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Mason Raymond has a deal in place with the Leafs

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Old
09-09-2013, 01:07 PM
  #251
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11 pages on a Mason Raymond PTO...... Just shows you how big Leafs nation is.

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Old
09-09-2013, 01:09 PM
  #252
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Originally Posted by Dr Knowledge View Post
11 pages on a Mason Raymond PTO...... Just shows you how big Leafs nation is.
Word.

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09-09-2013, 01:11 PM
  #253
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Originally Posted by BB v2 0 View Post
Salary projections for Raymond are kind of high. He's on a camp tryout, I'm not expecting anything more than $1M at the max.

Leafs should be able to make it work, whether they have to trade Franson or not. Kadri needs to just take the cheap 2 year deal and prove his worth, and it will happen eventually. I doubt any team with a semi-competent GM would offer him more than a bridge deal. Derek Stepan has proven more and had a better all around season last yearand HE'S getting bridge offers.
No, he actually didn't...

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09-09-2013, 01:16 PM
  #254
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Originally Posted by NYVanfan View Post
no it wont
still need 23 to make a roster, that would just drop them to 19 ... and who's gonna be cheaper than those guys anyway?
you aren't forced to take 23 on your squad. 23 is just the maximum.

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09-09-2013, 01:19 PM
  #255
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It's time to trade Kulimen for picks.

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09-09-2013, 01:20 PM
  #256
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No, he actually didn't...
So, what you're saying is that Stepan wasn't a better all-around player than Kadri last season?

Ok. While your assumption is hilarious, that's not the point. Stepan has objectively proven more at the NHL level than Kadri, as he had 51 and 45 point seasons prior to his breakout year. Stepan is being offered a bridge deal. What makes Kadri think he deserves more?

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09-09-2013, 02:43 PM
  #257
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It's time to trade Kulimen for picks.
No it's not.

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09-09-2013, 02:56 PM
  #258
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Originally Posted by NYVanfan View Post
no it wont
still need 23 to make a roster, that would just drop them to 19 ... and who's gonna be cheaper than those guys anyway?
You don't have to have a 23 man roster. You have to have a 20 man roster. Dave Poulin, a member of Nonis's staff already sad the Leafs don't need a 23 man roster and may not have one this season.
It is a quite reasonable possibility that the Leafs will go into the season with a 21 or 22 man roster.

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09-09-2013, 03:01 PM
  #259
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Originally Posted by beauchamp View Post
But there must be valid reasons why you very rarely see a team with a shorter roster...

But back to the topic: Raymond would be a valuable addition, if Nonis can find a way to create cap space.
Dave Poulin who is a member of the teams management already said the team may not go with a 23 man roster this season.

Whether or not that is a good idea is a different discussion but the Leafs starting the season with a 22 man roster is quite possible.

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09-09-2013, 03:12 PM
  #260
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Originally Posted by Cyris View Post
Dave Poulin who is a member of the teams management already said the team may not go with a 23 man roster this season.

Whether or not that is a good idea is a different discussion but the Leafs starting the season with a 22 man roster is quite possible.
He might have said that because he was aware of the possible cap squeeze (preemptive strike).

By the way, isn't he the cap expert for the Leafs? I'm possibly mixing him up with Loiselle.

I believe 22 is the strict minimum.

21 is playing with fire, at least on the road.

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09-09-2013, 03:51 PM
  #261
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Originally Posted by beauchamp View Post
He might have said that because he was aware of the possible cap squeeze (preemptive strike).

By the way, isn't he the cap expert for the Leafs? I'm possibly mixing him up with Loiselle.

I believe 22 is the strict minimum.

21 is playing with fire, at least on the road.
I think Loiselle is the cap guy but I'm certainly not positive about it. And sure maybe it was just a negotiating tactic when he said it who knows.

Even on the road there are options for getting someone in to ice a full roster like emergency call ups from jr.
The Devils a few years ago went with a 21 man roster the season after they signed Kovi but that also could be used as an example of why its not a good idea because there were a few games where they weren't able to ice a full roster and couldn't afford to call anyone up.

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09-09-2013, 04:13 PM
  #262
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Originally Posted by Cyris View Post
I think Loiselle is the cap guy but I'm certainly not positive about it. And sure maybe it was just a negotiating tactic when he said it who knows.

(1) Even on the road there are options for getting someone in to ice a full roster like emergency call ups from jr.

(2)The Devils a few years ago went with a 21 man roster the season after they signed Kovi but that also could be used as an example of why its not a good idea because there were a few games where they weren't able to ice a full roster and couldn't afford to call anyone up.
(1) Hockey is a winter sports, so sometimes airports are closed...

(2) In fact, they started with a 20-player roster, but it only lasted 2 games, if memory serves me right.

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09-09-2013, 04:22 PM
  #263
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Originally Posted by sgupca View Post
i'd wager that Raymond makes the team if Kadri isn't signed. He's sort of insurance - and i'm fully aware the talent differences and they play a different position. That said, Raymond would get Kadri's spot in the lineup until he signs.

I also think Liles is moved out, even if the leafs have to eat salary. Or the bury him in the minors and save 900k in cap space to sign raymond.
$925,000 this season.

CBA Article 50.5.d.i.B.7 says league minimum plus $375,000.
Quote:
For any Player on a Two-Way NHL SPC who is Loaned to
a club in another professional league, the total
compensation (defined for the purpose of this provision
only as the greater of (i) that Player's stated Paragraph 1
Minor League Salary and Bonuses (other than Exhibit 5
Bonuses unless earned)) in that League Year, and (ii) that
Player's minimum compensation guarantee and Bonuses
(other than Exhibit 5 Bonuses unless earned) in that League
Year in excess of the sum of the Minimum Paragraph 1
NHL Salary and $375,000 for that League Year (e.g.,
$925,000 in 2013-14) for the period during which such
Player is Loaned to a club in such professional league; plus
CBA Article 11.12
Quote:
11.12 Minimum Paragraph 1 Salary. No SPC shall provide:
(a) for Paragraph 1 NHL Salary of less than the following:
2012-13 U.S. $525,000
2013-14 U.S. $550,000
2014-15 U.S. $550,000
2015-16 U.S. $575,000
2016-17 U.S. $575,000
2017-18 U.S. $650,000
2018-19 U.S. $650,000
2019-20 U.S. $700,000
2020-21 U.S. $700,000
2021-22 U.S. $750,000

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09-09-2013, 04:23 PM
  #264
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Originally Posted by beauchamp View Post
(1) Hockey is a winter sports, so sometimes airports are closed...

(2) In fact, they started with a 20-player roster, but it only lasted 2 games, if memory serves me right.
You got me on point 1 if the team goes with a 22 man roster (I agree a 21 man roster is asking for trouble) and while they are on the road 3 players come down with a day to day situation like the flu while a storm is raging closing local airports the team would be screwed and forced to ice a shortened lineup. I'm not really saying its a good idea to run with a shortened roster just that it may happen.

On point 2 I believe it was later in the season when they ran into minor injury problems and couldn't ice a full lineup. I only really remember because one of the games they couldn't do it was against the Leafs.

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09-09-2013, 04:27 PM
  #265
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Originally Posted by BB v2 0 View Post
So, what you're saying is that Stepan wasn't a better all-around player than Kadri last season?

Ok. While your assumption is hilarious, that's not the point. Stepan has objectively proven more at the NHL level than Kadri, as he had 51 and 45 point seasons prior to his breakout year. Stepan is being offered a bridge deal. What makes Kadri think he deserves more?
Stepan had two seasons in a mini season. He was inconsistent for the first half, and went on a tear in the 2nd half.

Kadri was fairly consistent throughout the season.

51 and 45 points really have nothing to do with anything. Kadri could have easily gotten those points under Wilson but the Leafs take their time with their prospects.

I am glad the Leafs aren't in the numbers game. It's not about how many prospects make the NHL as much as how many of your prospects help you win games when they play and Kadri helped the Leafs win a lot of games last year.

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09-09-2013, 04:36 PM
  #266
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Originally Posted by ENuck View Post
He had been showing much improvement, a nasty hit that resulted in a broken back headed him in the other direction. If he's completely rehabbed the Leafs will have a speedster with an offensive upside, who can pass, works hard along the boards, is reliable defensively and very good on the PK. He's not a top 6 but can fill in if necessary.

There's no reason to think he hasn't completely healed. I hope he gets signed, he's a good guy on and off the ice as well.
When he came back, he said his doctor told him his back will never fully heal.

I think at this point, his back is as healthy as it's going to get barring some major medical breakthrough in the near future.

I hope MayRay sticks with the Leafs (or another NHL team). He's a good enough player to play in the NHL plus he's a really nice guy. Signs lots of autographs and he and his wife do a lot of charity work.

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09-09-2013, 04:57 PM
  #267
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Originally Posted by Pi View Post
Stepan had two seasons in a mini season. He was inconsistent for the first half, and went on a tear in the 2nd half.

Kadri was fairly consistent throughout the season.

51 and 45 points really have nothing to do with anything. Kadri could have easily gotten those points under Wilson but the Leafs take their time with their prospects.

I am glad the Leafs aren't in the numbers game. It's not about how many prospects make the NHL as much as how many of your prospects help you win games when they play and Kadri helped the Leafs win a lot of games last year.
This. Kadri was clutch at times too.

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09-09-2013, 05:04 PM
  #268
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Originally Posted by Dr Knowledge View Post
11 pages on a Mason Raymond PTO...... Just shows you how big Leafs nation is.
Or how much fun it is to be jostling with some Leafs fans.

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09-09-2013, 05:07 PM
  #269
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Originally Posted by Pi View Post
Stepan had two seasons in a mini season. He was inconsistent for the first half, and went on a tear in the 2nd half.

Kadri was fairly consistent throughout the season.

51 and 45 points really have nothing to do with anything. Kadri could have easily gotten those points under Wilson but the Leafs take their time with their prospects.

I am glad the Leafs aren't in the numbers game. It's not about how many prospects make the NHL as much as how many of your prospects help you win games when they play and Kadri helped the Leafs win a lot of games last year.
Well, this isn't really the thread to discuss this, but you're partially wrong. Yes, Stepan struggled to start, but, no, it wasn't the first half. After he scored his first goal, which was about 9-10 games in, he was the most productive and best player on the team from that point on. Even then, he was still effective in those 9-10 games, just snakebitten. That's less than 25% of the season.

And how are his prior seasons irrlevant? You seriously don't think Stepan's two solid seasons have any factor in his contract demands/worth, and that Kadri's lack of a long track record doesn't effect his worth/demands? That's a ridiculous claim. Stepan has proved he's a legitimate top-6 player at this point, and a verstaile one at that, while Kadri had a very productive 48 games, and that's it. 48 games doesn't earn a player anything more than a bridge contract at best.

Again, though, this isn't the thread to discuss that. If you want to discuss it further, make a thread comparing the two.

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09-09-2013, 05:15 PM
  #270
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Originally Posted by Cyris View Post
You got me on point 1 if the team goes with a 22 man roster (I agree a 21 man roster is asking for trouble) and while they are on the road 3 players come down with a day to day situation like the flu while a storm is raging closing local airports the team would be screwed and forced to ice a shortened lineup. I'm not really saying its a good idea to run with a shortened roster just that it may happen.

On point 2 I believe it was later in the season when they ran into minor injury problems and couldn't ice a full lineup. I only really remember because one of the games they couldn't do it was against the Leafs.
Oct 8, 2010: 1st game of the season:

http://www.nhl.com/ice/boxscore.htm?id=2010020007

No player scratched

Oct 9, 2010:

http://www.nhl.com/ice/boxscore.htm?id=2010020017

No player scratched

Oct 11, 2010:

http://www.nhl.com/ice/boxscore.htm?id=2010020027

23-player roster.

I can't remember what moves they made, unless some players went on LTIR between October 9th and October 11th.

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09-09-2013, 05:23 PM
  #271
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Originally Posted by BB v2 0 View Post
Well, this isn't really the thread to discuss this, but you're partially wrong. Yes, Stepan struggled to start, but, no, it wasn't the first half. After he scored his first goal, which was about 9-10 games in, he was the most productive and best player on the team from that point on. Even then, he was still effective in those 9-10 games, just snakebitten. That's less than 25% of the season.

(...)

Again, though, this isn't the thread to discuss that. If you want to discuss it further, make a thread comparing the two.
Stepan was 1-4-5 in his first 11 games, 17-22-39 for the other 37 games.

Kadri was 1-4-5 in his last 12 games, 17-22-39 for the other 36 games.

Eerie parallel...

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Old
09-09-2013, 06:19 PM
  #272
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Can you provide examples please.
Brendan Morrison with Vancouver. Nonis drafted Raymond so you could possibly infer that's whats going on here. Though it likely isn't the case.

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09-09-2013, 06:21 PM
  #273
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He won't play for the Leafs. Sure hope not!

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Old
09-09-2013, 06:27 PM
  #274
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He won't play for the Leafs. Sure hope not!
Why? He's an exceptional skater, who's good defensively, can kill penalties and chip in 15-20 goals. Seems like a perfect fit for Bolland and Kulemin.

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09-09-2013, 06:28 PM
  #275
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Why? He's an exceptional skater, who's good defensively, can kill penalties and chip in 15-20 goals. Seems like a perfect fit for Bolland and Kulemin.
No thanks. Keep him in VAN. LOL

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