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Sabres acquire Jamie McBain and 2nd Rounder (JT Compher) from Canes for Andrej Sekera

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Old
07-01-2013, 06:32 PM
  #276
Jame
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Originally Posted by struckbyaparkedcar View Post
Well, what they did shows that they think Risto ~ Monahan.

Trading up for Lindholm/Monahan would've meant they had a big five.


Losing a trade at the NHL level, on a player they don't have many of after standing pat at eight means they're probably not looking to be immediately competitive. Which is fine, mind you.
I think they, like me, had a top 4, followed by another 3, and were confident that Edmonton would take Nurse

the attempts by our fan base to convince themselves that there was a gap between lindholm/monahan and ristolainen is futile

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07-01-2013, 06:49 PM
  #277
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Comments on the trade :
Rutherford : I offered the same deal for 5 (5, mcbain for 8, sekera
Regier : [smug smile] no comment
Devine : they wanted 38 as well

i think Rutherford was pissed off because Regier got the best of him

i think, had they made the 5/8 swap, Regier would've taken Ristolainen anyways, and Carolina would've still landed Lindholm at 8 (cal/monahan, edm/nurse remains the same)

Rutherford is pissed, because he had to give up his 2nd to get the D he wanted, when really he wanted to trade down with regier (gms talk about who they are going to take when discussing trades) and still get lindholm, get sekera, and KEEP his 2nd rounder

Regier's smug smile when asked about the potential 5/8 trade and his comment about Jimmy.... that's the read i got on it... Regier got the best of Rutherford.

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07-01-2013, 07:18 PM
  #278
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- Buffalo #Sabres' offered Andrej Sekera and their #8 pick to move up to the #5 spot in which the #Hurricanes declined and Drafted .

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07-01-2013, 07:25 PM
  #279
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Originally Posted by Awwufelloff View Post
- Buffalo #Sabres' offered Andrej Sekera and their #8 pick to move up to the #5 spot in which the #Hurricanes declined and Drafted .
source?

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07-01-2013, 07:45 PM
  #280
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From what I'm piecing together, either we offered #8 and Sekera for #5, and the then the 'Canes offered #8, #38, Sekera for #5 & McBain, or it happened in the other order. Both sides backed away. I'm thinking that it was the Canes' initiative from the beginning since they came calling later on, offering #35.

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07-01-2013, 07:56 PM
  #281
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Originally Posted by Awwufelloff View Post
- Buffalo #Sabres' offered Andrej Sekera and their #8 pick to move up to the #5 spot in which the #Hurricanes declined and Drafted .
Not true. Carolina already confirmed they made the offer

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07-01-2013, 07:58 PM
  #282
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Awwufelloff View Post
- Buffalo #Sabres' offered Andrej Sekera and their #8 pick to move up to the #5 spot in which the #Hurricanes declined and Drafted .
That doesn't make sense based on the later trade. That would mean Sekera was worth moving up only three spots, and also worth McBain and #35. Moving up three spots does not equal McBain and #35, moving up three spots is worth a decent amount less than McBain and #35.

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07-02-2013, 07:41 PM
  #283
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It would be nice to see McBain get his game back on track, for at least just this year. Maybe Darcy can flip him for a pick at the deadline if he plays decently. I can't see him in the long term plans.

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07-02-2013, 07:48 PM
  #284
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Originally Posted by Jame View Post
I think they, like me, had a top 4, followed by another 3, and were confident that Edmonton would take Nurse

the attempts by our fan base to convince themselves that there was a gap between lindholm/monahan and ristolainen is futile
Everyone loves that shiny forward prospect

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07-03-2013, 11:51 AM
  #285
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Sometimes you've just got to give yourself the old pat on the back...


http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh....php?t=1441653

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07-03-2013, 12:07 PM
  #286
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Originally Posted by stokes84 View Post
Sometimes you've just got to give yourself the old pat on the back...


http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh....php?t=1441653
I love how passionate Jame's retort is on this.

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07-03-2013, 12:18 PM
  #287
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Originally Posted by stokes84 View Post
Sometimes you've just got to give yourself the old pat on the back...


http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh....php?t=1441653


Because young 27 year old SHUTDOWN d-men never get traded.

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07-03-2013, 12:59 PM
  #288
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Originally Posted by stokes84 View Post
Sometimes you've just got to give yourself the old pat on the back...


http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh....php?t=1441653
I'll have to say, you were pretty spot on. It's hard to tell what the marketplace is like right now, but it seems guys on a cheapish contract should still be getting at least average value, maybe even better than average. It has me worried about Miller/Vanek's value now for sure, with those high cap hits. Would you care to take a guess at what you think their current value is? I'm always willing to listen to a guy who has been accurate recently. Not to derail the thread of course, but just for my own good.

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07-03-2013, 10:13 PM
  #289
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The fun thing about this is that we will all have the next couple of seasons (who knows, maybe decades) to "objectively evaluate the merits" of Darcy's actions.

I can see lots of future threads on this topic as Rej succeeds and McBain flames out. It all comes down to the draft picks.

So until some evidence is accumulated, it's all conjecture and speculation. (He said, She said, who knows who led, who followed, who blinked, who struck out....)

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07-03-2013, 10:46 PM
  #290
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
Comments on the trade :
Rutherford : I offered the same deal for 5 (5, mcbain for 8, sekera
Regier : [smug smile] no comment
Devine : they wanted 38 as well

i think Rutherford was pissed off because Regier got the best of him

i think, had they made the 5/8 swap, Regier would've taken Ristolainen anyways, and Carolina would've still landed Lindholm at 8 (cal/monahan, edm/nurse remains the same)

Rutherford is pissed, because he had to give up his 2nd to get the D he wanted, when really he wanted to trade down with regier (gms talk about who they are going to take when discussing trades) and still get lindholm, get sekera, and KEEP his 2nd rounder

Regier's smug smile when asked about the potential 5/8 trade and his comment about Jimmy.... that's the read i got on it... Regier got the best of Rutherford.
I agree with pretty much everything ...except the part where Reiger would've still taken Risto at 5.

It would've been one of Lindholm or Monahan.

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07-03-2013, 10:53 PM
  #291
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Originally Posted by littletonhockeycoach View Post
The fun thing about this is that we will all have the next couple of seasons (who knows, maybe decades) to "objectively evaluate the merits" of Darcy's actions.

I can see lots of future threads on this topic as Rej succeeds and McBain flames out. It all comes down to the draft picks.

So until some evidence is accumulated, it's all conjecture and speculation. (He said, She said, who knows who led, who followed, who blinked, who struck out....)

McBain shouldnt even be factored into the equation. The deal was to get Compher... Carolina wanted to move McBain...there is no risk in us taking him... I doubt Darcy expects anything fromm McBain.

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07-03-2013, 11:48 PM
  #292
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Originally Posted by Beerz View Post
I agree with pretty much everything ...except the part where Reiger would've still taken Risto at 5.

It would've been one of Lindholm or Monahan.
Darcy said at 2:00pm or so draft day that they felt that the guy they wanted outside the top 4 would be there at #8.

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07-04-2013, 08:39 AM
  #293
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Originally Posted by Moskau View Post
Darcy said at 2:00pm or so draft day that they felt that the guy they wanted outside the top 4 would be there at #8.

So why would he even be in discussions for the 5th pick? And then stated afterwards.. "We almost got there"

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07-04-2013, 09:16 AM
  #294
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Originally Posted by Beerz View Post
So why would he even be in discussions for the 5th pick? And then stated afterwards.. "We almost got there"
If Darcy really thought Risto >> Monahan, I'd like some of what he's smoking.

And before you jump all over me, 99% of you would've said the same thing pre-draft.

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07-04-2013, 09:17 AM
  #295
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Originally Posted by Moskau View Post
Darcy said at 2:00pm or so draft day that they felt that the guy they wanted outside the top 4 would be there at #8.
And Devine, who's much more frank than Darcy, said "not necessarily" when asked if Ristolainen would have been the pick at 5. My guess is they had one or both of Lindholm/Monahan ranked slightly ahead of Ristolainen, but not far enough ahead to warrant what they perceived to be the difference in value between Sekera and McBain. Plus, with all of Devine's comments during the pre-draft interviews citing the number of defensemen the organization lost over the last year, and that they had a clear top-4 defensemen in the draft (SJ, RR, NZ, and DN in some order), they probably felt they had to get one of those guys in the 1st round--and we know they were shocked that Zadorov was there at 16--and didn't think any would be there by the time 16 rolled around.

We know they had a late-1st round grade on Compher because they were trying to use their 2nd rounders to get back into the 1st to draft him. It's probably as simple as the Sabres valued Rej as a late-1st rounder + secondary roster player, and when what they perceived to be a late-1st rounder (Compher) was still on the board at 35, the deal was then acceptable.

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07-04-2013, 09:35 AM
  #296
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Originally Posted by haseoke39 View Post
If Darcy really thought Risto >> Monahan, I'd like some of what he's smoking.

And before you jump all over me, 99% of you would've said the same thing pre-draft.
I dont think he did... My guess would be...

Top 4 obviously on 1st tier.

Then Lindholm and Monahan on second tier

Then Risto and Nikita..and probably a few others on following tier.


As Zip stated..I don't think they felt the gap between Risto and Lindholm-Monahan was that big to warrant the overpayment Carolina was asking for.

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07-04-2013, 09:38 AM
  #297
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Originally Posted by Beerz View Post
I dont think he did... My guess would be...

Top 4 obviously on 1st tier.

Then Lindholm and Monahan on second tier

Then Risto and Nikita..and probably a few others on following tier.


As Zip stated..I don't think they felt the gap between Risto and Lindholm-Monahan was that big to warrant the overpayment Carolina was asking for.
And they got a player they didn't feel they were going to be able to get in the 2nd in kompher. I'm conservatively optimistic about Mcbain maybe he needed a change of scenery as we know Reggie did.

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07-04-2013, 09:41 AM
  #298
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And they got a player they didn't feel they were going to be able to get in the 2nd in kompher. I'm conservatively optimistic about Mcbain maybe he needed a change of scenery as we know Reggie did.

Exactly.

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07-04-2013, 10:07 AM
  #299
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beerz View Post
I agree with pretty much everything ...except the part where Reiger would've still taken Risto at 5.

It would've been one of Lindholm or Monahan.
doubtful

Quote:
Originally Posted by Moskau View Post
Darcy said at 2:00pm or so draft day that they felt that the guy they wanted outside the top 4 would be there at #8.
sounds like Ristolainen

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zip15 View Post
And Devine, who's much more frank than Darcy, said "not necessarily" when asked if Ristolainen would have been the pick at 5. My guess is they had one or both of Lindholm/Monahan ranked slightly ahead of Ristolainen, but not far enough ahead to warrant what they perceived to be the difference in value between Sekera and McBain. Plus, with all of Devine's comments during the pre-draft interviews citing the number of defensemen the organization lost over the last year, and that they had a clear top-4 defensemen in the draft (SJ, RR, NZ, and DN in some order), they probably felt they had to get one of those guys in the 1st round--and we know they were shocked that Zadorov was there at 16--and didn't think any would be there by the time 16 rolled around.

We know they had a late-1st round grade on Compher because they were trying to use their 2nd rounders to get back into the 1st to draft him. It's probably as simple as the Sabres valued Rej as a late-1st rounder + secondary roster player, and when what they perceived to be a late-1st rounder (Compher) was still on the board at 35, the deal was then acceptable.
sounds more like there was NO seperation what so ever in their minds between Ristolainen and whichever forwards you choose to presume they may have taken at 5.

The evidence shows that they had them as equals, and were leaning defense, as an organizational need.

If they traded up, they would've "MOST LIKELY" still taken Risto. That was Devine's guy, but there were certainly voices in the room that may have preferred Lindholm/Monahan.

Listening to his guys, and having an idea of what the guys in front of him would do, Darcy stood knowing that the guy his top scout preferred would be there (risto)

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07-04-2013, 10:08 AM
  #300
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Quote:
Originally Posted by haseoke39 View Post
If Darcy really thought Risto >> Monahan, I'd like some of what he's smoking.

And before you jump all over me, 99% of you would've said the same thing pre-draft.
there were those of us who knew better.

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