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The 2014 Draft Prospect Thread: Breaking Blad - "They're Draft picks MacT, Jesus!"

View Poll Results: If the Oilers end up with the #1 overall pick, who would you select?
Sam Reinhart 16 4.92%
Aaron Ekblad 286 88.00%
William Nylander 6 1.85%
Leon Draisaitl 9 2.77%
Other (explain) 8 2.46%
Voters: 325. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
01-23-2014, 10:02 AM
  #901
JoeCool16
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I honestly think Ekblad comes 'kinda' NHL ready next season. The kind of player that wouldn't die in the NHL or look completely lost, but would probably benefit from seasoning in the AHL and another stint in junior, like most defensemen.

I don't think he's a long way off though. He thinks the game well and is as physically ready as anyone coming out of junior. Really hope we get him. With him, Nurse and Schultz, our defense would be set... it'd just become a matter of getting them the veteran support so they could all transition to their roles.

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01-23-2014, 10:13 AM
  #902
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Originally Posted by OilerFan4Life View Post
No guarantees in hockey dude. Especially not with d-men.

Your hate for the Nuge is mind boggling. RNH will be an elite C for years to come. Why do you dislike him so much??
I don't hate RNH but people really need to stop saying he's going to be elite. To me he's a first line guy but I don't think he'll ever be among the top 5 centers in the league especially with new guys like Mackinnon, and Mcdavid coming into the league. He may crack the top 10 in his prime but IMO he'll be in the same class of center as a guy like Spezza.

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01-23-2014, 10:19 AM
  #903
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We won't see RNH in his prime IMHO for another 3 years.

With respect to Bennett, he certainly is an intriguing prospect, but the NHL is bigger, stronger, and faster than juniors.

Even a guy like Yakupov had pretty great wheels for junior and just blew by people, but I don't see the same in-game speed from him in the NHL.

Bennett's going to get closed out much more quickly in the bigs than he does in junior. Not saying I wouldn't draft him, but I will say I wouldn't take him in the top 3.


In other news, Prince Albert is crashing and burning, and so is Draisaitl. Wonder if someone will trade for him. Gotta suck in your draft year to be on a team that is nosediving for the bottom.

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01-23-2014, 10:30 AM
  #904
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Originally Posted by raab View Post
I don't hate RNH but people really need to stop saying he's going to be elite. To me he's a first line guy but I don't think he'll ever be among the top 5 centers in the league especially with new guys like Mackinnon, and Mcdavid coming into the league. He may crack the top 10 in his prime but IMO he'll be in the same class of center as a guy like Spezza.
if he turns into spezza, that is awesome

i agree, he will never be a top-5 C in the league, but a top-10/15 guy is still pretty dam amazing... with one of the best (if not the best) LW in the game on one wing, and a more than competent scorer on the right wing (eberle or yakupov long term), our top-line is gonna be more than fine... its the other 3 lines that worry me so much, lol... but really, hall/RNH/eberle or yakupov could be a top-5 line in the entire league as early as next season... they are likely already a top-10 line

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01-23-2014, 10:42 AM
  #905
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Originally Posted by JoeCool16 View Post
I honestly think Ekblad comes 'kinda' NHL ready next season. The kind of player that wouldn't die in the NHL or look completely lost, but would probably benefit from seasoning in the AHL and another stint in junior, like most defensemen.

I don't think he's a long way off though. He thinks the game well and is as physically ready as anyone coming out of junior. Really hope we get him. With him, Nurse and Schultz, our defense would be set... it'd just become a matter of getting them the veteran support so they could all transition to their roles.
I really wonder if he would be like Seth Jones when he hits the league. The only thing with Jones is that he already had a top 4 D NHLer's skating ability. I haven't read a lot of how Ekblad's skating ability compares to Jones.

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01-23-2014, 10:50 AM
  #906
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Gonna get flamed for this but I'd take Bennett at #1 over Ekblad.

When is the last draft that the top D taken was better than the top forward? And don't give me Murray over Yakupov...

Nurse and Klefbom are coming....Marincin, Gernat, Musil all have pro upside. C is still the weakest overall positional group for this org.
I think you are making too big of a deal of past drafts. Ekblad really has nothing to do with Murray, Larsson, or any defenseman recently drafted in the first round. He's his own man and I think it takes watching him to come to the conclusion if you think there is something special there and if he is deserving of being drafted in the top 3.

I see an absolute workhouse who has the skills and size to make a difference in the nhl sooner than later. I need to see more of Bennett but I question how long his game will take to translate to the nhl, especially in the pacific division. We absolutely need to fix our depth at center but I don't think adding more youth and inexperience to the position does very much to fix that in the next 3-4 years.

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01-23-2014, 11:05 AM
  #907
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Originally Posted by jadeddog View Post
if he turns into spezza, that is awesome

i agree, he will never be a top-5 C in the league, but a top-10/15 guy is still pretty dam amazing... with one of the best (if not the best) LW in the game on one wing, and a more than competent scorer on the right wing (eberle or yakupov long term), our top-line is gonna be more than fine... its the other 3 lines that worry me so much, lol... but really, hall/RNH/eberle or yakupov could be a top-5 line in the entire league as early as next season... they are likely already a top-10 line
Exactly a top 10-15 center in the league is what I see him as to. I also see both Bennett and Reinhart being in the same league. So if we could get an established #1 dman for RNH I'd be all for it. Or if we could get a young solid top 4 dman and another young center with size and defensive acumen for RNH I'd make that trade to, provided our pick is either one of Reinhart or Bennett. Trades like RNH for Weber or RNH for Berglund, Shattenkirk, Jaskin. I think if you take one of Bennett or Reinhart and can get a return like those above for RNH it makes us a better team now and in the future.

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01-23-2014, 11:08 AM
  #908
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Plus Jones gets to step into an experienced and talented D corps in Nashville, which plays a great system and has a great coach.

I mean, Nurse basically looked like our best D-man by the end of training camp (which is exciting and sad), but I'm sure it would have been terrible if we kept him on the team.

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01-23-2014, 11:19 AM
  #909
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Assuming whoever we draft, Ekblad, Reinhart, Bennet, Dal Colle, comes in and just dominates TC and the Pre-season, and gets the 9 game look and performs amazingly, what should we do? I would hesitate sending them down if they truly are ready, but keeping them up here is such a risk in itself.

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01-23-2014, 11:53 AM
  #910
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Originally Posted by raab View Post
Exactly a top 10-15 center in the league is what I see him as to. I also see both Bennett and Reinhart being in the same league. So if we could get an established #1 dman for RNH I'd be all for it. Or if we could get a young solid top 4 dman and another young center with size and defensive acumen for RNH I'd make that trade to, provided our pick is either one of Reinhart or Bennett. Trades like RNH for Weber or RNH for Berglund, Shattenkirk, Jaskin. I think if you take one of Bennett or Reinhart and can get a return like those above for RNH it makes us a better team now and in the future.
i disagree with trading RNH and then drafting a replacement that you *hope* in 3 years becomes as good as RNH is RIGHT NOW... we already know that RNH will be a top-tier C in the league, there are no guarantees with reinhart

i just think of it as robbing paul to pay peter... you would gain a #1 Dman, but lose a #1 C... sure, you might gain the #1 C back in 3 years, but you might not... and even if you do, you still don't have that #1 C in the meantime

we have developed a #1 C, the first in 20 years, i think its absolute CRAZY TALK to move him now

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01-23-2014, 11:59 AM
  #911
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Plus Jones gets to step into an experienced and talented D corps in Nashville, which plays a great system and has a great coach.

I mean, Nurse basically looked like our best D-man by the end of training camp (which is exciting and sad), but I'm sure it would have been terrible if we kept him on the team.
this is probably 100% true.... my guess is that nurse would have been severely over-whelmed if he has stayed with the big club all year.... going back to junior this year was the best decision for him... and going back to junior *next year* is likely the best decision once more

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01-23-2014, 12:07 PM
  #912
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i disagree with trading RNH and then drafting a replacement that you *hope* in 3 years becomes as good as RNH is RIGHT NOW... we already know that RNH will be a top-tier C in the league, there are no guarantees with reinhart

i just think of it as robbing paul to pay peter... you would gain a #1 Dman, but lose a #1 C... sure, you might gain the #1 C back in 3 years, but you might not... and even if you do, you still don't have that #1 C in the meantime

we have developed a #1 C, the first in 20 years, i think its absolute CRAZY TALK to move him now
Thats why you sign a stop gap like Statsny if you say move RNH for Weber. I mean how would this look going into next season?

Hall-Statsny/UFA-Eberle
Perron-Bennett-Yakupov
Winnik/UFA-Gordon-Downie/UFA
Gazdic-Arcobello-Hendricks

Phillips/UFA-Weber
Ference-Schultz
Marincin-UFA
Fedun


Both Gagner and Petry can be traded for help, and I've filled the spots with guys I think we should target during UFA.

Can also make a line up with the Berglund deal as well.

Hall-Berglund-Eberle
Perron-Bennett-Yakupov
UFA-Gordon-Jaskin
Gazdic-Arcobello-Hendricks

Phillips/UFA-Shattenkirk
Ference-Schultz
Marincin-UFA

Both teams have us winning more next year and a few years down the road then keeping RNH would.

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01-23-2014, 12:18 PM
  #913
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I don't hate RNH but people really need to stop saying he's going to be elite. To me he's a first line guy but I don't think he'll ever be among the top 5 centers in the league especially with new guys like Mackinnon, and Mcdavid coming into the league. He may crack the top 10 in his prime but IMO he'll be in the same class of center as a guy like Spezza.
I love the idea that RNH wil never be elite (whatever that means) but a rookie (who is scoring at a lesser rate than Nuge did in his rookie campaign) and a kid who won't even be in the NHL for another three years are sure bets.

Also, Spezza put up multiple 70+ point seasons and is a career point per game player. If that's not elite, what is?

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01-23-2014, 12:26 PM
  #914
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Originally Posted by Moose Coleman View Post
I love the idea that RNH wil never be elite (whatever that means) but a rookie (who is scoring at a lesser rate than Nuge did in his rookie campaign) and a kid who won't even be in the NHL for another three years are sure bets.

Also, Spezza put up multiple 70+ point seasons and is a career point per game player. If that's not elite, what is?
The only Elite guys in the NHL right now are Crosby, Malkin, Stamkos, Thornton. When RNH scores 50 goals or puts up 100 points in a season without any help then I'll call him elite. I question what RNH's point production would be without Hall since every time they've been seperated RNH seems to go through a dry spell.

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01-23-2014, 12:35 PM
  #915
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Originally Posted by raab View Post
The only Elite guys in the NHL right now are Crosby, Malkin, Stamkos, Thornton. When RNH scores 50 goals or puts up 100 points in a season without any help then I'll call him elite. I question what RNH's point production would be without Hall since every time they've been seperated RNH seems to go through a dry spell.
Elite isn't all about Points. Add Datsyuk and Toews to that Elite list. Infact, after Crosby, Toews is the next center I build my team around

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01-23-2014, 12:35 PM
  #916
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Originally Posted by raab View Post
The only Elite guys in the NHL right now are Crosby, Malkin, Stamkos, Thornton. When RNH scores 50 goals or puts up 100 points in a season without any help then I'll call him elite. I question what RNH's point production would be without Hall since every time they've been seperated RNH seems to go through a dry spell.
I question your player evaluations completely when you covet someone like Shattenkirk to be the solution as the teams #1 d-man.

He'd be slaughtered here with first pairing minutes.. absolutely slaughtered.

Berglund? my god he's one of the few Blues players that actually knows where the doghouse is. He'd live there for us.

Jaskin won't displace any of our wingers anytime soon.

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01-23-2014, 12:37 PM
  #917
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Originally Posted by EpSoNiight View Post
Assuming whoever we draft, Ekblad, Reinhart, Bennet, Dal Colle, comes in and just dominates TC and the Pre-season, and gets the 9 game look and performs amazingly, what should we do? I would hesitate sending them down if they truly are ready, but keeping them up here is such a risk in itself.
If dominante means #1 C for Reinhart or #1 D from Ekblad, then it's a hard decision - I'd probably keep Reinhart but send Ekblad down, to be honest. It's not as if we're winning anything next year with that D-corps, and he's not going to learn anything other than how to lose if he stays here too long.

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01-23-2014, 12:40 PM
  #918
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Lol at trading RNH. People need to remember that players like the Sedins were only putting up like 30 points at this point in their careers. He's only 20 years old...

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01-23-2014, 12:42 PM
  #919
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The only Elite guys in the NHL right now are Crosby, Malkin, Stamkos, Thornton.
The question I'm asking is what makes them elite and others not? Where's Martin St. Louis in that conversation, for example? Pavel Datsyuk? Ovechkin?

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When RNH scores 50 goals or puts up 100 points in a season without any help then I'll call him elite.
Who on that list of players has done that? Every one of those guys has played with top level talent pretty much their whole careers.

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I question what RNH's point production would be without Hall since every time they've been seperated RNH seems to go through a dry spell.
This year RNH has been as productive without Hall (19 points) as he has been with him (18 points).

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01-23-2014, 01:04 PM
  #920
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The question I'm asking is what makes them elite and others not? Where's Martin St. Louis in that conversation, for example? Pavel Datsyuk? Ovechkin?

Who on that list of players has done that? Every one of those guys has played with top level talent pretty much their whole careers.



This year RNH has been as productive without Hall (19 points) as he has been with him (18 points).
Ovechkin and MSL are both wingers so I don't see how they pertain to RNH being an Elite center. Datsyuk could be considered elite as well as Toews. I was just going off the top of my head. And who did crosby play with in his first 2 seasons in Pittsburgh? Malkin ditto he played with a bunch of nobodies and led the team into the playoffs by himself when Crosby went down for over half the year, Thornton turned Cheechoo into a 50 goal scorer, Datsyuk and Toews are perhaps the best defensive centers in the world all while putting up PPG seasons. Also I would like to know where you got the info on the games he played with Hall and what games he didn't.

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01-23-2014, 01:15 PM
  #921
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Ovechkin and MSL are both wingers so I don't see how they pertain to RNH being an Elite center. Datsyuk could be considered elite as well as Toews. I was just going off the top of my head.
Ah you didn't specify centres.

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And who did crosby play with in his first 2 seasons in Pittsburgh?
Some plug named Lemieux in his first year and then he had Malkin around to make life easier for him.

Quote:
Malkin ditto he played with a bunch of nobodies and led the team into the playoffs by himself when Crosby went down for over half the year,
And I'm not arguing Malkin (or any of these guys for that matter) isn't elite.

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Thornton turned Cheechoo into a 50 goal scorer,
Thornton played with Marleau.

Quote:
Datsyuk and Toews are perhaps the best defensive centers in the world all while putting up PPG seasons
With Kane, Zetteberg and others. Point is, all these guys have played with a ton of other good players. By saying RNH only qualifies if he soemhow scores 50 goals and 100 points by himself (good lord) ignores that fact.

Quote:
Also I would like to know where you got the info on the games he played with Hall and what games he didn't.
stats.hockeyanalysis.com

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01-23-2014, 01:23 PM
  #922
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I think you are making too big of a deal of past drafts. Ekblad really has nothing to do with Murray, Larsson, or any defenseman recently drafted in the first round. He's his own man and I think it takes watching him to come to the conclusion if you think there is something special there and if he is deserving of being drafted in the top 3.

I see an absolute workhouse who has the skills and size to make a difference in the nhl sooner than later. I need to see more of Bennett but I question how long his game will take to translate to the nhl, especially in the pacific division. We absolutely need to fix our depth at center but I don't think adding more youth and inexperience to the position does very much to fix that in the next 3-4 years.
Excellent post. People always talk about how you can't take a dman first or you have to follow a certain path with developing players. You don't. Every player is unique, so you can't look at past players. You have to look at Ekblad without bias.

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01-23-2014, 01:32 PM
  #923
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Ah you didn't specify centres.



Some plug named Lemieux in his first year and then he had Malkin around to make life easier for him.



And I'm not arguing Malkin (or any of these guys for that matter) isn't elite.



Thornton played with Marleau.



With Kane, Zetteberg and others. Point is, all these guys have played with a ton of other good players. By saying RNH only qualifies if he soemhow scores 50 goals and 100 points by himself (good lord) ignores that fact.



stats.hockeyanalysis.com
Bringing up Lemieux playing in Crosby's first year is laughable the guy played 26 games, and Crosby still had 102 points as an 18 year old. Same with bringing up Marleau. Marleau's career high in points prior to Joe Thornton was 57 points, San Jose acquires Jumbo Joe and suddenly he's putting up 86 points. Coincidence I think not. If and its a big If RNH become the best defensive center in the world and puts up 80 points with Hall then he may be put in that elite category although I doubt that'll happen.

Also still don't understand how you calculated and knew what games the Perron-RNH-Eberle line was together vs the Hall-RNH-Eberle line.

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01-23-2014, 02:13 PM
  #924
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For some strange reason, Ekblad is reminding me a bit of Griffin Reinhart. Big body, doesn't always play as aggressively as scouts would like, big shot, pretty sound, mature game at both ends, could use work on foot speed/skating...

Is it far off to draw such a comparison?

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01-23-2014, 02:19 PM
  #925
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Bringing up Lemieux playing in Crosby's first year is laughable the guy played 26 games, and Crosby still had 102 points as an 18 year old. Same with bringing up Marleau. Marleau's career high in points prior to Joe Thornton was 57 points, San Jose acquires Jumbo Joe and suddenly he's putting up 86 points. Coincidence I think not.
Which is all just nitpicking. I made my point pretty clear, yet you skated right by that. C'est la vie.

Quote:
If and its a big If RNH become the best defensive center in the world and puts up 80 points with Hall then he may be put in that elite category although I doubt that'll happen.
I think we've established your criteria for what constitutes "elite" is more or less arbitrary.

Quote:
Also still don't understand how you calculated and knew what games the Perron-RNH-Eberle line was together vs the Hall-RNH-Eberle line.
n hindsight, I realize I actually didn't give an accurate picture as the numbers I was looking at were 5 on 5 only. Please disregard.

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