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Pittsburgh signs Kris Letang to extension (8 years, $7.25M per)

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Old
07-01-2013, 06:31 PM
  #651
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Originally Posted by ObsessedCreative View Post
Seriously, you have clowns coming back saying how their "points" and "facts" help them support their "different points of view" sounds like a lot of fluff speak to me for them not having one damn valid point, and looking like a bunch of whiney jealous A-holes.

It gets really old fast.
And suddenly "facts" are referred to as "opinions" when somebody (namely a Pens with more knowledge on Letang) brings up actual facts.

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07-01-2013, 06:35 PM
  #652
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Would have gotten $8M+ on the open market.

People in this thread saying it's "FARR TOO MUCH!!11" need to take a long look at the current NHL market, and out their biases aside. Letang is a legitimate #1 defenseman. He finished third in Norris voting last season. He plays a ton of minutes and is one of the most productive defenseman in the NHL. He's relatively reliable in his own end; a bit of an adventure at times, but not nearly as bad as some other "top" offensive defenseman.

What do you expect for a Norris finalist? $6M? Those are ridiculous expectations. This contract is fine, a little under market value, in fact. Hoping it doesn't get done because I don't want to see my favorite non-Ranger on a team I can't stand, but if it does, props to Shero, this is a solid contract.

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Old
07-01-2013, 06:38 PM
  #653
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Originally Posted by BB v2 0 View Post
Would have gotten $8M+ on the open market.

People in this thread saying it's "FARR TOO MUCH!!11" need to take a long look at the current NHL market, and out their biases aside. Letang is a legitimate #1 defenseman. He finished third in Norris voting last season. He plays a ton of minutes and is one of the most productive defenseman in the NHL. He's relatively reliable in his own end; a bit of an adventure at times, but not nearly as bad as some other "top" offensive defenseman.

What do you expect for a Norris finalist? $6M? Those are ridiculous expectations. This contract is fine, a little under market value, in fact. Hoping it doesn't get done because I don't want to see my favorite non-Ranger on a team I can't stand, but if it does, props to Shero, this is a solid contract.
Nice to see a fan or a rival come here, know the facts and the player, and post about the subject with rational and a thought out educated response!

I wouldn't have been surprised to see teams like the isles or oilers who generally have a hard time getting UFAs to sign with their clubs offering 9mil or 9mil+ to him to agree to stay there long term easy!


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07-01-2013, 06:40 PM
  #654
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Originally Posted by Steve Holt View Post
And suddenly "facts" are referred to as "opinions" when somebody (namely a Pens with more knowledge on Letang) brings up actual facts.
Exactly, it's so easy to predict all the posts and responses here of all the horrible knuckle draggers who bang on a keyboard around here.

I really do need to use the "ignore list feature" a lot more.

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07-01-2013, 06:43 PM
  #655
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Originally Posted by ObsessedCreative View Post
Letang 3.5m / year

EK 6.5m / year both as RFA
EK also signed after his breakout season and agreed to 6.5 b/c there's no guarantee he'd repeat his performance. Now we know he can repeat so if he was RFA this year, he'd get north of 8, nevermind as a UFA.

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07-01-2013, 06:50 PM
  #656
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It's definitely an overpayment. But the actual cap hit isn't what is bad, I don't like the 8 year term.

At $7.25 million he is being paid at a rate of a top-3 defense man in the NHL. He will need to be a perennial Norris finalist / Norris winner to live up to that contract. As of now, few defense men actually earn what Letang does. As of right now, the only defense men making more than him will be Suter, Weber and Campbell. And of those three, Weber / Suter are a step above Letang. Letang is better than Campbell, but Campbell, despite having some real solid seasons recently, is also overpaid.

Secondly, some people are claiming it's a great cap hit given that the cap ceiling is to elevate in future years. Who knows what the NHL market will be like 8 years from now?

Thirdly, would Letang have made more in the open market? Probably, but not much. He wouldn't have pulled in $8+ million unless there was a GM willing to make him the highest paid defense man in the NHL, and that would mean the GM believes Letang is the premiere defense man in the NHL and will be for the foreseeable future. And even IF a GM signed him for $8+ million, that doesn't mean it would have been a good signing. People keep forgetting that. "He could have made," doesn't mean it would have been a good contract for that team. That's why a lot of overpaid UFA's don't work out.

I think Shero locking up three players at $25.5 million is certainly questionable. And $30.5 million amongst four players if you include Fleury. I would have locked up Malkin and Crosby to big money, I personally wouldn't have signed Letang at $7.25 million over 8 years. Over a couple years? Probably.

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07-01-2013, 06:57 PM
  #657
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Originally Posted by HavlatMach9 View Post
EK also signed after his breakout season and agreed to 6.5 b/c there's no guarantee he'd repeat his performance. Now we know he can repeat so if he was RFA this year, he'd get north of 8, nevermind as a UFA.
exactly, anyone else pissing and moaning about what Letang is getting as a UFA is either 1. insane 2. No idea of the CBA RFA/UFA status 3. Just completely jealous that Letang isn't on their favorite team.

Or a combo of all three!

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07-01-2013, 06:58 PM
  #658
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It might have be an overpayment in the old CBA but it's a fair deal in the new CBA.

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07-01-2013, 07:02 PM
  #659
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"It's definitely an overpayment. But the actual cap hit isn't what is bad, I don't like the 8 year term."

Please tell me who would be cheaper and why it is an over-payment, and would meet all of Letang's credentials / accomplishments and has a UFA contract status under this current CBA.

2 why don't you like the year term?! haha The kid is TWENTY SIX he hasn't even entered his prime yet of playing at full potential, he is still 2-3 years away from that.

"At $7.25 million he is being paid at a rate of a top-3 defense man in the NHL. "

No under the current CBA his cap hit can't be artificially lowered like old contracts under the old CBA with "fake years" on the deal...


You know what I'm not even going to repeat myself a million times for people like you anymore who have no idea what they are talking about...



Quote:
Originally Posted by Fataldogg View Post
It's definitely an overpayment. But the actual cap hit isn't what is bad, I don't like the 8 year term.

At $7.25 million he is being paid at a rate of a top-3 defense man in the NHL. He will need to be a perennial Norris finalist / Norris winner to live up to that contract. As of now, few defense men actually earn what Letang does. As of right now, the only defense men making more than him will be Suter, Weber and Campbell. And of those three, Weber / Suter are a step above Letang. Letang is better than Campbell, but Campbell, despite having some real solid seasons recently, is also overpaid.

Secondly, some people are claiming it's a great cap hit given that the cap ceiling is to elevate in future years. Who knows what the NHL market will be like 8 years from now?

Thirdly, would Letang have made more in the open market? Probably, but not much. He wouldn't have pulled in $8+ million unless there was a GM willing to make him the highest paid defense man in the NHL, and that would mean the GM believes Letang is the premiere defense man in the NHL and will be for the foreseeable future. And even IF a GM signed him for $8+ million, that doesn't mean it would have been a good signing. People keep forgetting that. "He could have made," doesn't mean it would have been a good contract for that team. That's why a lot of overpaid UFA's don't work out.

I think Shero locking up three players at $25.5 million is certainly questionable. And $30.5 million amongst four players if you include Fleury. I would have locked up Malkin and Crosby to big money, I personally wouldn't have signed Letang at $7.25 million over 8 years. Over a couple years? Probably.

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07-01-2013, 07:02 PM
  #660
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Originally Posted by ObsessedCreative View Post
Nice to see a fan or a rival come here, know the facts and the player, and post about the subject with rational and a thought out educated response!

I wouldn't have been surprised to see teams like the isles or oilers who generally have a hard time getting UFAs to sign with their clubs offering 9mil or 9mil+ to him to agree to stay there long term easy!
9 or 9+ for Letang? That's almost as ridiculous as PK winning the Norris..

Wait a minute.

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07-01-2013, 07:14 PM
  #661
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9 or 9+ for Letang? That's almost as ridiculous as PK winning the Norris..

Wait a minute.
exactly haha

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07-01-2013, 07:17 PM
  #662
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Originally Posted by BB v2 0 View Post
Would have gotten $8M+ on the open market.

People in this thread saying it's "FARR TOO MUCH!!11" need to take a long look at the current NHL market, and out their biases aside. Letang is a legitimate #1 defenseman. He finished third in Norris voting last season. He plays a ton of minutes and is one of the most productive defenseman in the NHL. He's relatively reliable in his own end; a bit of an adventure at times, but not nearly as bad as some other "top" offensive defenseman.

What do you expect for a Norris finalist? $6M? Those are ridiculous expectations. This contract is fine, a little under market value, in fact. Hoping it doesn't get done because I don't want to see my favorite non-Ranger on a team I can't stand, but if it does, props to Shero, this is a solid contract.
I have to agree with that,ppl that thinks that he's worth 6M/yr on a long term are insane.

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07-01-2013, 07:20 PM
  #663
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On the whole, Pens fans are a strangely defensive bunch. Obviously, that doesn't apply to all of them, there are quite a few I've rather enjoyed discussing things with (more than I'd probably care to admit as a Flyers fan).

For the most part, I don't think I've said anything that many Pens fans haven't said themselves. Kris Letang is a great but flawed offensive dman. The Pens had to sign him and while i find the dollar amount high for his contributions, particularly given the Pens salary structure, he would get as much if not more on the open market. The only major point of departure is I've said that if I were in Shero's shoes I'd explore a trade if I could get a quality package in return that would have to include a potential Letang replacement, a younger guy at a smaller cap hit, with top pairing upside and shutdown capabilities, if perhaps less proficient offensively. I've even conceded that finding such a package could be difficult, but that Letang would be attractive enough to yield such a return.

And for that I've been called an idiot, a knuckle-dragger, a clown, and a whiny jealous ******* (my apologies if I've missed any other entirely unprovoked insults.) Strange.

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07-01-2013, 07:21 PM
  #664
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Originally Posted by PensBandwagonerNo272 View Post
Gonchar was slightly better positionally. Letang is more physical + harder backchecker. Different players.

This motion that has arisen lately that Letang can't play defense is ridiculous and a classic case of "haters gonna hate".
The notion that Letang is not that good defensively is not new. People have been saying that since his first season.

That also doesn't mean he isn't elite offensively, he just isn't that great defensively.

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07-01-2013, 07:24 PM
  #665
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Originally Posted by nmbr_24 View Post
The notion that Letang is not that good defensively is not new. People have been saying that since his first season.

That also doesn't mean he isn't elite offensively, he just isn't that great defensively.
Pens fans say it and they're right.

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07-01-2013, 07:32 PM
  #666
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On the whole, Pens fans are a strangely defensive bunch. Obviously, that doesn't apply to all of them, there are quite a few I've rather enjoyed discussing things with (more than I'd probably care to admit as a Flyers fan).

For the most part, I don't think I've said anything that many Pens fans haven't said themselves. Kris Letang is a great but flawed offensive dman. The Pens had to sign him and while i find the dollar amount high for his contributions, particularly given the Pens salary structure, he would get as much if not more on the open market. The only major point of departure is I've said that if I were in Shero's shoes I'd explore a trade if I could get a quality package in return that would have to include a potential Letang replacement, a younger guy at a smaller cap hit, with top pairing upside and shutdown capabilities, if perhaps less proficient offensively. I've even conceded that finding such a package could be difficult, but that Letang would be attractive enough to yield such a return.

And for that I've been called an idiot, a knuckle-dragger, a clown, and a whiny jealous ******* (my apologies if I've missed any other entirely unprovoked insults.) Strange.
He is a TWENTY SIX year old kid with easily the best 8 years of his career and improvement ahead of him! haha JESUSSSS

I'm just going to stop and stop wasting my time on you who just obviously don't get it or know what they are going on and on about. good day!

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07-01-2013, 07:39 PM
  #667
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Originally Posted by ObsessedCreative View Post
He is a TWENTY SIX year old kid with easily the best 8 years of his career and improvement ahead of him! haha JESUSSSS

I'm just going to stop and stop wasting my time on you who just obviously don't get it or know what they are going on and on about. good day!
Isn't it fairly obvious Letang's not going to make improvements to his game over the next 8 years? The Letang of today is the Letang we'll see in 2021. And then when the cap is $80mil+ in the future, he'll still be overpaid for his flawed skills.


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07-01-2013, 07:41 PM
  #668
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Originally Posted by ObsessedCreative View Post
He is a TWENTY SIX year old kid with easily the best 8 years of his career and improvement ahead of him! haha JESUSSSS

I'm just going to stop and stop wasting my time on you who just obviously don't get it or know what they are going on and on about. good day!
I've even said that he could potentially improve defensively. That was only a few posts of mine ago. I still cannot fathom what you are so defensive about, nor why you are so angry. Do you seriously lack the maturity to cope with an opinion (from a complete stranger on the internet) that doesn't neatly align with yours?

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07-01-2013, 07:51 PM
  #669
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mja View Post
For the most part, I don't think I've said anything that many Pens fans haven't said themselves. Kris Letang is a great but flawed offensive dman. The Pens had to sign him and while i find the dollar amount high for his contributions, particularly given the Pens salary structure, he would get as much if not more on the open market. The only major point of departure is I've said that if I were in Shero's shoes I'd explore a trade if I could get a quality package in return that would have to include a potential Letang replacement, a younger guy at a smaller cap hit, with top pairing upside and shutdown capabilities, if perhaps less proficient offensively. I've even conceded that finding such a package could be difficult, but that Letang would be attractive enough to yield such a return.
Why would Shero trade for a "potential Letang replacement" when he has the where withall to just resign Letang?

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07-01-2013, 07:55 PM
  #670
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Originally Posted by Steve Holt View Post
Why would Shero trade for a "potential Letang replacement" when he has the where withall to just resign Letang?
Didn't we already have this conversation?

Btw, love yr username & avatar, suits you perfectly.

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07-01-2013, 07:59 PM
  #671
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Didn't we already have this conversation?
I think we did, and I'm sure it was pointed out it would be unnecessary to trade him.

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07-01-2013, 08:04 PM
  #672
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I am a little surprised that the "friction" was caused by 250,000/year in salary. Wasn't that the difference between the Penguins's position and Letang's? That is a relatively tiny amount to quibble over. They had the term, the clauses, etc. I understand that Letang wants to fight for every dollar he can, and that the Penguins may be sweating the cap, but I'm surprised that Shero/Lemieux didn't just capitulate from the get-go.

Plus, it is abundantly clear that Letang wanted to stay in Pittsburgh.

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07-01-2013, 08:11 PM
  #673
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Why would Shero trade for a "potential Letang replacement" when he has the where withall to just resign Letang?
Because apparently Tang is a complete liability on D.

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07-01-2013, 08:17 PM
  #674
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I think we did, and I'm sure it was pointed out it would be unnecessary to trade him.
Well, to reiterate my position, I don't believe in Letang as a legit number 1 on a cup contending team (you are welcome to disagree, I can handle opinions different from my own without losing my ****) as I simply don't like the idea of paying elite #1 money to a guy who does not possess shutdown capabilities in a cap world with two other longterm elite contracts up front. I would explore the option I've already laid out a few times, as a longterm signed Letang should bring back quite a package. This is all my opinion of course, which some seem incapable of handling.

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07-01-2013, 08:20 PM
  #675
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Because apparently Tang is a complete liability on D.
That'd be a strawman attack, never said that. But at 7.25 a year, with a couple of bigger contracts on the books, I'd want my number 1 D to have shut down capabilities, like nearly every other guy making that kind of coin.

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