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Mark Arcobello vs Sam Gagner 2014/15 Season

View Poll Results: Better season
Sam Gagner more points, better +/- 66 50.77%
Sam Gagner more points, worse +/- 34 26.15%
Mark Arcobello more points, better +/- 24 18.46%
Mark Arcobello more points, worse +/- 6 4.62%
Voters: 130. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
09-08-2014, 03:53 PM
  #1
Spawn
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Mark Arcobello vs Sam Gagner 2014/15 Season

The debate has been going on all summer. Plenty of people think Arcobello provides as much offense as Gagner with a better all around game. Some think that Gagner, the 6 year NHL vet, just had an off season and will be the better player going forward.

So the question is simple. Assuming no significant injuries, who will put up more points this year?

It'll be interesting to revisit at the end of the year and see which player had a stronger season. So here's your chance to throw in your thoughts!

Edit: I tried to make end date as the first date of the season. Didn't work. So if a mod can fix that, that would be appreciated.


Last edited by Spawn: 09-08-2014 at 04:52 PM.
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Old
09-08-2014, 04:02 PM
  #2
am_man
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Phoenix has a good track record with bringing in players like Sam Gagner, which is why I think he'll have more points and a better +/- then Arcobello. With that said, on the Oilers, I think Id still rather see what Arco can do in his spot.

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Old
09-08-2014, 04:03 PM
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joestevens29
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Well I voted Arco more points worse +/-, but after thinking about it I think Gagner puts up more points.

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Old
09-08-2014, 04:11 PM
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McOkMcgoMcoil
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don't think Arco will really play in the NHL this year, so gags more points, +/- who knows.

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Old
09-08-2014, 04:15 PM
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ohheyhemsky
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Quote:
Originally Posted by okgooil View Post
don't think Arco will really play in the NHL this year, so gags more points, +/- who knows.
I'm of the group that is hoping for something, but is ultimately ready for a disappointment when it comes to Arco.

The fact that he played "slightly" better than Gagner isn't reassuring.

Plus, he's cursed.

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Old
09-08-2014, 04:27 PM
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Spawn
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My opinion on the matter:

Gagner will have a bounce back season playing on a team with an actual defensive system in place. I expect career highs for him (the mythical 50+ point season). He'll be closer to his lockout season in level of play than he will this past season.

I think Mark Arcobello will struggle in any top 6 role he may be given and will eventually wind up as a 3rd/4th tweener for the majority of the year. Wont break 35 points.

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09-08-2014, 04:36 PM
  #7
McDNicks17
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I don't expect too much from Arco, but I think he's better suited for the role.

He knew how to get the puck to the more skilled players on his line quickly and consistently.

Gagner's tendency to hold onto the puck for too long and throw a blind pass through the crease started to aggravate me more than his nonexistent defensive game.


I'm voting Gagner with more points and better +/- although that doesn't mean I think Gagner would have been a better option here.


p.s. Do you mean the 2014/15 season?

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Old
09-08-2014, 04:41 PM
  #8
McArthur
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I say Arcobello, only because I really think Edmonton is breaking out this year.

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Old
09-08-2014, 04:50 PM
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I think Arco, he has done nothing but exceed expectations at every level, kinda like how Eberle did. Im really starting to have a hard time thinking that doesnt continue.

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09-08-2014, 04:52 PM
  #10
Spawn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dnicks17 View Post
I don't expect too much from Arco, but I think he's better suited for the role.

He knew how to get the puck to the more skilled players on his line quickly and consistently.

Gagner's tendency to hold onto the puck for too long and throw a blind pass through the crease started to aggravate me more than his nonexistent defensive game.


I'm voting Gagner with more points and better +/- although that doesn't mean I think Gagner would have been a better option here.


p.s. Do you mean the 2014/15 season?
I did indeed. While you are noticing my errors, can you fix the end date for the poll? I can't remember if mods can. I know you can edit options, but not sure about close date.

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Old
09-08-2014, 04:54 PM
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joestevens29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spawn View Post
My opinion on the matter:

Gagner will have a bounce back season playing on a team with an actual defensive system in place. I expect career highs for him (the mythical 50+ point season). He'll be closer to his lockout season in level of play than he will this past season.

I think Mark Arcobello will struggle in any top 6 role he may be given and will eventually wind up as a 3rd/4th tweener for the majority of the year. Wont break 35 points.
The biggest issue I see for him is if he struggles he could very well get benched in ARI. The other key for me is how many games can the kid play? Even if he does play 82 can he be one of the few that puts up 50 points in ARI?

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Old
09-08-2014, 04:55 PM
  #12
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Gagner will be playing on a competently coached team known for getting the most out of it's players within a tight team structure.

Arcobello will get to play for the Edmonton Oilers, if he even managed to win the job - hardly a shoo-in considering he couldn't take ice time away from an injured and poorly playing Gagner in the coach's eyes last year.

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09-08-2014, 04:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spawn View Post
I did indeed. While you are noticing my errors, can you fix the end date for the poll? I can't remember if mods can. I know you can edit options, but not sure about close date.
I think I got it.

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Old
09-08-2014, 04:56 PM
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Spawn
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Originally Posted by dnicks17 View Post
I think I got it.
Indeed. Thanks a bunch.

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Old
09-08-2014, 05:00 PM
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Egads, this is an unfair poll!

I would have picked Arcobello if he had gone to the Coyotes. That being said, I would pick Ganger if they were both still on the same team, so I'm gonna have to give it to him, here.

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Old
09-08-2014, 05:01 PM
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I am not a huge arco supporter but i dont think he could be worse than Gagner at pivot position. From what i saw last year from Arco, i stand behind my thoughts. Individual points are meaningless, making us more competitive over the entire ice is what matters.

Keep in mind too...Gagner, as stated in OP is a six year nhl VETERAN, Arco is a thirty game rookie. The fact a rookie is even questioned as being as good as a six year vet who hasnt performed at all...is enough said.

6year vet Sam Gagner versus...rookie. Rookie wins if even close.


Last edited by oilinblood: 09-08-2014 at 05:06 PM.
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Old
09-08-2014, 05:07 PM
  #17
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I think Arco will surprise many this year 14 g 38 a 52 pts. While playing decent defensively.

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09-08-2014, 05:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oilinblood View Post
I am not a huge arco supporter but i dont think he could be worse than Gagner at pivot position. From what i saw last year from Arco, i stand behind my thoughts. Individual points are meaningless, making us more competitive over the entire ice is what matters.

Keep in mind too...Gagner, as stated in OP is a six year nhl VETERAN, Arco is a thirty game rookie. The fact a rookie is even questioned as being as good as a six year vet who hasnt performed at all...is enough said.
Gagner might have much more NHL experience, but Arcobello is a full year older and will be entering his 6th year of pro hockey this upcoming year. He's not some kid coming straight out of college/junior.

I was off about Gagner's experience in the NHL though. He's actually a 7 year vet (which is crazy when you consider he's just going to be 25 this upcoming season).

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09-08-2014, 05:09 PM
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Gagner's far from a bad hockey player, but I don't know if his first year in Phoenix will be his turn-around year. I think by 2015-16 he'll be a highly effective player on their team, but I have a gut feeling that he's simply not a fit for the Coyotes system yet. I wouldn't be surprised to see him bounce between the second and third line this upcoming season as he finds his niche on his new team.

Arcobello is more of a fit for what we've seen of the existing Oilers system, but he's pretty much incapable of generating offense on his own. With talented wingers he seems to produce, but from the 3rd or 4th line he disappears from the scoresheet. I personally believe he's more effective on defense than Gagner is, however.

I think that the most likely outcome is that Arcobello has a moderately better +/-, but Gagner puts up more points. If Arcobello manages to play a significant number of games with either Perron or Eberle, however, I think he'll make it more interesting.

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Old
09-08-2014, 05:31 PM
  #20
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Gagner will be going to a team with a role given to him (replace Mike Ribiero) where he will play plenty of PP minutes surrounded by huge teammates.

Arcobello will be fighting for a center spot with no PP minutes guaranteed.

Gagner will score more points, but possibly worse plus minus.

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09-08-2014, 05:34 PM
  #21
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This debate makes as much sense as arguing whether you'd prefer if your mailman or your mechanic performed the open heart surgery you needed. I wouldn't consider either.

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09-08-2014, 05:34 PM
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Predicting Arcobello to have more points than Gagner would be pretty aggressive.

+/- will mostly have to do with how the respective teams perform, and I'm not really expecting either of them to be good so I'd say there is no way to really tell.

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Old
09-08-2014, 06:12 PM
  #23
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Yeah plusminus is really just a number comparing these two, no meaning behind it. And I sincerely hope Gagner gets more points, because he should have a lot bigger role in ARZ than Arco here. Arco is not our 2C, please.

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Old
09-08-2014, 07:21 PM
  #24
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Good poll, but irrelevant.

The question is who would be play better on the Oilers this season?

Acrobello + Purcell will produce more points and keep Edmonton more competitive than Gagner alone because let's face it, if Gagner were still here Acrobello would be starting the year in the AHL. TO me that spells better +/- and more points for Edmonton.


Gagner is playing on a defence first team with a number of very competent 2 way forwards around him and he won't be the only smurf out there like it was with his situation last year.

Furthermore, there's a good chance that Gagner gets a lot of points next year because he's Phoenix's best offensive forward out of all of Phoenix's group.

If Gagner doesn't thrive in Phoenix, then he's even worse a player than we initially thought.

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09-08-2014, 07:28 PM
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oXo Cube View Post
Predicting Arcobello to have more points than Gagner would be pretty aggressive.

+/- will mostly have to do with how the respective teams perform, and I'm not really expecting either of them to be good so I'd say there is no way to really tell.
I only picked Arco cause I expect Gagner's point production to suffer under the defense first system Tippet employs.

Tippet's system seems to reply heavily upon speed/positioning/back checking, all things Gagner is weak at.

Really a terrible way to pose this situation.

-Plus Minus, like all stats isn't a great indicator of anything without some context.

-Gagner could ignore Tippet and with increased ice time, offensive zone starts, and PP time and thus do very well for points but most likely would have a terrible plus minus.

I think if everything was equal. PP time, offensive zone starts, etc... Arco and Gagner will have very similar point production with Gagner getting more goals and Arco getting more assists. Depending on who's goaltending and defense is more reliable (egde to Pho/Gagner) I see plus minus being very similar as well.

I suppose taking into account all the variables (ice time, PP time, offensive zone starts, Oilers improved D & goal) I should have put Gagner with more points but worse plus minus.

I don't put much stock in the Oilers succeeding this year because of Eakins but some things I am optimistically expecting.

RNH 65+ points if healthy
Schultz 45+ points if healthy
Yak 25+ goals if healthy
Arco 45+ points if healthy and used as our #2 over Leon/Lander.

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