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Do Habs fans think that Bergevin is going to ice this roster ?

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Old
08-05-2013, 10:00 AM
  #176
Dr Gonzo
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Originally Posted by RyanBostonRedsox View Post
Penner hasn't scored 20 goals in 3 years. MacArthur is a LW, not a RW where Briere plays. Bouchard is injury-prone. Stalberg is overpaid. And he signed for 4 years, not 2 or less. Any more players.

The defense rests its case. This case is dismissed.

I'm bored so I am going to play Devil's advocate.

1) Good call on Penner. Neither has Briere.
2) MacArthur is a LW, but Briere isn't even really a RW. He played there last year and was TERRIBLE. I have no doubts that MacArthur could have matched his output at RW.
3) In what world is $3M for Stalberg overpaying? He's a 20 goal scorer.

Your case may pass in kangaroo court, but to be honest it's very skewed reasoning.

Then again, I am just butting in and have no better alternatives to suggest. So what do I know?

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08-05-2013, 10:12 AM
  #177
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Definitely not our biggest problem, I agree, poor defense I agree, however when he's getting beat glove hand or thru the legs please explain how defense can prevent this? He is a good goalie , probably most technically sound goalie in league..but..he has not taken it to another level as Patrick Roy did in 1989 when he won cup practically by himself. Or as Halak did a few years ago, we have yet to see this type of performance from Price, do you agree? By now, at his age, he should have done this. Easy crutch to blame defense when a goalie plays like crap, he still has to win games by himself which Price has yet to do in playoffs. So yes, Price not our biggest problem but he has to step it up big time, this can be seen by commentators across the sports universe who are appointing Luongo as team Canada starter in 2014 Olympics.

That is all.
I think we saw that performance two years ago against the Bruins. We lost in the first round but it was despite Price's performance.

Problem is that he's been a great goalie for the better part of three years now but for two of those seasons he's played behind crap teams. This past season our team looked good but when Emelin went down our D was really exposed. Price played like crap for a while too and there's no doubt he has to be better than he was.

But if the standard is Patrick Roy then he'll never be good enough. And that's the problem. Folks keep thinking about Roy (who was arguably the best goalie ever) and then say "why can't Price do this?"

No goalie will ever be able to live up to that. And even Roy himself was behind stellar defensive teams. So now we've got a goalie who isn't as good as Roy playing behind teams that don't protect him (or go to the other team's net for that matter) and then we wonder why we don't win and blame Price.

To me it was a no-brainer decision to go get a shutdown guy. Shocked we didn't do it. I'm hopeful that we'll still get one but man we're really leaving Price out to dry.

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08-05-2013, 11:13 AM
  #178
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Originally Posted by habs03 View Post
Ps like Penner, Briere hasn't score 20 goals in 3 years...
Briere scored 34 goals in 2010-11.

But I think the person you're quoting mean scoring 20 in the last 3 years combined. Penner has 11 total in 3 years.

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08-05-2013, 11:33 AM
  #179
Dr Gonzo
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Originally Posted by Habsterix View Post
Briere scored 34 goals in 2010-11.

But I think the person you're quoting mean scoring 20 in the last 3 years combined. Penner has 11 total in 3 years.
But...he's...HUGE!!!!

#moarbigger

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08-05-2013, 11:41 AM
  #180
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To OP,

...

yeah, he's gonna ice those roosters.

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08-05-2013, 11:57 AM
  #181
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Originally Posted by ChemiseBleuHonnete View Post
To OP,

...

yeah, he's gonna ice those roosters.
To the poster ^

More roosters than the Nords right ?

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Old
08-05-2013, 12:09 PM
  #182
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Habsterix View Post
Briere scored 34 goals in 2010-11.

But I think the person you're quoting mean scoring 20 in the last 3 years combined. Penner has 11 total in 3 years.
Oh then he would be correct if he was talking about total goals, because in 2010-11 Penner had 20+ goals

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Old
08-05-2013, 12:15 PM
  #183
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Habsterix View Post
Briere scored 34 goals in 2010-11.

But I think the person you're quoting mean scoring 20 in the last 3 years combined. Penner has 11 total in 3 years.
Penner had 2 goals last year, 7 the year before and 23 the year before that.

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Old
08-05-2013, 12:21 PM
  #184
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Originally Posted by Pierre Dagenais View Post
Penner had 2 goals last year, 7 the year before and 23 the year before that.
My bad. Forgot to add the goals he had as an Oiler. Still, Briere has been a lot more productive.

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08-05-2013, 02:16 PM
  #185
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There will be no more moves and we'll start the season with the same ''boring to watch'' club. At least P.K Subban is fun to watch.... omfg.

Signing Brière at the end of his career was The move now its over. What an improvement MB wow ! soo that's it ?

oh wait...

Kristo vs Thomas (LOL) Another small guy....like the habs didnt have enough...another move nobody care about.

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08-05-2013, 04:03 PM
  #186
Beendair Donedat
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The Briere signing was horrible. No other way to look at it.... Lost out on Vinny, signs the next "big" Québécois out there. Leaves the Habs with midgets: Briere, Gionta, Gallagher and Desharnais in the top 9 roster spots. Nobody wants Gionta at the current price tag. You're stuck with a declining Briere, and a lost looking Desharnais for the next two years at high price tags. Why?

Habs won't win with these small gutless players on their roster. Not when it counts anyway. They will be pushed around and bullied by the stronger teams as they have been for the past 10-15 years?

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08-05-2013, 05:50 PM
  #187
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beendair Donedat View Post
The Briere signing was horrible. No other way to look at it.... Lost out on Vinny, signs the next "big" Québécois out there. Leaves the Habs with midgets: Briere, Gionta, Gallagher and Desharnais in the top 9 roster spots. Nobody wants Gionta at the current price tag. You're stuck with a declining Briere, and a lost looking Desharnais for the next two years at high price tags. Why?

Habs won't win with these small gutless players on their roster. Not when it counts anyway. They will be pushed around and bullied by the stronger teams as they have been for the past 10-15 years?
WTF?

I'm not a fan of the Briere signing, but to call him, gionta, Gallagher or Desharnais "gutless" is beyond absurd...

the only reason they've made it this far DESPITE their physical limitations is precisely because they are among the GUTSIEST players in the league.

comments like that, aside from being incredibly ignorant, are exactly why it becomes difficult to have quality discussions around... the "noise" of extreme and flat out stupid commentary distracts people from the legitimate talking points on either side of the arguments

get a clue

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Old
08-05-2013, 06:46 PM
  #188
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miller Time View Post
WTF?

I'm not a fan of the Briere signing, but to call him, gionta, Gallagher or Desharnais "gutless" is beyond absurd...

the only reason they've made it this far DESPITE their physical limitations is precisely because they are among the GUTSIEST players in the league.

comments like that, aside from being incredibly ignorant, are exactly why it becomes difficult to have quality discussions around... the "noise" of extreme and flat out stupid commentary distracts people from the legitimate talking points on either side of the arguments

get a clue
Great post as usual MillerTime.

Yes those midgets made it to the best stage in the world with everything stacked against them because they were gutless . The team makeup is not their doing.

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08-05-2013, 08:52 PM
  #189
Beendair Donedat
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Originally Posted by habsfanatics View Post
Great post as usual MillerTime.

Yes those midgets made it to the best stage in the world with everything stacked against them because they were gutless . The team makeup is not their doing.
Briere is and always has been a gutless puke. Now he's an old and declining.
Desharnais has very very very little testictular fortitude
Gionta was okay but is now old, injury prone and overpaid
Gallagher is a warrior and shows up every shift.

When you have these 4 in your top 9, you won't win anything. Like when the Habs had Koivu, Petrov and Bure. I'll be surprised if they make the playoffs.

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08-05-2013, 09:03 PM
  #190
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I've said this before, don't be blind by the regular season's performances of last year: we are rebuilding. I think that's what MB had in mind and he's not changing course. Briere is just there to fill a jersey.

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08-05-2013, 09:05 PM
  #191
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beendair Donedat View Post
Briere is and always has been a gutless puke. Now he's an old and declining.
Desharnais has very very very little testictular fortitude
Gionta was okay but is now old, injury prone and overpaid
Gallagher is a warrior and shows up every shift.

When you have these 4 in your top 9, you won't win anything. Like when the Habs had Koivu, Petrov and Bure. I'll be surprised if they make the playoffs.
The small guys didn't create the roster. They've made it where they are with extremely hard work. I get that you're butt hurt Briere picked Philly before, but it's time to move on.

No doubt you were probably surprised last year when we made the playoffs too, that's not really saying much for ya.

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08-05-2013, 09:30 PM
  #192
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beendair Donedat View Post
Briere is and always has been a gutless puke. Now he's an old and declining.
Desharnais has very very very little testictular fortitude
Gionta was okay but is now old, injury prone and overpaid
Gallagher is a warrior and shows up every shift.

When you have these 4 in your top 9, you won't win anything. Like when the Habs had Koivu, Petrov and Bure. I'll be surprised if they make the playoffs.
I don't even know where to start with this. I guess I won't. Then again, if I told you Neal Broten and Stephane Richer led a team in scoring to the Stanley Cup you'd stutter something about Mike Peluso I'm sure.

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08-05-2013, 09:36 PM
  #193
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Originally Posted by habsfanatics View Post
The small guys didn't create the roster. They've made it where they are with extremely hard work. I get that you're butt hurt Briere picked Philly before, but it's time to move on.

No doubt you were probably surprised last year when we made the playoffs too, that's not really saying much for ya.
Most of us didn't think the team would make the playoffs though. Gallagher and Galchenyuk made a huge difference.

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Originally Posted by No Team Needed View Post
I don't even know where to start with this. I guess I won't. Then again, if I told you Neal Broten and Stephane Richer led a team in scoring to the Stanley Cup you'd stutter something about Mike Peluso I'm sure.
Richer? Nobody should be surprised by that. Great player, pretty big guy too if I recall.

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08-05-2013, 10:08 PM
  #194
RyanBostonRedsox
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Originally Posted by Dr Gonzo View Post
I'm bored so I am going to play Devil's advocate.

1) Good call on Penner. Neither has Briere.
2) MacArthur is a LW, but Briere isn't even really a RW. He played there last year and was TERRIBLE. I have no doubts that MacArthur could have matched his output at RW.
3) In what world is $3M for Stalberg overpaying? He's a 20 goal scorer.

Your case may pass in kangaroo court, but to be honest it's very skewed reasoning.

Then again, I am just butting in and have no better alternatives to suggest. So what do I know?
1) This is true.
2) Regardless, Briere fits a need, MacArthur does not.
3) 20 goal scorer? He's scored 20 goals once in his career. He was a healthy scratch in Chicago quite a bit during the playoffs. There's a reason for that.

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08-05-2013, 10:14 PM
  #195
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Originally Posted by Lshap View Post
Your case seems to be built on this: "Look! All those other guys were even worse signings than Briere!". And I mostly agree that Montreal was better off NOT signing those guys. But for the same reasons, Montreal would've been better off not signing Briere.

The point was we didn't need to sign any of them -- not Ryder, not MacArthur, not Clarkson, and certainly not Briere. All those guys are mid-depth offense, which we already have on the roster and in our prospect pool. I'd love Briere to light it up with 25+ goals, but his history suggests a smaller output. So why do we need him when our solid draft picks will be able to do the same 2nd/3rd line job within a couple of years? Why did we need to saddle ourselves with any multi-million dollar contract? To use up the Cap? Because there was no other UFA to buy? Why did we need to buy anything?

The bottom line is that we don't need much of what Briere has to offer. This season should be about developing rookies, maybe doling out ice time for our prospects, re-signing Subban and then waiting to pounce on a trade for a big defenseman or prime forward. It shouldn't be about taking a two-year sentimental journey with a limited small forward who won't be around for our future Cup run, and whose contract leaves us with $4M less to trade or buy a real difference-maker.

We've been saving our pennies, so let's spend them on a player that makes a difference. Top players will become available as the season starts; we should be the team that can afford them. So many teams have crippled themselves with stupid contracts; Montreal should be the team that says, "We Pay Top Dollar for Young, Big and Talented Players!". Once the season starts and teams get itchy to trade and dump contracts, that's when Bergevin gathers his balls and does whatever it takes to get that big missing piece and make this team into a real contender.
First bold- That's exactly what I'm saying. The Briere signing wasn't my favorite signing, but he was the best short-term player available on the market without breaking the bank.

Second bold- Who do you suggest we put in a top-6 role that played in Hamilton last year? Leblanc? The guy played 18 games.

I'm going to repeat myself one more time: I don't like the Briere signing, but at the same time, it was the best Bergevin could have done without, a, breaking the bank and b, signing a guy longterm.

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08-05-2013, 10:29 PM
  #196
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Originally Posted by RyanBostonRedsox View Post

I'm going to repeat myself one more time: I don't like the Briere signing, but at the same time, it was the best Bergevin could have done without, a, breaking the bank and b, signing a guy longterm.
Ryder was an option... a safer one at that.

Morrow was another option, and a much better roster fit.

Cleary was also an option.

All 3 of those players = better risk/reward + fit IMO.

Morrow & cleary much better, given that they wouldn't "cost" guys like Gallagher/Eller/galch opportunities to be used in more "offensive" minutes/ roles the way briere will.

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08-06-2013, 12:24 AM
  #197
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Originally Posted by RyanBostonRedsox View Post
First bold- That's exactly what I'm saying. The Briere signing wasn't my favorite signing, but he was the best short-term player available on the market without breaking the bank.

Second bold- Who do you suggest we put in a top-6 role that played in Hamilton last year? Leblanc? The guy played 18 games.
Why does it have to come from Hamilton?

Eller, Galchenyuk, Plecs, Bourque, Max, Gallagher, Gionta, DD... There's a bunch of guys who could play top six. Plus we could promote Prust to the 2nd line (which really wouldn't be a bad idea actually) and he could play with Gallagher and Galchenyuk.

Gionta Plecs Bourque
Prust Galchenyuk Gallagher
DD Eller Max

Something like that would be fine. If Gionta can't start the year just promote somebody from the 3rd line...
Quote:
Originally Posted by RyanBostonRedsox View Post
I'm going to repeat myself one more time: I don't like the Briere signing, but at the same time, it was the best Bergevin could have done without, a, breaking the bank and b, signing a guy longterm.
The best he could've done would've been to ignore Briere and the UFA market altogether. Go after a shutdown guy, maybe get a 3rd liner with grit to round out the forwards... you're good to go for now. Let Eller and Galchenyuk suck up some top six minutes. Eller for sure is ready for it.

Just 'cause Briere was arguably the best of a bad lot doesn't mean that we should've gone after him.

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08-06-2013, 12:35 AM
  #198
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Originally Posted by Miller Time View Post
Ryder was an option... a safer one at that.

Morrow was another option, and a much better roster fit.

Cleary was also an option.

All 3 of those players = better risk/reward + fit IMO.

Morrow & cleary much better, given that they wouldn't "cost" guys like Gallagher/Eller/galch opportunities to be used in more "offensive" minutes/ roles the way briere will.
First and foremost, Cleary was NOT a better option. Guy Carbonneau said that Bergevin was talking to Morrow so why cry about him being a better option? I wouldn't pay Morrow Briere's money, far from there. And finally, haven't we heard that Ryder wasn't happy about coming back and that he didn't want to re-sign? What's to say that it wasn't mutual?

It's easy to come up with names but do we know what went on behind closed doors?

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08-06-2013, 12:47 AM
  #199
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Originally Posted by Habsterix View Post
First and foremost, Cleary was NOT a better option. Guy Carbonneau said that Bergevin was talking to Morrow so why cry about him being a better option? I wouldn't pay Morrow Briere's money, far from there. And finally, haven't we heard that Ryder wasn't happy about coming back and that he didn't want to re-sign? What's to say that it wasn't mutual?

It's easy to come up with names but do we know what went on behind closed doors?
Even if all of this is true its still stupid to go get Briere.

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08-06-2013, 02:13 AM
  #200
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Looking at the depth chart, our RW is an absolute joke, Gionta 5'7 Gallagher 5'9, Breire 5'10, and maybe some one can help me out, but but the top 2 RW for the Bulldogs are most likely going to be Thomas 5'9 and Leblanc 6'.

They gotta go up against nothing but huge D-men playing LD in our division.

Cowen, Methot, Phillips all between 6'3 and 6'5, Chara at 6'9, Tallinder at 6'4, Aule Brewer, and Hedman all between 6'4 and 6'6, Phaneuf and Fraser at 6'3 and 6'4, Detriot with no LD under 6'3.

Just rewatch Bergevin press confernce July 5th explain the Briere signing, and only good I see coming from the signing, is that Bergevin knows his honeymoon is over, you can hear it in his voice that he got mad when media where drilling him with question about size after what he said on draft day. I don't know what was worse for me, Gauthier finding away to talk himself from answer questions like a little *****, or Bergevin straight up contradicting himself in a matter or days, when he said that getting size in the draft was about sending a message, and filling a team need, and then going out to sign Briere.. lol

Edit: atleast we got Parros for some size on RW.


Last edited by habs03: 08-06-2013 at 02:21 AM.
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