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How good would Luke Schenn have been under Carlyle?

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07-20-2013, 10:22 AM
  #76
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Originally Posted by Cyris View Post

leaf fans rubbed in the Beauchimin for Lupul and Gardiner trade for a couple years (some still try) but I would bet the Ducks are extremely happy with that trade right now.
Beauchemin had one good year this year. We still robbed them.

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07-20-2013, 10:27 AM
  #77
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Originally Posted by Hurt View Post
I think it was unnecessary for him to bulk up like he did and his skating speed wasn't that great (partially because of the aforementioned issue). I think him (and Komisarek, even) could have been solid players under Carlyle.
Have yoy seen pictures of Luke Schenn as a kid??? Im pretty sure he slims down and doesnt bulk up. He could look like Big Buff if he tried to put on more weight. It is his genetics. The leafs did not encourage him getting bigger.

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07-20-2013, 10:35 AM
  #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen View Post
Beauchemin had one good year this year. We still robbed them.
Beauch has been good for them since they got him back but this year he was amazing.

This season they had a guy who finished 4th in norris voting and the 2 players we got played a combined 28 of 96 games.
I wouldn't reverse the trade if I could but we certainly didn't rob them.

The way Beauchimin plays in Anaheim isnt the same way he played in Toronto.

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07-20-2013, 10:36 AM
  #79
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He would have been an absolute beast. Mark Fraser with a hell of a lot more skill

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07-20-2013, 10:37 AM
  #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyris View Post
leaf fans rubbed in the Beauchimin for Lupul and Gardiner trade for a couple years (some still try) but I would bet the Ducks are extremely happy with that trade right now.
How do you figure that? The Leafs got Lupul, Gardiner and a 4th... how can you possibly think Beauch even at his best is worth that?

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07-20-2013, 10:55 AM
  #81
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Originally Posted by Cyris View Post
Beauch has been good for them since they got him back but this year he was amazing.

This season they had a guy who finished 4th in norris voting and the 2 players we got played a combined 28 of 96 games.
I wouldn't reverse the trade if I could but we certainly didn't rob them.

The way Beauchimin plays in Anaheim isnt the same way he played in Toronto.
Irrelevant.

We've gotten 103 points out of 110 Lupul games to date, and Gardiner on a full ELC including one All-Rookie team nomination to date. A nice 48 game campaign doesn't match that.

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07-20-2013, 11:04 AM
  #82
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Schenn would be a Norris nominee in the making under Carlyle, who would coach Schenn on how to minimize shots against and only take high quality shots for.

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07-20-2013, 11:04 AM
  #83
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Originally Posted by TieClark View Post
How do you figure that? The Leafs got Lupul, Gardiner and a 4th... how can you possibly think Beauch even at his best is worth that?
Beauch has been their #1 Dman since he returned to them and this season he was one of the best dmen in the league.

#1 Dman > Often injured 1st line winger.
It was a great trade for both teams because due to circumstances neither player was likely to be as good for their previous team as they are now.

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07-20-2013, 11:08 AM
  #84
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Originally Posted by Cyris View Post
Beauch has been their #1 Dman since he returned to them and this season he was one of the best dmen in the league.

#1 Dman > Often injured 1st line winger.
It was a great trade for both teams because due to circumstances neither player was likely to be as good for their previous team as they are now.
The Ducks have also not been a very good team in 2011 and 2012.

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07-20-2013, 11:10 AM
  #85
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Originally Posted by Stephen View Post
Irrelevant.

We've gotten 103 points out of 110 Lupul games to date, and Gardiner on a full ELC including one All-Rookie team nomination to date. A nice 48 game campaign doesn't match that.
I dont think Duck fans would see it as irreverent. And it isnt just 1 nice season for Beauch, he has been great for them since his return.

I'm not saying the trade didnt work out great for us. Clearly it did. But why it so hard to understand that it worked out pretty good for the Ducks too.

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07-20-2013, 11:10 AM
  #86
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The Ducks have also not been a very good team in 2011 and 2012.
And we were?

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07-20-2013, 11:11 AM
  #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyris View Post
Beauch has been their #1 Dman since he returned to them and this season he was one of the best dmen in the league.

#1 Dman > Often injured 1st line winger.
It was a great trade for both teams because due to circumstances neither player was likely to be as good for their previous team as they are now.
Beauchemin finished 4th in Norris voting this past season and was named to the 2nd All-star team.

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Joining Toews on the Second All-Star Team are New York Rangers goaltender Henrik Lundqvist, defensemen Francois Beauchemin of the Anaheim Ducks and Kris Letang of the Penguins, right wing Martin St. Louis of the Tampa Bay Lightning, and Ovechkin at left wing.
Anaheim's mistake was not re-signing Beauchemin as a UFA and then needing to reacquire him through trade, otherwise he has been a big asset to that team.

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07-20-2013, 11:18 AM
  #88
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Originally Posted by Mess View Post
Beauchemin finished 4th in Norris voting this past season and was named to the 2nd All-star team.



Anaheim's mistake was not re-signing Beauchemin as a UFA and then needing to reacquire him through trade, otherwise he has been a big asset to that team.
Exactly!
I will never understand the obsession on HF with trying to prove 1 side won a trade.

This is as close to a win win trade as you can find. We traded a player that didnt really fit for a guy that has been great for us and a fantastic prospect.
They traded a guy that didnt fit for them and they couldnt afford for a guy that came in and was great for them and solidified their biggest area of weakness.

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07-20-2013, 11:23 AM
  #89
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Originally Posted by Cyris View Post
Exactly!
I will never understand the obsession on HF with trying to prove 1 side won a trade.

This is as close to a win win trade as you can find. We traded a player that didnt really fit for a guy that has been great for us and a fantastic prospect.
They traded a guy that didnt fit for them and they couldnt afford for a guy that came in and was great for them and solidified their biggest area of weakness.
Defensive dmen under coach Wilson like Schenn and Beauchemin would look bad because of the coaches system.

Beauchemin won a Cup in Anaheim when Carlyle was his coach and Schenn would look pretty good right now under Randy as well.

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07-20-2013, 11:28 AM
  #90
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Originally Posted by Mess View Post
Defensive dmen under coach Wilson like Schenn and Beauchemin would look bad because of the coaches system.

Beauchemin won a Cup in Anaheim when Carlyle was his coach and Schenn would look pretty good right now under Randy as well.
Beauch would be the perfect #2 dman this team desperately needs right now.
Still wouldn't reverse the trade tho. Lupul has been amazing for us and Gards is gonna be great.

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07-20-2013, 11:31 AM
  #91
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Originally Posted by number72 View Post
Schenn would be a Norris nominee in the making under Carlyle, who would coach Schenn on how to minimize shots against and only take high quality shots for.
this post made my day

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07-20-2013, 12:21 PM
  #92
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Originally Posted by Cyris View Post
I dont think Duck fans would see it as irreverent. And it isnt just 1 nice season for Beauch, he has been great for them since his return.

I'm not saying the trade didnt work out great for us. Clearly it did. But why it so hard to understand that it worked out pretty good for the Ducks too.
You might also be missing the part where Anaheim had to give up a recent first round pick at the time (plus Lupul, who was a throw in) to re-acquire a guy they didn't want to re-sign.

It's about the same as if we went out and traded a better Stuart Percy and Nikolai Kulemin to get Mikhail Grabovski back in a year and a half.

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07-20-2013, 02:25 PM
  #93
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Originally Posted by Stephen View Post
You might also be missing the part where Anaheim had to give up a recent first round pick at the time (plus Lupul, who was a throw in) to re-acquire a guy they didn't want to re-sign.

It's about the same as if we went out and traded a better Stuart Percy and Nikolai Kulemin to get Mikhail Grabovski back in a year and a half.
It is completely irreverent to us from a Leafs perspective that they missed out on resigning him.
It has no effect on the value we traded away or the value we got back.

I'm sure they regret no resigning him when they had the chance but I seriously doubt they regret the trade to get him back.

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07-20-2013, 05:13 PM
  #94
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Originally Posted by Cyris View Post
It is completely irreverent to us from a Leafs perspective that they missed out on resigning him.
It has no effect on the value we traded away or the value we got back.

I'm sure they regret no resigning him when they had the chance but I seriously doubt they regret the trade to get him back.
I really don't care how you want to break it down. We took something from them and got a premium giving him back after a short rental. If that's not a fleecing I don't know what is.

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07-20-2013, 05:28 PM
  #95
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Originally Posted by Stephen View Post
I really don't care how you want to break it down. We took something from them and got a premium giving him back after a short rental. If that's not a fleecing I don't know what is.
If both sides are happy with the trade why is it a fleecing? The fact that Beauch was a Duck has nothing to do with the later trade. The Ducks couldn't afford to resign him at the time so it isnt like we stolle him from them in the first place either.

Why do you and other insist on naming a winner on this trade, will we get a special award for it if you convince enough people?

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07-20-2013, 06:22 PM
  #96
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I don't miss Schenn. At all. The fact that he got us JVR is icing on the cake.

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07-20-2013, 07:03 PM
  #97
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Originally Posted by number72 View Post
Schenn would be a Norris nominee in the making under Carlyle, who would coach Schenn on how to minimize shots against and only take high quality shots for.
ummmm, no. The words Schenn and Norris should not be used in the same sentence.

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07-20-2013, 07:36 PM
  #98
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Originally Posted by Stephen View Post
I really don't care how you want to break it down. We took something from them and got a premium giving him back after a short rental. If that's not a fleecing I don't know what is.
Congrats go proclaim victory in this trade and win the internet.

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07-20-2013, 07:36 PM
  #99
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Schenn is no longer relevant. Regardless of what he could have been here, JVR is the better player and better suits out needs IMO.

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07-20-2013, 07:40 PM
  #100
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"Something happened early in Randy Carlyleís time coaching the Maple Leafs. He decided he didnít trust Luke Schenn on defence.
He didnít see in him the virtues that others in the hockey world believed in. So it was obvious once the coaching change was made that Schenn would no longer be a Leaf.
The Carlyle opinion tipped the scale after Leafs management and captain Dion Phaneuf had come to a similar conclusions earlier.
The player chosen fifth overall in 2008 never developed the way they wanted him to. He was too slow to react, unsure too often, playing an in between game on defence. He wasnít a shutdown defenceman, wasnít an offensive defenseman, was just a guy making too much money."

http://www.torontosun.com/2012/06/23...ight-have-been

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