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Vinny Lecavalier (Reports: 5 years, $4.5 per season, NMC; jersey #40; upds post #1)

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Old
07-02-2013, 04:45 AM
  #51
Snotbubbles
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Originally Posted by healthyscratch View Post
Explain to me how playing a 20 year old at possibly third line center in the NHL is considered "giving up on his development"?
So you think signing Lecavalier to a 5 year deal then moving Schenn to wing, keeping Couturier on the 3rd line and burying Laughton in the AHL or moving him to a different position as well is a better plan then just letting Schenn, Couturier and Laughton get as many minutes in a ton of different situation at their natural positions?

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07-02-2013, 05:10 AM
  #52
BackWithaVengeance
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So, let's say the negotiations with Lecavaliers agent come to frution and his client is ready to sign just for

a) 3 years, $ 18M. ($ 6M. AAV)

or

b) 6 years, $ 25.5M. ($ 4.25M. AAV)

What would you do? Accept one of them or let him walk?

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07-02-2013, 05:23 AM
  #53
kimmofan44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BackWithaVengeance View Post
So, let's say the negotiations with Lecavaliers agent come to frution and his client is ready to sign just for

a) 3 years, $ 18M. ($ 6M. AAV)

or

b) 6 years, $ 25.5M. ($ 4.25M. AAV)

What would you do? Accept one of them or let him walk?
that's tough, I like the thought of not giving a player a payday until he's almost 40 but the then you can't really sign anyother player (I.e. Thomas) but on the other hand giving vinny a home for 6 years and allowing us more money over that time may make him too comfortable and stagnant... you've weaved quite the conundrum my friend.

ill go with the 3 yr only because I've come to HATE IT when players are handed their 6 or 7 year retirement package.

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07-02-2013, 05:39 AM
  #54
BackWithaVengeance
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Originally Posted by kimmofan44 View Post
that's tough, I like the thought of not giving a player a payday until he's almost 40 but the then you can't really sign anyother player (I.e. Thomas) but on the other hand giving vinny a home for 6 years and allowing us more money over that time may make him too comfortable and stagnant... you've weaved quite the conundrum my friend.

ill go with the 3 yr only because I've come to HATE IT when players are handed their 6 or 7 year retirement package.


I'm with you, would probably take the same deal.

Just got rid of 2 horrible contracts. No need for a new one.

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07-02-2013, 05:57 AM
  #55
mja
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BackWithaVengeance View Post
So, let's say the negotiations with Lecavaliers agent come to frution and his client is ready to sign just for

a) 3 years, $ 18M. ($ 6M. AAV)

or

b) 6 years, $ 25.5M. ($ 4.25M. AAV)

What would you do? Accept one of them or let him walk?
I wouldn't do either.

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Old
07-02-2013, 07:05 AM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BackWithaVengeance View Post
So, let's say the negotiations with Lecavaliers agent come to frution and his client is ready to sign just for

a) 3 years, $ 18M. ($ 6M. AAV)

or

b) 6 years, $ 25.5M. ($ 4.25M. AAV)

What would you do? Accept one of them or let him walk?
I don't like either of these two, really, but I think I would go with the six year deal if he were moved to wing. If not, I would probably pass. The three year deal is too high a cap hit and he would likely remain at center. The six year deal is too long if he isn't moving to wing.

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07-02-2013, 07:16 AM
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BackWithaVengeance View Post
So, let's say the negotiations with Lecavaliers agent come to frution and his client is ready to sign just for

a) 3 years, $ 18M. ($ 6M. AAV)

or

b) 6 years, $ 25.5M. ($ 4.25M. AAV)

What would you do? Accept one of them or let him walk?
I would be happy with 3 years...6 is tooooo long. But With my luck, it will be 6 years at 6 mil per.

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Old
07-02-2013, 07:36 AM
  #58
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Do not want Vinny. I'd rather we just let Schenn develop into our second line center for the next 8-10 years. Vinny also hasn't been the same since he was Matt Cooked a couple years ago.

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07-02-2013, 07:44 AM
  #59
healthyscratch
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Snotbubbles View Post
So you think signing Lecavalier to a 5 year deal then moving Schenn to wing, keeping Couturier on the 3rd line and burying Laughton in the AHL or moving him to a different position as well is a better plan then just letting Schenn, Couturier and Laughton get as many minutes in a ton of different situation at their natural positions?
You came up with a lot of stuff I said, that I didnt actually say. Whats the crime with playing a 20 year old center with a career 45% faceoff in the number 3 center, even at 4 for one more season? HE'S TWENTY YEARS OLD.

My plan, as stated before, would be to sign Vinny and trade Laughton. (OR leave a 19yo to develop in the minors some more) Leaving everyone at their natural positions. If necessary, move Brayden to wing, although i dont like doing that. Then in 2 seasons or whenever you start sliding Vinny down and moving other guys up. Wala!

Whats your rush with rushing these kids(Laughton and Coots)? And expecting the moon in return right now?

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07-02-2013, 07:51 AM
  #60
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This team doesn't need anymore centers. We are already looking at a situation in which we will have to move one of Schenn or Laughton to wing either this year or next. Or we will have to trade one of Schenn, Couts, or Laughton. My preference is to keep all three and move Schenn to wing full time this year. He needs more than a 2-3 game trial at wing and it should be at LW not RW. He also won't have to be on Briere's wing who was just awful the past two seasons and was keeping Schenn from becoming a better player IMO

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Old
07-02-2013, 08:02 AM
  #61
Snotbubbles
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Originally Posted by healthyscratch View Post
You came up with a lot of stuff I said, that I didnt actually say. Whats the crime with playing a 20 year old center with a career 45% faceoff in the number 3 center, even at 4 for one more season? HE'S TWENTY YEARS OLD.

My plan, as stated before, would be to sign Vinny and trade Laughton. (OR leave a 19yo to develop in the minors some more) Leaving everyone at their natural positions. If necessary, move Brayden to wing, although i dont like doing that. Then in 2 seasons or whenever you start sliding Vinny down and moving other guys up. Wala!

Whats your rush with rushing these kids(Laughton and Coots)? And expecting the moon in return right now?
You plan involves moving one player from his natural position and then taking valuable offensive zone and PP ice time from another and trading another just to have Lecavalier for a year or two and then be saddled with his cap hit for a couple more years. Oh and this move would guarentee that Read is gone at some point as well. So we get older, slower, have less cap flexibility and potentially stunt growth so we can have a guy that can win some faceoffs. Brilliant!

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Old
07-02-2013, 08:07 AM
  #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Snotbubbles View Post
You plan involves moving one player from his natural position and then taking valuable offensive zone and PP ice time from another and trading another just to have Lecavalier for a year or two and then be saddled with his cap hit for a couple more years. Oh and this move would guarentee that Read is gone at some point as well. So we get older, slower, have less cap flexibility and potentially stunt growth so we can have a guy that can win some faceoffs. Brilliant!
Ok well I don't want to hear you crying and demanding Couturier be traded next summer because our second line center didnt put up 20+ goals and can't win a faceoff.

(and if you read my post, I'd prefer NOT moving Schenn out of position)

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07-02-2013, 08:13 AM
  #63
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Originally Posted by RoDu View Post
5-6 years, and he's already in his 30's....ugh, don't do something stupid homer
"don't do something stupid Homer!"

With his recent history, and the outcome from the results of those moves, I don't think he can do anything that isn't stupid!

I have no faith in Paul Holmgren's decisions. If he were GM of any other team in the NHL, he would have been fired by now.

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Old
07-02-2013, 08:19 AM
  #64
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Originally Posted by healthyscratch View Post
Ok well I don't want to hear you crying and demanding Couturier be traded next summer because our second line center didnt put up 20+ goals and can't win a faceoff.

(and if you read my post, I'd prefer NOT moving Schenn out of position)
Just like I don't want to hear you crying about Lecavalier's contract in 5 years.

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07-02-2013, 08:35 AM
  #65
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Everyone lauds the Flyers ability to draft and develop forwards. They have gotten a lot of credit for Giroux becoming the dominant force he is, Voracek's step forward, Simmonds, Read, etc.

Knowing that... if the Flyers decide (which I actually doubt) to bring in Vinny LeCavelier as a 2C, doesn't that indicate that the people most in the know (Holmgren, Lavi, the assistant coaches) have deemed that Couturier simply is not ready to handle the 2C job at this stage? I would also indicate that they agree with the supposition that most have made that Schenn can appropriately be placed on a wing for at least the short term.

My feelings are that:
1. I am not so confident that Couturier is ready to be the 2C. He has the ability to be a elite 2C like Bergeron, but has more than a few things to work on to get there and I'm not about to put even more pressure on a rushed prospect.

2. I like Vinny, but have no interest in a bidding war for his services. That probably eliminates us already.

3. I'm also not confident that Schenn is ready to move to a wing. I hope he is as it balances our team more, but he clearly demonstrated last season that he plays better in the middle.

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07-02-2013, 08:36 AM
  #66
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I'm super ambivalent on this. It's entirely contingent upon years and cap hit.

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07-02-2013, 08:39 AM
  #67
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I think Vinny will just cost too much. Unless they can unload Coburn/Mesz. I don't see how you can allocate that much cap space to a forward when forward isn't really a concern.

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07-02-2013, 08:49 AM
  #68
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Originally Posted by Broad Street Elite View Post
3. I'm also not confident that Schenn is ready to move to a wing. I hope he is as it balances our team more, but he clearly demonstrated last season that he plays better in the middle.
It wasn't clear to me. Long term I think he's better off on the wing, or becoming a Patrick Sharp-type player who can play both positions.

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07-02-2013, 08:51 AM
  #69
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Originally Posted by JustJim View Post
"don't do something stupid Homer!"

With his recent history, and the outcome from the results of those moves, I don't think he can do anything that isn't stupid!
Bryzgalov was a disaster, but the Carter and Richards trades weren't stupid. They set the team up with quality, young forwards for years to come.


Last edited by Curufinwe: 07-02-2013 at 09:00 AM.
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07-02-2013, 08:54 AM
  #70
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I think Vinny will just cost too much. Unless they can unload Coburn/Mesz. I don't see how you can allocate that much cap space to a forward when forward isn't really a concern.
One of Coburn or Mez have to be traded if they want to make a spot avaialble for Gus. I would prefer to see Mez traded.

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07-02-2013, 08:59 AM
  #71
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Bryzgalov was a disaster, but the he Carter and Richards trades weren't stupid. They set the team up with quality, young forwards for years to come.
Don't bother with explaining the situations surrounding the recent trades. There is a large group of people that think the trades were terrible because Bobs won the Vezina, and Richards/Carter won a Cup. Context be damned! OMgZ!!!1 Holmgren stoopid!!!

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07-02-2013, 09:00 AM
  #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JustJim View Post
"don't do something stupid Homer!"

With his recent history, and the outcome from the results of those moves, I don't think he can do anything that isn't stupid!

I have no faith in Paul Holmgren's decisions. If he were GM of any other team in the NHL, he would have been fired by now.
The 'cons' list really isn't that long.

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07-02-2013, 09:05 AM
  #73
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It would be awesome if they can convince him to sign here for one season. Schenn can permanently move to wing...and our centers could line up as G-Vinny-Coots-Laughton. Hopefully by next season Coots can fill in as our second line center and laughton as our 3rd.

Doubt he would sign for one year though, unless Homer gives him like 8 mil.

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07-02-2013, 09:05 AM
  #74
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Originally Posted by Snotbubbles View Post
Just like I don't want to hear you crying about Lecavalier's contract in 5 years.
I would go 4 years/18m max. And no tears here.


Last edited by healthyscratch: 07-02-2013 at 09:13 AM.
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Old
07-02-2013, 09:08 AM
  #75
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Originally Posted by StevensCakeBakerBacker View Post
Don't bother with explaining the situations surrounding the recent trades. There is a large group of people that think the trades were terrible because Bobs won the Vezina, and Richards/Carter won a Cup. Context be damned! OMgZ!!!1 Holmgren stoopid!!!
Yep. It's simplistic thinking at it's finest.

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