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2013-2014 Ducks toughness thread

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Old
10-22-2013, 08:20 AM
  #76
5minsforfighting
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Wow... as I said in game thread, I cant remember the time when we (as team) was bullied so much hard as in game against Dallas. That was ridiculous. We took all the abuse they could throw at us - crosschecks/late hits, cheapshots etc... Final score is great, but I its really hard to watch punks like Garbutt, Rousell taking runs at our players. Where was Penner's teammates when he got rocked???

If we dont bring up grit or at least one guy who can take care of players like Rousell, our trip to east will be a tough one. I really hope we will not see more injuries....

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10-22-2013, 09:13 AM
  #77
McDonald19
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First concussion of Penner's NHL career.

Coach B's revenge is the powerplay (refs missed the call) and Shanahan's decision (we'll find out soon)

Get an enforcer Bob...

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10-22-2013, 09:25 AM
  #78
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Originally Posted by McDonald19 View Post
First concussion of Penner's NHL career.

Coach B's revenge is the powerplay (refs missed the call) and Shanahan's decision (we'll find out soon)

Get an enforcer Bob...
Hire me at league minimum. I'm willing to drop the gloves with whoever messes with my teammates and can even skate unlike certain former enforcers we had

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10-22-2013, 09:40 AM
  #79
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Originally Posted by McDonald19 View Post
Coach B's revenge is the powerplay (refs missed the call) and Shanahan's decision (we'll find out soon)
I think that 6-3 beating we gave them hurt their club more than our enforcer punching their enforcer a few times. Actually, it hurt them more than the 6-game-ish suspension to Garbutt will, as well.

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10-22-2013, 10:28 AM
  #80
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I'll admit, I didn't like seeing Dallas running around put there taking shots but if anything that game prove exactly why we DON'T need an enforcer (they don't exist anymore by the way). This team took their lumps and made the Stars pay on the scoreboard. Would like to see them fight back a little more? Sure, but not at the expense of winning the game.

As for Penner's injury, what good would a goon have been in that moment? For one it was a power play unit on the ice, any goon would be on the bench. Secondly, no one saw it. The play was still going before the refs blew the whistle. That piece of **** Garbutt is going to get his with at least a 5-game suspension. It would have been nice if someone punched him the face later but that doesn't stop Penner from getting hurt. Which is another thing, would having a 6-minute-a-game enforcer on the bench have prevented that hit in anyway? Not a chance. That d-bag would have jumped into that hit no matter what. All that would happen is said enforcer would challenge Garbutt to a lackluster fight and Penner would still be hurt. And we'd have a useful player out of the lineup or traded in order to make room for this marginal player.

No, steady as she goes. No reason to change what is clearly working.

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10-22-2013, 10:45 AM
  #81
5minsforfighting
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I didnt call for goon, but I think Gurbutt would think twice before throwing this hit if he knew that he will have to answer the bell later on.
This team needs to be more nasty and stick up for each other. Its painful to watch Cogliano recieving 3 late crosschecks back of the head and not even one single Duck giving oppenent a push back a little.
And one more thing - i dont recall a single scrum in front of the our net this season, we are not protecting our goalie enough as well.

You cant hide behind Shanahan all the time... HW era might be dead, but there is still need for players who can police the game a little.

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10-22-2013, 11:20 AM
  #82
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Originally Posted by 5minsforfighting View Post
I didnt call for goon, but I think Gurbutt would think twice before throwing this hit if he knew that he will have to answer the bell later on.
This team needs to be more nasty and stick up for each other. Its painful to watch Cogliano recieving 3 late crosschecks back of the head and not even one single Duck giving oppenent a push back a little.
And one more thing - i dont recall a single scrum in front of the our net this season, we are not protecting our goalie enough as well.

You cant hide behind Shanahan all the time... HW era might be dead, but there is still need for players who can police the game a little.
I don't. I think these hits are happening in a microsecond and players aren't thinking about anything but hitting that player. The threat of suspension isn't even deterring them in that moment. Yeah it would be satisfying if there was an answer for these hits but at the end of the day they don't accomplish anything and the player still gets injured. If we could add a player that could bring that kind of aspect and not dilute the talent level I'd be fine with that but that player doesn't exist. The few in this league that can bring both that kind of toughness and skill don't get traded.

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10-22-2013, 11:25 AM
  #83
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If not an enforcer, then at least team toughness. It's time to start standing up for each other. It's a long season to get pushed around.

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10-22-2013, 11:33 AM
  #84
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Originally Posted by 5minsforfighting View Post
I didnt call for goon, but I think Gurbutt would think twice before throwing this hit if he knew that he will have to answer the bell later on.
Not a chance. That's not what happens in a player's head in the fragments of seconds before going for hits. Completey with TJM on that.

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10-22-2013, 12:00 PM
  #85
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There's still such a disconnect on this thread it drives me nuts.

I'd like an enforcer, yes... but we really need are some players that will at least have the ability to stick up for each other. I don't think we have that now.

The game the other night was just pathetic. A player of ours gets knocked out and not a single guy says or does anything. Its happened quite a few times this year (cheap shots), and you guys have to remember last year and the injuries from cheap plays. I don't like it.

I'm not saying we need to retaliate for every little thing, but I don't care what the score is... if someone takes a cheap run at your teammate and knocks him out.. you don't skate away.

Regardless of if the league suspends Garbutt, this team is a target.. and we cannot expect the NHL to protect us. I guarantee it will continue to get worse. Yes, we're winning now, but if we start losing players because of this, that will change.

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10-22-2013, 12:13 PM
  #86
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Originally Posted by snowave View Post
There's still such a disconnect on this thread it drives me nuts.

I'd like an enforcer, yes... but we really need are some players that will at least have the ability to stick up for each other. I don't think we have that now.

The game the other night was just pathetic. A player of ours gets knocked out and not a single guy says or does anything. Its happened quite a few times this year (cheap shots), and you guys have to remember last year and the injuries from cheap plays. I don't like it.

I'm not saying we need to retaliate for every little thing, but I don't care what the score is... if someone takes a cheap run at your teammate and knocks him out.. you don't skate away.

Regardless of if the league suspends Garbutt, this team is a target.. and we cannot expect the NHL to protect us. I guarantee it will continue to get worse. Yes, we're winning now, but if we start losing players because of this, that will change.
There's also a lack of a realistic suggestion from anyone saying we need to be tougher. Who then? Who is out there that can provide that element that can be had and not make this team less competitive? Belesky will help with that once he's healthy. Maroon can as well to an extent. But who is realistically attainable and who do you trade away?

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10-22-2013, 12:28 PM
  #87
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I don't have all the answers to who. But... I do know there are alot of players out there that have enough balls to stick up for their teammates.

What bothers me, and the point I suppose I'm trying to make is the trend of BB and making this team as soft as possible, and not dress or bring up anyone that can fill that roll. I have high hopes for Maroon.. I think he's a decent player and has an edge to him... but if he's going to be sitting all year, it does no good.


I admit at this point, it's a tough call (pun intended ) to send someone down or trade for another guy or two to fill this roll... but again, I don't like the trend that is continuing.

I swear BM last year after the playoffs made a comment that were needed to be tougher and his goal was to make that happen. I don't know if it's the disconnect between him and BB... or if he was just blowing smoke.

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10-22-2013, 12:39 PM
  #88
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I'm really sick of the cheap shots. It's obvious other teams don't fear retaliation. We really miss Beleskey and Maroon's toughness when they are out of the lineup.

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10-22-2013, 12:52 PM
  #89
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Look at San Jose. They wanted to make such a move and the best they could get is Mike Brown. I'll take Belesky and Maroon over someone like Brown 100 times. The ideal kind of player isn't available.

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10-22-2013, 01:11 PM
  #90
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Not a chance. That's not what happens in a player's head in the fragments of seconds before going for hits. Completey with TJM on that.
Probably, but then also you can say - if somebody from Ducks ''would have taken care" earlier in the game (Garbutt wise), then he wouldnt run around looking for headshot later.
That hit at the beginning of the second period was consecutive result of us taking all kind of abuse in 1st period.

I cant believe i have to explain these basic thinks here....

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10-22-2013, 01:19 PM
  #91
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Originally Posted by 5minsforfighting View Post
Probably, but then also you can say - if somebody from Ducks ''would have taken care" earlier in the game (Garbutt wise), then he wouldnt run around looking for headshot later.
Unless you're talking about deliberately injuring him to take him out of the game, then that would only have made it worse, and would have had him looking for blood even more. These things don't get solved over self-policing, of whatever kind. They almost exclusively and universally escalate.

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That hit at the beginning of the second period was consecutive result of us taking all kind of abuse in 1st period.
I don't see the logic in that. Why would it be the result of that? Garbutt is hitting against all kinds of teams, not just the Ducks, and not just in such situations. He's a hitter that made a reckless decisions. His recklessness and dumb decision making has nothing to do with the Ducks.

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I cant believe i have to explain these basic thinks here....
Those really aren't basics. They are some fictional stories to make sense of some things, where there isn't. They are popular fictional stories, I'll gladly give you that, but many people believing in those types of things doesn't make it real.

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10-22-2013, 01:23 PM
  #92
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Look at San Jose. They wanted to make such a move and the best they could get is Mike Brown. I'll take Belesky and Maroon over someone like Brown 100 times. The ideal kind of player isn't available.
The cost was cheap and they needed grit.

Getting Beleskey back will help, but I'd still like a true fighter even if he is healthy scratched often. Boulton for a 7th rd pick.

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10-22-2013, 01:26 PM
  #93
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If you have played hockey at a high level you would know enforcers and intimidation serve a purpose.

I've seen guys like Garbutt run around against soft teams and suddenly play really carefully against teams with fighters.

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10-22-2013, 01:29 PM
  #94
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The cost was cheap and they needed grit.

Getting Beleskey back will help, but I'd still like a true fighter even if he is healthy scratched often. Boulton for a 7th rd pick.
But a player like that can't do anything but fight and takes a skilled player out of the lineup, even if it is once in a while. Maroon basically has that role except he can actually play and is a lot bigger than Boulton.

Jordan Tootoo might the only player that could fit but his cap hit is too big and he takes a lot of stupid penalties.

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10-22-2013, 01:31 PM
  #95
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But a player like that can't do anything but fight and takes a skilled player out of the lineup, even if it is once in a while. Maroon basically has that role except he can actually play and is a lot bigger than Boulton.

Jordan Tootoo might the only player that could fit but his cap hit is too big and he takes a lot of stupid penalties.
Are you saying Tootoo is a skill player?

He and Brown are the same player. 4th line energy, grit, fighting.

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10-22-2013, 01:33 PM
  #96
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Originally Posted by Vipers31 View Post
Unless you're talking about deliberately injuring him to take him out of the game, then that would only have made it worse, and would have had him looking for blood even more. These things don't get solved over self-policing, of whatever kind. They almost exclusively and universally escalate.
I dont want to see any player get injured, but if you really saw the whole game you would know what I'm talking about. His teammate Roussel was geting away with a lot of cheap plays behind the whistle in 1st. No one stood up against him, so Garbutt took next step.


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Originally Posted by Vipers31 View Post
I don't see the logic in that. Why would it be the result of that? Garbutt is hitting against all kinds of teams, not just the Ducks, and not just in such situations. He's a hitter that made a reckless decisions. His recklessness and dumb decision making has nothing to do with the Ducks.
I still think Garbutt would think twice before throwing his hit, when we havent lay down soft in 1st and actually stand up for each other.


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Originally Posted by Vipers31 View Post
Those really aren't basics. They are some fictional stories to make sense of some things, where there isn't. They are popular fictional stories, I'll gladly give you that, but many people believing in those types of things doesn't make it real.
You can tell that now to Penner.

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10-22-2013, 01:36 PM
  #97
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I dont want to see any player get injured, but if you really saw the whole game you would know what I'm talking about. His teammate Roussel was geting away with a lot of cheap plays behind the whistle in 1st. No one stood up against him.
This is a good point. Roussel set the tone for the game and no one responded until Beauchemin's hit in the 3rd.

This will keep happening with a skilled 4th line.

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10-22-2013, 01:43 PM
  #98
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Originally Posted by 5minsforfighting View Post
His teammate Roussel was geting away with a lot of cheap plays behind the whistle in 1st. No one stood up against him, so Garbutt took next step.
I don't agree with that line of reasoning. Roussel is a pest, basically. He does that always, and he isn't less of a pest when anyone tries to "enforce" that he stops that. And nothing what he did was that vicious. Garbutt didn't take any step from there. Garbutt just made a bad decision to make a reckless play. You can try and create a narrative around these incidents, but that won't make it a causal sequence of events.

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I still think Garbutt would think twice before throwing his hit, when we havent lay down soft in 1st and actually stand up for each other.
And I think you have no basis at all for that belief.

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You can tell that now to Penner.
I don't have to. Penner knows that Garbutt made a boneheaded play. But you can tell to Penner how he himself and his teammates "not stepping" are to blame because that's all it took for preventing stuff like that.

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10-22-2013, 01:55 PM
  #99
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Are you saying Tootoo is a skill player?

He and Brown are the same player. 4th line energy, grit, fighting.
He can skate. I don't want Tootoo (I hate him in fact) I'm just saying he's probably best of what's out there. Honestly Maroon and Belesky are as good as it gets in this department.

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10-22-2013, 01:58 PM
  #100
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I could argue further with you, but that wouldnt change things anyway and I'm not here to change your point of view about the game (Only I hope you are not a Wings fan deep down in your heart)....
Our team got run over, our player got injured... but still we won...horray!!

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