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Roster/Trade/Etc Discussion Part IX: Offseason

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Old
07-01-2013, 12:42 AM
  #26
AngelDuck
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I'm with Static.

There is simply too much money tied up in the goaltenders given how close this team is to the cap. If we're re-signing Koivu and Teemu, one of the goaltenders is definitely being moved. If we want to upgrade defense, Ryan more than likely HAS to be moved because of his expensive salary

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07-01-2013, 12:47 AM
  #27
Eddie Shack
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Originally Posted by Static View Post
One of the starters is probably gone, Anderson as the backup, and Bobkov and Gibson fighting for the Norfolk starters job. We just can't afford almost seven million there, especially with the depth we have. Use the cheap labor damnit.
I've been saying that since shortly after BM signed Viktor. This team doesn't throw money around like that, to have $7M tied up in goal. That's why I have been speculating a Hiller trade. I think that's been Bob's plan for a while now. Why it didn't go down today I don't know, but maybe Bob is holding out for a better price?

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07-01-2013, 12:49 AM
  #28
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Originally Posted by Bobby Ryan Getzlaf View Post
I do agree, but I would hate to see him being forced to the NHL because we have Hiller and Fasth, regardless of how he plays. I'd like to see him going into camp with a legitimate chance to make the team, or even be the starter, as unlikely as that is(not impossible, not when some guys are saying he's the best goalie prospect in a long, long time). Also, as I said, lots of other factors to that opinion.
If Gibson comes to camp and impresses/out performs Fasth or Hiller, he will get a legitimate chance. Competition is good thing. No need to move a goalie prior to that for him to have that chance. If one of them is moved before training camp it will be for $ purposes.

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07-01-2013, 12:51 AM
  #29
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I think one of them will get traded too, probably Hiller. Stephens mentioned it, LeBrun did, and Bob even mentioned they're getting calls about the goalies as well. Matter of time IMO.

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Old
07-01-2013, 12:51 AM
  #30
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One thing to note is that Philly still doesn't have a real starting goaltender. Murray could still work a Hiller trade out with them. Hiller for Read?

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07-01-2013, 12:53 AM
  #31
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After the FA frenzy teams tend to be a little more desperate. Today most trades have to do with the draft, ie, picks and whatnot. Murray might not want that, and/or teams weren't willing to give up a pick that was truly worthy of a starting goalie.

The Schneider trade today was a definite rarity.

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Old
07-01-2013, 01:00 AM
  #32
Paul4587
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Originally Posted by AngelDuck View Post
One thing to note is that Philly still doesn't have a real starting goaltender. Murray could still work a Hiller trade out with them. Hiller for Read?
Read would help us a lot up front. He's versatile, is a great PKer and should hit 20 goals. He's not as good as Flyer fans make him out to be but he's definitely capable of playing in the top 6.

Not sure what the Flyers are up to regarding goaltending though. Whether or not they want to give up Read to get a starter I don't know.

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Old
07-01-2013, 01:01 AM
  #33
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Then it's for you to feel like he has a chance.

His chance to make the team won't be any more legitimate just because we trade a goalie. And if he's as special as they say, he won't be blocked no matter who's in camp.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rollingdux View Post
If Gibson comes to camp and impresses/out performs Fasth or Hiller, he will get a legitimate chance. Competition is good thing. No need to move a goalie prior to that for him to have that chance. If one of them is moved before training camp it will be for $ purposes.
I guess I disagree. Training camp's such a short sample, and unless Gibson is by far the best of the bunch, it's just way too easy to go with the guys penciled in and send the 20-year old down. But if he's competing with another young rookie, even if the other guy is the favorite, he has a much more legitimate chance to stick. I just really can't see them trading one of Hiller or Fasth in September if Gibson merely outplays one of them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Static View Post
After the FA frenzy teams tend to be a little more desperate. Today most trades have to do with the draft, ie, picks and whatnot. Murray might not want that, and/or teams weren't willing to give up a pick that was truly worthy of a starting goalie.

The Schneider trade today was a definite rarity.
It was a rarity, in today's NHL at least, where a lot of teams have good-to-decent goaltending situations. However, if we're trading one or Hiller or Fasth, it was a great trade for us. Devils weren't really mentioned as a team really looking for a goalie(and they don't need to be yet, but good on them to nip that problem right in the bud), and they took one of the best guys available. And they got a great return doing it. If BM feels dealing one of the two is the best move, he should be in a pretty good position to do it.

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07-01-2013, 01:11 AM
  #34
rollingdux
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Originally Posted by Bobby Ryan Getzlaf View Post
I guess I disagree. Training camp's such a short sample, and unless Gibson is by far the best of the bunch, it's just way too easy to go with the guys penciled in and send the 20-year old down. But if he's competing with another young rookie, even if the other guy is the favorite, he has a much more legitimate chance to stick. I just really can't see them trading one of Hiller or Fasth in September if Gibson merely outplays one of them.
We both see the situation differently, but I just can't see how it could hurt Gibson to have some AHL experience 1st. This coaching staff isn't afraid to give young guys a chance so I think he'll get a fair shot.

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07-01-2013, 01:12 AM
  #35
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i'm on the boat of trading fasth rather than hiller if we have to trade one. unless 1's value is significantly higher/lower than the other

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Old
07-01-2013, 01:14 AM
  #36
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Gibson was a beast at camp last year, no reason why he's not going to be again. Not sure that's the best measuring stick for a goalie.

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Old
07-01-2013, 01:21 AM
  #37
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Originally Posted by rollingdux View Post
We both see the situation differently, but I just can't see how it could hurt Gibson to have some AHL experience 1st. This coaching staff isn't afraid to give young guys a chance so I think he'll get a fair shot.
It wouldn't, not one bit, but like I said, I don't see him getting a fair shot at cracking the big squad with two big money guys ahead of him, not at his age, and I'd like him to. Probably not even to make it, but just for the possibility. But, like I also said, that's just one of many factors. I think Andersen(or Gibson, obviously) should be the back-up either way and we clear cap space and acquire an asset by dealing one of Hiller or Fasth. I just think overall it makes a ton of sense.

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Old
07-01-2013, 01:24 AM
  #38
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Originally Posted by Bobby Ryan Getzlaf View Post
It wouldn't, not one bit, but like I said, I don't see him getting a fair shot at cracking the big squad with two big money guys ahead of him, not at his age, and I'd like him to. Probably not even to make it, but just for the possibility. But, like I also said, that's just one of many factors. I think Andersen(or Gibson, obviously) should be the back-up either way and we clear cap space and acquire an asset by dealing one of Hiller or Fasth. I just think overall it makes a ton of sense.
I'll agree with that. It makes sense to move one, but like every move there is some risk.

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Old
07-01-2013, 01:25 AM
  #39
heusy_79
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Ryan - $5.1MM
Hiller - $4.5MM
Souray - $3.66MM

There's over $13.2MM that I think can be re-distributed through this lineup in order to create better balance.

I'm thinking we should target Klein from Nashville now that they have Jones likely stepping into their top 4. He's got a cap-friendly deal and provides a very steady right-handed partner for Fowler.

Ryan+Souray for Klein+Forsberg+2nd


If a 2C doesn't present itself in free agency, would Hiller to the Isles for Nielsen be something you guys could get behind? He'd be a solid stop-gap 2C who could slide down into Koivu's role eventually. Underrated playmaker who kills penalties and has a great contract for what he brings. I think the Isles expect Ryan Strome and Brock Nelson to battle for the 2C spot in between Tavares and Cizikas.

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07-01-2013, 01:34 AM
  #40
rollingdux
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Originally Posted by heusy_79 View Post
Ryan - $5.1MM
Hiller - $4.5MM
Souray - $3.66MM

There's over $13.2MM that I think can be re-distributed through this lineup in order to create better balance.
add Allen's 3.5 in there as well.

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Old
07-01-2013, 01:36 AM
  #41
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add Allen's 3.5 in there as well.
You could move Allen instead of Souray, but I personally would prefer to keep Allen. I think he's a great fit on the third pairing with Vatanen and/or Lovejoy.

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Old
07-01-2013, 01:38 AM
  #42
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We need to keep one of Allen/Souray.

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Old
07-01-2013, 01:39 AM
  #43
rollingdux
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We need to keep one of Allen/Souray.
i think that will come down to what the Ducks staff values more.

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Old
07-01-2013, 01:43 AM
  #44
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If a 2C doesn't present itself in free agency, would Hiller to the Isles for Nielsen be something you guys could get behind? He'd be a solid stop-gap 2C who could slide down into Koivu's role eventually. Underrated playmaker who kills penalties and has a great contract for what he brings. I think the Isles expect Ryan Strome and Brock Nelson to battle for the 2C spot in between Tavares and Cizikas.
Isles aren't going to give up Nielson for one year of Hiller. Nielson is one of the best defensive forwards around and is capable of putting up 45+ points a year.

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Old
07-01-2013, 01:44 AM
  #45
Eddie Shack
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Allen is younger, but they both had their ups and downs last year. It could come down to who is more marketable. In that case I think it would be Allen, mainly due to age.

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Old
07-01-2013, 02:00 AM
  #46
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I would like allen or sourray gone
I would like fasth or hiller gone (whichever one has a better offer that fits a team need)

Ryan i dont mind keeping, but not if he can be dealt for a top 2 dman or 2c.

There was just zero movement today. I guess gms are still getting a feel for what they can acquire in the ufa market And are hesitant to take on any salary.

I think that your bottom 6ers and 2nd line players are going to get poopy contracts this year more than ever. Guys like penner. I am sure gms will take risks, but far less than previous years. If the cap had gone up a few mil, instead of down 6, you could envision a guy like oenner getting 3 or 4 mil. And i think gms know that the wallet crunch means that every couple mil they keep in capspace might land them a discounted guy like penner.

My number on penner might be off slightly... but really moving sourray might be tough.

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07-01-2013, 02:04 AM
  #47
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Souray needs to go. Period. Allen earned a second look with his playoff play.

Bobby's act is running thin.

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Old
07-01-2013, 02:35 AM
  #48
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Souray needs to go. Period. Allen earned a second look with his playoff play.

Bobby's act is running thin.
Souray was a top pairing defenseman for 3/4 of the year. Why exactly does he need to go?

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Old
07-01-2013, 02:44 AM
  #49
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Souray's minutes need to be carefully monitored, i would prefer he not play any b2b's

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07-01-2013, 03:05 AM
  #50
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Souray on the 2nd pairing playing against the other teams 2nd and 3rd line = effective player

Souray on the top pairing playing 23 minutes a night against the other teams top line = we are royally ****ed.

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