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Leafs' Bozak talks new additions, contract, criticism

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07-13-2013, 10:05 PM
  #76
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Originally Posted by LeafsWantStanley View Post
Don't want a 4.2mil 3rd line C, rather keep Bolland Ship Liles and Bozak
Good thing Bozak is a damn good 2c then

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07-13-2013, 10:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Lightsol View Post
Don't you guys remember that the plan this year was supposed to be taking a run at Getzlaf and Perry?
Weren't we supposed to offload Kessel to do that?

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07-13-2013, 10:14 PM
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Originally Posted by GordieHoweHatTrick View Post
Or good enough to those who watch 95% of the games.

Anyway, congratulations on his new contract. I hope the Leaf aren't content with keeping him around in a top-6 role for the long-term just because he signed for 5 years and that it was more a market value thing.



I usually agree with everything you always say, Ponder, but you don't really know what sort of offensive output he'd have on the 2nd line, or what sort of defence he could provide on the 3rd line, shut-down role. He's never really had to play without offensive dynamos on his line and has never really been asked to play difficult minutes against tough opponents night-in, night-out. I'm from the school of thought that believes his offense would dry up on the 2nd line (unless he has elite offensive linemates) to ~30pts/82gms and that his (true) defensive acumen would be exposed. Didn't Carlyle only use him after a whistle on the PK? Bozak would take the faceoff and take off for the bench the first chance he got so that a better defensive center could play.
Weird, I watched nearly every minute of every game. Mind you, I don't have your level of knowledge or experience, or the absolute ability to speak for what is apparently 95% of the hockey world, however, I was fairly accurate on the contract he would get and with who.

Thank you however, for setting me straight.


Last edited by The Apologist: 07-13-2013 at 10:24 PM. Reason: Sorry but it's a pet peeve of mine when people use lines like 'its a fact' 'it's common knowledge' 'really high percent of people' as if them saying it automatically makes it true.
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07-13-2013, 11:04 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by LeafsWantStanley View Post
What if theres a used 2009 luxury Lexus at say, $490 (Weiss) and your driving a 2012 Honda Civic that costs $420 (Bozak), which would you choose?

The Lexus has more mileage, but its a luxury car, proven to turn heads, something special, desirable, proven.

While the Honda Civic, new model and all, is meh, turns around no heads, common and typical.
Weiss is a luxury Lexus? Lol Good one.
Maybe analogies aren't your thing.

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07-13-2013, 11:05 PM
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Weird, I watched nearly every minute of every game. Mind you, I don't have your level of knowledge or experience, or the absolute ability to speak for what is apparently 95% of the hockey world, however, I was fairly accurate on the contract he would get and with who.

Thank you however, for setting me straight.
FWIW, I was speaking only for myself. Congratulations on guessing what a below average first line center gets paid though, I suppose, as long as you remember that he is there by committee, not by talent.

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07-13-2013, 11:12 PM
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Originally Posted by GordieHoweHatTrick View Post
FWIW, I was speaking only for myself. Congratulations on guessing what a below average first line center gets paid though, I suppose, as long as you remember that he is there by committee, not by talent.
Well, considering I believe him to be an above average 2c, I thank you for the congratulations.

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07-13-2013, 11:21 PM
  #82
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Well, considering I believe him to be an above average 2c, I thank you for the congratulations.
Just curious, and you can answer this in a reasonable timeline, but what evidence do you have to support that claim considering Bozak has played with above average linemates ALL his career?

Literally, from the moment he stepped onto NHL ice he was spoon fed minutes with Kessel. Lets not forget that 3/4 of that time was spent in the Eastern Conference cellar

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07-13-2013, 11:36 PM
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Originally Posted by GordieHoweHatTrick View Post
Just curious, and you can answer this in a reasonable timeline, but what evidence do you have to support that claim considering Bozak has played with above average linemates ALL his career?

Literally, from the moment he stepped onto NHL ice he was spoon fed minutes with Kessel. Lets not forget that 3/4 of that time was spent in the Eastern Conference cellar
What evidence do you have to prove he's not?

Regardless of who you think is responsible for his production, he does produce at a top 6 level (in fact, I believe he was 97th among forwards just this past season, putting him just outside top line stats point wise)

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07-13-2013, 11:49 PM
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What evidence do you have to prove he's not?

Regardless of who you think is responsible for his production, he does produce at a top 6 level (in fact, I believe he was 97th among forwards just this past season, putting him just outside top line stats point wise)
Tell you what, I'm not basing anything of what I'm saying off stats - strictly from what I saw. Bozak had an incredible 1/3 of a season when he first stepped onto NHL ice for a Maple Leafs team that was struggling hard and was desperate for any center to to play in the top-6. All his career he has had Kessel spoon feeding him points (his numbers next to PPG players should be enough to convince people that he does not belong) and now that the Maple Leafs put together an arguably successful season so some folks are content with the mediocrity he provides.

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07-13-2013, 11:49 PM
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What evidence do you have to prove he's not?

Regardless of who you think is responsible for his production, he does produce at a top 6 level (in fact, I believe he was 97th among forwards just this past season, putting him just outside top line stats point wise)
If someone is playing with Kessel, JVR, 20+mins a game and 1st PP unit, I'd expect them to be ranked higher than 97th amongst forwards. Heck, even 60th amongst forwards would be decent.

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07-13-2013, 11:51 PM
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Originally Posted by LeafsWantStanley View Post
If someone is playing with Kessel, JVR, 20+mins a game and 1st PP unit, I'd expect them to be ranked higher than 97th amongst forwards. Heck, even 60th amongst forwards would be decent.
I think I've asked it before, but I'll ask again, how many lines in the NHL contain three top 90 forwards?

I'll wait.

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07-13-2013, 11:55 PM
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I think I've asked it before, but I'll ask again, how many lines in the NHL contain three top 90 forwards?

I'll wait.
Most NHL teams don't have the offensive firepower the Maple Leafs possess. Most NHL teams also prefer to spread offense around the top-6, not keep it on one line. Crazy part is that we could still drastically improve upon that top line and still provide offense from the 2nd unit.

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07-13-2013, 11:56 PM
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Originally Posted by GordieHoweHatTrick View Post
Tell you what, I'm not basing anything of what I'm saying off stats - strictly from what I saw. Bozak had an incredible 1/3 of a season when he first stepped onto NHL ice for a Maple Leafs team that was struggling hard and was desperate for any center to to play in the top-6. All his career he has had Kessel spoon feeding him points (his numbers next to PPG players should be enough to convince people that he does not belong) and now that the Maple Leafs put together an arguably successful season so some folks are content with the mediocrity he provides.
Great, so we have two opinions, yours, and mine. I see a solid two way forward, who allows his wingers to play a more offensive game. This Center is often the first one back when one of those wingers gets a little too frisky. He is solid on faceoffs, plays solid penalty kill minutes and contributes at a top 6 forward, lower end top 3 forward pace.

Mine is backed up by something.

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on what qualifies as mediocre.

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07-14-2013, 12:00 AM
  #89
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Originally Posted by GordieHoweHatTrick View Post
Most NHL teams don't have the offensive firepower the Maple Leafs possess. Most NHL teams also prefer to spread offense around the top-6, not keep it on one line. Crazy part is that we could still drastically improve upon that top line and still provide offense from the 2nd unit.
One of those teams that 'spreads it out' is our Leafs. Statistically, we had one of the better offensive centers in the game last year on our second line.

Not sure which Center you're thinking we could have brought in to improve a line that is already one of the better offensive lines in the NHL, but I bet it would cost a lot more than 4.2M per.

Do you know why many NHL teams don't have three top 90 forwards on the top line? I'll give you a huge hint, it starts with a C.

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07-14-2013, 12:01 AM
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Great, so we have two opinions, yours, and mine. I see a solid two way forward, who allows his wingers to play a more offensive game. This Center is often the first one back when one of those wingers gets a little too frisky. He is solid on faceoffs, plays solid penalty kill minutes and contributes at a top 6 forward, lower end top 3 forward pace.

Mine is backed up by something.

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on what qualifies as mediocre.
Those are often the attributes you hear when talking about a top-6 forward on a contending team. A center that is the first one back when one of his wingers gets a little too frisky. A center that is solid on faceoffs and contributes second line numbers next to elite wingers.

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07-14-2013, 12:08 AM
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Those are often the attributes you hear when talking about a top-6 forward on a contending team. A center that is the first one back when one of his wingers gets a little too frisky. A center that is solid on faceoffs and contributes second line numbers next to elite wingers.
Nope, you usually hear about teams with six top 90 scorers, two elite centers and six elite wingers, and of course no cap hell at all

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07-14-2013, 12:10 AM
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Great, so we have two opinions, yours, and mine. I see a solid two way forward, who allows his wingers to play a more offensive game. This Center is often the first one back when one of those wingers gets a little too frisky. He is solid on faceoffs, plays solid penalty kill minutes and contributes at a top 6 forward, lower end top 3 forward pace.

Mine is backed up by something.

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on what qualifies as mediocre.
-Plays Solid Defensively
-Good on Draws
-Good on Penalty Kill
-Has trouble producing points
-Extremely high shooting percentage

= 3rd Line Center, whats he doing with 4.2mil a season?

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07-14-2013, 12:12 AM
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-Plays Solid Defensively
-Good on Draws
-Good on Penalty Kill
-Has trouble producing points
-Extremely high shooting percentage

= 3rd Line Center, whats he doing with 4.2mil a season?
97th among forwards in points.
That's what he's doing at 4.2

Glad I could help.

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07-14-2013, 12:12 AM
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Nope, you usually hear about teams with six top 90 scorers, two elite centers and six elite wingers, and of course no cap hell at all
Hey! Tyler Bozak does not help our cap situation at all!

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07-14-2013, 12:14 AM
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Hey! Tyler Bozak does not help our cap situation at all!
Tyler Bozak at 4.2 will be a steal in two years time when the Bollands of the world are making 5.5 plus.

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07-14-2013, 12:15 AM
  #96
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97th among forwards in points.
That's what he's doing at 4.2

Glad I could help.
Slot in Jay McClement as your #1C (Probably an upgrade over Bozak offensively too ) and he would be ranked higher than 97th amongst forwards.

Its crazy, but we've had a #3C as our #1C for 4 years, may aswell try a #4C as our #1C.

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07-14-2013, 12:17 AM
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Slot in Jay McClement as your #1C (Probably an upgrade over Bozak offensively too ) and he would be ranked higher than 97th amongst forwards.

Its crazy, but we've had a #3C as our #1C for 4 years, may aswell try a #4C as our #1C.
You keep saying it like its fact, yet offer nothing to prove your point.

Anyway, I need sleep. Let me know when you come up with something of substance to show why Bozak isn't exactly what I say he is, a solid #2 c.

I won't hold my breath.

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07-14-2013, 12:19 AM
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Tyler Bozak at 4.2 will be a steal in two years time when the Bollands of the world are making 5.5 plus.
If Bolland commands anything north of 4 then acquiring him was a mistake as well.

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07-14-2013, 12:20 AM
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If Bolland commands anything north of 4 then acquiring him was a mistake as well.
Assuming Bolland is the #3C, he won't be racking up more than 30points a season, so he'll ask for little money (hopefully)

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07-14-2013, 12:22 AM
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...if you like mediocre tweeners riding your best player's coat tails.

1c was 'supposed' to be something we were looking to upgrade on. We didn't, were just paying the same guy more. It's a disappointing non-improvement.
Perhaps Leafs' management is confident that Kadri will became that 1C? He's only 21 and had a PPG season last year. They probably didn't want to go out and pay a king's ransom for a 1C before Kadri can show what he can do next season; perhaps they won't need that 1C, anymore, and they can focus on addressing other issues.

Besides, who realistically is available? Patty Roy has implied he would like to keep Stastny, I don't think they'd move him unless they truly thought they were getting better. So that's out the window. Ribiero and Weiss got expensive contracts, and are hardly long term solutions as the 1C/

I think this is the best route for Leafs' management to go.

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