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Softest team in the NHL

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Old
07-08-2013, 09:26 AM
  #301
HatTrick Swayze
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Inferno View Post
What response are you expecting? First and foremost you named basically 1 player. Lucic. The biggest, toughest, meanest power forward in the NHL.

Gee, yeah, sure, who WOULDNT want a team filled with guys that can go toe to toe with him.

Lucic played against the Hawks, it didnt matter, they won.

The Rangers essentially lost 3 games against the Bruins by 1 goal. The final game had an empty netter. We only lost 1 game by more than a goal.

Having a healthy team woulda helped.
I'm expecting, something, anything that will make him think twice next shift or next game. You can set the tone in the regular season too. Didn't see Lucic taking out Hawks left and right. To be fair, part of that was the increased stakes and the fact that the Hawks were playing in their o-zone alot. Noone is saying that doesn't matter or shouldn't be a priorty. You need goals to win.

But if you don't have the top-skill of the Hawks, it's gonna be tough to keep teams on their heels for large stretches. I don't care what your strategy is. You still need players who can execute it. And if you can't consistently dominate the puck in your offensive zone you need other ways to counteract the physicality, especially on the breakout and in battles along the walls to maintain possession.

Being healthy would have helped. Having a healthy defense that wasn't constantly being rammed into the back glass would have helped with that, no?

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07-08-2013, 09:27 AM
  #302
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Originally Posted by NYR Viper View Post
Callahan originally inured his shoulder fighting.

Ovechkin was charging McDonagh all series. No response.

Nash gets crushed from behind by Lucic. No response.

That type of stuff happened all season.
Cally injury was mostly a fluke he got caught and fell weird. Its not like Talbot is some big enforcer that Cally cant handle.

And Im not sure what the point is with Lucic, how many players that can play can fight him anyway? Not to mention its doubtful he would even be willing in the postseason to drop the gloves when his team is already winning.

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07-08-2013, 09:36 AM
  #303
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Originally Posted by Orr Nightmare View Post
The irony is that the Hawks still carried a goon on their team and carried Mayers and Carcillo, they are not even remotely close to the reason they won but I call that a team that is prepared for any type of game you want to play.

They dumped Bolland and Stalberg but kept Bickell...I wonder why...

Ignila signs with Bruins "Theyre a team that year in year out is extremely competitive. They are very hard to play against. They play a physical, aggressive style".

The Rangers will have to "out skill" every team they play this year without having the better skill...sounds like a disaster to me.
Let's not forget Bollig, and Brookbank.

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07-08-2013, 09:38 AM
  #304
Kel Varnsen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Inferno View Post
I'm sorry but who are these big tough teams that everyone is so scared of?

what team really killed us thanks to their physicality?

Boston? We've owned Boston for years, they came in RED HOT, and we came in hurt. Is it a surprise we lost to them? Not really. We lost Staal, Clowe, and Stralman in that series. Cally and Hagelin were playing with 1 arm each. We all know that Nash was hurt.

They had their issues too, but not like we did.

You could argue that their physicality hurt Stralman, but injuries happen.

A big part of the reason why they beat us is in fact Torts. I'm a huge Torts fan, don't ge tme wrong, but I said it from the moment we played them, our style does not suit playing against teams like the Bruins who want to use their D as the focal point of their attack.

EVERYTHING goes through their D. Their forwards do a great job of getting the puck back up top to reset when in danger. we NEVER pressure the points. Recipe for disaster.

But, who are the big scary teams we need to worry about? The Flyers? Havent we won like 25,000 straight games against them?

Maybe the Leafs? They didnt beat us with their physical forwards, when they won, it was thanks to Phil, soft as toilet paper, Kessel.

There is no Legion of Doom line out there.

Ovechkins maybe the only power hitting forward left outside of Lucic. Everyone else has skill. And we shut down AO w/o a problem.

The "softest" team in the NHL is basically bringing back the same exact team as what finished last year. The team that rampaged through the final month, that won 4 of 5 VS Washington, that came a helluva lot closer to beating the Bruins than a healthy Pittsburgh team did.

This team is not soft by any means.

Threads like this drive me crazy. No objectivity, no foresight. Just repeating crap your parents said when they were younger.. we gotta get tougher, meaner, blah blah blah.

Wayne Gretzky was as soft as they came, yet hes the greatest player to ever play, and we all know it.
It's not about other teams being tougher, it's about other teams being more skilled and then those that perhaps aren't being tougher.

Again, the goal is supposed to be the cup. How do we beat the Hawks? We don't with this sort of lineup. This roster is all finesse but not very good finesse.

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07-08-2013, 09:40 AM
  #305
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Originally Posted by Kel Varnsen View Post
It's not about other teams being tougher, it's about other teams being more skilled and then those that perhaps aren't being tougher.

Again, the goal is supposed to be the cup. How do we beat the Hawks? We don't with this sort of lineup. This roster is all finesse but not very good finesse.
Well if the bruins are the ideal tough team, and they couldnt beat the hawks either, the rangers might as well give up and stay home. No?

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07-08-2013, 09:40 AM
  #306
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Inferno View Post
did they have to "out skill" every team last year after the trade deadline?

They finished 9-3-1 to end the season. They beat Washington. Lost 3 games by essentially 1 goal against the eventual ECC.

All without their #1 defenseman, their captain playing hurt, and Hagelin playing hurt....not to mention the big piece they got at the deadline being hurt, etc etc etc


This team is plenty tough.
They played the bottom of the East through the end of the season. I'm sure we'll beat up on those crap teams again this year, but who cares if that doesn't lead to post season success. This team is not more skilled than any of the good teams, and any borderline cases or teams we are slightly more skilled than are significantly more physical.

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07-08-2013, 09:45 AM
  #307
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Originally Posted by slipknottin View Post
Well if the bruins are the ideal tough team, and they couldnt beat the hawks either, the rangers might as well give up and stay home. No?
The bruins might have been the "ideal" tough team out of last years teams, but by no means does that make them the perfect tough team. We never make the Nash deal, keep the torts kind of guys, and keep torts and we're a better tough team then them. It's a shame Gabby lost his arm in those playoffs.

And here's the thing anyway, that high end skill we lack is only really available by drafting extremely high for an extended amount of time. We can't and won't be doing that with Hank in net. We should have continued to build team toughness and team chemistry that we were showing we had in our 1 seed east finish year.

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07-08-2013, 09:46 AM
  #308
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Originally Posted by Kel Varnsen View Post
The bruins might have been the "ideal" tough team out of last years teams, but by no means does that make them the perfect tough team. We never make the Nash deal, keep the torts kind of guys, and keep torts and we're a better tough team then them. It's a shame Gabby lost his arm in those playoffs.

And here's the thing anyway, that high end skill we lack is only really available by drafting extremely high for an extended amount of time. We can't and won't be doing that with Hank in net. We could have continued to build team toughness and team chemistry that we were showing we had in our 1 seed east finish year.
So Dubi + Ani = better than the Bruins?

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07-08-2013, 09:51 AM
  #309
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Originally Posted by slipknottin View Post
So Dubi + Ani = better than the Bruins?
We lost more than that when we traded Nash. It forced out other guys as well. And the thing is that those guys came together to make something more than the sum of their parts. I hope you watched those games because it was the most fun thing to watch as a rangers fan in a long, long time. The team played as a team. We would hold onto leads, but more impressively we always seemed to come back to win games. We'd go down and I wouldn't even worry, I'd think of course this team can come back and we often did.

So don't try to go player by player because that's missing the forest in the trees. These trees came together to make a ****ing incredible forest, even though each individual tree you might not have been impresses by all alone. But they didn't exist all alone, they existed only together.

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07-08-2013, 09:53 AM
  #310
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slipknottin View Post
So Dubi + Ani = better than the Bruins?
You keep cherry-picking terrible arguments but have yet to post anything of substance to defend your position if you feel so strongly that it is not an issue.

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07-08-2013, 09:55 AM
  #311
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Inferno View Post
You don't have to outskill every team. You can out mistake them, you can out defend them, etc.

We've got some talent on this team.

Are we a top 8 team in the East?

YES

We should be. Especially if we get anything out of Brad Richards. We have an elite defense.

Also, regarding our injuries, im not sure how Cally and Hagelin got injured, but i know the toughest people in the world have Concussions, and no manner of toughness is stopping a puck from hitting you in the eye...Shields help.

People act as if this team is incapable of winning. We made it to the playoffs on an uptick. We beat the hottest team in the NHL at that point in Washington.

Then, we got beat by the Bruins, a team that was healthier in terms of significant injuries, a team that was definitely hotter at that point, and, lets face it, a team that was better and more vetted. That team had won a cup together. They know what it takes to win, and even after their games they talked about how theyve never played as well as they did against us, not even in their cup winning series.

Sometimes, teams get red hot.
Didn't Boston come in missing 3 dmen for games 1 and 2?..I don't really count Redden, so, they were missing Ference and Seidenberg

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07-08-2013, 09:59 AM
  #312
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Originally Posted by HatTrick Swayze View Post
You keep cherry-picking terrible arguments but have yet to post anything of substance to defend your position if you feel so strongly that it is not an issue.
Im still waiting for someone to prove that it is an issue.

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07-08-2013, 10:00 AM
  #313
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Originally Posted by Kel Varnsen View Post
We lost more than that when we traded Nash. It forced out other guys as well. And the thing is that those guys came together to make something more than the sum of their parts. I hope you watched those games because it was the most fun thing to watch as a rangers fan in a long, long time. The team played as a team. We would hold onto leads, but more impressively we always seemed to come back to win games. We'd go down and I wouldn't even worry, I'd think of course this team can come back and we often did.

So don't try to go player by player because that's missing the forest in the trees. These trees came together to make a ****ing incredible forest, even though each individual tree you might not have been impresses by all alone. But they didn't exist all alone, they existed only together.
As much as i loved that team, with richards going to crap, and gaborik not scoring, that team would have struggled a ton last year. probably missing the playoffs completely.

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07-08-2013, 10:00 AM
  #314
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Inferno View Post
did they have to "out skill" every team last year after the trade deadline?

They finished 9-3-1 to end the season. They beat Washington. Lost 3 games by essentially 1 goal against the eventual ECC.

All without their #1 defenseman, their captain playing hurt, and Hagelin playing hurt....not to mention the big piece they got at the deadline being hurt, etc etc etc


This team is plenty tough.
ok, if you say so. That heat in Atlanta might be getting to you.

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07-08-2013, 10:00 AM
  #315
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Originally Posted by Inferno View Post
I'm sorry but who are these big tough teams that everyone is so scared of?

what team really killed us thanks to their physicality?

Boston? We've owned Boston for years, they came in RED HOT, and we came in hurt. Is it a surprise we lost to them? Not really. We lost Staal, Clowe, and Stralman in that series. Cally and Hagelin were playing with 1 arm each. We all know that Nash was hurt.

They had their issues too, but not like we did.

You could argue that their physicality hurt Stralman, but injuries happen.

A big part of the reason why they beat us is in fact Torts. I'm a huge Torts fan, don't ge tme wrong, but I said it from the moment we played them, our style does not suit playing against teams like the Bruins who want to use their D as the focal point of their attack.

EVERYTHING goes through their D. Their forwards do a great job of getting the puck back up top to reset when in danger. we NEVER pressure the points. Recipe for disaster.

But, who are the big scary teams we need to worry about? The Flyers? Havent we won like 25,000 straight games against them?

Maybe the Leafs? They didnt beat us with their physical forwards, when they won, it was thanks to Phil, soft as toilet paper, Kessel.

There is no Legion of Doom line out there.

Ovechkins maybe the only power hitting forward left outside of Lucic. Everyone else has skill. And we shut down AO w/o a problem.

The "softest" team in the NHL is basically bringing back the same exact team as what finished last year. The team that rampaged through the final month, that won 4 of 5 VS Washington, that came a helluva lot closer to beating the Bruins than a healthy Pittsburgh team did.

This team is not soft by any means.

Threads like this drive me crazy. No objectivity, no foresight. Just repeating crap your parents said when they were younger.. we gotta get tougher, meaner, blah blah blah.

Wayne Gretzky was as soft as they came, yet hes the greatest player to ever play, and we all know it.
Agree.

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07-08-2013, 10:03 AM
  #316
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Originally Posted by slipknottin View Post
Im still waiting for someone to prove that it is an issue.
Again, deflection.

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07-08-2013, 10:07 AM
  #317
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The Rangers definitely aren't the softest team, but once again, similar to this past season, I am not sure what the identity of this team is supposed to be.

There's not really a lot of toughness up and down the lineup, nor is there a lot of skill. If they are scaring any opponents, it will be due to Lundqvist in net - the team isn't physically intimidating and they don't have enough firepower up front to strike fear in opposing defensemen or goaltenders.

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07-08-2013, 10:08 AM
  #318
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Originally Posted by HatTrick Swayze View Post
Again, deflection.
http://www.nizkor.org/features/falla...-of-proof.html

Did I start this thread? No.

I dont have to prove my point, the thread originator has to prove his. And so far he, and the people who agree with him, havent.

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07-08-2013, 10:09 AM
  #319
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Agree.
The Great one had a body guard...Dave Semenko

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07-08-2013, 10:10 AM
  #320
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The role of the enforcer is dead, boys. And good riddance.

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07-08-2013, 10:14 AM
  #321
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Originally Posted by slipknottin View Post
http://www.nizkor.org/features/falla...-of-proof.html

Did I start this thread? No.

I dont have to prove my point, the thread originator has to prove his. And so far he, and the people who agree with him, havent.
You are arguing your point over and over and yet you don't have to defend it? That makes no sense.

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07-08-2013, 10:14 AM
  #322
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slipknottin View Post
http://www.nizkor.org/features/falla...-of-proof.html

Did I start this thread? No.

I dont have to prove my point, the thread originator has to prove his. And so far he, and the people who agree with him, havent.
Well when your only contributions are pointless and belittling replies like these, it would generally be best to provide a legitimate counter argument. Or then what is the point of provoking?

At the end of the day I'm sure it will be proven on the ice this year either way. Hopefully they are able to use the "system changes" whatever they may be to win more hockey games. I have a tough time envisioning a contender though as the Rangers are constructed right now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by slipknottin View Post
Well if the bruins are the ideal tough team, and they couldnt beat the hawks either, the rangers might as well give up and stay home. No?
Quote:
Originally Posted by slipknottin View Post
So Dubi + Ani = better than the Bruins?

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07-08-2013, 10:16 AM
  #323
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Originally Posted by Callagraves View Post
The role of the enforcer is dead, boys. And good riddance.
I don't see many, if any, people calling for an enforcer.

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07-08-2013, 10:23 AM
  #324
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Callagraves View Post
The role of the enforcer is dead, boys. And good riddance.
Yep and so move on and stop using this line every time people point out that you and others don't see the value of tough hockey players If Lucic was a Rangers his ugly mug would be on billboards city wide as a hero

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07-08-2013, 10:38 AM
  #325
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Originally Posted by Thugice View Post
How quickly everyone forgets mcdonagh being run right and left during the playoffs. To not acknowledge this as a major issue to be addressed would be a mistake on the rangers part. They knew they had to get clowe but he got hurt and that aspect of our game disappeared with his playing time. Now he plays for the devils and will be very effective against us, bank on it.

We can bury our heads in the sand and have ridiculous conversations on the definition of toughness or we can get a player in here to compliment dorsett. When someone runs one of ours he needs to answer for it or they will all do it. Our players weren't just hurt from shotblocking and while all teams deal with injuries we seem to be receive way more than we give.
exactly, the same folks who will moan and whine when the team doesn't respond to a cheap shot are the same people who berate people who call the team soft.

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