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Old
09-25-2013, 01:25 PM
  #176
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but with offersheets, teams have to have their pick available. So picking up another teams 2nd wouldn't suffice. Right?

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09-25-2013, 01:31 PM
  #177
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Originally Posted by Boom Boom Geoffrion View Post
Correct me if I'm wrong, but with offersheets, teams have to have their pick available. So picking up another teams 2nd wouldn't suffice. Right?
Correct. The other poster mentioned getting the Oilers own pick back.

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09-25-2013, 02:20 PM
  #178
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Moving Marincin for a second would be a terrible move. Especially to make a shot-in-the-dark offersheet that would likely be matched. Absolute crazy talk.

Really, the guy could be the Oiler's second best prospect at this point...
That's what confused me. I thought he was pretty well regarded among Oiler fans.

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09-25-2013, 03:07 PM
  #179
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If I'm Anaheim I'd look into Stepan, via trade or offersheet. I know they have some young guys coming up, but Stepan would be a solid long term 2C behind Getz.

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09-25-2013, 03:10 PM
  #180
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Originally Posted by Fataldogg View Post
In regards to Stepan, he's worth exactly what Sather is offering him. $2.8-3.2m per year. It's a similar offer to what Dubinsky, Del Zotto, and Callahan had to deal with. And at this point in team, Stepan wasn't any better than Dubinsky, Del Zotto or Callahan were.

He's a 2nd line center who had a great 48 game season. He hasn't done enough with his first three seasons to merit a significant contract. When he can prove that he is a 70 point two way center over two full 82 game seasons, on his bridge contract, then we can seriously consider giving him a Bergeron caliber contract. Until then, he hasn't done anything to merit a long term / high cap hit.

And no, I don't agree with the kind of contracts that have been given out to players like RNH. But, EDM clearly has a different philosophy regarding reacquiring young talent and a different philosophy with bridge contracts. Sather doesn't share that sentiment. He almost always does bridge contracts. And with a bridge contract, that's all Step is worth.
Shortened season or not - Stepan DID play like a #1 center last year. Comparing him to Dubinsky, MDZ, or Callahan as they came off their ELC's is misleading IMO.

I understand where Sather is coming from, and why he feels like he needs to hold the line. If the Rangers see him like a #2 center, he shouldn't be that hard to replace internally. This is one of those situations where there is going to be a lot of pressure on the team, and if Stefan's not playing and they struggle, it is going to get ugly. Similar situation to Pietro in STL, they REALLY needed to get him on the ice, and it gave him leverage even though he didn't have any from being a RFA without arbitration rights.

Somewhat rhetorical question, but If the Rangers feel like Stefan hasn't proven enough to justify more than a 2 year deal, why not sign a 1 year deal? I know that he has more leverage than with arbitration, but if he proves he's a #1 center, wouldn't you think that the Rangers want to lock him up long term and that's not an issue?

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09-25-2013, 03:34 PM
  #181
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Originally Posted by AslanRH View Post
If I'm Anaheim I'd look into Stepan, via trade or offersheet. I know they have some young guys coming up, but Stepan would be a solid long term 2C behind Getz.
Anaheim is an internal cap team, not only is it unlikely that they would offersheet a player so much so that the other team would not match, but they then leave themselves susceptible in future by angering a club with a ton of money.

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09-25-2013, 05:48 PM
  #182
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Originally Posted by Beukeboom Fan View Post
Shortened season or not - Stepan DID play like a #1 center last year. Comparing him to Dubinsky, MDZ, or Callahan as they came off their ELC's is misleading IMO.
True, but Stepan is being offered a lot more than those players got. MDZ only got 2.55 mil a year ago. Dubinsky got 1.85 mil per year on his 2nd contract.

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If the Rangers see him like a #2 center, he shouldn't be that hard to replace internally.
I don't think they view him that way, though Brassard has done nothing but good things since he came over in the trade, so he could in theory be our #1C. We have guys in the pipeline who may reach Stepan's level, but it will be a few years at least before they do.

Quote:
This is one of those situations where there is going to be a lot of pressure on the team, and if Stefan's not playing and they struggle, it is going to get ugly. Similar situation to Pietro in STL, they REALLY needed to get him on the ice, and it gave him leverage even though he didn't have any from being a RFA without arbitration rights.
The pressure is on Stepan too. Every day of the season he misses is lost money. At what point does it become a losing proposition?

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Somewhat rhetorical question, but If the Rangers feel like Stefan hasn't proven enough to justify more than a 2 year deal, why not sign a 1 year deal? I know that he has more leverage than with arbitration, but if he proves he's a #1 center, wouldn't you think that the Rangers want to lock him up long term and that's not an issue?
We have a lot of players who will need new contracts next season. And with a 2 year deal, the cap will have gone up twice by the time he needs to be re-signed.

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09-25-2013, 06:30 PM
  #183
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Originally Posted by Championship View Post
Anaheim is an internal cap team, not only is it unlikely that they would offersheet a player so much so that the other team would not match, but they then leave themselves susceptible in future by angering a club with a ton of money.
Understand the internal cap part but think 3-5@<5 million could be enough to get him to sign and force the Rangers hand, while still being a value contract for a 2C.

As for angering a team, if the Ducks lock up their young guys early it is not an issue. Also, how many revenge offer sheets have actually happened? It is a legitimate option in the NHL rules, and teams should be more willing to use them IMO, and I can't see GMs getting upset unless it's something like offering a player clearly way more than the market dictates.

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09-25-2013, 06:51 PM
  #184
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Originally Posted by AslanRH View Post
Understand the internal cap part but think 3-5@<5 million could be enough to get him to sign and force the Rangers hand, while still being a value contract for a 2C.

As for angering a team, if the Ducks lock up their young guys early it is not an issue. Also, how many revenge offer sheets have actually happened? It is a legitimate option in the NHL rules, and teams should be more willing to use them IMO, and I can't see GMs getting upset unless it's something like offering a player clearly way more than the market dictates.
If Ducks overpaid for Stepan, then their internal cap would hinder them from locking up their young guys early. Rangers are gonna match anything up to 4 at least, and possibly even over. Ducks would have to overpay, and that's the point. There internal cap is not going to allow them to overpay, especially with the new contracts to Getzlaf and Perry.

How many offer sheets actually happen? How many offer sheets happen that aren't matched? How many offer sheets happen to the Rangers?

I think those are the more pertinent questions. Katie Strang recently even brought up the revenge the Rangers could exact on someone when someone asked her about the Islanders possibly offersheeting stepan, so it's not an out of the blue thing. Sather is vindictive. I think his recent comments more than prove that.

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09-25-2013, 06:59 PM
  #185
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Stepan has to be willing to except the offer sheet...I thought the NYR and Him were far apart but apparently they are not that far apart....

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09-25-2013, 10:34 PM
  #186
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I don't know if it's been mentioned but Nashville could be an interesting option. They drafted his cousin, they love American forwards, and they need a player who can score like Stepan. It would all depend of course on Stepan actually wanting to go there and Nashville being able to afford it

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09-25-2013, 11:18 PM
  #187
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If his contract demands were to drop to the $2.75-$3M range (probably closer to $2.75M), a deal could get done. The Rangers are likely to be carrying 8 defensemen (Justin Falk and one of Stu Bickel or Conor Allen; Bickel would likely be purely the enforcer.

The Rangers, counting Bickel and subtracting Aaron Johnson, have $2.03M in cap space. This does not include an LTIR designation for Carl Hagelin. One of Darroll Powe or Arron Asham will likely remain on the roster - and lineup - for however long it takes for Hagelin to be ready.

As for an offer sheet that would be too rich to match, it would have to be at least $3.5M per if you ask me. The problem is that the Rangers only have 6 players under contract for 2014-15.

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09-26-2013, 01:12 AM
  #188
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Originally Posted by aemoreira1981 View Post
If his contract demands were to drop to the $2.75-$3M range (probably closer to $2.75M), a deal could get done. The Rangers are likely to be carrying 8 defensemen (Justin Falk and one of Stu Bickel or Conor Allen; Bickel would likely be purely the enforcer.

The Rangers, counting Bickel and subtracting Aaron Johnson, have $2.03M in cap space. This does not include an LTIR designation for Carl Hagelin. One of Darroll Powe or Arron Asham will likely remain on the roster - and lineup - for however long it takes for Hagelin to be ready.

As for an offer sheet that would be too rich to match, it would have to be at least $3.5M per if you ask me. The problem is that the Rangers only have 6 players under contract for 2014-15.
you need to rework your numbers..... they can sign him to 3.5 right now if they wanted , they have the space.... an offe sheet would have to be over 5.5 for them to have some trouble and even then theres moves to be made to make it work if they wanted.....

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09-26-2013, 06:56 AM
  #189
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I don't know if it's been mentioned but Nashville could be an interesting option. They drafted his cousin, they love American forwards, and they need a player who can score like Stepan. It would all depend of course on Stepan actually wanting to go there and Nashville being able to afford it
And heres another team that isn't going to risk what money they do have to spend on an offer sheet. They had to go out on a limb to match the Shea Weber contract. They aren't going to be able to overpay to the point where the Rangers wouldn't match and/or attempt to draw the ire of a club with a bottomless money pit.

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09-26-2013, 07:19 AM
  #190
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They will have enough trouble using their money pit just to sign their own free agents next year. Currently they only have six players signed for 14-15.

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09-26-2013, 07:26 AM
  #191
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They will have enough trouble using their money pit just to sign their own free agents next year. Currently they only have six players signed for 14-15.
Not sure how they are going to have trouble when the cap is going up and they have no limitations on spending money, which they will have even more of if they amnesty Richards after this season. Not sure at all how that would have anything to do with re-signing Stepan this year. You should be more concerned about how the flyers routinely mismanage their cap instead of worrying about the Rangers having all the cap in the world to re-sign their players.

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09-26-2013, 08:21 AM
  #192
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They will have enough trouble using their money pit just to sign their own free agents next year. Currently they only have six players signed for 14-15.
Actually not worried at all. Richards will be CBO. We will have TONS of cap space.

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09-26-2013, 08:24 AM
  #193
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They will have enough trouble using their money pit just to sign their own free agents next year. Currently they only have six players signed for 14-15.
Yeah, sorry, not seeing it. It will also help adding players like Miller, Lindberg, Fast and Hrivik to the line-up replacing guys like Pyatt, Boyle, Powe and Asham. Cheaper options.

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09-26-2013, 09:04 AM
  #194
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Originally Posted by Championship View Post
If Ducks overpaid for Stepan, then their internal cap would hinder them from locking up their young guys early. Rangers are gonna match anything up to 4 at least, and possibly even over. Ducks would have to overpay, and that's the point. There internal cap is not going to allow them to overpay, especially with the new contracts to Getzlaf and Perry.

How many offer sheets actually happen? How many offer sheets happen that aren't matched? How many offer sheets happen to the Rangers?

I think those are the more pertinent questions. Katie Strang recently even brought up the revenge the Rangers could exact on someone when someone asked her about the Islanders possibly offersheeting stepan, so it's not an out of the blue thing. Sather is vindictive. I think his recent comments more than prove that.
The Ducks are in great shape right now with cap space and salary. Once Souray hits LTIR, we'll have over 6 million bucks in cap space, and the actual team salary is around 5 million lower than our current cap hit. It is very possible that the Ducks add salary during the season, plus next year we'll be without Teemu, Saku and Penner (unless he surprises). That's over 6 million additional bucks freed up. Could be looking at a Etem - Stepan - Palmieri second line in a few years (please?)

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09-26-2013, 09:19 AM
  #195
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Originally Posted by Championship View Post
Not sure how they are going to have trouble when the cap is going up and they have no limitations on spending money, which they will have even more of if they amnesty Richards after this season. Not sure at all how that would have anything to do with re-signing Stepan this year. You should be more concerned about how the flyers routinely mismanage their cap instead of worrying about the Rangers having all the cap in the world to re-sign their players.
Because the Rangers need to sign 16 players for next season, a lot of whom will be looking for significant raises. The supposedly mismanaged Flyers have signed all the players they wanted even with Pronger's injury complicating matters and already have their entire forward core locked up apart from Schenn.

Meanwhile the Rangers can't even get their best center under contract with the season days away.

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09-26-2013, 09:37 AM
  #196
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Stepan close to new deal with NYR as per Elliotte Friedman

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09-26-2013, 09:56 AM
  #197
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Originally Posted by Curufinwe View Post
Because the Rangers need to sign 16 players for next season, a lot of whom will be looking for significant raises. The supposedly mismanaged Flyers have signed all the players they wanted even with Pronger's injury complicating matters and already have their entire forward core locked up apart from Schenn.

Meanwhile the Rangers can't even get their best center under contract with the season days away.
Still not sure what the problem is when they have a significant amount of cap space. You are talking as if there will be some sort of cap space limiting them to re-signing the key players. There won't be. Dead weight will be shed and kids will take their place. Very simple.

Oh, and Step deal is coming to a close, thanks.

The Flyers aren't "supposedly" mismanaged, they are hilariously mismanaged. That's great that there forward core is locked up. Too bad their problems are on defense and goaltending.

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09-26-2013, 11:43 AM
  #198
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I'm guessing 3.25/season for 2 seasons.

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09-26-2013, 12:30 PM
  #199
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Originally Posted by Curufinwe View Post
Because the Rangers need to sign 16 players for next season, a lot of whom will be looking for significant raises. The supposedly mismanaged Flyers have signed all the players they wanted even with Pronger's injury complicating matters and already have their entire forward core locked up apart from Schenn.

Meanwhile the Rangers can't even get their best center under contract with the season days away.
You don't know what you're talking about, Flyer fan.

Stepan is signed.
Richards will CBO after the season.
Cap is going up.
Cheaper options, mentioned above, will replace some of costlier options throughout our bottom 6.

Worry about your team. The Rangers are fine. And they've been fine, despite all the nonsense you outsiders keep posting.

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09-26-2013, 12:53 PM
  #200
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you need to rework your numbers..... they can sign him to 3.5 right now if they wanted , they have the space.... an offe sheet would have to be over 5.5 for them to have some trouble and even then theres moves to be made to make it work if they wanted.....
The cap going forward has to be looked at as well. The Rangers have most of their roster approaching restricted or unrestricted free agency next season...and that includes Lundqvist, who could be looking at $7.5M per.

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