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Blues fan Q&A: notes on Reaves, Rattie, Team Direction and the goaltender debate

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06-24-2013, 02:28 PM
  #1
BBSuns
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Blues fan Q&A: notes on Reaves, Rattie, Team Direction and the goaltender debate

http://thehockeywriters.com/st-louis-blues-fan-qa/

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06-24-2013, 02:55 PM
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HooliganX2
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Don't really agree with him on goaltending I want Allen as our backup. I think he deserves NHL time. He helped bail out our season for us.

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06-24-2013, 03:02 PM
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Yeah I don't really agree with the goaltending part either.

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06-24-2013, 03:05 PM
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Don't really agree with him on goaltending I want Allen as our backup. I think he deserves NHL time. He helped bail out our season for us.
Allen proved his "serviceability" in a shortened season, but like I mentioned, both Halak and Elliott only have 1 year left on their contracts. This next year can be used as a test to see which one they'd want to try and keep (if either) and allow Allen to get another year of experience in the minors

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06-24-2013, 03:06 PM
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Yeah I don't really agree with the goaltending part either.
I certainly understand where the disagreement comes from, but in all honesty, the only upgrades would cost the Blues a pretty penny, especially after the Bernier deal set the market price. Also, there has been no indication from the blues upper management that either Halak or Elliott will be traded, and thats per Rutherford.

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06-24-2013, 03:15 PM
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Allen proved his "serviceability" in a shortened season, but like I mentioned, both Halak and Elliott only have 1 year left on their contracts. This next year can be used as a test to see which one they'd want to try and keep (if either) and allow Allen to get another year of experience in the minors
The problem is Allen may not get starts playing with the Chicago Wolves, thus stunting his development.

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06-24-2013, 03:19 PM
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The problem is Allen may not get starts playing with the Chicago Wolves, thus stunting his development.
If he's good enough for the blues he'll have no problem supplanting the 30 year old starter the wolves had last year, who played 70% of the teams regular season games.

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06-24-2013, 03:32 PM
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Also, there has been no indication from the blues upper management that either Halak or Elliott will be traded, and thats per Rutherford.
Blues management usually never give much indication of specific moves.

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06-24-2013, 03:38 PM
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Blues management usually never give much indication of specific moves.
Thats very true, i think my wording was a bit misleading. my apologies. his exact words were there doesnt seem to be any indication that other teams are targeting them and blues fans overestimate their trade value

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06-24-2013, 03:42 PM
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Thats very true, i think my wording was a bit misleading. my apologies. his exact words were there doesnt seem to be any indication that other teams are targeting them and blues fans overestimate their trade value
Right, I think what he said was to play down the potential return for Halak. I'm guessing the crazies at the asylum were saying we could get a #1 center for Halak and JR needed to politely say that they are insane.

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06-24-2013, 05:31 PM
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If he's good enough for the blues he'll have no problem supplanting the 30 year old starter the wolves had last year, who played 70% of the teams regular season games.
Yeah, I think this is a pretty bogus concern. For someone to think Allen is good enough to be in the NHL line-up, but not good enough to help the Wolves win....its doesn't compute.

The issue is that the Blues don't own the AHL club, so don't control personnel decisions. But there is a partnership there, and they want to work together in a positive fashion. There is concern (and Vancouver fans have expressed) that Chicago is interested more in winning and being profitable than in developing prospects (sometimes those two goals are at odds, but most of the time they'll go hand in hand). But if Allen can't help Chicago win, then why the hell would we want him on the Blues? If he can't win an AHL job, how to we expect him to compete in the big leagues?

Bottom line, I think he could benefit from more time in the AHL rather than sitting on the bench for the majority of starts in the NHL. And the Blues' goalie situation with contracts makes a move necessary for him to be anywhere else. Seems less likely that happens, but the Peoria/Chicago move is not a big deal in the decision.

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06-24-2013, 05:53 PM
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I personally want to see binniogton in chicago and Allen on the Blues. Allen earned an NHL spot with his play when we needed him most.

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06-24-2013, 05:58 PM
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I personally want to see binniogton in chicago and Allen on the Blues. Allen earned an NHL spot with his play when we needed him most.
Thats called the Clemmensen effect and look how that worked out in Florida...albeit the age makes it a bit different of a scenario but you catch my drift I hope. Allen will get his shot, but while the Blues have two serviceable, arguable #1 goalies with only 1 year left on their deals, they should be given the chance to carry the team like they did when they won the Jennings

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06-24-2013, 06:02 PM
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It'll come down to a money situation with Halak. His salary is the easiest on the team to shed since we do have Elliott and Allen. If one or 2 of the RFAs sign for more than expected, I could easily see Halak moved. That's why I'd like to see a couple signings before the draft in case we do have to move Halak at the draft.

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06-24-2013, 06:33 PM
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It'll come down to a money situation with Halak. His salary is the easiest on the team to shed since we do have Elliott and Allen. If one or 2 of the RFAs sign for more than expected, I could easily see Halak moved. That's why I'd like to see a couple signings before the draft in case we do have to move Halak at the draft.
The whole no signing any of our top 4 RFA is killing me. I want Pietrangelo signed ASAP. I'm not that afraid of offer sheets just the compensation really sucks and needs to be updated IMO. 6 million offer sheet should be at least 2-3 firsts IMO.

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06-24-2013, 07:56 PM
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The whole no signing any of our top 4 RFA is killing me. I want Pietrangelo signed ASAP. I'm not that afraid of offer sheets just the compensation really sucks and needs to be updated IMO. 6 million offer sheet should be at least 2-3 firsts IMO.
Andy Strickland gave an update today, no significant contract talks between Petro and the Blues as of yet, while Shatts has had more serious talks thus far. He doesn't expect any of the RFAs to be a tough sign but Shatts may be the toughest because he has arbitration rights.

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06-25-2013, 03:50 AM
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This is right on and the best way to handle all three goaltenders, Halak probably won't be traded so having Allen splitting time between the NHL and the AHL when either one of the veterans need relief from meltdowns or injury. Patience can only help Allen get better, also with this set up it makes him work that much harder to prove he can do the job, if he struggles in the AHL then he's not ready and still needs to work on the mental part of his game.

I don't buy that he's already won the job, he's proven he has the potential they believed he had when he was drafted. Development is this most important thing here and by trading Halak they would be giving themselves poor flexibility.

Also because both Vets are playing for their next contract, that should make for a very healthy competition which helps The Blues. Not only with wins but at the trade deadline if they were to choose to move one, because some team has become desperate because of injury.

This could become a WIN, WIN, WIN scenario but only if they keep them all.

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06-25-2013, 10:18 AM
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Originally Posted by bluesman11 View Post
This is right on and the best way to handle all three goaltenders, Halak probably won't be traded so having Allen splitting time between the NHL and the AHL when either one of the veterans need relief from meltdowns or injury. Patience can only help Allen get better, also with this set up it makes him work that much harder to prove he can do the job, if he struggles in the AHL then he's not ready and still needs to work on the mental part of his game.

I don't buy that he's already won the job, he's proven he has the potential they believed he had when he was drafted. Development is this most important thing here and by trading Halak they would be giving themselves poor flexibility.

Also because both Vets are playing for their next contract, that should make for a very healthy competition which helps The Blues. Not only with wins but at the trade deadline if they were to choose to move one, because some team has become desperate because of injury.

This could become a WIN, WIN, WIN scenario but only if they keep them all.
The old Michael Scott win, win, win scenario. I think you have to throw some of the things you saw from last season out the window because of the unusual circumstance that was last season: most players didn't think there'd even be a season and didnt properly prepare to play like they normally do (Brad Richards was one of the few to own up to that). Also, a condensed schedule puts a huge strain on the body, especially a goalie who has to play every minute of the game..and its not like Halak just magically got hurt, his injury happens to plenty of goalies; he just got unlucky. Halak is a true competitor and I expect him to prove his worth next year. The Blues would be foolish to ship him out.

Halak's career goals against average is 2.41 (above average) and his save percentage is .917% (also above average). Take a look at the company he is in for GAA: http://www.quanthockey.com/nhl/recor...e-leaders.html

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06-25-2013, 10:35 AM
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I'm actually not down on Halak because of the injury at all. I've personally had a pulled groin and to be honest 6 months later it still gives me problems from time to time. They are tricky injuries that linger on and on. Mine was actually from running then kind of doing a side step. Some days you don't notice it at all some days it's there in full force. It frustrates me because it really limits what I can squat at the gym an I have to really start light and warm up and stretch to get going.

I just think his cap hit is to high and he's not really needed. I've been following Allen since we drafted him though. So I am probably higher then most people on him. I really think Allen can be a top 10 NHL goalie in a few years.

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06-25-2013, 11:10 AM
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I'm actually not down on Halak because of the injury at all. I've personally had a pulled groin and to be honest 6 months later it still gives me problems from time to time. They are tricky injuries that linger on and on. Mine was actually from running then kind of doing a side step. Some days you don't notice it at all some days it's there in full force. It frustrates me because it really limits what I can squat at the gym an I have to really start light and warm up and stretch to get going.

I just think his cap hit is to high and he's not really needed. I've been following Allen since we drafted him though. So I am probably higher then most people on him. I really think Allen can be a top 10 NHL goalie in a few years.
If you look at his cap comparables though, he makes about what you should expect him to make. Actually, in my opinion, he should probably be making more but considering when he signed the deal, its fair market value for that time period. If he posts a huge season next year, hes likely to command upwards of 4.5mill: http://www.capgeek.com/comparables/?player_id=80

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06-25-2013, 11:12 AM
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If you look at his cap comparables though, he makes about what you should expect him to make. Actually, in my opinion, he should probably be making more but considering when he signed the deal, its fair market value for that time period. If he posts a huge season next year, hes likely to command upwards of 4.5mill: http://www.capgeek.com/comparables/?player_id=80
When you have 2 other NHL goalies, his salary really isn't needed. If we want to add a center without taking away from any of the forwards or if we adding a bigger salary player in a trade, we will have to move Halak to make everything fit under the cap and budget.

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06-25-2013, 11:42 AM
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When you have 2 other NHL goalies, his salary really isn't needed. If we want to add a center without taking away from any of the forwards or if we adding a bigger salary player in a trade, we will have to move Halak to make everything fit under the cap and budget.
Still not sure why everyone is so convinced Allen is ready to take over for Halak, a guy whose cap hit is very manageable and has proven his ability to not only play in the NHL, but excel when healthy. Allen's numbers in the AHL are decent, not great...

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06-25-2013, 11:59 AM
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The old Michael Scott win, win, win scenario. I think you have to throw some of the things you saw from last season out the window because of the unusual circumstance that was last season: most players didn't think there'd even be a season and didnt properly prepare to play like they normally do (Brad Richards was one of the few to own up to that). Also, a condensed schedule puts a huge strain on the body, especially a goalie who has to play every minute of the game..and its not like Halak just magically got hurt, his injury happens to plenty of goalies; he just got unlucky. Halak is a true competitor and I expect him to prove his worth next year. The Blues would be foolish to ship him out.

Halak's career goals against average is 2.41 (above average) and his save percentage is .917% (also above average). Take a look at the company he is in for GAA: http://www.quanthockey.com/nhl/recor...e-leaders.html

I agree he shouldn't be moved, but I also don't see it very likely he'll be here after next season. Not saying there aren't some scenarios that would keep him with The Blues after next year, I just wouldn't bet on it.

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06-25-2013, 12:09 PM
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Still not sure why everyone is so convinced Allen is ready to take over for Halak, a guy whose cap hit is very manageable and has proven his ability to not only play in the NHL, but excel when healthy. Allen's numbers in the AHL are decent, not great...
Peoria was never that great of a team for him, watching them play, it makes sense. He'd split time with Elliott, who has proven that he can maintain #1 play when he has his confidence going. I think a training camp would make sure he has that going into a season.

I'm not saying we have to dump Halak, but moving him makes the most sense to free up money to improve the team. Everyone wants a center, but we still have a budget and moving Halak is the best way to free up some money for that center.

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06-25-2013, 12:56 PM
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Peoria was never that great of a team for him, watching them play, it makes sense. He'd split time with Elliott, who has proven that he can maintain #1 play when he has his confidence going. I think a training camp would make sure he has that going into a season.

I'm not saying we have to dump Halak, but moving him makes the most sense to free up money to improve the team. Everyone wants a center, but we still have a budget and moving Halak is the best way to free up some money for that center.
If it came down to Halak or being able to acquire a guy like Stastny via trade contingent on the Blues moving Halaks contract, then yes I agree they should look at the possibility of moving him

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