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NB/PEI midget AAA 2013/2014 season

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Old
09-24-2013, 03:04 PM
  #126
hockey jockey
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Originally Posted by NBHockey View Post
This has less to do with Scott.. he is what he is, I stand behind what I said of the play and that's the end of that part of it for me.

This has much more to due with HNB and other provinces putting these young players at risk. It's been awhile for me, but you mentioned that he needed to be in the top 4 players? When I coached, players rarely moved up a division, but if they did, there was some process for it, anyone know what it is now? You also asked who were the top 6 forwards, I don't know them all but I would not have put Hoyt in the top 6 that day.

Its irresponsible from what I saw on Sunday, and HNB should be taken to task for it. And this in the era of checking being removed from Peewee...
I was the one who asked the above mentioned questions not NS64, my point was that Hoytt should have been evaluated by who ever is in charge of the Midget league.Exceptional players should not be held back but it should be clear the kid is able to play at that level before the decision is made by the team.

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09-24-2013, 03:26 PM
  #127
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Originally Posted by NBHockey View Post
This has less to do with Scott.. he is what he is, I stand behind what I said of the play and that's the end of that part of it for me.

This has much more to due with HNB and other provinces putting these young players at risk. It's been awhile for me, but you mentioned that he needed to be in the top 4 players? When I coached, players rarely moved up a division, but if they did, there was some process for it, anyone know what it is now? You also asked who were the top 6 forwards, I don't know them all but I would not have put Hoyt in the top 6 that day.

Its irresponsible from what I saw on Sunday, and HNB should be taken to task for it. And this in the era of checking being removed from Peewee...
The process for an underage player to move up is section 17.5:

http://www.hnb.ca/images/NBMHC_OPERA...14_ENGLISH.pdf

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09-24-2013, 05:46 PM
  #128
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Originally Posted by Canada4Gold1 View Post
The process for an underage player to move up is section 17.5:

http://www.hnb.ca/images/NBMHC_OPERA...14_ENGLISH.pdf
The problem I've always had with this rule is "the top 3rd of their position of the upper level team". So basically if you are a 3 line team and the kid is trying out for left wing he only has to be in the top 3. But the fact remains that we have seen quality player's cut to make room for an under age player for whatever reason. Nb hockey, you have the wrong dada here and I think we both know who he is. I didn't drive to watch Moncton vs the Wild because Scott was playing. Let's leave it at that. You are not the hfboards god and we do not all bow to your opinions nor should you bow to mine or anybody else's although I have agreed with most of your posts on different topics. As I said the hit took place on my side of the ice and 3-4 strides in my opinion does not warrant words like nasty blow to the head. We know what they look like. I never disputed the fact that it was a hit to the head and the love tap comment was for the person assuming based on a scoresheet.

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09-24-2013, 05:57 PM
  #129
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Originally Posted by Canada4Gold1 View Post
The process for an underage player to move up is section 17.5:

http://www.hnb.ca/images/NBMHC_OPERA...14_ENGLISH.pdf
The process is on paper but it is as clear as mud, it is like everything else in HNB, if a coach wants a player and has the right contacts a player can and will be evaluated to satisfy the coaches request. For example let's say have to be in the top 1/3 of your position. Last year Fredericton had 5 good forwards
Cass
Bamford
Cass
Tompkins
Daley

So how did Taylor Leblanc rank in the top 1/3 of his position? The coach could argue he was one of the top 3 ,I watched him play several times and would say he may have been top 6 maybe

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09-25-2013, 07:23 AM
  #130
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Originally Posted by mrscout View Post
The problem I've always had with this rule is "the top 3rd of their position of the upper level team". So basically if you are a 3 line team and the kid is trying out for left wing he only has to be in the top 3. But the fact remains that we have seen quality player's cut to make room for an under age player for whatever reason. Nb hockey, you have the wrong dada here and I think we both know who he is. I didn't drive to watch Moncton vs the Wild because Scott was playing. Let's leave it at that. You are not the hfboards god and we do not all bow to your opinions nor should you bow to mine or anybody else's although I have agreed with most of your posts on different topics. As I said the hit took place on my side of the ice and 3-4 strides in my opinion does not warrant words like nasty blow to the head. We know what they look like. I never disputed the fact that it was a hit to the head and the love tap comment was for the person assuming based on a scoresheet.
Fair enough... Lets end the hit debate as far as Scott is concerned.

BUT...

I just can't leave the underage player part of this alone. From what I read of that document, section 17.5e is pretty clear. The player must be in the top 1/3 of his position which in this case is RW. So I know Tompkins, is playing right wing... Hoyt is definately not better than him, and he is not better than Sam Cameron or Sam Jeffrey so how could he possibly have been selected?

Even if we say top 1/3 of all forwards, he is not the 4th best forward on the team, not by a long shot. If he was a 98, he might have a chance to fit in but not as a top 6 forward.

After seeing them last Sunday I would rank them:

Tompkins
Bamford
Daley
Bertrand
Cameron
Jeffrey

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09-25-2013, 07:58 AM
  #131
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Originally Posted by NBHockey View Post
Fair enough... Lets end the hit debate as far as Scott is concerned.

BUT...

I just can't leave the underage player part of this alone. From what I read of that document, section 17.5e is pretty clear. The player must be in the top 1/3 of his position which in this case is RW. So I know Tompkins, is playing right wing... Hoyt is definately not better than him, and he is not better than Sam Cameron or Sam Jeffrey so how could he possibly have been selected?

Even if we say top 1/3 of all forwards, he is not the 4th best forward on the team, not by a long shot. If he was a 98, he might have a chance to fit in but not as a top 6 forward.

After seeing them last Sunday I would rank them:

Tompkins
Bamford
Daley
Bertrand
Cameron
Jeffrey
Bertrand didn`t even make the team , he is an affiliate.

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09-25-2013, 08:31 AM
  #132
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Originally Posted by hockey4life13 View Post
Bertrand didn`t even make the team , he is an affiliate.
WHAT? are you serious.

LOL.. well I guess I have my answer to all my questions on the Fredericton team then!

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09-25-2013, 09:47 AM
  #133
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Originally Posted by NBHockey View Post
Fair enough... Lets end the hit debate as far as Scott is concerned.

BUT...

I just can't leave the underage player part of this alone. From what I read of that document, section 17.5e is pretty clear. The player must be in the top 1/3 of his position which in this case is RW. So I know Tompkins, is playing right wing... Hoyt is definately not better than him, and he is not better than Sam Cameron or Sam Jeffrey so how could he possibly have been selected?

Even if we say top 1/3 of all forwards, he is not the 4th best forward on the team, not by a long shot. If he was a 98, he might have a chance to fit in but not as a top 6 forward.

After seeing them last Sunday I would rank them:

Tompkins
Bamford
Daley
Bertrand
Cameron
Jeffrey
Taylor Leblanc will be back in November he should help

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09-25-2013, 10:37 AM
  #134
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Bertrand didn`t even make the team , he is an affiliate.
Bertrand has grown and his skill set would be up there with Tompkins and Daley, very surprised he didn't make the team.He still needs to play with more grit he played High School last year it will take time for him to adjust to the speed of midget.I would bet he will finish the season with the Canadiens.

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09-25-2013, 11:13 AM
  #135
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The problem I've always had with this rule is "the top 3rd of their position of the upper level team". So basically if you are a 3 line team and the kid is trying out for left wing he only has to be in the top 3. But the fact remains that we have seen quality player's cut to make room for an under age player for whatever reason. Nb hockey, you have the wrong dada here and I think we both know who he is. I didn't drive to watch Moncton vs the Wild because Scott was playing. Let's leave it at that. You are not the hfboards god and we do not all bow to your opinions nor should you bow to mine or anybody else's although I have agreed with most of your posts on different topics. As I said the hit took place on my side of the ice and 3-4 strides in my opinion does not warrant words like nasty blow to the head. We know what they look like. I never disputed the fact that it was a hit to the head and the love tap comment was for the person assuming based on a scoresheet.
I hope you don't think I am dada. As I said before, I do know the family. If many years down the road my son is being discuss on this board you can be sure neither he or I will be on here trying to change peoples' opinions of him, everyone is entitled to an opinion. My opinion of Scott is that he is one of those players that you love to have on your team and hate to play against.

I don't follow the league as closely as I would like to but it seems a little funny to me that Miramichi had to have two underagers on their team last year. I don't think it would have hurt either of those kids development to have spent another year in Bantam AAA. I don't know much about LeBlanc's situation in Fred so I won't comment on it. Is moving kids up more comon in NB than it is in the other Atlantic provinces or is it pretty much the same?

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09-25-2013, 11:35 AM
  #136
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Is moving kids up more comon in NB than it is in the other Atlantic provinces or is it pretty much the same?
That's a very good question that I don't know the answer too. What I do know is that there have been a number of them in the last couple of years in NB and I don't see where it helps them any.

Sometimes I wonder if its just people behind the scenes who are promoting a kid, which is fine.. if he can handle it.

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09-25-2013, 11:54 AM
  #137
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That's a very good question that I don't know the answer too. What I do know is that there have been a number of them in the last couple of years in NB and I don't see where it helps them any.

Sometimes I wonder if its just people behind the scenes who are promoting a kid, which is fine.. if he can handle it.
I'm not sure about other midget teams in NB but I have followed the Fredericton team for almost 20 years. What I have seen in the past is far different then the way it is now. Pottle has taken a couple of underage kids going way back but his norm was to affiliate these kids , allow them to practice and maybe see 1 game each throughout the season. This was the case a few years back when he had Cooper , Murphy , Zilbert , Whitlock and Vanderlann. These were top end talent players that saw 1 game all year as affiliates. I think the talent in Fredericton over the last few years has really thinned out and there are not high end up and comers so Pottle wants to try and develop 1 or 2 each year for his program. Not sure how that will pan out with Leblanc or Hoyt but what is coming up through our watered down programs is pretty slim picking. IMO

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09-25-2013, 12:09 PM
  #138
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I'm not sure about other midget teams in NB but I have followed the Fredericton team for almost 20 years. What I have seen in the past is far different then the way it is now. Pottle has taken a couple of underage kids going way back but his norm was to affiliate these kids , allow them to practice and maybe see 1 game each throughout the season. This was the case a few years back when he had Cooper , Murphy , Zilbert , Whitlock and Vanderlann. These were top end talent players that saw 1 game all year as affiliates. I think the talent in Fredericton over the last few years has really thinned out and there are not high end up and comers so Pottle wants to try and develop 1 or 2 each year for his program. Not sure how that will pan out with Leblanc or Hoyt but what is coming up through our watered down programs is pretty slim picking. IMO
You have to remember that this team draws players from Fredericton to Edmunston.Maybe they are not getting the quality players from the north west part of the province that they did in previous years.Does anyone know the number of players from outside Fredericton that play on the team this year.?Maybe the development system in there minor system is to blame.? High School takes quality players as well , and one thing I know is that it cost a lot more now for hockey than when my kids played.

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09-25-2013, 12:16 PM
  #139
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You have to remember that this team draws players from Fredericton to Edmunston.Maybe they are not getting the quality players from the north west part of the province that they did in previous years.Does anyone know the number of players from outside Fredericton that play on the team this year.?Maybe the development system in there minor system is to blame.? High School takes quality players as well , and one thing I know is that it cost a lot more now for hockey than when my kids played.
This year the team has Tompkins , Paul , Cloutier , Stairs and the 2 goalies from outside that were cut from their respective teams.

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09-25-2013, 12:35 PM
  #140
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I'm not sure about other midget teams in NB but I have followed the Fredericton team for almost 20 years. What I have seen in the past is far different then the way it is now. Pottle has taken a couple of underage kids going way back but his norm was to affiliate these kids , allow them to practice and maybe see 1 game each throughout the season. This was the case a few years back when he had Cooper , Murphy , Zilbert , Whitlock and Vanderlann. These were top end talent players that saw 1 game all year as affiliates. I think the talent in Fredericton over the last few years has really thinned out and there are not high end up and comers so Pottle wants to try and develop 1 or 2 each year for his program. Not sure how that will pan out with Leblanc or Hoyt but what is coming up through our watered down programs is pretty slim picking. IMO
Affiliating the players sounds like a much better way of doing it to me, seems like it is working out OK for the players you mentioned.

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09-25-2013, 01:44 PM
  #141
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Looks like a long year for Ch'town islanders goalies. almost 100 Shots against in 2 games. Wild will be much like last year, might be a long year with young team but I think they will upset chtown and win the island

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09-25-2013, 01:52 PM
  #142
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Originally Posted by hockey4life13 View Post
I'm not sure about other midget teams in NB but I have followed the Fredericton team for almost 20 years. What I have seen in the past is far different then the way it is now. Pottle has taken a couple of underage kids going way back but his norm was to affiliate these kids , allow them to practice and maybe see 1 game each throughout the season. This was the case a few years back when he had Cooper , Murphy , Zilbert , Whitlock and Vanderlann. These were top end talent players that saw 1 game all year as affiliates. I think the talent in Fredericton over the last few years has really thinned out and there are not high end up and comers so Pottle wants to try and develop 1 or 2 each year for his program. Not sure how that will pan out with Leblanc or Hoyt but what is coming up through our watered down programs is pretty slim picking. IMO
I agree that the programs are watering down but its a variety of reasons for this. Some go abroad to play, some can't afford it and elect HS and on and on. How can it be that Bertrand a 97' is an AP and Hoyt a 99' in the top 6 forwards? Can anyone remember the last time Moncton or Saint John took an underage player? I get it with Miramichi who struggle with numbers but Fredericton shouldn't have that problem should they?

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09-25-2013, 02:13 PM
  #143
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I agree that the programs are watering down but its a variety of reasons for this. Some go abroad to play, some can't afford it and elect HS and on and on. How can it be that Bertrand a 97' is an AP and Hoyt a 99' in the top 6 forwards? Can anyone remember the last time Moncton or Saint John took an underage player? I get it with Miramichi who struggle with numbers but Fredericton shouldn't have that problem should they?
I have said this here many times , you will never take the politics out of hockey.

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09-25-2013, 05:50 PM
  #144
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Fredericton has to resort to underagers because the high school programs are two of the top ones in the province and once a kid starts playing high school they are very unlikely to switch to midget AAA, in fact it is more common for kids in their final year of midget to switch from AAA to high school.
Also a kid like Hoyt would have been heavily recruited to play high school, same with Leblanc last year. Would they have gone back to midget the following year? maybe but maybe not.

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09-25-2013, 08:12 PM
  #145
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Fredericton has to resort to underagers because the high school programs are two of the top ones in the province and once a kid starts playing high school they are very unlikely to switch to midget AAA, in fact it is more common for kids in their final year of midget to switch from AAA to high school.
Also a kid like Hoyt would have been heavily recruited to play high school, same with Leblanc last year. Would they have gone back to midget the following year? maybe but maybe not.
I agree that is always a problem but the ones that want to go to the next level after Midget will not go to high school. So your suggesting that a coach will take an underage prospect to keep him from playing high school with the risk of not returning to midget. If high school hockey was doing things right they would not allow 14 year olds to possibly play with 18 and some 19 year olds. Saying that should HNB allow 14 year olds to play midget.

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09-25-2013, 09:14 PM
  #146
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I agree that is always a problem but the ones that want to go to the next level after Midget will not go to high school. So your suggesting that a coach will take an underage prospect to keep him from playing high school with the risk of not returning to midget. If high school hockey was doing things right they would not allow 14 year olds to possibly play with 18 and some 19 year olds. Saying that should HNB allow 14 year olds to play midget.
Just a correction here, midget is only for kids that "Turn 15, 16 or 17" in the calendar year that the season starts. No 19 year olds.

As for underage kids, i think each province has a process to follow, in NS it is very strict for 12 yo playing Major bantam and 14 yo playing Major Midget.

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09-26-2013, 05:28 AM
  #147
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Just a correction here, midget is only for kids that "Turn 15, 16 or 17" in the calendar year that the season starts. No 19 year olds.

As for underage kids, i think each province has a process to follow, in NS it is very strict for 12 yo playing Major bantam and 14 yo playing Major Midget.
What I said was if high school was doing things correctly they would not allow 14 against 19, in New Brunswick if a student is 19 in grade 12 he can play high school hockey so that makes it possible for a 14 year old to play against a 19 year old.

In New Brunswick there is a process for player movement how much is it enforced who would know.

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09-26-2013, 06:31 AM
  #148
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Fredericton has to resort to underagers because the high school programs are two of the top ones in the province and once a kid starts playing high school they are very unlikely to switch to midget AAA, in fact it is more common for kids in their final year of midget to switch from AAA to high school.
Also a kid like Hoyt would have been heavily recruited to play high school, same with Leblanc last year. Would they have gone back to midget the following year? maybe but maybe not.
Someone said Bertrand played HS last year as a grade 10, but came back and tried out with the Midget team. What does the coach do??? Makes him an AP and takes the 99. Sorry Tony, it doesn't sound like they had to resort to anything in this case.

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09-26-2013, 09:18 AM
  #149
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What I said was if high school was doing things correctly they would not allow 14 against 19, in New Brunswick if a student is 19 in grade 12 he can play high school hockey so that makes it possible for a 14 year old to play against a 19 year old.

In New Brunswick there is a process for player movement how much is it enforced who would know.
Ah yes, my apologies, i thought we were referring to Midget - high school for sure you can have that junior aged kid on the team

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09-26-2013, 02:38 PM
  #150
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Someone said Bertrand played HS last year as a grade 10, but came back and tried out with the Midget team. What does the coach do??? Makes him an AP and takes the 99. Sorry Tony, it doesn't sound like they had to resort to anything in this case.
Did Bertrand tryout last year for midget ? I hope to catch the game in Moncton Saturday any chance the Bertrand kid will play Saturday or is he gone back to his club team.

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