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The demise of the Maple Leafs: Top Ten

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Old
06-14-2005, 09:44 PM
  #1
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The demise of the Maple Leafs: Top Ten

There's so many low points since 1967. anyone who read '67 fill in the blanks:

1. Ballards childish(no pun) reign; what did King know?

2. trading sittler

3. trading lanny

4. bag headed neilson episode

5. jim gregory

6. gord stellick

7. trading palmateer/ his arm injury

8. keon 's falling out (is this the real curse; not that I care)

9. cam connors goal

10. John Brophy

hm: popularity of Dougie given his st louis past; return of Punch

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06-14-2005, 10:07 PM
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I consider Dougie one of the high points, personally. Who cares if he had a checkered past? He was one of the major forces bringing the Leafs back to respectability in the early 1990's

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06-15-2005, 11:10 AM
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John Ferguson as GM must be on a list of why the Leafs suck.

The senior citizens that he added at the trade deadline were hilarious. How this guy still has a job is a complete mystery. I guess the President of the club is dumber than the GM.

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06-15-2005, 11:13 AM
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I would say the pedophilia scandal at Maple Leaf Gardens is one of the worst.

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06-15-2005, 11:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ogopogo
John Ferguson as GM must be on a list of why the Leafs suck.

The senior citizens that he added at the trade deadline were hilarious. How this guy still has a job is a complete mystery. I guess the President of the club is dumber than the GM.
Signing Cujo when Jim Carrey was available was hard to fathom.

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06-15-2005, 11:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Habsfunk
I would say the pedophilia scandal at Maple Leaf Gardens is one of the worst.
disgusting, but not really hockey related though

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06-15-2005, 11:23 AM
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Ummm.....Gretzky's high stick?

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06-15-2005, 11:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyByngJeanRatelle
Ummm.....Gretzky's high stick?
that, coupled with Gretzky being unspeakably good in that series

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06-15-2005, 11:34 AM
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I think 2, 3 and 8 are all sub-categories of 1

and I'd say the Montreal Canadiens should be the #2 factor of the Leafs' demise. Nothing about the Canadiens in particular - just the fact that, without Montreal around, Toronto would rival Detroit for most storied hockey franchise (Yes I know Toronto has more cups than Detroit, but without Montreal, Detroit would have won 7 or 8 more cups from the 40s and 50s).

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Old
06-15-2005, 11:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chooch
There's so many low points since 1967. anyone who read '67 fill in the blanks:

1. Ballards childish(no pun) reign; what did King know?
That's your top ten right there.

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06-15-2005, 11:42 AM
  #11
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1) Ballard

I knew it was the beginning of the end when I saw Sittler without the "C."

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06-15-2005, 11:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ACC1224
Signing Cujo when Jim Carrey was available was hard to fathom.
Funny but, way out of context.

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06-15-2005, 11:50 AM
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Who did the Leafs lose in the '67 expansion draft?

They had an old team and I'm wondering if they lost some good young players (can't remember).

I'm also wondering who they got back when they dealt Bernie Parent.

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06-15-2005, 12:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chili
Who did the Leafs lose in the '67 expansion draft?

They had an old team and I'm wondering if they lost some good young players (can't remember).

I'm also wondering who they got back when they dealt Bernie Parent.
They lost Red Kelly, Terry Sawchuk, Larry Jeffrey, Eddie Shack, Kent Douglas, Bob Baun, and Brit Selby and other lesser players.

Parent was traded for Favell.

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06-15-2005, 12:56 PM
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If you look up 'pathetic' in the dictionary, this thread would be there.

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06-15-2005, 01:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ogopogo
John Ferguson as GM must be on a list of why the Leafs suck.

The senior citizens that he added at the trade deadline were hilarious. How this guy still has a job is a complete mystery. I guess the President of the club is dumber than the GM.
In Ferguson's defense there are worse GMs in the league than him. A lot of the deals he's made so far have been reaction deals to public and media pressure. If he can learn to ignore the braying of the herd I think he has enough hockey sense to make some better deals.

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06-15-2005, 02:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mooseOAK
They lost Red Kelly, Terry Sawchuk, Larry Jeffrey, Eddie Shack, Kent Douglas, Bob Baun, and Brit Selby and other lesser players.

Parent was traded for Favell.
Thanks. Doesn't seem they were hit any harder than the other original six. They definitely lost some depth Kelly and Sawchuk were near the end of their careers and it seems like they reacquired Baun and Shack.

Parent for Favell hurt though.

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06-15-2005, 03:15 PM
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I agree with a lot of those ones. At the top of the list as always is Ballard. He made it very personal with trades. If a guy was religious, or if a guy went to the WHA he'd let him go for the saving of $5000. Many players have mentioned that it was as if it was more important for him to be on the front of a newspaper then to see the team win.

Letting a Hall of Famer like Gerry Cheevers go didnt help either in '62. But the main thing that had to hurt was the Parent trade. The Leafs trade him and then he goes on to win two Cups the following year with Philly. Also two Conn Smythe Trophies.

But Ballard is the centre of it all. Trading Lanny away only because Sittler wouldnt wave his no trade clause was prepostrous. What an evil, evil man he was!

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06-15-2005, 03:18 PM
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Ballard ruined the franchise and it's still recovering to this day. He occupies spots 1-10 on any list.

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06-15-2005, 03:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Phil
I agree with a lot of those ones. At the top of the list as always is Ballard. He made it very personal with trades. If a guy was religious, or if a guy went to the WHA he'd let him go for the saving of $5000. Many players have mentioned that it was as if it was more important for him to be on the front of a newspaper then to see the team win.

Letting a Hall of Famer like Gerry Cheevers go didnt help either in '62. But the main thing that had to hurt was the Parent trade. The Leafs trade him and then he goes on to win two Cups the following year with Philly. Also two Conn Smythe Trophies.

But Ballard is the centre of it all. Trading Lanny away only because Sittler wouldnt wave his no trade clause was prepostrous. What an evil, evil man he was!
The Parent trade was due to Ballard also, Bernie was so pissed off at the Leafs he forced the trade to happen. That's they way things were back then, the minute a player got to the point where Harold had to give him more money he got rid the guy.

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06-15-2005, 05:40 PM
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If you look up 'pathetic' in the dictionary, this thread would be there.

I'm pretty sure it wouldn't be under 'pathetic", but rather 'pathetic attempt to stir controversy"

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06-15-2005, 06:59 PM
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someone please explain gilmour's 'checkered past' and this 'pedophilia' talk about ballard. thanks, in advance.

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06-15-2005, 08:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Bring Back Bucky
I'm pretty sure it wouldn't be under 'pathetic", but rather 'pathetic attempt to stir controversy"
thats the height of hypocrisy; remind me again why you are on this site?

To tell stories of Kelly Buchberger?

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06-15-2005, 08:11 PM
  #24
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thats the height of hypocrisy; remind me again why you are on this site?
To tell stories of Kelly Buchberger?

Sorry, I can't remind you again why I'm on this site, as I have never felt obliged to explain myself to you once , much less would I feel obliged to explain myself again.

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06-15-2005, 08:17 PM
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someone please explain gilmour's 'checkered past' and this 'pedophilia' talk about ballard. thanks, in advance.
Story is at the bottom
Quote:
Gilmour had been implicated in civil suit for alleged sexual improprieties with a teenage babysitter (he was never charged), but the Blues sent him packing a week later
Another account
Quote:
The Baby-Sitter Incident: Early in his NHL career, as he was emerging as a bona fide star in St. Louis, Gilmour was sued by a St. Louis couple, who claimed he had sexually abused their daughter over a period of months, beginning when she was 13. The couple's daughter had been working as a baby-sitter for the Gilmours, often spending entire nights at the house while she cared for the couple's baby girl, Maddison, who was born in 1985. The couple demanded $1 million in damages, charging that Gilmour repeatedly had sex with their daughter while she was staying in his home. In their lawsuit, the couple alleged that Gilmour's wife and Blues team officials were aware of the incident but chose to do nothing. The suit, filed Aug. 30, 1988, was entirely civil in nature, since police never filed criminal charges against Gilmour. In fact, St. Louis County prosecutor George Westfall said the girl's family had never come to the authorities requesting a criminal investigation and said he saw the accusation as a blatant attempt at extortion. Westfall said the family had begun its endeavor by asking the Blues for more than $200,000 in order not to go public with their allegations, and that prosecutors might investigate the family to see if criminal charges were in order. Despite all of this, negative publicity surrounding the case hurt Gilmour's popularity with fans and made it difficult for him to continue playing in the city. Gilmour initially refused to comment on the lawsuit, but his first wife, Robyne, was quick to deny the allegations and said her husband was not guilty in any way. But the damage had been done. Gilmour, who later joined his wife in denying the charges, was plagued by prank phone calls to his home, while Blues officials were unhappy at being asked by the media to comment on the issue. The firestorm ended in early September 1988, when the Blues traded Gilmour to Calgary. Due to the controversy, St. Louis was unable to deal Gilmour for fair value and had to settle for a seven-player deal that clearly favored Calgary. After the trade, Gilmour reiterated that the accusations were an extortion effort and had done nothing but humiliate his entire family. He said he had not asked to be traded but recognized he would be better off in another city. "This has jeopardized my career," he said at a press conference after the trade. On Oct. 4, 1988, Gilmour and his first wife countersued the girl's family for $4 million, charging them with slander and libel. On Oct. 22, 1988, the attorney for the girl's family was charged with trying to extort hush money from the Blues organization. Despite his efforts to clear his name and the obvious flaws in the girl's family's case, the 1988-89 season was a nightmare for Gilmour, as he was subjected to taunts from fans everywhere. In the long run he didn't need to worry about his hockey career. He went on to greater heights in the NHL, while the case against him never made it to court. On Dec. 27, 1988, a St. Louis County grand jury ruled there was insufficient evidence to press sexual assault charges against Gilmour, and the case was promptly dismissed. Gilmour, who sat for two hours of grand jury questioning, expressed great relief at the ruling and turned his focus back to the Flames, who went on to win the 1989 Stanley Cup.

"pedophilia" is overstating it, statutory is more accurate.

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