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Old
06-20-2013, 03:49 PM
  #101
YWGinYYZ
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Lillian: diskless doesn't mean you have to have all the games on your drive at all times - you can swap them out whenever you want: it's part of the online strategy.

Regarding PC's: I used to be a huge video nut, building my own HTPC's with transcoders to get component video out to crazy big (for the time) rear projection TV's. Even given my techy nature, I got tired of the upkeep, upgrades, etc. Most people want an appliance, imho: turn it on, and forget about it.

Regarding obsolescence: one of my Xboxes is 6 years old, and still relevant. The PS3 I gave my parents is 5,and still relevant. It really doesn't make much sense for MS or Sony to obsolete the devices too quickly: they're a platform to make money on other things like games and video content. For the first year or two, I doubt either company makes much on the consoles themselves, but they become cash cows after a couple of years as they amortize development costs, and re-engineer them to be cheaper and cheaper to make.

For some, PC's are a great option, but it really is a bit of a minority thing when it comes to the living room, I think.

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06-20-2013, 04:33 PM
  #102
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Originally Posted by YWGinYYZ View Post
Lillian: diskless doesn't mean you have to have all the games on your drive at all times - you can swap them out whenever you want: it's part of the online strategy.
Indeed. Moving forward, I believe having all your digital media stored on personal drives, will eventually be considered as archaic as storing all of your media on physical disk/tape/records on a shelf. Or all your money in a safe, a jar, or under a mattress.

Everything will eventually be stored on vast redundant server farms, and you can access your DRM-managed media instantly, in the same way you access your money instantly, and you won't think twice about it. So perhaps the next-next generation consoles will require minimal storage, except for solid-state drives for caching...hmmm

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06-20-2013, 04:55 PM
  #103
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Wings: yep. All of my data is already online. Its refreshing to not have to think about where it is, can I get to it, do I have the wrong tablet/laptop with me, etc. Only have the phone with me? No prob.

I agree that this is where everything is heading. Just so darned convenient.

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06-20-2013, 05:56 PM
  #104
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Wings: yep. All of my data is already online. Its refreshing to not have to think about where it is, can I get to it, do I have the wrong tablet/laptop with me, etc. Only have the phone with me? No prob.

I agree that this is where everything is heading. Just so darned convenient.
I'm not a huge supporter of cloud storage. Yes, it's convenient, but we are giving our data to someone else to safekeep. I need to be in control of the technology that I use.

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06-20-2013, 06:01 PM
  #105
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I'm not a huge supporter of cloud storage. Yes, it's convenient, but we are giving our data to someone else to safekeep. I need to be in control of the technology that I use.
Curmudgeon.

I still have local sync'ed copies, and I still do backups.

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06-20-2013, 06:10 PM
  #106
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Originally Posted by YWGinYYZ View Post
Agree. Some have commented that it's like the story of throwing a frog into boiling water. The thought is: the features may get introduced more slowly.

I wonder how many people who are on Steam (which I am) have considered the parallel here? Many disliked Steam at the beginning for very similar reasons. Me? I like the flexibility. I liken it to what's happened to music: I subscribe to online services, and get whatever I want in my playlists whenever I want.

I tend not to be a collector though: I place more value on immediate consumption.
Steaming really a good comparison here since it is a online service so "always on" compliments it.

A disk based media can work either way, regular checkins, or playable with the disk in the system while offline. But it must be one way or the other. There is no hybrid system that will not be heavily susceptible to piracy.

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06-20-2013, 07:37 PM
  #107
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Originally Posted by Lilina View Post
i'm not sure i like the discless play, think about it, if everything becomes discless you're essentially paying 500 bucks for a glorified pc.

console with diskless
a) arguably more people?
b) a lot less capacity for games
c) ability to play on a tv without anything extra
d) no need for a separate chat program in most cases
e) trophies?

pc
a) arguably more people?
b) huge capacity for games and you can buy a bigger hardrive for more space
c) need extra equipment to hook up to a tv and wireless
d) you can alt tab!
e) runs games better (on a gaming pc)
f) torrents, free games, sharing, no kinect/move

I just think that 500 bucks on a desktop will get you a lot better experience than 500 bucks on a console, especially since in 3 years your pc will still be relevant.

i don't think i'll ever buy a console that only takes diskless games because there's no way you'll have enough space on it in order to have all the games you would with disks. i have like 100 games for ps3, there's no way you'd be able to fit all that on diskless consoles without massive massive space, which will of course cost a whole lot more and probably cause some problems of its own. my ps3 is 80gb i believe and it has problems with more than 3 games being downloaded (also only space for about 5). i just don't see diskless consoles a possibility right now.
For the $500 I can buy a good video card. What about the rest of the syste?
I have both a PS3 and a gaming PC.

In the past I played a LOT of PC games, especially MMOs.
I was constantly updated drivers, defragging hard drives, and doing countless other things to keep the machine running well.
One of the other things that I did to make sure it ran well was to run no other software on the system.
All my other PC activities were done on another PC. So basically I was maintaining two systems.

A lot of the time when I played on the PC I spent hours tweaking video settings to make the games ran as well as possible and most of the time I layed with the video quality turned as low as I could stand in order to improve framerate.
Even with a very good video card the resulting video quality was usually lower then what I experience on the PS3.

Now, instead of worrying about the headaches, I pop in a disk and play. No adjusting video settings and deciding whatever AA and AS levels I will play on. No moving other games to my high capacity hard drive to make room for a new install on my gaming hard drive. No time spent key mapping. No carpal tunnel from hours on WASD. No sitting in a ****ing office chair after already sitting in one for 10 hours at work.

In the next console generation I will spend more money on virus protection and OS software for my PC then I will for the PS4.

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06-20-2013, 07:53 PM
  #108
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WTF is up with Aaron Hernandez???? I will wait until the facts come in but this does not look good.

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Old
06-20-2013, 08:32 PM
  #109
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Originally Posted by Gnova View Post
For the $500 I can buy a good video card. What about the rest of the syste?
I have both a PS3 and a gaming PC.
Your gaming pc is intense if you have a $500 video card.

I run everything I play, generally at a setting close to "ultra" on a $1100 system.


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06-20-2013, 08:49 PM
  #110
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Your gaming pc is intense if you have a $500 video card.

I run everything I play, generally at a setting close to "ultra" on a $1100 system.

And you can build a machine that can run every game out there comfortably for less than $700.

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Old
06-20-2013, 08:58 PM
  #111
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So...big flood where I live(thanks for mentioning it and askin if I was ok, jerks...) anyways, my wife's aunt her two cousins and one of their kids and nanny had to move in with us because they were too close to the water. There is no way in or out to where I live, so I know live on Turner Island, not Turner Valley. There was also a gas leak, so we've all been stuck inside. It's lots of fun. Tons of fun.

**** you Mother Nature!

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Old
06-20-2013, 09:02 PM
  #112
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So...big flood where I live(thanks for mentioning it and askin if I was ok, jerks...) anyways, my wife's aunt her two cousins and one of their kids and nanny had to move in with us because they were too close to the water. There is no way in or out to where I live, so I know live on Turner Island, not Turner Valley. There was also a gas leak, so we've all been stuck inside. It's lots of fun. Tons of fun.

**** you Mother Nature!
Zoinks!



Looks bad. You and yours OK? House / possessions, etc?

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Old
06-20-2013, 09:03 PM
  #113
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Old
06-20-2013, 09:09 PM
  #114
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Zoinks!



Looks bad. You and yours OK? House / possessions, etc?
Oh yea. We're not near the river so we're fine. We were supposed to leave for the peg tomorrow....but THAT ain't happening. Can't leave town lol. Black Diamond, about 3 clicks up the hwy is under 6 ft. Okotoks is not much better even some areas of Calgary are bad.

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Old
06-20-2013, 09:10 PM
  #115
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WTF is up with Aaron Hernandez???? I will wait until the facts come in but this does not look good.
Pats took him as a "buyer beware" pick in 2010 due to some character issues, I didn't realize the extent of the character issues though. Really disheartening.

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Old
06-20-2013, 09:11 PM
  #116
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So, why is there a ginormous flood?

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Old
06-20-2013, 09:12 PM
  #117
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So, why is there a ginormous flood?
Global warming

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Old
06-20-2013, 10:19 PM
  #118
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On a lighter note. Trouba is throwing out the first pitch at the gold eyes game tomorrow

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Old
06-20-2013, 11:55 PM
  #119
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On a lighter note. Trouba is throwing out the first pitch at the gold eyes game tomorrow
He should bring his stick and take a slapshot from the mound.

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Old
06-21-2013, 12:13 AM
  #120
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For the $500 I can buy a good video card. What about the rest of the syste?
I have both a PS3 and a gaming PC.

In the past I played a LOT of PC games, especially MMOs.
I was constantly updated drivers, defragging hard drives, and doing countless other things to keep the machine running well.
One of the other things that I did to make sure it ran well was to run no other software on the system.
All my other PC activities were done on another PC. So basically I was maintaining two systems.

A lot of the time when I played on the PC I spent hours tweaking video settings to make the games ran as well as possible and most of the time I layed with the video quality turned as low as I could stand in order to improve framerate.
Even with a very good video card the resulting video quality was usually lower then what I experience on the PS3.

Now, instead of worrying about the headaches, I pop in a disk and play. No adjusting video settings and deciding whatever AA and AS levels I will play on. No moving other games to my high capacity hard drive to make room for a new install on my gaming hard drive. No time spent key mapping. No carpal tunnel from hours on WASD. No sitting in a ****ing office chair after already sitting in one for 10 hours at work.

In the next console generation I will spend more money on virus protection and OS software for my PC then I will for the PS4.
Hyberbole... everywhere.

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Old
06-21-2013, 01:08 AM
  #121
Gnova
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Originally Posted by winterpeg View Post
Your gaming pc is intense if you have a $500 video card.

I run everything I play, generally at a setting close to "ultra" on a $1100 system.

A lot of the issues with graphics settings for me has to do with playng MMOs. They generally do not have the most efficient engines so performance varies.

I know that $500 video card are for really high end systems and I haven't spent that much on a single card, ever. I was comparing next gen to next gen in this case.

However, in the time that I have owned my PS3 I have spent around $500 on video cards because I have upgraded twice. The first of these times I had to buy a new PSU as well for the power.
What is the life cycle of GPUs these days? Three years?
Console life cycle is 7-8 years.

I understand the attraction of PC gaming. MMO's, moba's, and RTS games just don't feel right on consoles. If you want to spend the money games can look fantastic.
I just think that PC gaming is a far more expensive hobby then console gaming and this has always been the case.
My definition of a PC gamer is someone who owns a system that is capable of running any new game on the market well. It sounds like your system can do this easily now but in two years....?

Heh, this is all just a bit of a bitter subject because a few weeks back I moved and had to throw out a couple grand worth of obsolete hardware.

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06-21-2013, 02:15 AM
  #122
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My definition of a PC gamer is someone who owns a system that is capable of running any new game on the market well. It sounds like your system can do this easily now but in two years....?
That's fair.

My intention was as much a multitrack recording workhorse as it was a gaming PC, and so I threw in a sweet GPU because why wouldn't I, but it wasn't the primary objective. In 2 years, I don't know what I'll do. I'll be working full time by then and may decide to pour another 500 into it to bring it up to date, if I'm still doing a lot of PC gaming, but then again, I may just continue to use it recording, and not worry about keeping it up to date.

While I have an up to date machine though, I really am liking PC gaming. (though I also love sitting on the couch with someone else for a console style experience)

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Old
06-21-2013, 07:13 AM
  #123
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Originally Posted by Hank Chinaski View Post
Pats took him as a "buyer beware" pick in 2010 due to some character issues, I didn't realize the extent of the character issues though. Really disheartening.
It's not like I pick it up off his locker room teammate demeanor (cough cough TO). Weird how those buyer beware charcter warnings usually don't pan out.

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Old
06-21-2013, 07:24 AM
  #124
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Warrant out for his arrest for obstruction of justice

Just getting worse for him

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Old
06-21-2013, 08:40 AM
  #125
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I just want to chime in to say that I haven't played a video game since attempting to ski down a hill on Intellivision!

I don't know what any of them look like or what they do. I don't even know if the computers I use have standard games like solitaire???


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