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The Beauchemin Deal

View Poll Results: Would you undo the Beauchemin trade?
Yes 13 23.21%
No 36 64.29%
Who cares, its an even trade 7 12.50%
Voters: 56. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
08-20-2013, 02:09 AM
  #1
johnnyutah
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The Beauchemin Deal

If you could, would you undo the deal that sent Jake Gardiner and Joffrey Lupul to Toronto for Francois beauchemin. This is a deal that leafs fans often boast about as a major steal.

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08-20-2013, 02:36 AM
  #2
Paul4587
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I would undo letting him walk in the first place. Terrible asset management trading guys for someone we could have kept and who we needed to keep as our blueline was already weakened considerably with the loss of Pronger.

Ignoring that fact the trade itself doesn't bother me. We paid a pretty high price but got a pretty good defenseman back.

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08-20-2013, 02:47 AM
  #3
AngelDuck
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I would undo it if I could. Gardiner looks like a top 4 D, and Lupul is a PPG winger when healthy. Beauch is awesome but in a couple years his decline will begin, right when Gardiner starts to enter his prime.

As Paul said, awful asset management in the first place by Murray. Letting Beauch walk was his biggest mistake by far. He then gave up two very good pieces to get him back.

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08-20-2013, 02:48 AM
  #4
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Shouldn't have let him walk in the first place, but I'm not mad at the deal at all

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08-20-2013, 03:11 AM
  #5
Unagi
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Difficult to say. I mean we clearly lost the trade value wise. Lupul is a 1st liner and Gardiner is looking like a legitimate Top 4 defenseman.

But on the other hand we really needed Beauchemin. He was easily out best defender since the trade. I don't even want to think of how bad our D would look without him. Personally I think he should have been a Norris candidate last season.

So bottom line is no I'd probably not undo the trade. Mistake was to let him walk in the first place.

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08-20-2013, 04:05 AM
  #6
Elvs
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I wouldn't. Lupul was never gonna reach this level in Anaheim. We have Fowler on D, and soon maybe a couple of both Vatanen, Lindholm and Theodore. That makes the D very soft, and then you add Gardiner to that...

I'm sure the Ducks wanted to keep Beauchemin when he left, but couldn't afford him. I think people are forgetting the situation at the time. The Ducks could not score goals, and when you upgrade up front (Koivu and Lupul), you are going to downgrade somewhere else if you're on a budget.

My guess is that Murray thought that trading Pronger was the only downgrade he did, as Beauchemin barely played that season. Scotty, Whitney and Wisniewski looked like a decent enough top three. Unfortunately, Whitney and Wisniewski didn't play up to their capabilities, the Sbisa gamble didn't work, the insurance signing Boynton didn't work either, and Lupul got injured.


Last edited by Elvs: 08-20-2013 at 04:16 AM.
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Old
08-20-2013, 07:45 AM
  #7
Spicy Porkins
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No. Lupul was a spare part, and a tool.

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08-20-2013, 11:03 AM
  #8
Terry Yake
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i wouldn't have let him walk in the first place but like someone else mentioned, they needed to upgrade up front which meant that someone had to go. whitney and wisniewski were nothing special and the rentals that were brought in after pronger was traded like eminger, boynton, and ward didn't work out either. i wish gardiner was still a duck but am i mad about the trade? absolutely not, at the time we reacquired beauch the D on this team was sorely lacking and he was exactly the guy we needed

lupul on the other hand was going nowhere on this team, especially after that nasty infection that kept him out for so long and his problems with carlyle. it was only a matter of time before he was dealt

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08-20-2013, 11:25 AM
  #9
snarktacular
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Ignoring the stupidity in letting Beauch go in the first place, the trade is "right guy, wrong price."

Lupul was treated as a dump by us. Which is fine, we probably would have needed to dump him anyways. But he was valued as a dump, when I think he should have had actual value. Or we should have held on longer until he reestablished his value. I think they could have made the trade without Lupul (say Gardiner + 3rd), and tried to move Lupul separately to a team that did value him.

Not too sad to see Gardiner go. I think he was overrated anyways, and we were probably going to lose a prospect defenseman to get a good now defenseman. That's just how those trades generally go.

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08-20-2013, 11:56 AM
  #10
Suddenly7
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I would of still traded Lupul for a defensemen. Looking how Beauchemin was doing in Toronto I could have waited and picked him up for less. Burke really over sold Beauchemin back to us.

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08-20-2013, 12:37 PM
  #11
Theridion
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Anytime you deal youngsters for vets, the trade will almost always favor the team with younger guys as the older players eventually decline or retire. Its an almost inevitable limit.

Beauch has been this teams best defenseman. And its not close. And it doesnt look like it will be close next year.

Lets analogy.

You buy a new car. 2013 model. Two years later, its 2015. Someone walks up to you and says, dont you wish you waited till now and bought a used 2013 car? Its the same as you would jave now, but cost 8k less.

Under that thinking, no one should ever buy a new car.

So we got exactly what we wanted out of that trade.
Toronto got what they wanted and more (worked out big for them).

If we dont make the trade...

Beachemin struggles in toronto.
Lupul struggles here. Gardiner develops as predicted.

A whole bunch of unpredictable moves are made or not made as a result of this. Maybe perry os n9t resigned. Is that good? Is it good now, but will perrys contract look bad in 3 years, and we wish we did not trade for beach so that lupul stays so perry isnt resigned in 2013?

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08-20-2013, 12:40 PM
  #12
DarthYenik
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Loops is good, but we have a lot of good wingers that weren't ready at the time really, but are all maturing really well right now. Plus at the time he wasn't doing too good on the Ducks. He might have rebounded if he stayed in Anaheim, but I think he has more chemistry in Toronto.

Beauch in my opinion has the potential for elite quality defense, and he is a veteran. Gardiner might one day be that one day, but not right now. Add that to the Defensemen in the system (even if some weren't drafted yet), and the loss of Gardiner isn't so bad.

I might be a Beauch fanboy, but I think it's a good trade for both teams.

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08-20-2013, 12:54 PM
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnnyutah View Post
This is a deal that leafs fans often boast about as a major steal.
Yeah, but that's also due in large part to there not being much else to boast about in that time.

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08-20-2013, 12:56 PM
  #14
muckbin15
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if only burke wanted schultz instead of gardiner

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08-20-2013, 01:52 PM
  #15
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Originally Posted by muckbin15 View Post
if only burke wanted schultz instead of gardiner
He did.

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08-20-2013, 02:08 PM
  #16
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Beauchemin is the best player in the deal.
But I voted yes because it was poor asset management and we could have got a lot for Gardiner (if we ever traded him) and a decent amount for Lupul if we traded him.
All we had to do was resign Beauchemin and not let him walk.

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08-20-2013, 02:52 PM
  #17
Eddie Shack
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At the time Lupul was a salary dump and even TOR looked at the trade that way. The only reason we gave up Gardiner for Beauch was because TOR took the salary dump as well. Hindsight is always 20/20. We got a very good player who has contributed very well even if in hindsight we look to have over paid.

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08-20-2013, 06:50 PM
  #18
duxfan8
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This deal was really a win-win. I can't stand when fans think we got hosed. Sure, we gave up Gardiner, but he hasn't made a huge difference for Toronto and Lupul was stuck in a bad position with us. The way I saw it, we gave up Gardiner for Beauch, and we were happy to unload Lupul. Beauch wasn't playing well for Toronto, Lupul wasn't playing well for us, and both ended up blooming. It's much harder to get a 1/2 dman than a 2nd or 3rd line winger, which is what Lupul was behind Teemu/Perry.

If I could go back and alter the trade to my liking, maybe the Ducks get an extra 3rd or average prospect, but I would have no regrets looking back at it if I were Murray. Beauch is way too valuable to this team to think we got robbed.

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08-20-2013, 06:58 PM
  #19
snarktacular
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Quote:
Originally Posted by duxfan8 View Post
This deal was really a win-win. I can't stand when fans think we got hosed. Sure, we gave up Gardiner, but he hasn't made a huge difference for Toronto and Lupul was stuck in a bad position with us. The way I saw it, we gave up Gardiner for Beauch, and we were happy to unload Lupul. Beauch wasn't playing well for Toronto, Lupul wasn't playing well for us, and both ended up blooming. It's much harder to get a 1/2 dman than a 2nd or 3rd line winger, which is what Lupul was behind Teemu/Perry.

If I could go back and alter the trade to my liking, maybe the Ducks get an extra 3rd or average prospect, but I would have no regrets looking back at it if I were Murray. Beauch is way too valuable to this team to think we got robbed.
Why do you call Beauchemin a 1/2 Dman but you don't call Lupul a 1st line PPG winger?

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08-20-2013, 08:16 PM
  #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eddie Shack View Post
At the time Lupul was a salary dump and even TOR looked at the trade that way. The only reason we gave up Gardiner for Beauch was because TOR took the salary dump as well. Hindsight is always 20/20. We got a very good player who has contributed very well even if in hindsight we look to have over paid.
Pretty much this, plus I'd add that I'm glad we went back for the player we lost.

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08-21-2013, 12:41 AM
  #21
duxfan8
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Originally Posted by snarktacular View Post
Why do you call Beauchemin a 1/2 Dman but you don't call Lupul a 1st line PPG winger?
Not with us, he wasn't. I think I made that pretty clear. I am not talking about Toronto, I'm talking about Anaheim and the roles both Lupul had and Beauch has with us currently.

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08-21-2013, 03:20 AM
  #22
camshaft
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Like others above stated, we never should have let go of Beauch in the first place. But the trade probably cost us not only Gardner and Lupul, but also Schultz. Since Gardner and Schultz were friends and teammates at Wisconsin, if Gardner was with the Ducks, Schultz probably signs with the Ducks.

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08-21-2013, 03:41 AM
  #23
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Originally Posted by camshaft View Post
Like others above stated, we never should have let go of Beauch in the first place. But the trade probably cost us not only Gardner and Lupul, but also Schultz. Since Gardner and Schultz were friends and teammates at Wisconsin, if Gardner was with the Ducks, Schultz probably signs with the Ducks.
No.

Then why Shultz didn`t sign with Toronto? Also a Canadian team.
But if we would trade Schultz instead of Gardiner, we would probably sign Gardiner, as he doesn`t look like such a *********.

In this case the trade would look very good if Schultz left Toronto for Edmonton, it would mean we got Beauc for Lupul only. Both for good teams, if, of course we forget that we let Beauch walk.

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08-21-2013, 05:57 AM
  #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by camshaft View Post
Like others above stated, we never should have let go of Beauch in the first place. But the trade probably cost us not only Gardner and Lupul, but also Schultz. Since Gardner and Schultz were friends and teammates at Wisconsin, if Gardner was with the Ducks, Schultz probably signs with the Ducks.
Makes no sense. If that was the reason why not sign in Toronto?

Friendship in signings are way overplayed.

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08-21-2013, 07:21 AM
  #25
Unagi
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Friendship in signings are way overplayed.
100% agree. Doubt they factor in at all to be honest unless you have 2 identical offers and situations. You probably make some friends with your new team anyway so no point in joining another friend somewhere. What is important is money, role on the team/minutes and chance at winning the cup. For older players also probably what the family wants (children probably reluctant to move and lose their school friends).

On a sidenote: Schultz still is a ******.

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