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So Kovalchuk just retired

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Old
07-12-2013, 10:48 AM
  #201
DegenX
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Originally Posted by zhenya71 View Post
I was under the impression that some of those hockey players got special tax breaks to give them an incentive to return to Russia and play in the KHL.
I don't know if they get any incentives as far as taxes go, although where there are taxes there are inevitability tax breaks.

I did the research a while ago, just because the idea of 'tax free' was kind of unbelievable. IIRC the team can, and often does, offer additional incentives or 'bonuses' for signing. Hard to know for sure though unless the player talks about it, since the KHL doesn't normally release salary details like the NHL does. Usually the info is 'reported' by the Russian press, which is another discussion entirely.

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07-12-2013, 10:54 AM
  #202
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Originally Posted by PensBandwagonerNo272 View Post
Would he not be obligated to play for the Devils until the end of his contract?

Seems like a very flawed/unfair process if true.
the Devils signed off on fully voiding the contract.

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07-12-2013, 11:24 AM
  #203
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Originally Posted by AZPenguins View Post
They Devils got what they deserved with the punishment from the league. The original Kovalchuk contract took what other teams had done with back diving deals and made a complete joke out of it. A 17 year deal that he was to earn $98.5 million of the $102 million in the first 11 years of the deal. Lou accepted the punishment so no, they should not get the pick back.
I also think that taking away the draft pick might have been intended to serve as a deterrent, both to NJ and other teams.

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07-12-2013, 11:59 AM
  #204
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Originally Posted by shureshot66 View Post
Looks that way, yup.

Tom Gulitti ‏@TGfireandice
For some period of time (I don't know how long), Kovalchuk would require approval of all 30 NHL teams to un-retire and play in NHL again.
In short, he will never play in this league again, except at such time as he's old enough, slow enough, and washed up enough to not really make a difference to the other 29 teams.


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Originally Posted by Shady Machine View Post
Roenick should be happy he was really good at hockey because he isn't the sharpest tool in the shed.
You're being too nice. Jeremy Roenick (while I approve his anti-Kovalchuk attitude as a media guy -- he deserves whatever abuse he gets in that respect) is a moron. Not a "this is HFB and we like to call people morons sometimes" moron.... an actual, dyed-in-the-wool moron. An unintelligent human being. You are right we should be glad he made it as a hockey player because intellect-wise his options are pretty limited. Not even sure I can see him managing a retail store. You have to be a good director of people without making them hate your guts (which means you have to figure out what makes them click), good at managing money, good at noticing details... seriously I don't think he could do it. That said neither can approximately 50% of the people doing that job.


Last edited by Darth Vitale: 07-12-2013 at 12:05 PM.
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07-12-2013, 11:59 AM
  #205
Dennis Reynolds
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Originally Posted by nuernberger View Post
Well, that's the thing. There's more than the NHL. Breaching contracts, not honoring contracts, signing contracts just to use it as a leverage used to happen numerous times each offseason when there was no agreement between the IIHF and the NHL in place (I think my hometown team signed Darren Haydar like three times, he never came). Good old Canadian boys used to do it all the time.
Thank you for this post. There's so much xenophobic nonsense in this thread and on these boards.

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07-12-2013, 12:07 PM
  #206
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Originally Posted by The Oneironaut View Post
Thank you for this post. There's so much xenophobic nonsense in this thread and on these boards.
Well taking that even a step further, how many people in regular business breach contracts and go back on their word and generally cut corners everywhere they can within the bounds of the law (and outside it sometimes) to make a little extra money? Why should the judgement be limited to Russian hockey players? Frankly Kovalchuk didn't breach any contract, what he did was screw over the team. I guess it would be analogous to someone with very special skills joining a new startup, getting a couple years into it and then leaving unexpectedly and taking all their skills with them, leaving the rest of the people high and dry.

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07-12-2013, 12:11 PM
  #207
Dennis Reynolds
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Originally Posted by Chancellor Vitale View Post
Well taking that even a step further, how many people in regular business breach contracts and go back on their word and generally cut corners everywhere they can within the bounds of the law (and outside it sometimes) to make a little extra money? Why should the judgement be limited to Russian hockey players? Frankly Kovalchuk didn't breach any contract, what he did was screw over the team. I guess it would be analogous to someone with very special skills joining a new startup, getting a couple years into it and then leaving unexpectedly and taking all their skills with them, leaving the rest of the people high and dry.
Did he even really do that, though? Yes, it's really going to suck for a few years for the Devils, but in a twisted way, this helps out the team in the long run.

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07-12-2013, 12:24 PM
  #208
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Originally Posted by The Oneironaut View Post
Did he even really do that, though? Yes, it's really going to suck for a few years for the Devils, but in a twisted way, this helps out the team in the long run.
Just because they may be better off in the long run doesn't mean what he did was cool. What he did was wrong. There's no if and or buts about it.

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07-12-2013, 12:28 PM
  #209
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chancellor Vitale View Post
Well taking that even a step further, how many people in regular business breach contracts and go back on their word and generally cut corners everywhere they can within the bounds of the law (and outside it sometimes) to make a little extra money? Why should the judgement be limited to Russian hockey players? Frankly Kovalchuk didn't breach any contract, what he did was screw over the team. I guess it would be analogous to someone with very special skills joining a new startup, getting a couple years into it and then leaving unexpectedly and taking all their skills with them, leaving the rest of the people high and dry.
Many people breach contracts, etc. As you say, this probably isn't a breach of contract, more like a mutual termination. If this were one-sided, the Devils' stance would be a lot different.

I think the better analogy is someone leaving a very high, key position in a blue-chip company to go to a small/mid-size company with higher pay, but more risk (and closer to home). The former will survive, while the exec will make as much as he can while he still can.

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07-12-2013, 12:35 PM
  #210
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Originally Posted by Shady Machine View Post
Just because they may be better off in the long run doesn't mean what he did was cool. What he did was wrong. There's no if and or buts about it.
In my opinion, there are too many things going on here to say whether or not what "he" "did" was "cool." The timing is very, very interesting, especially for a club in financial turmoil. This:

Quote:
Mike Colligan ‏@MikeColligan 20h
If Kovalchuk had played 5 more seasons (age 35), he would have earned $56m ($11.2m/yr) and left #Devils with a $3.7m cap penalty for 7 years
and this (in re: to the actual cap penalty for the Devils now):

Quote:
Mike Colligan ‏@MikeColligan 19h
@Forechecker only $250k per year for next dozen years
are enough for a million conspiracy theories that, if thought through, don't paint Kovalchuck in a bad light in the least.

But then there's this:

Quote:
Mike Colligan ‏@MikeColligan 19h
Kovalchuk "tired of paying escrow", according to @TGfireandice, yet other players were forced to pay excess escrow bc of his deal structure
that makes him sound like he's just a dick.

That's why I say there's just too much going on to pass judgement yet.

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07-12-2013, 01:09 PM
  #211
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Agree to disagree. It was Kovy's decision to leave. He was openly talking about not returning after the lockout. Now he retires so he can go back to Russia. That's his choice and I don't hate the guy for it but it's pretty selfish. Think of all the fans he hurt with this decision.

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07-12-2013, 02:55 PM
  #212
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Originally Posted by Shady Machine View Post
Is this real life? Bobby Lou was totally put through the ringer by Vancouver. They basically **** on him for 18 months and now they want to kiss and make up and he's just supposed to swallow his pride?

I've got mad respect for how Luongo handled the whole "you're going to be traded, someday" thing. He played hard, never complained and patiently waited to move on. If he's not sure what to do now, I totally understand.
Umm, yes that is exactly what he's supposed to do because he signed a contract and the team wants him to fulfill it. It's not a mutual decision to part ways like the Kovalchuk situation.

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07-12-2013, 03:48 PM
  #213
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Originally Posted by Justin Sickways View Post
Umm, yes that is exactly what he's supposed to do because he signed a contract and the team wants him to fulfill it. It's not a mutual decision to part ways like the Kovalchuk situation.
Agree to disagree. How your brain can look at these two situations and come out hatting on Luongo and understanding Kovalchuk is one for the ages.

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07-12-2013, 04:05 PM
  #214
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Originally Posted by Shady Machine View Post
Agree to disagree. How your brain can look at these two situations and come out hatting on Luongo and understanding Kovalchuk is one for the ages.
Wow. Talk about double standards. Kovalchuk should honor his contract but Loungo should not?

And how exactly did the Canucks "**** all over him for 18 months"?... by promising to move a contract that ultimately proved unmovable? You know, the one he signed himself? Or did they owe him a trade to the detriment of the team?

I have no sympathy for pro athletes who sign such massive contracts and then cannot live with the negative consequences that might come with it. What he is supposed to do, you asked? Grow up, be professional, and honor your contract.

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07-12-2013, 04:09 PM
  #215
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Kovy's mother tells all:

http://www.nj.com/devils/index.ssf/2...ks_mother.html

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07-12-2013, 04:13 PM
  #216
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And here's an exclusive picture of Kovalchuk's mother:


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07-12-2013, 04:26 PM
  #217
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Originally Posted by Jacob View Post
And here's an exclusive picture of Kovalchuk's mother:

Haha she's likely more attractive than Kennedy's mom.

I'm amazed people on this site are praising Kovy for his "unselfish decision" or "putting family first." His decision was motivated by money. He will likely get paid $15 million + a year tax-free in the KHL when players like Radulov make $7 million. I don't blame him, id do the same thing, but lets not act like he is Danny effing Tanner. (Full house)

I hate New Jersey, I hope the nhl sanctions the team because its obvious Lou knew he was going to leave since he threw money at Ryder, Clowe and now paying $9.5 or whatever for goalies. Fans are also bashing Kovy for waiting so long into free agency, but it's clear the devils knew he was retiring before June.

In the end only devils fans lose out.

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07-12-2013, 04:52 PM
  #218
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Originally Posted by Wingerz View Post
Haha she's likely more attractive than Kennedy's mom.

I'm amazed people on this site are praising Kovy for his "unselfish decision" or "putting family first." His decision was motivated by money. He will likely get paid $15 million + a year tax-free in the KHL when players like Radulov make $7 million. I don't blame him, id do the same thing, but lets not act like he is Danny effing Tanner. (Full house)

I hate New Jersey, I hope the nhl sanctions the team because its obvious Lou knew he was going to leave since he threw money at Ryder, Clowe and now paying $9.5 or whatever for goalies. Fans are also bashing Kovy for waiting so long into free agency, but it's clear the devils knew he was retiring before June.

In the end only devils fans lose out.
sanction them? For what?

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07-12-2013, 05:46 PM
  #219
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Originally Posted by DegenX View Post
I don't know if they get any incentives as far as taxes go, although where there are taxes there are inevitability tax breaks.

I did the research a while ago, just because the idea of 'tax free' was kind of unbelievable. IIRC the team can, and often does, offer additional incentives or 'bonuses' for signing. Hard to know for sure though unless the player talks about it, since the KHL doesn't normally release salary details like the NHL does. Usually the info is 'reported' by the Russian press, which is another discussion entirely.
My understanding is that many laws in Russia are sort of figurative, rather than concrete, particularly when it comes to businesses Vladimir Putin's buddies are involved in. If memory serves, SKA is one such business. The KHL as a whole is DEFINITELY something Putin's got his hands on.

If Putin needs to waive taxes for guy X to get him to join the KHL, if guy X is important enough to marketing and growth, I assume Putin would find a way to make it happen.

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07-12-2013, 06:06 PM
  #220
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Amazes that people are coming up with conspiracy theories that he'll return next year and sign a low-end deal. Not going to happen. He won't return I think.

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07-12-2013, 06:15 PM
  #221
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Originally Posted by Shrimper View Post
Amazes that people are coming up with conspiracy theories that he'll return next year and sign a low-end deal. Not going to happen. He won't return I think.
People are actually saying this? In what world would the man give up a guaranteed $77 million to play for less? It must be the shock talking; there's really no other explanation. Like you said, Kovalchuk is dunzo in the U.S. Luckily, for the sake of American pride, he did not make this announcement on the 4th of July.

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07-12-2013, 06:40 PM
  #222
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Originally Posted by Gwydyr View Post
People are actually saying this? In what world would the man give up a guaranteed $77 million to play for less? It must be the shock talking; there's really no other explanation. Like you said, Kovalchuk is dunzo in the U.S. Luckily, for the sake of American pride, he did not make this announcement on the 4th of July.
That's the main board for you.

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07-12-2013, 07:02 PM
  #223
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That is unbelievable people think that's what's going on here. 29 other teams would tell him to get bent in a hurry. No way he'll be allowed back in this league for several years at least.

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07-12-2013, 08:13 PM
  #224
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Originally Posted by Shady Machine View Post
Roenick should be happy he was really good at hockey because he isn't the sharpest tool in the shed.
yeah what an absolute classless moron roenick is, as is anyone who employs the guy. that just demonstrated that he has zero intelligence. again. wow. is he an adult?


Last edited by rocky7: 07-12-2013 at 08:31 PM.
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07-13-2013, 03:34 AM
  #225
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I just bet a friend at work who goes for NJ $50 that the Devils would finish bottom 3 in the east next year. He said make it bottom 4. Easy, easy money.
You're probably going to lose this bet. New Jersey is a better team with Schneider than they are with Kovalchuk, and they're a pretty decent team to begin with even if they lack the namepower that they had in the past.

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