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Is Joe Sakic Bluffing?

View Poll Results: Is Joe Sakic Bluffing?
Yes 65 33.16%
No 80 40.82%
Yes (Avs fan) 3 1.53%
No (Avs fan) 48 24.49%
Voters: 196. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
06-24-2013, 07:25 PM
  #26
hockeyfreak7
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I don't see why everyone's so convinced it's a bluff.

I think the Avs are looking at MacKinnon and Barkov. The question for them is now if Barkov+Something small from FLA/TB/NSH is worth more than MacK.

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06-24-2013, 07:37 PM
  #27
Wrath
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There was one good thread in the prospects (now 2013 draft) section which detailed the history of high overall defensemen picks compared with high overall forward picks which was pretty eye opening. Not only are highly touted forwards seemingly more likely to excel in the NHL, but also they are more likely to excel at an earlier age (i.e. when they have a cheap entry level contract or are still in RFA). Many defensemen even if drafted early don't develop fully until later on in their careers (Lidstrom, Chara, etc.).


Anyways, I'll take Sakic's word for it. He won't pick Jones with the 1st overall pick. If he trades down I wouldn't be surprised for him to take Jones though.

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06-24-2013, 08:21 PM
  #28
WildcatMapleLeafs28
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No , I think we'll see them pick MacKinnon. He's simply to hard to pass up. With the #1 overall pick , forwards seem to be the way to go.

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06-24-2013, 08:43 PM
  #29
Vipers31
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I don't really get why so many believe in a bluff. I don't see how it makes sense.

First of all, most rankings say it's very close. A majority may have Jones going 1st, but lists with different names up top aren't overly uncommon. It's not too hard to imagine the Avs' scouting staff being among those that prefer a forward, like Sakic's comments on surface would indicate.

Secondly, I find the thought of him bluffing to get something from Florida pretty absurd. If Jones really was so deserving of the top selection to have us assume Sakic was "bluffing", why would the Panthers dislike the idea of getting to pick him second? Even if they did prefer MacKinnon, the Avs can't create leverage out of nothing - leverage would only come into play if they were willing to trade down to 3 or further (talking to at least two teams about the #1 pick), which seems less likely. As Florida's GM, if they are only willing to trade down one spot, why would you give them anything? The difference between the players isn't overly big (which would yet again be indicated by the Avalanche even entertaining the idea of trading down a spot), so you'd ultimately expect the Avs to select who they want. If they want Jones, they'll pick him. They aren't getting offered anything that would change their mind on who the right pick is, anyway, when they are limited to a market of just the one team they'd want to trade down to.

The only way they could make anything out of this bluff is if they talk to Florida and at least Tampa, firmly believing both want MacKinnon (or both want Drouin, for argument's sake), and neither will pick Jones before them. Even if they tried to force the Panthers' hand saying they were going to trade down and let someone else get MacKinnon (as Florida's guy in the scenario), Florida could always counter affirming they are going to be fine picking Jones at #2 - which really isn't much of a stretch of the imagination, seeing how many believe not picking Jones at #1 just has to be some form of elaborate ruse.

If it's a bluff, it's a pointless exercise, and it would take the Panthers to react foolishly (in a scenario where the Avs are moving down to #2), or (in the scenario of them moving down to #3 or further) it would be a significant gamble with the player on the line that you see the best way to go for your franchise. Neither seems overly smart to me.

Well, on the flip side, I really don't see anything substantial that would make me doubt that the Avs simply believe that MacKinnon is the best player. So that option seems to be a lot more reasonable at this point in time, would require a lot less firm disagreements between teams on who the best players are, and so on.

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06-24-2013, 09:57 PM
  #30
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What I don't understand about people not believing Joe is telling the truth is if you look back at the polls about 'Who will go #1?' 'Who would you take Mackinnon/Jones?' etc etc etc. Every single one of them has Mackinnon winning in the poll.

Then Sakic comes out and says he's likely going to take Mackinnon.... BLUFF BLUFFU BLUFBLU BLUFF!!!

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06-24-2013, 10:12 PM
  #31
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I'd hope so because Jones would be the perfect pick for them, but I don't think he is.

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06-24-2013, 11:28 PM
  #32
Gigantor The Goalie
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Wow people actually think Joe Sakic is bluffing? I'd love to play poker with Joe because I'd clean him out. He's not the bluffing type. There are going to be so many people genuinely surprised its going to be hilarious.

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06-25-2013, 01:25 AM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundwaveIsCharisma View Post
Because everyone keeps playing up the Jones "hometown factor", as well as local media constantly hyping Jones. Sakic is prepping everyone for Jones not being the pick.
Hmm I see. I don't doubt he will take MacKinnon 1st, but I still think that his impetus for announcing this is at least partially to see if anyone wants to change his mind.

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06-25-2013, 01:31 AM
  #34
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Originally Posted by StringerBell View Post
Hmm I see. I don't doubt he will take MacKinnon 1st, but I still think that his impetus for announcing this is at least partially to see if anyone wants to change his mind.
This is pretty much what I think he's doing with announcing he's taking MacKinnon. If he doesn't get an offer that blows him away, he's going to MacKinnon. I don't really think there's much posturing behind his comments.

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06-25-2013, 03:07 AM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vipers31 View Post
The only way they could make anything out of this bluff is if they talk to Florida and at least Tampa, firmly believing both want MacKinnon (or both want Drouin, for argument's sake), and neither will pick Jones before them. Even if they tried to force the Panthers' hand saying they were going to trade down and let someone else get MacKinnon (as Florida's guy in the scenario), Florida could always counter affirming they are going to be fine picking Jones at #2 - which really isn't much of a stretch of the imagination, seeing how many believe not picking Jones at #1 just has to be some form of elaborate ruse.
I can't speak for the Panthers, but I can tell you that if Jones is available when the Lightning pick that he is going there.

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06-25-2013, 03:58 PM
  #36
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I think Jones will be the better player. If he's there at 2, I don't think the Panthers have a problem taking him. On a side note, I don't think it's smart for the Avs to pass up on him. A lot of scouts believe that Jones is the best player in the draft and he fits a big need for the Avs. Duchene and Landeskog are two dynamos up front, now give EJ some help on the back end and I think they are set for the future.

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06-25-2013, 04:00 PM
  #37
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Mackinnon - Colorado (incredible skilled top 9)
Jones - Florida (add a franchise dman in theire young d core)
Drouin - Tampa (stamkos-drouin the future combo, as the new lecavalier/stlouis).

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06-25-2013, 10:32 PM
  #38
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I don't think he is. But I wouldn't be surprised if he is.

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Old
06-26-2013, 09:27 AM
  #39
Blind Gardien
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I doubt he's completely bluffing... probably just trying to drive up the price in a trade-down scenario. But I think he'd still take MacKinnon #1 if no trade happened. Because the Avs would also be pretty happy to get Jones, however, they probably don't mind trading down a spot or two and picking something up in the process. But that "something" will be worth more if the teams they're negotiating with understand that the Avs are otherwise truly fine with taking MacKinnon and won't just take Jones anyway at #1 and let MacKinnon fall through.

So it's a tactical release of information, but I don't think you can really call it a "bluff" per se.

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06-26-2013, 12:47 PM
  #40
KA BLAMO
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I think he's bluffing.

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Old
06-26-2013, 12:54 PM
  #41
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Do GMs really bluff with respect who they're going to pick #1 overall? I mean, if they were going to trade it, or if they were selecting later on in the 1st round, maybe, but what incentive is there with bluffing about who you're going to pick 1st overall. There is none. You're just taking these kids on an emotional rollercoaster.

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06-26-2013, 01:03 PM
  #42
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I think so. One day they are willing to trade down and the next they are taking MacKinnon. Sounds fishy. I think they want Drouin and they are willing to move down and nab him in the 2-3 spot

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06-26-2013, 01:28 PM
  #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GordieHoweHatTrick View Post
Do GMs really bluff with respect who they're going to pick #1 overall? I mean, if they were going to trade it, or if they were selecting later on in the 1st round, maybe, but what incentive is there with bluffing about who you're going to pick 1st overall. There is none. You're just taking these kids on an emotional rollercoaster.
It's the "Game of Prospects". The South will never forget

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06-26-2013, 01:37 PM
  #44
Bob Kudelski
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He's not bluffing.

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Old
06-26-2013, 01:41 PM
  #45
DaveG
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No, but I do think making this public is trying to put pressure on someone to trade up. Either he wants the Panthers to swap with the Avs so Florida can land Mac and the Avs get a very nice return for being so generous, or he's putting this out here early to avoid the PR nightmare that is not taking the home-town kid who, up until he said something, everyone assumed would be going #1.

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06-26-2013, 01:45 PM
  #46
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As of today...
- Joe Sakic (executive president of hockey operations)
- Patrick Roy (VP of hockey operations & Head coach)
- Andre Tourigny (Asst. coach)
- Rick Pracey (chief scout)

have all gone on the record stating that if the avs have the #1 pick, they will select Mackinnon.

I truly believe they are comfortable with trading down for the right assets. But bluffing? Theyre willing to trade down, but if they dont get the right offer, its Mack at #1. No question about it.

And just because theyd be willing to trade down doesnt mean theyre bluffing. It just means theyre comfortable enough with some of the other prospects in the draft.

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06-26-2013, 02:00 PM
  #47
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Not a bluff. We take mackinnon if we pick first. Is he, maybe, also trying to see if there are any trade offers out there? Yeah, I'm sure he is. Doesn't mean he's lying about taking mackinnon.

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06-26-2013, 02:37 PM
  #48
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I'm going to say no (not an Avs fan), on the basis that I believe both MacKinnon and Drouin are better prospects than Jones. Most people that had Jones pegged to Colorado, only did so because of his prior connections. Colorado might not get the 1st overall again in my lifetime, it would be stupid to take a kid based on anything other than talent.

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Old
06-27-2013, 09:11 AM
  #49
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MacKinnon is like one year younger than Jones. I'm hearing buzz he could be player like Tavares/Stamkos. He might be too good to pass.

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06-27-2013, 11:24 AM
  #50
Zih
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GordieHoweHatTrick View Post
Do GMs really bluff with respect who they're going to pick #1 overall?
I might be mis-remembering this and I was busy on the actual draft day so I only read about it afterwards, but didn't NYI pretty heavily imply on draft day that they were taking Duchene?

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