HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk Trade rumors, transactions, and free agent talk. Rumors must contain the word RUMOR in post title. Proposals must contain the word PROPOSAL in post title.

Offers for Jovanovski...

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
06-21-2005, 11:48 PM
  #51
Peter Griffin
Registered User
 
Peter Griffin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Country: Canada
Posts: 27,071
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by IlkaScoraGoala
You're right, I threw that out there hypothetically.

What about Niitymakki and Handzus?
Value is there, but doesn't make sense really. Handzus doesn't fill a need and the Canucks can't be taking any chances in net. If they replace Cloutier it has to be with someone proven, not another question mark.

Peter Griffin is offline  
Old
06-22-2005, 02:10 AM
  #52
Shareefruck
Registered User
 
Shareefruck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Vancouver, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 17,333
vCash: 500
You know, based on all these suggestions, if the Niedermayer's are really coming, I'm beginning to really like the idea of trading Jovo if we could get this kind of return. Would automatically address some of our needs.

Handzus and Esche I'd do in a heartbeat too. IMO, Esche is an upgrade over Cloutier and Handzus is pretty good too. I'm not sure if he can play wing ( if he could, he'd work well with the Sedins ), but if not, he has pretty decent value. Edmonton could use a guy like Handzus- we might be able to get a guy like Smith from them. Then with Esche in, we could trade Cloutier for a power-forward right-winger to play with the Sedins.

Edit: I'm not following Philli much, but Knuble is someone I'm VERY interested in from a Vancouver standpoint. Is he even IN philli? Does he have around the same value as Handzus or what?


Last edited by Shareefruck: 06-22-2005 at 02:18 AM.
Shareefruck is offline  
Old
06-22-2005, 03:02 AM
  #53
QuickDynamite
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Abu Dhabi
Country: Abu Dhabi
Posts: 4,815
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by cyrisweb
... just because he plays on the second pairing doesn't make him any less of a #1/#2 dman... pair him up with a better dman than Malik and you will see him jump back up to the #1 pairing.. and it wouldn't make Ohlund any less of a dman.
I can agree with that. Jovanovski hasn't been as good since Lachance went to the Blue Jackets IMO.

QuickDynamite is offline  
Old
06-22-2005, 03:41 AM
  #54
QuickDynamite
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Abu Dhabi
Country: Abu Dhabi
Posts: 4,815
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfpack
You'd rather have a draft pick than Torres? Yikes, I didn't know Vancouver was building a cup-winning team for 2010.

That changes things, IMO. I'd do Smith and a pick for Jovanovski, even WITH Jovo's bloated contract.
Sorry, I didn't know Torres was that missing piece the Canucks needed to win a Stanley Cup. He is a 3rd liner on most teams or a 2nd liner on a bad team.

I'm not saying its a bad trade or I wouldn't do it. But the Canucks don't exactly need any third line players and they could do alot better than putting Torres w/ the Sedins.

QuickDynamite is offline  
Old
06-22-2005, 11:23 AM
  #55
Wolfpack
Registered User
 
Wolfpack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,036
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by chapel113x
Sorry, I didn't know Torres was that missing piece the Canucks needed to win a Stanley Cup. He is a 3rd liner on most teams or a 2nd liner on a bad team.

I'm not saying its a bad trade or I wouldn't do it. But the Canucks don't exactly need any third line players and they could do alot better than putting Torres w/ the Sedins.


Well, I guess we'll have to disagree. I simply believe that a 23-year old banging winger who scores 20 goals in his first full season in the NHL is more valuable than a draft pick.

IMO Raffi would shine with the Sedins. His style of play would be a good fit. But I guess we'll have to wait and see just how much better the Canucks can do in adding a winger to play with the twins.

By the way, I can't see the Oilers swinging any sort of deal with the Canucks anyway.

Wolfpack is offline  
Old
06-22-2005, 01:04 PM
  #56
flyer73
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Falher, Alberta
Posts: 50
vCash: 500
As a Flyer fan there is no way I trade my starting goaltender and #2 center for a dman that has taken quite a few steps backwards the last couple of years. I think Jovo could do well in Philly because of the system that they play but I don't see him being that valuable on hte trade market. If Philly was to make an offer I'd say Amonte and one of our lesser prospects like Sharp.

flyer73 is offline  
Old
06-22-2005, 02:55 PM
  #57
mercury
Registered User
 
mercury's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: South Philly/SoCal
Country: United States
Posts: 11,111
vCash: 500
Hitchcock would probably have several heart attacks trying to get Jovo (who is immensely talented) to be more defensively responsible.

mercury is offline  
Old
06-22-2005, 03:30 PM
  #58
QuickDynamite
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Abu Dhabi
Country: Abu Dhabi
Posts: 4,815
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfpack
Well, I guess we'll have to disagree. I simply believe that a 23-year old banging winger who scores 20 goals in his first full season in the NHL is more valuable than a draft pick.

IMO Raffi would shine with the Sedins. His style of play would be a good fit. But I guess we'll have to wait and see just how much better the Canucks can do in adding a winger to play with the twins.

By the way, I can't see the Oilers swinging any sort of deal with the Canucks anyway.
You are right the Canucks/Oilers would never make a trade of this magnitude. The Canucks would most likely deal Jovanovski to a team like Washington, Chicago, Anaheim or Florida.

Torres would shine with the Sedins because the Sedins are such talented playmakers, not because Torres is a raw talent. Hell, even Wade Brookbank played pretty good with the Sedins last season.

Like I said, im not saying I wouldn't do it. If I was the GM I would seriously consider this trade (Maybe put Cooke up with Naslund and Morrison, Bertuzzi with the Sedins, and Torres on the 3rd line).

BTW, since when is having lots of prospects and draft picks for the future in an organization a bad thing? I'd rather keep taking runs at the cup for many years then make one big shot for the cup like the Maple Leafs and tossing away the team's future.

QuickDynamite is offline  
Old
06-22-2005, 07:52 PM
  #59
Mizral
Registered User
 
Mizral's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Earth, MW
Country: Canada
Posts: 18,161
vCash: 500
Unfortunatly, many fans see Jovo as error prone and quick to take stupid penalties.

While he does make errors and take stupid penalties, they aren't immensely common either (the stupid penalty thing is a far greater problem than his errors).

However, the key to Jovo for me is he is a proven playoff performer. He is consistantly our best defenseman come playoff time. Say what you will about Ohlund, but he's yet to show a lot of offensive spark in the post-season compared to Jovo.

I would be unwilling to trade Jovocop for any defensemen in the league right now. Partially due to salary, but partially due to the fact that I feel he is the kind of defenseman who can win a Conn Smythe - there aren't many who have the talent to potentially do that these days.

I don't think the Canucks need to shed any salary right now. Primarily because I don't think the Canucks need to go UFA shopping outside of resigning their own guys. My only advice to Nonis would be to consider moving one of Salo or Malik to get a veteran guy who can just be a mean 'ol dog in front of our goaltender. Salo and Malik are big guys, but neither are very physical players. I would recommend we keep Malik over Salo. Though I think Salo is a slightly overall better player, Malik brings a huge stick and a big frame to move around that our D doesn't really have outside of him.

But.. yes, please keep Jovo.

Mizral is offline  
Old
06-22-2005, 10:23 PM
  #60
Peter Griffin
Registered User
 
Peter Griffin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Country: Canada
Posts: 27,071
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay Thompson
I don't think the Canucks need to shed any salary right now. Primarily because I don't think the Canucks need to go UFA shopping outside of resigning their own guys.
But if the Canucks have the opportunity to not only sign Scott Niedermayer, but also trade Jovo for help in another area, should they not do it? In all likelyhood, Nidermayer wont be going anywhere, he'll likely end up re-signing with the Devils, but if there is ANY chance of acquiring him, the Canucks should do everything they can to get him. And if that means moving out Jovo, they need to do it.

Quote:
My only advice to Nonis would be to consider moving one of Salo or Malik to get a veteran guy who can just be a mean 'ol dog in front of our goaltender. Salo and Malik are big guys, but neither are very physical players. I would recommend we keep Malik over Salo. Though I think Salo is a slightly overall better player, Malik brings a huge stick and a big frame to move around that our D doesn't really have outside of him.
Agreed. I have a feeling that Nonis may let both Malik and Salo walk though. Malik is basically the Canucks 6th d-man at this point, and he'd be an awesome 6th defenseman, but there are cheaper alternatives out there that could be a better fit. Kevin Bieksa is a definite possibility as the 6th/7th d-man, perhaps sharing that spot with a veteran journeyman. As for Salo, I really like the guy and has been a solid fit for the Canucks, but it's apparent that this defense could use more a more gritty, physical prescence on the backend, and replacing Salo with a solid, gritty, stay-at-home defenseman could be exactly what this team needs, especially if Niedermayer is swapped for Jovo.

In any case, there are going to be a lot of options open for Nonis regarding the backend once free agency opens up.

Quote:
But.. yes, please keep Jovo.
Agreed 100%, unless you have a chance to upgrade, then you HAVE to go for it IMO.

Peter Griffin is offline  
Old
06-23-2005, 04:04 AM
  #61
QuickDynamite
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Abu Dhabi
Country: Abu Dhabi
Posts: 4,815
vCash: 500
What do you guys think about bringing back Scott Lachance? He and Jovanovski has really good chemistry together. And he always roughed guys up infront of the net. He was always an underrated player with the Canucks and rarely made a bad mistake besides the occasional penalty.

Jovanovski, Lachance, Ohlund, Salo, Allen, Sopel would be a really solid defense.

QuickDynamite is offline  
Old
06-23-2005, 04:22 AM
  #62
JonathanTwinkleToews
is a Canuck fan.
 
JonathanTwinkleToews's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Vancouver
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,566
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by chapel113x
What do you guys think about bringing back Scott Lachance? He and Jovanovski has really good chemistry together. And he always roughed guys up infront of the net. He was always an underrated player with the Canucks and rarely made a bad mistake besides the occasional penalty.

Jovanovski, Lachance, Ohlund, Salo, Allen, Sopel would be a really solid defense.
He was at 2 million pre-lockout. With a 24% rollback, he's still be clocking around 1.5 mill. For he brings to the table, that might be a little too rich for the Canucks. I'd rather splurge more for that TRUE crease clearing defenseman or a legit scoring right wing..........or both

JonathanTwinkleToews is offline  
Old
06-23-2005, 04:22 AM
  #63
Iggy-4-50
Registered User
 
Iggy-4-50's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Country: Switzerland
Posts: 5,818
vCash: 500
As a Flames fan i hope the Nucks KEEP the bum...he actually helps us win

Iggy-4-50 is offline  
Old
06-23-2005, 04:55 AM
  #64
QuickDynamite
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Abu Dhabi
Country: Abu Dhabi
Posts: 4,815
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brule
He was at 2 million pre-lockout. With a 24% rollback, he's still be clocking around 1.5 mill. For he brings to the table, that might be a little too rich for the Canucks. I'd rather splurge more for that TRUE crease clearing defenseman or a legit scoring right wing..........or both
I thought he was Unrestricted? The Blue Jackets sure have made some bad signings (Sanderson, Marchant, Lachance).

QuickDynamite is offline  
Old
06-23-2005, 05:04 AM
  #65
JonathanTwinkleToews
is a Canuck fan.
 
JonathanTwinkleToews's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Vancouver
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,566
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by chapel113x
I thought he was Unrestricted? The Blue Jackets sure have made some bad signings (Sanderson, Marchant, Lachance).
I'm not sure if he's a UFA or not, probably is.

JonathanTwinkleToews is offline  
Old
06-23-2005, 11:54 AM
  #66
cyrisweb
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Calgary ab
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,149
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by chapel113x
I can agree with that. Jovanovski hasn't been as good since Lachance went to the Blue Jackets IMO.
Well not only that but look at the salt lake Olympics where he was mostly paired up with Blake. He played what was probably his best hockey ever and was named by several sources as "one of Canada's best" dman during the tournament. "The best dman" according the Cherry.

If you want to see greatness out of Jovo you need to pair him up with greatness. He then doesn't have to try to do everything.

I would love to keep Jovo and pair him up with Niedermayer. You'd see Jovo become the dominant dman we all know he can be and we'd see probably one of the best d-pairing the Canucks have had. Many Canuck posters have commented on how it's just not feasable money wise. But if I were Nonis I would look into every single possible option available(Trading Sopel, dropping Malik for a cheaper #6/prospect(Bieska?), dropping May(that's at least 2.5 million saved right there), asking for paycutsbefore pulling a trigger.

cyrisweb is offline  
Old
06-23-2005, 12:13 PM
  #67
ginner classic
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Kitsilano
Posts: 6,866
vCash: 500
Jovo is an elite d-man, that has an unusalu comination of youth, speed, grit and finesse. He is not a salary dump player and was making fair value for where the salaries were in the NHL. I'm sorry but I take a 5 million Jovo over a 10 million Pronger any day. Jovo's in the top ten and a rare commodity. I would like someone to tell me who exactly is available (guaranteed UFA), that is a better package.

Secondly, if there is a salary roll back, he is now a 3.75 million dollar #1 d-man.

Finally, I do not believe that a UFA age reduction will apply in the first year. There is no way the NHL would go for that. If the new UFA age is 29, it's not going to apply right away, I guarantee that.

He would be a good fit in Florida, LA, Chicago, Philly (perfect fit), Boston, etc. etc.

The sign Nieds, trade Jovo proposal is founded in pretty solid logic. I think it more likely however, that Ohlund would be more likely to go based on positional requirements. Niedermayer is a left side guy (that can play right), Jovo is always on the right. Ohlund has as much or more value on the trade market. I would personally rather keep Ohlund, but I am sure if Nieds does sign in Vancouver, then either one could be on the table.

ginner classic is offline  
Old
06-23-2005, 01:01 PM
  #68
Wolfpack
Registered User
 
Wolfpack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,036
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by chapel113x
BTW, since when is having lots of prospects and draft picks for the future in an organization a bad thing? I'd rather keep taking runs at the cup for many years then make one big shot for the cup like the Maple Leafs and tossing away the team's future.

I agree, but the point that I was making is that if you look at the Canucks, they are not the young team that they were a few years ago. Their key, core players are all at or near 30, and contrary to what the Maple Leafs' mamagement believes, players generally do not improve once they hit 35. So if Vancouver wants to win with their current line-up, they might have a 4 or 5 year window. If the Canucks best chance at winning a cup is coming within the next 4 years, doesn't it make more sense to get a 23 year old who can help you do that rather than a draft pick who probably won't play for you within that 5 year window? It's not like you're trading for a 34 year old, after all.

Just my opinion of course.

Wolfpack is offline  
Old
06-23-2005, 02:01 PM
  #69
Buffaloed
Administrator
Webmaster
 
Buffaloed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Buffalo, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 24,957
vCash: 2068
I think Buffalo would be interested, considering what they were willing to pay Zhitnik. I'd have no qualms about making McKee, Dumont, Afinogenov, and Biron available in some combination to acquire a player like Jovanovsky. The fans here would love him.

Buffaloed is offline  
Old
06-23-2005, 03:36 PM
  #70
tinyzombies
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Calif via Montreal
Posts: 11,705
vCash: 500
I don't think Jovo-Zed makes sense for either team.

Jovo coughs up the puck too much, which is one of Montreal's biggest problems (aside from size up front).

Zednik is really the only experienced winger on the entire team if you don't count Bonk, who is expected to play third line center.

And there are plenty of players on the market, why would either team do it?

tinyzombies is offline  
Old
06-23-2005, 04:33 PM
  #71
Peter Griffin
Registered User
 
Peter Griffin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Country: Canada
Posts: 27,071
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Buffaloed
I think Buffalo would be interested, considering what they were willing to pay Zhitnik. I'd have no qualms about making McKee, Dumont, Afinogenov, and Biron available in some combination to acquire a player like Jovanovsky. The fans here would love him.

No interest in Biron, no better than Cloutier and considering the Sabres have to protect Noronen and Miller, he'll likely become available before the waiver draft. Afinogenov is a huge question mark still. Dumont is nice, but I'm sure there are better options out there. I like McKee, but he seems to have taken a huge step back from a few years ago. IMO, you'd have to offer up some better options in order to get JovoCop.

Peter Griffin is offline  
Old
06-23-2005, 04:50 PM
  #72
Shareefruck
Registered User
 
Shareefruck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Vancouver, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 17,333
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Griffin
But if the Canucks have the opportunity to not only sign Scott Niedermayer, but also trade Jovo for help in another area, should they not do it? In all likelyhood, Nidermayer wont be going anywhere, he'll likely end up re-signing with the Devils, but if there is ANY chance of acquiring him, the Canucks should do everything they can to get him. And if that means moving out Jovo, they need to do it.



Agreed. I have a feeling that Nonis may let both Malik and Salo walk though. Malik is basically the Canucks 6th d-man at this point, and he'd be an awesome 6th defenseman, but there are cheaper alternatives out there that could be a better fit. Kevin Bieksa is a definite possibility as the 6th/7th d-man, perhaps sharing that spot with a veteran journeyman. As for Salo, I really like the guy and has been a solid fit for the Canucks, but it's apparent that this defense could use more a more gritty, physical prescence on the backend, and replacing Salo with a solid, gritty, stay-at-home defenseman could be exactly what this team needs, especially if Niedermayer is swapped for Jovo.

In any case, there are going to be a lot of options open for Nonis regarding the backend once free agency opens up.



Agreed 100%, unless you have a chance to upgrade, then you HAVE to go for it IMO.
Salo's more than just a little bit better than Malik. He's MUCH better defensively, MUCH better offensively, and even slightly more physical. The only thing Malik has on him is reach and I hardly think that's valuable enough to warrant keeping him around over Salo. Come'on guys, 30 point defensive studs like Salo aren't THAT common.

Shareefruck is offline  
Old
06-23-2005, 05:22 PM
  #73
Peter Griffin
Registered User
 
Peter Griffin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Country: Canada
Posts: 27,071
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2agingmonk
Salo's more than just a little bit better than Malik. He's MUCH better defensively, MUCH better offensively, and even slightly more physical. The only thing Malik has on him is reach and I hardly think that's valuable enough to warrant keeping him around over Salo. Come'on guys, 30 point defensive studs like Salo aren't THAT common.
Where did I say that Salo wasn't MUCH better than Malik? The fact is that Salo is a UFA, he can go whereever he wants, the Canucks can't just keep him, they'd have to sign him as a UFA. Malik is an RFA, much easier to keep than Salo.

Peter Griffin is offline  
Old
06-23-2005, 05:32 PM
  #74
Edonator
The Mightiest Club
 
Edonator's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: vancouver
Country: Bosnia and Herzegovina
Posts: 4,250
vCash: 500
Salo is used in every situation and Crawford can count on him to get the job done. Same can't be said for the other four defensemen we have (minus Ohlund). We shouldn't even be having a conversation comparing him with Malik as it's not fair to Marek. Burke got more than any of us expected when he dealt disgruntled forward Peter Schaefer for Salo. He's been more than we ever expected and easily our #3 dman and was our second best dman last year. Losing him will leave a big whole for Nonis to replace and swapping him with Neids wouldn't be a major boost to the team like it would be swapping Neids with Malik. Salo's great.

Edonator is offline  
Old
06-24-2005, 02:31 AM
  #75
QuickDynamite
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Abu Dhabi
Country: Abu Dhabi
Posts: 4,815
vCash: 500
To Vancouver:
Jay McKee
JP Dumont
Drew Stafford

To Buffalo:
Ed Jovanovski
Brent Sopel

QuickDynamite is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:40 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2015 All Rights Reserved.