HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Central Division > Winnipeg Jets
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Five members of the Winnipeg Jets file for salary arbitration

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
07-11-2013, 01:33 PM
  #76
Holden Caulfield
Moderator
The Eternal Skeptic
 
Holden Caulfield's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Winnipeg
Country: Canada
Posts: 13,376
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zhamnov10 View Post
I would replace Tangradi immediately he his in no position to be pushing for more money he hasn't even proved he is a full time NHL decent guy to have around at this point definitely not worth a whole lot,same goes for Postma I'm sure the jets have tried to move him only to find out there were no takers luckily we already have replacements for Postma. I would be willing to bet that the jets let both of these guys walk and I would be totally ok with it ,we could use the cap space to add another quality player.
Since neither one of the players will get above 3.5 million per season, the Jets will not be able to walk away from the arbitration awards. Jets will be forced to sign both of these guys.

Quote:
12.10 Walk-Away Rights for Player-Elected Salary Arbitration.
(a) If a Club has elected to arbitrate a one-year SPC, and the award issued is for
$3,500,000 or more per annum, then the Club may, within forty-eight (48) hours after the award
of the Salary Arbitrator is issued (or, if a Club has any other Player still eligible for salary
arbitration at that time and for whom a decision has not been rendered by a Salary Arbitrator at
that time, and the Club still has a walk-away right available to it in such League Year pursuant to
paragraph (c) below, forty-eight (48) hours after the award of the Salary Arbitrator for such other
Player is issued or that Player's salary arbitration case is settled), notify the Player or his
Certified Agent, if any, the NHLPA and the NHL in writing, in accordance with Exhibit 3
hereof, that it does not intend to tender to the Player an SPC based on the award as determined
by the Salary Arbitrator. Upon receipt of that notice, the Player shall automatically be deemed to
be an Unrestricted Free Agent.
(b) If a Club has elected to arbitrate a two-year SPC and the award issued is for
$3,500,000 or more per annum, then the Club may, within forty-eight (48) hours after the award
of the Salary Arbitrator is issued (or, if a Club has any other Player still eligible for salary
arbitration at that time and for whom a decision has not been rendered by a Salary Arbitrator at
that time, and the Club still has a walk-away right available to it in such League Year pursuant to
paragraph (c) below, forty-eight (48) hours after the award of the Salary Arbitrator for such other
Player is issued or that salary arbitration case is settled), notify the Player or his Certified Agent,
if any, the NHLPA and the NHL in writing, in accordance with Exhibit 3 hereof, that it does not
intend to tender to the Player a two-year SPC based on the award as determined by the Salary
Arbitrator. Upon receipt of that notice, the Player and the Club shall enter into a one-year SPC
providing for the compensation set forth in the award and the Player will automatically be
deemed to be an Unrestricted Free Agent at the conclusion of that one-year SPC, subject to the
provisions of paragraph (c) below.

Holden Caulfield is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 01:52 PM
  #77
Holden Caulfield
Moderator
The Eternal Skeptic
 
Holden Caulfield's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Winnipeg
Country: Canada
Posts: 13,376
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by knorthern knight View Post
Not Holden here, but I think the answer is no, they cannot be offer-sheeted. Let's look at the CBA...

Page 30
10.2 (a) (i) (B)


Next stop is page 58, and the above-mentioned section 12.3(a), specifically 12.3.(a)(iv)

Since the players elected to go to arbitration, 12.3(a) is moot.

Next stop is page 69, and the above-mentioned section 12.10

Well, yes, if a club has, and excercises "Walk-Away Rights", the player becomes a UFA, and is free to negotiate with whomever.
Props. You proved me wrong with the CBA. I will give full credit. Upon my own review I completely agree with you. Congrats to a fellow CBA aficionado.

So Little, Wheeler, Bogosian are no longer offer sheet eligible, that's some decent enough news.

Holden Caulfield is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 01:58 PM
  #78
Rheged
JMFT
 
Rheged's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Winnipeg
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,242
vCash: 500
Cool, so the benefit is still there, well that's something at least

Rheged is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 02:00 PM
  #79
scopar
Registered User
 
scopar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Winnipeg
Country: Canada
Posts: 227
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by SensibleGuy View Post
I think being a pro sports fan requires you develop a pretty hard shell of cynicism. All the players coming to Winnipeg hit the usual talking points - its awesome to play in front of a great knowledgeable fan base in a full arena like MTS yadda yadda. The reality is they are all just as happy playing in front of 6,000 hardcore golf fanatics in a city where they can hit the beach on off days...they might even do it for less money.
Also to keep in mind that hockey is a gate driven sport, especially for Winnipeg. As such, nearly half of our ticket dollars go directly to the players. They're making a heck of a lot money from us, who in some cases are given up a significant portion of our income to attend games.

I didn't see a single NHLPA representative arguing for reducing ticket prices - that would reduce the revenue pool and convert that $2M salary to $1.5M annually.

I'm not hating on the players, they're looking after their own interests. I also willingly fork over money for my tickets, gear, and concessions because of the entertainment value, contributing to the system. But as a fan, I reinforce the comment that a healthy dose of cynicism must be reserved for players who "love" our city and want to play here.

scopar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 02:00 PM
  #80
Gm0ney
Registered User
 
Gm0ney's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Winnipeg
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,549
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Howard Chuck View Post
And if those salaries eat up the cap space, those players will find themselves with no big FA signings to help them win games. Tough call, do you take a little less on the condition that Chevy uses the money to help the team win more games, or say screw it, all that matters is my salary?
Well, if the team is going to spend that money on bringing in help, then you might be able to convince Wheeler or Bogo or Little to take a discount. But if that money is just going to sit in Chipman's bank account while Chevy brings in talent like Wright and Mittens off the waiver wire, then I'd be saying "pay me!"

Gm0ney is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 02:21 PM
  #81
Hank Chinaski
Moderator
Above Paverage
 
Hank Chinaski's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Winnipeg
Country: Canada
Posts: 13,270
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Holden Caulfield View Post
Props. You proved me wrong with the CBA. I will give full credit. Upon my own review I completely agree with you. Congrats to a fellow CBA aficionado.

So Little, Wheeler, Bogosian are no longer offer sheet eligible, that's some decent enough news.
OT, but I'm continually impressed by how well the HF CBA aficionados (you, danishh, mouser, kdb, and kk now I guess ) can parse through it and extract information.

I've been going through the 2011 NFL CBA lately, and I swear, it's light reading compared to the 2013 NHL CBA.

Hank Chinaski is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 03:20 PM
  #82
Huffer
Registered User
 
Huffer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 10,200
vCash: 240
Can guys like Tangradi or Postma be traded after they get their arbitration contract, or is there anything in the CBA that prevents that?

Huffer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 03:25 PM
  #83
Howard Chuck
HFBoards Sponsor
 
Howard Chuck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 1,895
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gm0ney View Post
Well, if the team is going to spend that money on bringing in help, then you might be able to convince Wheeler or Bogo or Little to take a discount. But if that money is just going to sit in Chipman's bank account while Chevy brings in talent like Wright and Mittens off the waiver wire, then I'd be saying "pay me!"
True enough

Howard Chuck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 04:00 PM
  #84
The Doof
Registered User
 
The Doof's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 35
vCash: 500
Strange, I know the Jets website is wonky but it lists Bogo but not Wheeler or Little as players. I'm hoping that this means a deal is about to be announced for Bogo shortly

The Doof is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 04:12 PM
  #85
davemac1313
Registered User
 
davemac1313's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Keewatin, Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 524
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Doof View Post
Strange, I know the Jets website is wonky but it lists Bogo but not Wheeler or Little as players. I'm hoping that this means a deal is about to be announced for Bogo shortly
Antro is also listed....

davemac1313 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 07:01 PM
  #86
knorthern knight
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: GTA
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,439
vCash: 595
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hank Chinaski View Post
OT, but I'm continually impressed by how well the HF CBA aficionados (you, danishh, mouser, kdb, and kk now I guess ) can parse through it and extract information.

I've been going through the 2011 NFL CBA lately, and I swear, it's light reading compared to the 2013 NHL CBA.
In my case, it comes from being a linux user. "RTFM" is the order of the day for figuring out parameters for obscure commands. In this case, I used the PDF viewer search command to look through the PDF file for occurences of the string "offer sheet". There weren't that many, relatively speaking, and I found what I needed in a few minutes.

knorthern knight is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 09:18 PM
  #87
KingBogo
Admitted Homer
 
KingBogo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Winnipeg
Posts: 6,697
vCash: 507
Sorry if this is a bit of the lay of the land post, but I've been out at the lake for 2 weeks and pretty much off the grid. Though I have an old beater radio that picks up TSN 1290 amazingly well. The amount of RFA's going to arbitration has me a bit worried. Chevy seems to be a grinder in negotiations and I fear this may catch up to him. Sign Bogo ASAP even if it's for a bit more than you want. What do you think Bogo would have gone for on July 5th if he was an UFA? Now imagine if he goes to arbitration and gets a 2 year deal and continues to develop as hoped and is considered a top 10-15 d-man and then hits UFA as a 25 year old just as the cap takes a big jump forward. We are *********. If our A** is up against the cap it is one thing. But that is not the case. Chevy just sign your players. BTW Morrisey will turn out to be a great pick.

KingBogo is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 10:35 PM
  #88
knorthern knight
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: GTA
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,439
vCash: 595
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Doof View Post
Strange, I know the Jets website is wonky but it lists Bogo but not Wheeler or Little as players. I'm hoping that this means a deal is about to be announced for Bogo shortly
Quote:
Originally Posted by davemac1313 View Post
Antro is also listed....
What website are you looking at? I'm looking at http://jets.nhl.com/club/roster.htm and here's what I see (reformatted to take less space)

ForwardsDefensemenGoalies
Michael FrolikZach BogosianAl Montoya
Andrew GordonDustin ByfuglienOndrej Pavelec
Matt HalischukGrant Clitsome 
Olli Jokinen "A"Tobias Enstrom 
Evander KaneAdam Pardy 
Andrew Ladd "C"Paul Postma 
Bryan LittleZach Redmond 
Anthony PelusoMark Stuart "A" 
Mark ScheifeleJacob Trouba 
Devin Setoguchi  
Jim Slater **  
Eric Tangradi  
Chris Thorburn  
Blake Wheeler  
James Wright  

** = Injured Reserve

knorthern knight is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-12-2013, 01:02 PM
  #89
JMT21
I Give A Dam!
 
JMT21's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: In My House
Country: Canada
Posts: 934
vCash: 500
If filing for arbitration means the players can't get offer-sheeted by other clubs.... I'm good with that.

The hearings start July 22nd and run thru August 6th. If anything, this means Chevy going to have to get his arse in gear and start signing these guys.

JMT21 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-12-2013, 01:07 PM
  #90
roosemoose
Registered User
 
roosemoose's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Morden, MB
Country: Canada
Posts: 54
vCash: 500
All these RFA's filing for arbitration does concern me a little bit. I wonder why we did not start contract talks a lot sooner? If Wheeler, little and Bogosian have no contract before their arbitration hearing the Jets will get worked over the coals as far as future is concerned. That means they will all get two year deals and all would be UFA's at that time and gone. I want to start hearing some good news from Jets camp as far as signings is concerned and all these guys signed long term would help!

roosemoose is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-12-2013, 01:18 PM
  #91
YWGinYYZ
Global Moderator
.
 
YWGinYYZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 16,583
vCash: 50
IMHO, all three will sign prior to going to arbitration. Hate saying it, but there IS a process for these things.

YWGinYYZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-12-2013, 01:24 PM
  #92
The Doof
Registered User
 
The Doof's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 35
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by knorthern knight View Post
What website are you looking at? I'm looking at http://jets.nhl.com/club/roster.htm and here's what I see (reformatted to take less space)

ForwardsDefensemenGoalies
Michael FrolikZach BogosianAl Montoya
Andrew GordonDustin ByfuglienOndrej Pavelec
Matt HalischukGrant Clitsome 
Olli Jokinen "A"Tobias Enstrom 
Evander KaneAdam Pardy 
Andrew Ladd "C"Paul Postma 
Bryan LittleZach Redmond 
Anthony PelusoMark Stuart "A" 
Mark ScheifeleJacob Trouba 
Devin Setoguchi  
Jim Slater **  
Eric Tangradi  
Chris Thorburn  
Blake Wheeler  
James Wright  

** = Injured Reserve
It wasn't like that yesterday afternoon. Wheeler and Little were not listed. I see they are today.

The Doof is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-12-2013, 01:25 PM
  #93
Reed Solomon
GO ✈'s GO
 
Reed Solomon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Winnipeg, Man.
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,081
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by KingBogo View Post
Chevy seems to be a grinder in negotiations and I fear this may catch up to him. Sign Bogo ASAP even if it's for a bit more than you want.
OR the agents are trying to take advantage of an inexperienced GM to get as much as they can. Because they've seen it happen with Pavelec and Kane.

Reed Solomon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-12-2013, 01:30 PM
  #94
Hammer Slammer
Moderator
Tayler Mayors
 
Hammer Slammer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Winnipeg
Country: Canada
Posts: 10,229
vCash: 50
Send a message via AIM to Hammer Slammer
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Doof View Post
It wasn't like that yesterday afternoon. Wheeler and Little were not listed. I see they are today.
I looked yesterday as well and only Bogosian was listed of the three. Don't worry you're not crazy.

__________________
Hammer Slammer is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
07-12-2013, 01:34 PM
  #95
surixon
Registered User
 
surixon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Winnipeg
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,942
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reed Solomon View Post
OR the agents are trying to take advantage of an inexperienced GM to get as much as they can. Because they've seen it happen with Pavelec and Kane.
Agree about Pa vs but disagree about Kane who IMO is signed to a very fair deal!

surixon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-12-2013, 02:06 PM
  #96
devin1487
Registered User
 
devin1487's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Winnipeg
Country: Canada
Posts: 469
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reed Solomon View Post
OR the agents are trying to take advantage of an inexperienced GM to get as much as they can. Because they've seen it happen with Pavelec and Kane.
3.9 Mil is a great number for a starting goalie...no matter what you think of Pavelec, if you think you're getting fleeced paying less than 4 for a starter who eats up a ton of games you're kidding yourself.

Also Kane (Although I disagree with this trend) is right on par with what other young stars are getting (Ie: Skinner 5.75). Again, despite what you personally think of the value, these are reasonable going rates for these type of players. Quit pretending you somehow know more than a GM

devin1487 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-12-2013, 03:10 PM
  #97
garret9
AKA#VitoCorrelationi
 
garret9's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 12,234
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by devin1487 View Post
3.9 Mil is a great number for a starting goalie...no matter what you think of Pavelec, if you think you're getting fleeced paying less than 4 for a starter who eats up a ton of games you're kidding yourself.

Also Kane (Although I disagree with this trend) is right on par with what other young stars are getting (Ie: Skinner 5.75). Again, despite what you personally think of the value, these are reasonable going rates for these type of players. Quit pretending you somehow know more than a GM
I guess you must agree with every contract ever signed in the history of the NHL if a GM cannot be wrong at the same time a non-GM can be right.

garret9 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-12-2013, 03:20 PM
  #98
broinwhyteridge
Registered User
 
broinwhyteridge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,591
vCash: 0
Quote:
Originally Posted by devin1487 View Post
3.9 Mil is a great number for a starting goalie...no matter what you think of Pavelec, if you think you're getting fleeced paying less than 4 for a starter who eats up a ton of games you're kidding yourself.

Also Kane (Although I disagree with this trend) is right on par with what other young stars are getting (Ie: Skinner 5.75). Again, despite what you personally think of the value, these are reasonable going rates for these type of players. Quit pretending you somehow know more than a GM
3.9 is a great number for a great or even above average starting goalie... for what we're getting, not so much IMO.

broinwhyteridge is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-12-2013, 09:34 PM
  #99
devin1487
Registered User
 
devin1487's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Winnipeg
Country: Canada
Posts: 469
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by broinwhyteridge View Post
3.9 is a great number for a great or even above average starting goalie... for what we're getting, not so much IMO.
Actually, I saw that the great goalie that boston signed, settled for 7 million for 8 years.... 3.9 says we believe in you but there's room to grow.

Quote:
I guess you must agree with every contract ever signed in the history of the NHL if a GM cannot be wrong at the same time a non-GM can be right.
Ya, that's what I said...you can't look at this like it's a fantasy team...these are real people, negotiations aren't just as easy as well offer him this and then sign here and do this. But I imagine the view is different from your armchair

devin1487 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-12-2013, 10:51 PM
  #100
garret9
AKA#VitoCorrelationi
 
garret9's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 12,234
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by devin1487 View Post
Actually, I saw that the great goalie that boston signed, settled for 7 million for 8 years.... 3.9 says we believe in you but there's room to grow.


Ya, that's what I said...you can't look at this like it's a fantasy team...these are real people, negotiations aren't just as easy as well offer him this and then sign here and do this. But I imagine the view is different from your armchair
I guess you are misunderstanding what I was stating then.
Yes they are also real people and real people make mistakes.
It's not even independent to Chevaldayoff. There is no correlation it seems to good goaltending and contracts. Just GMs historically have been not very good at predicting or evaluating goaltender success.
These are not opinions of an armchair GM but that of the results and facts of history.



Look at this:

While some debate how much Sv% is affected by goaltending skill, luck and team...
What we do know for certain is Sv% is the sole stat predominately affected by goaltending skill and repeatable regardless of changing teams, coaches, and systems.
The fact is that how much GMs pay for goaltending and how much the goalie improves the team is completely two separate things.
Personally I a bitt tiffed at Chevy when it came out because I didn't think Pavelec earned that contract, but that's a bit consistent to how bad GMs are with this. What I was not happy at all was giving long term to someone who has yet to post an above average season in Sv% in his pro career (including AHL).

garret9 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:55 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2015 All Rights Reserved.