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Cody Franson Trade Talk "Will Heat Up"

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Old
08-01-2013, 12:26 PM
  #976
Holymakinaw
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Originally Posted by BigDaddyLurch View Post
For a PMD, Tom Gilbert...Ron Hainsey is a better all-around Dman, as is Ian White...there are better options than Liles out there right now for other teams looking for Dmen...





See above...

LOL. Gilbert, Hainsey, White.........Too funny.

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08-01-2013, 12:27 PM
  #977
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Originally Posted by Blaylock38 View Post
All fanbases own players are.
Some teams have varying degrees of it. Visit Habs board where 2/3 of the lineup/prospects are hated on by own fan base. There's already a thread questioning Fucale's abilities 1 month after he was drafted.

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08-01-2013, 12:33 PM
  #978
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Originally Posted by Holymakinaw View Post
LOL. Gilbert, Hainsey, White.........Too funny.
Dude, you can "LOL" all you want; all three are better options to teams looking for D right now...they'd be cheaper, cost nothing to sign, and perform just as well, if not better...if the Leafs want to move Liles without buying him out, they're throwing a costly sweetener asset in with him, plain & simple...and even then, there's no guarantee there'll even be a buyer unless the asset thrown in makes it unresistable...

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08-01-2013, 12:38 PM
  #979
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Originally Posted by BigDaddyLurch View Post
Dude, you can "LOL" all you want; all three are better options to teams looking for D right now...they'd be cheaper, cost nothing to sign, and perform just as well, if not better...if the Leafs want to move Liles without buying him out, they're throwing a costly sweetener asset in with him, plain & simple...and even then, there's no guarantee there'll even be a buyer unless the asset thrown in makes it unresistable...
I honestly don't understand why he doesn't get that, but this lays it out perfectly.

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08-01-2013, 12:44 PM
  #980
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Franson + Liles + retained salary for Duchene?

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08-01-2013, 12:45 PM
  #981
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Franson + Liles + retained salary for Duchene?

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08-01-2013, 12:48 PM
  #982
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Lol. A leafs fan says no to this? You truly are delusional.

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08-01-2013, 12:55 PM
  #983
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All Leaf players are
Ha, yeah. What's Stastny's value again? I need updating.

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08-01-2013, 01:00 PM
  #984
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Ha, yeah. What's Stastny's value again? I need updating.
ROR = Bergeron

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08-01-2013, 01:02 PM
  #985
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Originally Posted by BigDaddyLurch View Post
Dude, you can "LOL" all you want; all three are better options to teams looking for D right now...they'd be cheaper, cost nothing to sign, and perform just as well, if not better...if the Leafs want to move Liles without buying him out, they're throwing a costly sweetener asset in with him, plain & simple...and even then, there's no guarantee there'll even be a buyer unless the asset thrown in makes it unresistable...
LOL.

Keep telling yourself that.

If it's so hard to trade Liles because "other teams are already set" then why is it so easy for one of these LESSER D-Men to land a job?

Why are they all still unsigned?

Here's a clue.......They're not very good any more.

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08-01-2013, 01:03 PM
  #986
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ROR = Bergeron
Can you provide some quotes from Avs fans who said ROR is as good as Bergeron?

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08-01-2013, 01:07 PM
  #987
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go ahead. We'll gladly take your lottery pick


Think.

$3.3M offer sheet would find the Leafs in a pickle.

Match and find a way to shed some salary to sign Kadri + not being allowed to trade Franson for a year?

Accept a 2nd-round pick?

Decision, decision...

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08-01-2013, 01:11 PM
  #988
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Originally Posted by Holymakinaw View Post
LOL.

Keep telling yourself that.

If it's so hard to trade Liles because "other teams are already set" then why is it so easy for one of these LESSER D-Men to land a job?

Why are they all still unsigned?

Here's a clue.......They're not very good any more.
Dude, why would you quote my post when you're absolutely ignoring everything posted in it and bringing crap up that I've never mentioned??...I never once said anywhere that "other teams are already set"...not once...my post is simple; Gilbert, Hainsey, and White would be better options to teams looking for D for the reasons I stated earlier, so I doubt if a Liles trade is going to happen without the Leafs giving up a prime asset along with him...I'm sorry you can't seem to grasp that but, please, stay with the debate at hand if you're going to quote posts in it...thank you...

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08-01-2013, 01:19 PM
  #989
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Originally Posted by nwaZ View Post
Lol. A leafs fan says no to this? You truly are delusional.
He's not saying no, he's shaking his head at your ridiculous offer. You are a sad, sad individual if you think that is a fair trade

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08-01-2013, 01:21 PM
  #990
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Originally Posted by BigDaddyLurch View Post
Dude, why would you quote my post when you're absolutely ignoring everything posted in it and bringing crap up that I've never mentioned??...I never once said anywhere that "other teams are already set"...not once...my post is simple; Gilbert, Hainsey, and White would be better options to teams looking for D for the reasons I stated earlier, so I doubt if a Liles trade is going to happen without the Leafs giving up a prime asset along with him...I'm sorry you can't seem to grasp that but, please, stay with the debate at hand if you're going to quote posts in it...thank you...
or eating a good chunk of his salary.

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08-01-2013, 01:26 PM
  #991
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Originally Posted by Barney Gumble View Post
or eating a good chunk of his salary.
Even then, those other Dmen would probably still be better options, as they'd cost around the same as a discounted Liles and not cost the team an asset to get them, they just have to sign them...unless, of course, the Leafs ate alot of Liles salary; but then that would pretty much defeat the purpose of moving him in the first place, as the savings wouldn't really be alot of cap space...any way you slice it, this situation sucks fro the Leafs...

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08-01-2013, 01:32 PM
  #992
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Holymakinaw View Post
LOL.

Keep telling yourself that.

If it's so hard to trade Liles because "other teams are already set" then why is it so easy for one of these LESSER D-Men to land a job?

Why are they all still unsigned?

Here's a clue.......They're not very good any more.
With the cap coming down, and many teams already at that roster limit, dmen who offer poor bang for the buck aren't exactly in high demand. That is why some of these UFAs haven't got deals, and also why Toronto has been unable to move Liles.

In the case of guys like Hainsey, I suspect it has more to do with just refusing to deal with realities. He probably went into this summer wanting a big payday, but the current economic realities are not there.

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08-01-2013, 01:33 PM
  #993
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Originally Posted by nwaZ View Post
Franson + Liles + retained salary for Duchene?
We can't retain salary though, we need cap space

Maybe Franson + Liles + Bozak for Duchene and a mid round pick? (3rd or 4th)

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08-01-2013, 01:34 PM
  #994
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Originally Posted by Holymakinaw View Post
Why? Why would they trade him back then, when they MIGHT have been able to fit everyone in? It's only now, that the dust is settling, that Nonis can see what needs to be done to complete his summer of work.

It doesn't mean there was no interest in Liles all along, it could also mean that the Leafs weren't ready to trade him away 1-2 months ago.
Liles has clearly been the odd man out since Carlyle took over. He got into less playoff games than Ryan O'Byrne whom Toronto thought so highly of that they didn't even bother to re-sign him; he averaged less minutes-per-game in the playoffs than Mark Fraser. He played less games and averaged over three minutes less per game than Michael Kostka, whom the Leafs thought so highly of that they didn't even outbid Chicago's $600k-ish 2-way deal for him. Liles has been on the outside looking in for a long time in Toronto.

Quote:
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Liles can be a valuable player to most teams in the league barring they aren't overloaded with offensive D. The Leafs don't WANT to get rid of him... the point is if they're forced to cut cap costs with the cap and Franson/Kadri re-signings, Liles would be the logical choice to be shipped out. He most definitely can be traded... in this market with very few teams having cap I doubt the Leafs would get very much, but he can be moved for sure. I doubt the Leafs want to just give away a solid puck moving defenceman that they gave up a 2nd for only a couple years ago but it might come to that.
Liles has a $3.9 million cap hit for the next three (!) seasons. Who is going to pay $3.9 million for the next three years for a guy whose numbers have dropped badly in the past two seasons (27 and 11 points!)?!

Not mention there are only 14 current NHL teams who could fit Liles under their cap right now, and of those 14 five of those teams have significant RFAs to re-sign that will account for a good portion of that cap-space (NJD (Henrique); OTT (Cowen); STL (Pietrangelo); VAN (Tanev); and WAS (Johansson)); three are teams where he'd be redundant (Anaheim, Calgary, Phoenix) and four have an internal budget which they're going to be unlikely to add $3.9 million cap hits to (Carolina, Florida, Nashville, NY Islanders). That leaves two teams Colorado (Who already dumped him for a draft pick and have 6 d-men on 1-way deals) and Buffalo (who already have three offensively-minded defencemen in Jamie McBain, Tyler Myers and Christian Ehrhoff).

So, there is basically no market for Liles, unless Toronto wants to retain salary or take some back, which would defeat the whole purpose of the Liles trade.

If Toronto wants to part ways with Liles, it will almost certainly have to be a buy-out.

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08-01-2013, 01:34 PM
  #995
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Originally Posted by BigDaddyLurch View Post
Even then, those other Dmen would probably still be better options, as they'd cost around the same as a discounted Liles and not cost the team an asset to get them, they just have to sign them...unless, of course, the Leafs ate alot of Liles salary; but then that would pretty much defeat the purpose of moving him in the first place, as the savings wouldn't really be alot of cap space...any way you slice it, this situation sucks fro the Leafs...
You'd think with all the attention that they get that the Leafs were the only team up against the cap.....Buyout is a colossal waste of money but seems the much more logical route if Liles value is as poor as reflected here.

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08-01-2013, 01:35 PM
  #996
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With the cap coming down, and many teams already at that roster limit, dmen who offer poor bang for the buck aren't exactly in high demand. That is why some of these UFAs haven't got deals, and also why Toronto has been unable to move Liles.

In the case of guys like Hainsey, I suspect it has more to do with just refusing to deal with realities. He probably went into this summer wanting a big payday, but the current economic realities are not there.
You have NO IDEA if Toronto has even tried to move Liles. You're just making stuff up apparently? How fun for you.

And to the others......I've ALWAYS said that Toronto would likely have to "sweeten the pot" to move Liles, but it wouldn't be as much as some on here suggest. And not as little as some suggest either.

As always, it'll be somewhere in the middle.

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08-01-2013, 01:43 PM
  #997
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We can't retain salary though, we need cap space

Maybe Franson + Liles + Bozak for Duchene and a mid round pick? (3rd or 4th)
Was it supposed to be a better proposal?

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08-01-2013, 01:47 PM
  #998
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How many times have we gone over this in this thread?

1) The Leafs have already used their two compliance buyouts;
2) There is a second regular buyout period that exists for teams who had two players apply for arbitration, like the Leafs;
3) JM Liles can then be bought out if the Leafs so desire.
I didn't say he couldn't be bought out, just that it wouldn't be painless or "easy-peasy".

Get off your high horse.

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08-01-2013, 01:47 PM
  #999
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Originally Posted by Beastly Bozak View Post
We can't retain salary though, we need cap space

Maybe Franson + Liles + Bozak for Duchene and a mid round pick? (3rd or 4th)

If by "Franson, Liles & Bozak" you mean "Kessel" then I'd agree with you.

You must stop now. You are making my side ache from all the laughter.


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08-01-2013, 01:49 PM
  #1000
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Originally Posted by Holymakinaw View Post
You have NO IDEA if Toronto has even tried to move Liles. You're just making stuff up apparently? How fun for you
Sort of like the way Leaf fans obsessively manufacturer NYI interest in their expensive contract dumps, eh?

There were actually multiple reports of the Leafs shopping Liles.

http://www.cbssports.com/nhl/blog/ey...nmichael-liles


If CBS Sports or another source at that level had reported something dumb like "Leafs talking to Isles about Liles" you guys would probably crash the net with fantasy deals. So, don't even bother trying to act like this "source" can be completely ignored.

I think you can take this sort of report with a grain of salt, but where there is smoke there is usually fire.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Holymakinaw View Post

And to the others......I've ALWAYS said that Toronto would likely have to "sweeten the pot" to move Liles, but it wouldn't be as much as some on here suggest. And not as little as some suggest either.

As always, it'll be somewhere in the middle.
This I mostly agree with....

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