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MIN trades Devin Setoguchi to WPG for a draft pick (2014 2nd)

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07-08-2013, 11:49 PM
  #226
loudi94
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He will play well for the Jets but at this time indications are he will be looking to explore his options at the end of the season. As UFA, he will be able to dictate where he goes provided the team he wants to play wants him. There is a strong connection to California. He has also become quite close to Heatley who will be a UFA next year.

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07-09-2013, 07:38 AM
  #227
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If he performs at a 20 goal clip for one year, a second rounder is completely worth it. We desperately need a second line that works. The fans have been on Chevy for 2 years about it, he responds, and many continue to criticize the move!

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07-09-2013, 09:12 AM
  #228
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drumzan View Post
Well aware next year's draft class ain't that great. Given how poorly the Jets played the West 2 years ago, I think this is going to be a long year for the Jets and will likely be a top 5 pick. Their 2nd round pick is almost like a late first rounder.

I'm not against the Seto trade just because of the draft pick. I just never thought he was that great of a player. He's a decent 3rd liner with scoring potential, but will be used as a 2nd liner with more minutes. That concerns me, especially with his inconsistent play.
We've done nothing but improve this off-season yet we're gonna have our highest draft pick yet?

What? The West doesn't really look that much tougher from my point of view and the only teams that look definitively better than us in our new division are St. Louis and Chicago.

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07-09-2013, 10:14 AM
  #229
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Originally Posted by EpicGingy View Post
We've done nothing but improve this off-season yet we're gonna have our highest draft pick yet?

What? The West doesn't really look that much tougher from my point of view and the only teams that look definitively better than us in our new division are St. Louis and Chicago.
Chicago and St. Louis are already significantly better than the Jets.

Dallas finished with 48 points - 3 behind the Jets total of 51 and they've added Gonchar, Horcoff, Seguin, Peverley and Nichuskin and said goodbye to Eriksson. I think they might be able to make up the 3 points on us.

Minnesota finished with 55 points (8th in the West), lost Cullen and PM Bouchard, traded Seto to us, but added Cooke and Keith Ballard.

Nashville finished with 41 points (10 less than the Jets). Added Seth Jones, Stalberg, Cullen, and Forsberg via that deadline trade. They're much improved - never mind if Rinne bounces back to his career average .920 SV%.

Colorado added MacKinnon...and Tanguay? Let's not worry too much about the Avs yet...

The Jets have lost Hainsey and Burmistrov (and Antro and Welly). They've added Setoguchi and Frolik. Everyone's praying that a turning-35 Joker-in-decline can rebound from a terrible year and that Pavelec can beat the odds and become an average goalie. I predict a 5th/6th finish in the division...

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07-09-2013, 10:23 AM
  #230
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Are Nichuskin, Jones, and Mackinnon ready for next season?

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07-09-2013, 10:29 AM
  #231
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Are Nichuskin, Jones, and Mackinnon ready for next season?
I think its pretty safe to assume Jones and MacKinnon will be in the NHL next year. Nichuskin? he is debatable

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07-09-2013, 11:15 AM
  #232
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Originally Posted by Gm0ney View Post
Chicago and St. Louis are already significantly better than the Jets.

Dallas finished with 48 points - 3 behind the Jets total of 51 and they've added Gonchar, Horcoff, Seguin, Peverley and Nichuskin and said goodbye to Eriksson. I think they might be able to make up the 3 points on us.

Minnesota finished with 55 points (8th in the West), lost Cullen and PM Bouchard, traded Seto to us, but added Cooke and Keith Ballard.

Nashville finished with 41 points (10 less than the Jets). Added Seth Jones, Stalberg, Cullen, and Forsberg via that deadline trade. They're much improved - never mind if Rinne bounces back to his career average .920 SV%.

Colorado added MacKinnon...and Tanguay? Let's not worry too much about the Avs yet...

The Jets have lost Hainsey and Burmistrov (and Antro and Welly). They've added Setoguchi and Frolik. Everyone's praying that a turning-35 Joker-in-decline can rebound from a terrible year and that Pavelec can beat the odds and become an average goalie. I predict a 5th/6th finish in the division...
I don't see this so called improvement from a bunch of teams:

Minnesota downgraded from Gilbert to Ballard and IMO downgraded from Seto to Cooke. They IMO are worse off unless a number of their rookies make an impact.

I also fail to see how Dallas improved. At this point in time Erikson is a better player than Seguin by a decent amount. Peverally is a solid addition but Horcoff has been absolutely terrible for the past number of years. Those additions dont make them any better of a team imo.

I find it interesting that you give Nashville a big boast due to the infusion of a couple of rookies but don't do the same for us. I rank Scheifele ahead of Forsberg and Trouba and Jones as relatively equal at this point in time. If anything its a net zero effect.

So I feel quite confident about our chances this year!

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07-09-2013, 11:58 AM
  #233
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It's also worth noting that Pavelec will be playing in a
More defensive division, and the conference in general is much less offensively gifted.

All of Dallas, Minny, Nash, and St. Louis have ha trouble consistently scoring. St. Louis and Nash is. Defense first system where as Minny and Dal lack scoring depth. Chicago has a much bigger emphasis on 2 way play then an offense first system.

The big Offensive juggernauts are presominantly are in the east and we'll only be playing them twice a year. Stands to reason Pavs may have a better Sv%

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07-09-2013, 12:42 PM
  #234
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Originally Posted by Gm0ney View Post
Chicago and St. Louis are already significantly better than the Jets.

Dallas finished with 48 points - 3 behind the Jets total of 51 and they've added Gonchar, Horcoff, Seguin, Peverley and Nichuskin and said goodbye to Eriksson. I think they might be able to make up the 3 points on us.

Minnesota finished with 55 points (8th in the West), lost Cullen and PM Bouchard, traded Seto to us, but added Cooke and Keith Ballard.

Nashville finished with 41 points (10 less than the Jets). Added Seth Jones, Stalberg, Cullen, and Forsberg via that deadline trade. They're much improved - never mind if Rinne bounces back to his career average .920 SV%.

Colorado added MacKinnon...and Tanguay? Let's not worry too much about the Avs yet...

The Jets have lost Hainsey and Burmistrov (and Antro and Welly). They've added Setoguchi and Frolik. Everyone's praying that a turning-35 Joker-in-decline can rebound from a terrible year and that Pavelec can beat the odds and become an average goalie. I predict a 5th/6th finish in the division...
^^^Everything Gm0ney said

Until Winnipeg proves to us they're any better than 5th or 6th in the division, I'll believe it when I see it.

Again, the Jets were awful against Western teams two years ago. Now they have to play the West 50 out of 82 games. Outside of Detroit, Pittsburgh, Boston...I see the two West conferences as far superior to the East.

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07-09-2013, 01:24 PM
  #235
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Originally Posted by drumzan View Post
^^^Everything Gm0ney said

Until Winnipeg proves to us they're any better than 5th or 6th in the division, I'll believe it when I see it.

Again, the Jets were awful against Western teams two years ago. Now they have to play the West 50 out of 82 games. Outside of Detroit, Pittsburgh, Boston...I see the two West conferences as far superior to the East.
Meh... I don't think they were awful.
They **** the bed with a few Central games but had winning record other than that division.

CHI + STL far outchance any of their opponents. They will be trouble unless they have some unlucky %s.
NSH lives and dies by Rinne but is otherwise a far weaker team. Jones and Forsberg will be longterm problems for the Jets but not shortterm.
COL is pretty terrible overall and is one of the few teams in the league to be worse in outchancing AND goaltending than the Jets. McKinnon will be worse than Jones + Forsberg for us long and short term but even the greatest of rookies can only improve a team so much in their first season.
MIN has improved as much as they will for now.
DAL is a curious one... they were pretty terrible but have made some interesting moves.


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07-09-2013, 03:34 PM
  #236
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Yup. This is not the same team as two years ago. Sure it's not overly changed, but all the players from two years ago have improved since then (well..almost) and i'd say we've got some better pieces with the addition of frolik and seto (but a downgrade at d)

will be interesting, but we will not have a bottom 10 pick. If we, do, blow it up because this core is useless.

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07-09-2013, 03:50 PM
  #237
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Yup. This is not the same team as two years ago. Sure it's not overly changed, but all the players from two years ago have improved since then (well..almost) and i'd say we've got some better pieces with the addition of frolik and seto (but a downgrade at d)

will be interesting, but we will not have a bottom 10 pick. If we, do, blow it up because this core is useless.
If in 2010-2011 you would have told me the Jets would be back in Winnipeg, with the forward lines being Ladd-Little-Wheeler-Kane-Jokinen-Setoguchi, at the time, all potential 20+ goal scorers, with two 40-50-pt D-men in Enstrom and Byfuglien as the top defensive pairing, I would have been thrilled. Also, would not have believed you.

I'm optimistic Joker redeems his awful year. Oddly, I'm somewhat pessimistic of the Gooch...feel he's on the downside. Why I give Olli the benefit and Gooch not, I don't know. Might be Olli's recent interviews. If anything, he's a class guy who seems to want to get better, even if his body might say 'nope'.

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07-09-2013, 03:54 PM
  #238
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If in 2010-2011 you would have told me the Jets would be back in Winnipeg, with the forward lines being Ladd-Little-Wheeler-Kane-Jokinen-Setoguchi, at the time, all potential 20+ goal scorers, with two 40-50-pt D-men in Enstrom and Byfuglien as the top defensive pairing, I would have been thrilled. Also, would not have believed you.

I'm optimistic Joker redeems his awful year. Oddly, I'm somewhat pessimistic of the Gooch...feel he's on the downside. Why I give Olli the benefit and Gooch not, I don't know. Might be Olli's recent interviews. If anything, he's a class guy who seems to want to get better, even if his body might say 'nope'.
I'd be shocked to see Setoguchi have a bad season. Think about it - he's 26 now and one year away of UFA status. He NEEDS to have a good season because having a bad one will hurt his financial earnings big time for the next 3 to maybe 5 years. It all depends on what he shows this season and the numbers he'll put up.

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07-09-2013, 04:06 PM
  #239
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I'd be shocked to see Setoguchi have a bad season. Think about it - he's 26 now and one year away of UFA status. He NEEDS to have a good season because having a bad one will hurt his financial earnings big time for the next 3 to maybe 5 years. It all depends on what he shows this season and the numbers he'll put up.
That all makes sense, but I just don't want to get my hopes up after the huge Olli letdown from last season. We'll see. IMHO, less than 20 goals would be a disappointment to me. Not sure if that is the consensus around here.

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07-09-2013, 05:26 PM
  #240
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I don't see this so called improvement from a bunch of teams:

Minnesota downgraded from Gilbert to Ballard and IMO downgraded from Seto to Cooke. They IMO are worse off unless a number of their rookies make an impact.

I also fail to see how Dallas improved. At this point in time Erikson is a better player than Seguin by a decent amount. Peverally is a solid addition but Horcoff has been absolutely terrible for the past number of years. Those additions dont make them any better of a team imo.

I find it interesting that you give Nashville a big boast due to the infusion of a couple of rookies but don't do the same for us. I rank Scheifele ahead of Forsberg and Trouba and Jones as relatively equal at this point in time. If anything its a net zero effect.

So I feel quite confident about our chances this year!
Yes, I should include Scheifele and Trouba. I'm looking forward to them having an impact this year, although a lot of folks seem to think Scheifele will play in the AHL for at least part of the season and a few think Trouba's also destined for a stint in St. John's. But is Scheifele going to be more effective than Antro? Trouba more than Hainsey?

I may have been feeling a little pessimistic this morning, but even if I put on the rose coloured glasses, I think the Jets are still a bubble playoff team at best - they'll have to battle for that wildcard or 3rd spot in the division...we're sure not leaps and bounds ahead of anyone...except Colorado (now watch the Avalanche shock the world and tear it up this year).

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07-09-2013, 05:30 PM
  #241
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Yes, I should include Scheifele and Trouba. I'm looking forward to them having an impact this year, although a lot of folks seem to think Scheifele will play in the AHL for at least part of the season and a few think Trouba's also destined for a stint in St. John's. But is Scheifele going to be more effective than Antro? Trouba more than Hainsey?

I may have been feeling a little pessimistic this morning, but even if I put on the rose coloured glasses, I think the Jets are still a bubble playoff team at best - they'll have to battle for that wildcard or 3rd spot in the division...we're sure not leaps and bounds ahead of anyone...except Colorado (now watch the Avalanche shock the world and tear it up this year).
As it stands right now I don't disagree that it will be a battle for the last two spots, I just think we have a pretty good shot at nabbing one of them.

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07-09-2013, 05:32 PM
  #242
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That all makes sense, but I just don't want to get my hopes up after the huge Olli letdown from last season. We'll see. IMHO, less than 20 goals would be a disappointment to me. Not sure if that is the consensus around here.
I wouldn't be so worried about 1 players goal totals but more so the totals of the team.
Ladd, Wheeler and Kane can all hopefully push the 30 goal mark (we all want Kane to hit 40 but we'll see).
If Little can improve a bit (he had 24 in the last full season), and if Gooch can score 15 - 20 then that is a good start.
Some depth scoring from the D.
From there we'd need double digit goals from the 2nd line center and at least 10 from the likes of Frolik.
Imagine if Jokinen did score 20.
Last year he had 7 in 45 games, obviously a terrible year for him.
In a full season that translates to around 10 or so and I think he could easily score several more if he is just a bit better.

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07-09-2013, 05:43 PM
  #243
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I don't see this so called improvement from a bunch of teams:

Minnesota downgraded from Gilbert to Ballard and IMO downgraded from Seto to Cooke. They IMO are worse off unless a number of their rookies make an impact.

I also fail to see how Dallas improved. At this point in time Erikson is a better player than Seguin by a decent amount. Peverally is a solid addition but Horcoff has been absolutely terrible for the past number of years. Those additions dont make them any better of a team imo.

I find it interesting that you give Nashville a big boast due to the infusion of a couple of rookies but don't do the same for us. I rank Scheifele ahead of Forsberg and Trouba and Jones as relatively equal at this point in time. If anything its a net zero effect.

So I feel quite confident about our chances this year!
Agree with this in general.

Cooke for Setoguchi is a downgrade offensively, but overall I like what Minny did there. Not improvement or downgrade in my mind. More of a change in style.

Agreed about Dallas, although, with all those additions, I think the potential is definitely there for improvement, but it's yet to be seen and they lost the best player among their offseason moves.

Quote:
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^^^Everything Gm0ney said

Until Winnipeg proves to us they're any better than 5th or 6th in the division, I'll believe it when I see it.

Again, the Jets were awful against Western teams two years ago. Now they have to play the West 50 out of 82 games. Outside of Detroit, Pittsburgh, Boston...I see the two West conferences as far superior to the East.
So can someone explain to me the double standard here? We want the Jets to prove they belong but want to give Colorado(dead last finish), Nashville(picked 4th), and Dallas(who is basically on par with us) a pass???

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07-09-2013, 05:59 PM
  #244
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So can someone explain to me the double standard here? We want the Jets to prove they belong but want to give Colorado(dead last finish), Nashville(picked 4th), and Dallas(who is basically on par with us) a pass???
I don't understand it either, TBH. I'm perfectly happy predicting that the Jets will fight for one of the final playoff spots next year based on where the various teams finished, and what they've done to improve so far during the off-season.

I think it's going to be interesting moving from one of the better offensive divisions in the league, to one of the lower scoring divisions - for me, that's the one wild card.

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07-09-2013, 06:05 PM
  #245
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I don't understand it either, TBH. I'm perfectly happy predicting that the Jets will fight for one of the final playoff spots next year based on where the various teams finished, and what they've done to improve so far during the off-season.

I think it's going to be interesting moving from one of the better offensive divisions in the league, to one of the lower scoring divisions - for me, that's the one wild card.
That'll actually be very interesting.

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07-09-2013, 06:55 PM
  #246
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So can someone explain to me the double standard here? We want the Jets to prove they belong but want to give Colorado(dead last finish), Nashville(picked 4th), and Dallas(who is basically on par with us) a pass???
No kidding. This idea that our new division is filled with juggernauts is hilarious. The Jets will be fine.

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07-09-2013, 07:49 PM
  #247
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No kidding. This idea that our new division is filled with juggernauts is hilarious. The Jets will be fine.
Well, those teams didn't get to light up Pavelec 5 times a year before!

But then again, Pavs won't have to face Ovi and Stamkos much now either.

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07-09-2013, 07:56 PM
  #248
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No kidding. This idea that our new division is filled with juggernauts is hilarious. The Jets will be fine.
Every team in our division had pretty good upgrades
The one that didnt are the defending champs
Not inconceivable too see the season being a tough one.

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07-09-2013, 07:58 PM
  #249
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Every team in our division had pretty good upgrades
The one that didnt are the defending champs
Not inconceivable too see the season being a tough one.
Bring it on! Gotta beat the best to be the best.




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07-09-2013, 07:58 PM
  #250
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To keep the balance sheets a bit cleaner I think it's important to remember Dallas Dumped Roy, Jarg, and Morrow at the trade deadline and those were pieces that helped them achieve their results last season.

Although they did pick up Jim Nill and I think that was a heck of a long term hire and he wil be a formidable Competitor all be in in the form of an executive.

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