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The problem with David Clarkson’s new contract

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07-09-2013, 11:57 AM
  #76
Stephen
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I wonder if James Mirtle will be interviewing Clarkson any time soon? Must be awkward if you write articles that sound like hfboards posts.

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07-09-2013, 12:01 PM
  #77
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Am I also the only one who sees how important it is to have the highest profile, GTA born UFA actually make the decision to come home and live out his childhood dream? As recently as last summer, you had a guy like Rick Nash, who grew up cheering for the Leafs, decide that it wasn't in his best interests to seriously consider coming here. Well, now that the Leafs are quasi successful on the ice, they better capture that momentum and make this a potential go-to destination for all the future star free agents and malcontents to come home.
I was glad to see an end to the snubs as anyone.

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07-09-2013, 12:02 PM
  #78
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Hahaha..absolutely...Roberts is even being considered for the HHOF..David Clarkson has never reached 50 points. I am in agreement that this contract sucks although the player is a good addition to the team.
I don't mind Clarkson on our 3rd line at a reasonable cost. he does add some things we need. however now we're in a situation where Clarkson at 29 now has to put up career highs for the next 4-5 years to make this deal worthwhile.

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Thats the problem with going after UFA's...you rarely get the value that you pay..which is why you have to draft draft draft...

See people..its all one big circle...the circle of life LOL.....When dumb managers tell you "our draft day is July 1st"...you know that means you will never win a damn thing in this salary capped league. Never.
well we've used our picks lately at least. can't really complain too much about Gauthier at 21...I would have preferred a more skilled player but he's certainly a good enough prospect. better than the Biggs pick IMO.

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07-09-2013, 12:05 PM
  #79
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Every decision in life has consequences both good and bad.

At the end of the day you have to weigh those against each other and hope that the advantages outweigh the disadvantages.

Clarkson's contract is a perfect example that comes with potential reward and expected pitfalls as well, before he has even stepped on the ice in his leaf jersey.

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07-09-2013, 12:06 PM
  #80
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Would you rather give away three 1st round picks (one partially developed and some say a future Alfredsson) for a player or possibly overpay for Clarkson? I like our gamble, he's exactly what we need.

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07-09-2013, 12:07 PM
  #81
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Elite players very rarely make it to UFA. When people say top-tier UFAs won't sign in Toronto, there's a context to that (namely some of the bullets we dodged way back when on guys like Bobby Holik and Bill Geurin). Best way to acquire talent is to draft it, and trade for it, and then have the type of organization where people want to stay. UFA period is one best avoided.

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07-09-2013, 12:10 PM
  #82
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Let me just add. David Clarkson is a good hockey player. He's going to score goals, and play a physical game. People will rightly cheer his play. My concern with him isn't that he'll be some sort of anchor, but that in the larger context of the offseason moves (re-signing Bozak, dropping Grabovski, trading assets for Bernier that I think could have been better put elsewhere) that I don't see us that much further ahead from where we were at the end of the season, and we've attached ourselves to a long-term contract on a 2nd liner to boot. My issue with the deal is more an overall philosophical approach to team building than to disliking Clarkson himself as a hockey player.

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07-09-2013, 12:13 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by Transplanted Caper View Post
Elite players very rarely make it to UFA. When people say top-tier UFAs won't sign in Toronto, there's a context to that (namely some of the bullets we dodged way back when on guys like Bobby Holik and Bill Geurin). Best way to acquire talent is to draft it, and trade for it, and then have the type of organization where people want to stay. UFA period is one best avoided.
You understand not a single GM in the leagues history has ever agreed with that right.

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07-09-2013, 12:14 PM
  #84
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For the record I am a huge Clarkson fan and love the signing.

Clarkson is exactly the type of player we've needed for years. A guy who crashes the net and puts the fear of god into the goalie and other team... I love it.

I also normally like Mirtle, and the article has some merit, but the comparison to Wendel at the end was just silly. As I'm sure all of you know, Wendel had debilitating back issues and he missed long chunks of seasons dur to this even when he was a young man. The comparison is ridiculous

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07-09-2013, 12:16 PM
  #85
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You understand not a single GM in the leagues history has ever agreed with that right.
Very few teams acquire their core Cup pieces through UFA.

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07-09-2013, 12:16 PM
  #86
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Originally Posted by Transplanted Caper View Post
Let me just add. David Clarkson is a good hockey player. He's going to score goals, and play a physical game. People will rightly cheer his play. My concern with him isn't that he'll be some sort of anchor, but that in the larger context of the offseason moves (re-signing Bozak, dropping Grabovski, trading assets for Bernier that I think could have been better put elsewhere) that I don't see us that much further ahead from where we were at the end of the season, and we've attached ourselves to a long-term contract on a 2nd liner to boot. My issue with the deal is more an overall philosophical approach to team building than to disliking Clarkson himself as a hockey player.
He is a second liner at second liner money. The term is why he signed here though and it gives him a chance to retire at home,close to family. He did turn down better money at the same length elsewhere.


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07-09-2013, 12:17 PM
  #87
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Unfortunately Clarkson's stats alone will likely never be able to match his salary. But it's the intangibles that he brings to the team which may make him worth every cent.

Here's hoping the Cap goes up to 75 - 80 million in 3 - 5 years from now. Then all of a sudden a 5 million cap hit feels more like 3 million in today's dollars.

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07-09-2013, 12:17 PM
  #88
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Originally Posted by Transplanted Caper View Post
Very few teams acquire their core Cup pieces through UFA.
Agreed 100%

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07-09-2013, 12:19 PM
  #89
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I personally hope that Clarkson's much needed grit and toughness affords the Leafs the opportunity to dress either\or Orr or McLaren and not both in a game due to lack of team toughness.

If Toronto can dress a better skater in replace of one of the Leafs enforcers its not only Clarkson's impact alone but the skill upgrade on the ice from that other player that comes into play big picture.

Case in point if Leafs can dress Colborne\D'Amigo etc + Clarkson (& only one of ) Orr\McLaren the talent level on the ice goes up and the toughness is not entirely lost.

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07-09-2013, 12:20 PM
  #90
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Originally Posted by Transplanted Caper View Post
Very few teams acquire their core Cup pieces through UFA.
Agreed...but I would argue the core is Kessel, Lupul, Gardiner, Rielly, Kadri, Phaneuf and one of the keepers. None of which were brought in as UFA's.

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07-09-2013, 12:22 PM
  #91
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Originally Posted by Mess View Post
I personally hope that Clarkson's much needed grit and toughness affords the Leafs the opportunity to dress either\or Orr or McLaren and not both in a game due to lack of team toughness.

If Toronto can dress a better skater in replace of one of the Leafs enforcers its not only Clarkson's impact alone but the skill upgrade on the ice from that other player that comes into play big picture.

Case in point if Leafs can dress Colborne\D'Amigo etc + Clarkson (& only one of ) Orr\McLaren the talent level on the ice goes up and the toughness is not entirely lost.
That's your hope but it's very doubtful to happen. Carlyle makes the lineups and he likes both Orr and McLaren in, as do I. They have a trickle effect on the lineup that goes beyond adding up their point totals. Remember what Nazem said about them last year, why does he love having them both in the lineup?

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07-09-2013, 12:24 PM
  #92
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Originally Posted by Mess View Post
I personally hope that Clarkson's much needed grit and toughness affords the Leafs the opportunity to dress either\or Orr or McLaren and not both in a game due to lack of team toughness.

If Toronto can dress a better skater in replace of one of the Leafs enforcers its not only Clarkson's impact alone but the skill upgrade on the ice from that other player that comes into play big picture.

Case in point if Leafs can dress Colborne\D'Amigo etc + Clarkson (& only one of ) Orr\McLaren the talent level on the ice goes up and the toughness is not entirely lost.
Agreed. While I liked the toughness they brought to the team, I was always holding my breath every time they were on the ice. That's why Fraser was such an important component to an otherwise relatively soft D core.

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07-09-2013, 12:28 PM
  #93
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Originally Posted by Leafsin2014 View Post
That's your hope but it's very doubtful to happen. Carlyle makes the lineups and he likes both Orr and McLaren in, as do I. They have a trickle effect on the lineup that goes beyond adding up their point totals. Remember what Nazem said about them last year, why does he love having them both in the lineup?
When Kadri has Clarkson riding shotgun on his wing and having his back on the ice, he won't even be concerned with who is dressing on the 4th line anymore. Clarkson will take care of business.

Leafs top 9 forwards in the past have been relatively small, soft and non physical.. To compensate and provide protection Orr and McLaren were required. Now Clarkson will do some of the heavy lifting allowing Carlyle to dress only one on need.

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07-09-2013, 12:28 PM
  #94
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Everyone complaining about this deal before he's given a chance to play a single game should go on over to the Columbus board and take a look at the Horton signing thread. They're thrilled to have that guy on their club, term and cap-hit be damned, and if either of these guys are a lock to deteriorate before their expected best-before date, it's Horton. We got an extremely tough goal-scorer, who fills an organizational need, with no recurring injury history to speak of. Is the term long? Sure, and I have some questions about whether or not he'll be able to maintain a consistent level of play throughout its duration, but what I'm going to do, instead of tear him and Nonis to shreds over it a mere 5 days after the signing (around here it feels like the first 3 years are already up...), is wait and see what he does on the ice before condemning anybody.

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07-09-2013, 12:35 PM
  #95
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Originally Posted by Mess View Post
When Kadri has Clarkson riding shotgun on his wing and having his back on the ice, he won't even be concerned with who is dressing on the 4th line anymore. Clarkson will take care of business.

Leafs top 9 forwards in the past have been relatively small, soft and non physical.. To compensate and provide protection Orr and McLaren were required. Now Clarkson will do some of the heavy lifting allowing Carlyle to dress only one on need.
Disagree, Orr and MacLaren were both signed for a reason, they will both play. Clarkson can not do the same heavy lifting those two can do. Orr is the ultimate enforcer and MacLaren is surprisingly a great skater and very intimidating, a great combo.

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07-09-2013, 12:36 PM
  #96
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Originally Posted by Mess View Post
When Kadri has Clarkson riding shotgun on his wing and having his back on the ice, he won't even be concerned with who is dressing on the 4th line anymore. Clarkson will take care of business.

Leafs top 9 forwards in the past have been relatively small, soft and non physical.. To compensate and provide protection Orr and McLaren were required. Now Clarkson will do some of the heavy lifting allowing Carlyle to dress only one on need.
Clarkson isn't a heavyweight and will need them guys too though. Some heavy-weight will give Clarkson a goin over one night and then Orr or McLaren will have to return the favour.

Christ even Montreal has Parros/Moen and Prust now lol. The end of the big nasty fighter is a long way off.

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07-09-2013, 12:40 PM
  #97
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Originally Posted by Volcanologist View Post
Gary Roberts retired with 400+ goals and over 900 points.

Clarkson isn't even close to that good. Not even remotely.
Ya I didn't say he was him

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07-09-2013, 12:41 PM
  #98
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Disagree, Orr and MacLaren were both signed for a reason, they will both play. Clarkson can not do the same heavy lifting those two can do. Orr is the ultimate enforcer and MacLaren is surprisingly a great skater and very intimidating, a great combo.
Clarkson is to Toronto, what Chris Neil is to Ottawa or Milan Lucic is to Boston.

When you can have skill and toughness in a single player playing among your top 6, you're no longer concerned with team toughness of your 4th line as a priority to compensate. Clarkson is the upgrade on talent from either\or Orr\McLaren which makes the team better overall.

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07-09-2013, 12:43 PM
  #99
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You understand not a single GM in the leagues history has ever agreed with that right.
Can't find the quote now, but I can think of one GM who said exactly that. "If you're building through free agency you have bigger problems" or something to that effect.

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07-09-2013, 12:43 PM
  #100
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Clarkson isn't a heavyweight and will need them guys too though. Some heavy-weight will give Clarkson a goin over one night and then Orr or McLaren will have to return the favour.

Christ even Montreal has Parros/Moen and Prust now lol. The end of the big nasty fighter is a long way off.
Exactly. Orr and MacLaren are not the same player. Orr knows exactly what an enforcer's job is, and he does it well. He watches the game, watches who is taking liberties, and he knows when to step in. MacLaren on the other hand is younger ( and maybe arguably a better fighter at this stage) but still has lots to learn. They're a great combo. Even a David Clarkson will play bigger knowing he has them to take care of business against the heavies he'd prefer not to engage.

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