2013, 10:13 AM
  #55
BenedictGomez
1995/2000/2003
 
BenedictGomez's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: PRNJ
Country: United States
Posts: 26,255
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kensu View Post
was just about to post this

the same newspaper that put up pictures of people on the front page and assumed they were the terrorists because they just fit the description.
Q) Did the feds not seek those two?

A) Yes, yes they did.

They will lose their libel case (not that it has anything to do with the Devils).

BenedictGomez is offline  
Old
06-17-2013, 10:14 AM
  #56
CerebralGenesis
Registered User
 
CerebralGenesis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 23,531
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BenedictGomez View Post
It is different. The funding is altered, because since you're getting money earlier than you are entitled to it, you would now be required to pay interest on the money that was originally entitled to you on the later (original) date interest free. Unless of course you have some knowledge that the NHL is advancing this money to the Devils interest-free, but as I said, I doublt that's the case.



I am hardly a "doom and gloomer", I'm just not a ostrich with my head in the sand. I'm neither an optimist, nor a pessimist, but a realist.

The ridiculous posters are the ones who say, "New York Post" blah, blah, blah, and dismiss every article this guy writes, and latch onto every tiny nuance when he's not 100% correct. What those posters also dont understand, is that financial investigative reporting like this is never going to be 100% correct. It's not like writing about the aftermath of the Boston Bomber or any other news event. Nothing is ever public, and the details will change along the way. He could write a story on June 1 that is 100% correct, and on July 1 95% of the details he wrote about have changed. The fanboys in this thread will then say, "See, I told you he was wrong!" - not understanding how this crap works.

Nevertheless, whether people want to quibble over the details of what Kosma is right about and what he's wrong about, the fact remains that if the Devils are missing multi-million dollar loan payments less than 6 months after a complete financial restructuring? Not Good.
Why, in your expertise, is that? Not stirring, but curious.

CerebralGenesis is offline  
Old
06-17-2013, 10:14 AM
  #57
BrodeursCups
Zajac flat out sucks
 
BrodeursCups's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: NoDak now NYC area
Country: United States
Posts: 29,763
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to BrodeursCups
This was long overdue. Mildly shocked it took this long to publish another article..

Guess this means we're taking the bus to division games in Columbus this year.

BrodeursCups is offline  
Old
06-17-2013, 10:15 AM
  #58
Richer's Ghost
Moderator
awww summertime
 
Richer's Ghost's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: photoshop labor camp
Country: United States
Posts: 47,519
vCash: 425
maybe a car wash or bake sale...

__________________

Ball pits are just toilets filled with brightly colored balls instead of water.
Richer's Ghost is offline  
Old
06-17-2013, 10:18 AM
  #59
MartyOwns
NYRB!!!2013********33333
 
MartyOwns's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Country: United States
Posts: 10,332
vCash: 500
i can see it now...



MartyOwns is offline  
Old
06-17-2013, 10:19 AM
  #60
BrodeursCups
Zajac flat out sucks
 
BrodeursCups's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: NoDak now NYC area
Country: United States
Posts: 29,763
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to BrodeursCups
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richer's Ghost View Post
maybe a car wash or bake sale...
Open a coffee shop in Newark. Zubs can work the counter in the summer months..

BrodeursCups is offline  
Old
06-17-2013, 10:21 AM
  #61
BenedictGomez
1995/2000/2003
 
BenedictGomez's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: PRNJ
Country: United States
Posts: 26,255
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CerebralGenesis View Post
Why, in your expertise, is that? Not stirring, but curious.
Because I'm assumptive that the NHL isnt run by complete morons. You dont give people with financial problems tens-of-millions of dollars interest free. That's how a charity is run, not a business.

And if I thought there was even a 1% chance that the Devils were going to imminently file for Chapter 11 bankruptcy, I certainly wouldn't be advancing them millions of dollars AHEAD of the time when it's actually due to them!

BenedictGomez is offline  
Old
06-17-2013, 10:22 AM
  #62
OOOOIIIO
Binary
 
OOOOIIIO's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Nashua, NH
Country: United States
Posts: 1,737
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BenedictGomez View Post
It is different. The funding is altered, because since you're getting money earlier than you are entitled to it, you would now be required to pay interest on the money that was originally entitled to you on the later (original) date interest free. Unless of course you have some knowledge that the NHL is advancing this money to the Devils interest-free, but as I said, I doublt that's the case.
I dont disagree with that statement, however my point still stands; this is not a loan. Just because something includes interest does not make it a loan. The reason this point matters is that it goes to to the credibility of the article.

There is also the option you are not including which is that the NHL reduces the amount of money forwarded in exchange for getting the money earlier. That is essentially using the balance to pay future intrest now.

OOOOIIIO is offline  
Old
06-17-2013, 10:23 AM
  #63
Zajacs Bowl Cut
Nova Nation
 
Zajacs Bowl Cut's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Southampton, PA
Country: United States
Posts: 37,510
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Zajacs Bowl Cut Send a message via Yahoo to Zajacs Bowl Cut
Quote:
Originally Posted by BenedictGomez View Post
Because I'm assumptive that the NHL isnt run by complete morons. You dont give people with financial problems tens-of-millions of dollars interest free. That's how a charity is run, not a business.

And if I thought there was even a 1% chance that the Devils were going to imminently file for Chapter 11 bankruptcy, I certainly wouldn't be advancing them millions of dollars AHEAD of the time when it's actually due to them!
you are being VERY assumptive, then...

and lets say this is all true. why would the NHL have let JVB buy the team in the first place if he had no money? does that not go back to your first point?

Zajacs Bowl Cut is offline  
Old
06-17-2013, 10:24 AM
  #64
CerebralGenesis
Registered User
 
CerebralGenesis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 23,531
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BenedictGomez View Post
Because I'm assumptive that the NHL isnt run by complete morons. You dont give people with financial problems tens-of-millions of dollars interest free. That's how a charity is run, not a business.

And if I thought there was even a 1% chance that the Devils were going to imminently file for Chapter 11 bankruptcy, I certainly wouldn't be advancing them millions of dollars AHEAD of the time when it's actually due to them!
Ha

I'd be interested to hear about your take on the NHL's presence in Phoenix then if you are defining your borders like that. Wasn't aware the NHL was a bank with JVB as a small business owner.

CerebralGenesis is offline  
Old
06-17-2013, 10:26 AM
  #65
VaxjoDevil
Registered User
 
VaxjoDevil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Princeton, NJ
Country: Sweden
Posts: 7,934
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CerebralGenesis View Post
There is nothing untrue about that though. The police were looking for those guys, and the pic came from the feds. It's cynical as hell and despicable to put it in your newspaper, but they are not lying.

VaxjoDevil is offline  
Old
06-17-2013, 10:27 AM
  #66
NC107*
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Monmouth County, NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 1,800
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrodeursCups View Post
Open a coffee shop in Newark. Zubs can work the counter in the summer months..
Why not year round, Zubs shouldn't be resigned

NC107* is offline  
Old
06-17-2013, 10:29 AM
  #67
Devils731
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 2,282
vCash: 500
So this is the 3rd or 4th time Kosman has said VBK is financially insolvent? Let me know when one of the multiple unnamed sources has anybody else's phone number in the news business.

Devils731 is offline  
Old
06-17-2013, 10:33 AM
  #68
Devils86
Registered User
 
Devils86's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,938
vCash: 500
Do you realize how much of actual reporting is wrong??? Just go back to the terrible the coverage of Sandy Hook was...90% of the reports in the first days were inaccurate so not everything in the Post article will be accurate especially when you are somewhat speculating about a financial situation. Some of those comments need to be taken with a grain of salt but if you read back from the beginning the gist of what Kosman has been reporting has been accurate, You can parse words about loan, cash advance etc and get on him about the "once proud franchise" comment but this team was and still may be in serious financial trouble. Moreover the statement that someone would make things up to sell papers is stupid on this front. Nobody except us even cares about the Devils. This is not the Yankees. Anybody who doesn't think JVB has and probably still is in trouble either has not paid attention or has their head in the sand.

Devils86 is online now  
Old
06-17-2013, 10:33 AM
  #69
BenedictGomez
1995/2000/2003
 
BenedictGomez's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: PRNJ
Country: United States
Posts: 26,255
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrodeursCups View Post
Open a coffee shop in Newark. Zubs can work the counter in the summer months..
David Clarkson skating clinics.

BenedictGomez is offline  
Old
06-17-2013, 10:35 AM
  #70
OOOOIIIO
Binary
 
OOOOIIIO's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Nashua, NH
Country: United States
Posts: 1,737
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by VaxjoDevil View Post
There is nothing untrue about that though. The police were looking for those guys, and the pic came from the feds. It's cynical as hell and despicable to put it in your newspaper, but they are not lying.
Thats not quite true, feds said they were interested in speaking to those individuals. They did not name ANYONE as suspects till the FBI briefing which named the 2 suspects who ended up being pursued with 1 being killed and the other captured.

The Post took the image of someone the police were interested in talking to and claimed they were in fact the suspects which, as it turned out, was not true at all.

OOOOIIIO is offline  
Old
06-17-2013, 10:38 AM
  #71
AfroThunder396
Lou's Secret Sauce
 
AfroThunder396's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Hamburg, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 21,377
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by BenedictGomez View Post
Because I'm assumptive that the NHL isnt run by complete morons. You dont give people with financial problems tens-of-millions of dollars interest free. That's how a charity is run, not a business.

And if I thought there was even a 1% chance that the Devils were going to imminently file for Chapter 11 bankruptcy, I certainly wouldn't be advancing them millions of dollars AHEAD of the time when it's actually due to them!
I'm not sure that's a reasonable thing to assume.

AfroThunder396 is offline  
Old
06-17-2013, 10:39 AM
  #72
MartyOwns
NYRB!!!2013********33333
 
MartyOwns's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Country: United States
Posts: 10,332
vCash: 500
does it matter if it was technically a loan?

MartyOwns is offline  
Old
06-17-2013, 10:40 AM
  #73
BrodeursCups
Zajac flat out sucks
 
BrodeursCups's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: NoDak now NYC area
Country: United States
Posts: 29,763
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to BrodeursCups
Quote:
Originally Posted by NC107 View Post
Why not year round, Zubs shouldn't be resigned
You need your head examined if you don't think Zubs should be re-signed. Plus we really can't afford to have another hole in the top-9.

BrodeursCups is offline  
Old
06-17-2013, 10:40 AM
  #74
Devils86
Registered User
 
Devils86's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,938
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Brovalchuk View Post
Thats not quite true, feds said they were interested in speaking to those individuals. They did not name ANYONE as suspects till the FBI briefing which named the 2 suspects who ended up being pursued with 1 being killed and the other captured.

The Post took the image of someone the police were interested in talking to and claimed they were in fact the suspects which, as it turned out, was not true at all.
The cover said feds seek these two in bombing.. the picture was of public domain..In fact the Feds did talk to these two...and then quickly moved to the other brothers. The picture was on many web sites and in other papers. One could argue the Post was irresponsible but the story was not inaccurate,


http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=...9QEwAg&dur=482

Devils86 is online now  
Old
06-17-2013, 10:41 AM
  #75
TheRightWay
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 1,490
vCash: 505
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Brovalchuk View Post
Thats not quite true, feds said they were interested in speaking to those individuals. They did not name ANYONE as suspects till the FBI briefing which named the 2 suspects who ended up being pursued with 1 being killed and the other captured.

The Post took the image of someone the police were interested in talking to and claimed they were in fact the suspects which, as it turned out, was not true at all.
The word "suspect" is not in itself libelous. It's one of those "frowned upon" things in journalism and each paper has its own rules on when to use the word. So their use of it is, in hindsight really bad, but not something that would put them at any legal risk.

Again, I'm not trying to be condescending, but it's pretty clear that your understanding of how libel works, what falls under the category of libel, and what papers do to counteract it is very incomplete.

TheRightWay is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:26 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.