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Rangers re-sign Derek Stepan [2 years, $6.15M, $3.075M AAV]

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Old
09-24-2013, 07:59 AM
  #126
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I was very concerned about step not signing because of the tough metro division. Fortunately for me, I read this thread and learned step is a 2/3 c who had a bad playoff and plays too soft. I learned stats supporting his position are irrelevant and we grossly overrated stepan. I feel so relieved after watching our "proven" 1c **** the bed last night because I obviously have poor vision and since hes proven he will surely play up to his rediculous contract, at least according to some local experts.These same eyes have watched our young up in coming center steadily improve since his arrival. Now our classy gm is attacking him in the media.

Sather has ZERO leverage, plz watch his projected replacement and think about it.

Hrivic needs to make this team/outstanding work ethic,good size slots up and down/versatile
Kreider needs to go to ahl and find his game/clueless without puck
Kreider/miller/kristo to ahl gaining confidence and chemistry

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09-24-2013, 07:59 AM
  #127
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Originally Posted by Lundsanity30 View Post
He acts like this team can be good without Stepan already missing Hags and cally, geez
How in the world did you come to make that inference?

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09-24-2013, 08:06 AM
  #128
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Originally Posted by Thugice View Post
I was very concerned about step not signing because of the tough metro division. Fortunately for me, I read this thread and learned step is a 2/3 c who had a bad playoff and plays too soft. I learned stats supporting his position are irrelevant and we grossly overrated stepan. I feel so relieved after watching our "proven" 1c **** the bed last night because I obviously have poor vision and since hes proven he will surely play up to his rediculous contract, at least according to some local experts.These same eyes have watched our young up in coming center steadily improve since his arrival. Now our classy gm is attacking him in the media.

Sather has ZERO leverage, plz watch his projected replacement and think about it.
Hrivic needs to make this team/outstanding work ethic,good size slots up and down/versatile
Kreider needs to go to ahl and find his game/clueless without puck
Kreider/miller/kristo to ahl gaining confidence and chemistry

? -bucky-Nash
Poulliot-brass-zucc
Hrivic-lindberg-fast
Boyle-Moore-dorsett
Really? Because last time i checked, if Stepan doesn't sign on the dotted line, he doesn't get paid, a dime. And for each day he sits out he loses between 12-15,000 dollars (assuming he gets a contract in the 3.2-3.5 range).

And for a guy who hasn't made huge money yet, that's a lot to be missing out on.

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09-24-2013, 08:20 AM
  #129
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Originally Posted by 16 To Stanley View Post
Really? Because last time i checked, if Stepan doesn't sign on the dotted line, he doesn't get paid, a dime. And for each day he sits out he loses between 12-15,000 dollars (assuming he gets a contract in the 3.2-3.5 range).

And for a guy who hasn't made huge money yet, that's a lot to be missing out on.
Understood and fair point, .....but every point matters in a tough highly competitive div and not making playoffs costs a lot more than the extra .3 mil or damage to sathers ego. It's a business, I hope Dolan will get involved before this gets far enough to hurt the team. Stepan is banking on his value to the team, we will see who caves.

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09-24-2013, 08:28 AM
  #130
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Originally Posted by Thugice View Post
Understood and fair point, .....but every point matters in a tough highly competitive div and not making playoffs costs a lot more than the extra .3 mil or damage to sathers ego. It's a business, I hope Dolan will get involved before this gets far enough to hurt the team. Stepan is banking on his value to the team, we will see who caves.
Wow...as a Ranger fan I hope Dolan NEVER gets involved.

Like, EVER.

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09-24-2013, 08:33 AM
  #131
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Originally Posted by Thugice View Post
Understood and fair point, .....but every point matters in a tough highly competitive div and not making playoffs costs a lot more than the extra .3 mil or damage to sathers ego. It's a business, I hope Dolan will get involved before this gets far enough to hurt the team. Stepan is banking on his value to the team, we will see who caves.
What is Dolan going to do? It isn't about money, it's about cap space. Dolan can't just raise my optimum rates to give us more space.

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09-24-2013, 08:53 AM
  #132
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You can interpret it any which way you want but some people on these boards(like me) see Stepan for what he truly is "a really nice homegrown player who just happens to be the #1 center on a team with very mediocre centers."

He isn't anywhere near the Giroux's, Duchenes, Coutures, and about another 20+ centers in the league and he wouldn't be any better than a 2nd line center on most teams and a 3rd line center on some other teams.

In my mind, 6 mil for 2 years is more than a fair contract offer for Stepan.
You tried that "3rd line center on many teams" bit last season when he was in a slump, and then he went on to lead the team in scoring. You don't "just happen" to score at nearly a PPG clip. You don't "just happen" to develop a high-level two-way game. You don't "just happen" to increase your PPG production year over year as a 23 year old.

See, the problem is you think this kid elevated his game to a #1C level simply because there were no other options. That's delusional. We've had plenty of players that were our "#1C by default" over the years, and none of them have had the impact or the success that Stepan has. It's typical "everyone else has it better" Rangers' fan bitterness. Nothing more.

I'll start taking your word on Stepan when he stops blowing the doors off your 'scouting report' each season.

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09-24-2013, 09:02 AM
  #133
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Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
It's typical "everyone else has it better" Rangers' fan bitterness. Nothing more.
Hey, don't be jealous of Florida and their GOAT center in Jonathan Huberdeau

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09-24-2013, 09:03 AM
  #134
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I'm not going to bash Stepan because I understand that it's his right to try and get what HE FEELS he is worth. I AM on the other hand going to bash the people acting like Stepan is a proven #1 Center in this league when in reality he has only played like one for one half season. I'm not as sold on D-Step as seemingly everyone else on this board is. I think he's a very smart and responsible player with vision and skill, but he hasn't proven that he can be THAT player consistently over 82 games and his previous point totals speak to that.

It's just ridiculous to see people acting like he's a bonafide #1 C when the only reason he was in that position last season is because our actual proven #1 C was playing like a piece of poop all season.

And I'm saying this while Step is one of my favorite players in the league.
I think people saying "he was our #1C because we didn't have better options" is just as ridiculous as people claiming he's a guaranteed #1C. Perhaps even more so.

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09-24-2013, 09:09 AM
  #135
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Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
I think people saying "he was our #1C because we didn't have better options" is just as ridiculous as people claiming he's a guaranteed #1C. Perhaps even more so.
Maybe that's putting it a too harshly, but it's pretty much true. He's not a #1C on most other teams. Plus the guy is new to the league, he hasn't proven anything yet. $6M over two or close to that is a really fair deal. His agent has really bloated this guy's ego if he's not careful he's going to be taken down a notch for 12 months

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09-24-2013, 09:14 AM
  #136
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Originally Posted by GordonGecko View Post
Maybe that's putting it a too harshly, but it's pretty much true. He's not a #1C on most other teams.
Well, I count 11 teams where he's easily the number 1 center, including ours, and another 5 where he would be competing for that spot, based on his play for most of last season. The problem is that we don't yet know if that's really what he is or not.

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09-24-2013, 09:23 AM
  #137
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Originally Posted by GordonGecko View Post
Maybe that's putting it a too harshly, but it's pretty much true. He's not a #1C on most other teams. Plus the guy is new to the league, he hasn't proven anything yet. $6M over two or close to that is a really fair deal. His agent has really bloated this guy's ego if he's not careful he's going to be taken down a notch for 12 months
If last season is indicative of his future production, then I think he's a number one center on about half the teams in the league.

EDIT: He'd at least be competing for the number one spot on half the teams in the league.

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Old
09-24-2013, 09:28 AM
  #138
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The funny thing is that the player Stepan appears to be developing into reminds me significantly of the player Brad Richards used to be - not physically dominant like a Crosby or a Malkin who takes over the flow of a game, but a skilled, cerebral, clutch player who puts up a PPG in the context of the flow of the game, if that makes sense. Would I trade him for a Crosby or a Malkin? Of course. Is he - assuming he continues his development - a #1C? Of course.

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09-24-2013, 09:28 AM
  #139
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Originally Posted by GordonGecko View Post
Maybe that's putting it a too harshly, but it's pretty much true. He's not a #1C on most other teams. Plus the guy is new to the league, he hasn't proven anything yet. $6M over two or close to that is a really fair deal. His agent has really bloated this guy's ego if he's not careful he's going to be taken down a notch for 12 months
It's not true at all actually. It's just an incredibly simplistic and misinformed way of looking at things.

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09-24-2013, 09:30 AM
  #140
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The funny thing is that the player Stepan appears to be developing into reminds me significantly of the player Brad Richards used to be...
I honestly think he'll end up as a 75ish point, Patrice Bergeron kind of player. Unfortunately, the sad truth is that, even if he reaches that level every year, people will still refuse to call him a #1 center because he's "not really a PPG player".

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09-24-2013, 09:37 AM
  #141
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Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
I honestly think he'll end up as a 75ish point, Patrice Bergeron kind of player. Unfortunately, the sad truth is that, even if he reaches that level every year, people will still refuse to call him a #1 center because he's "not really a PPG player".
When and if he reaches that 75ish level (he hasn't yet, no matter how good the outlook), then we can start talking about him being a bona fide #1 center commanding the sort of money that comes with it

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09-24-2013, 09:41 AM
  #142
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When and if he reaches that 75ish level (he hasn't yet, no matter how good the outlook), then we can start talking about him being a bona fide #1 center commanding the sort of money that comes with it
I think it's pretty clear people are already talking about the money. Fortunately for me, I'm not one of those people.

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09-24-2013, 09:45 AM
  #143
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Originally Posted by Fanned On It View Post
I'm not going to bash Stepan because I understand that it's his right to try and get what HE FEELS he is worth. I AM on the other hand going to bash the people acting like Stepan is a proven #1 Center in this league when in reality he has only played like one for one half season. I'm not as sold on D-Step as seemingly everyone else on this board is. I think he's a very smart and responsible player with vision and skill, but he hasn't proven that he can be THAT player consistently over 82 games and his previous point totals speak to that.

It's just ridiculous to see people acting like he's a bonafide #1 C when the only reason he was in that position last season is because our actual proven #1 C was playing like a piece of poop all season.

And I'm saying this while Step is one of my favorite players in the league.
Compare him to other 1C's and include the fact that he only played at a high level for less than half a season (he was not good at all the first 10 or so games last year and it was very concerning b/c he really barely improved on his rookie year up until that point.) This is what you did so good job. I will disagree with the "only" reason. The fact that he did massively, FINALLY improve his game also allowed him to take that spot.

Unfortunately many people are blind to these facts or have forgotten them for some reason. They are not being honest. They feel that he will continue to develop and be worth the money but they aren't saying just that and are coming off as fairly biased and inaccurate. This is likely so they can manage to blindly defend their stance and win internet debates. Unfortunately you stopped to their level a little here


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09-24-2013, 09:49 AM
  #144
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What is Dolan going to do? It isn't about money, it's about cap space. Dolan can't just raise my optimum rates to give us more space.
That was freakin funny

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09-24-2013, 09:53 AM
  #145
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Well, I count 11 teams where he's easily the number 1 center, including ours, and another 5 where he would be competing for that spot, based on his play for most of last season. The problem is that we don't yet know if that's really what he is or not.
True, but its not like the sides are 4-5 years and 10's of millions of dollars apart. Thats what makes this stalemate so strange.

Sather makes multi-million dollar mistakes in his sleep. Drawing a hard line in the sand here, over a few hundred thousand bucks on a 2 year deal is bizarre.

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09-24-2013, 09:57 AM
  #146
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True, but its not like the sides are 4-5 years and 10's of millions of dollars apart. Thats what makes this stalemate so strange.

Sather makes multi-million dollar mistakes in his sleep. Drawing a hard line in the sand here, over a few hundred thousand bucks on a 2 year deal is bizarre.
Yeah, I agree. I keep saying it. $3.5m is not unreasonable for this player. Makes you wonder if maybe Oates/Stepan dropped to that number too quickly and now it's just a matter of Sather not wanting to accept the player's offer.

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09-24-2013, 09:57 AM
  #147
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I honestly think he'll end up as a 75ish point, Patrice Bergeron kind of player. Unfortunately, the sad truth is that, even if he reaches that level every year, people will still refuse to call him a #1 center because he's "not really a PPG player".
A lot of hockey fans are either stuck in the wild west days of the 80's or in video games.

PPG players are few and far between these days, and they're certainly not the benchmark for a #1 center anymore.

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09-24-2013, 09:59 AM
  #148
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Yeah, I agree. I keep saying it. $3.5m is not unreasonable for this player. Makes you wonder if maybe Oates/Stepan dropped to that number too quickly and now it's just a matter of Sather not wanting to accept the player's offer.
Stepan seems like good kid. The only thing I can come up with is Sather is entrenched in some sort of power play with Stepan's agent.

In the end, it deprives the Rangers of their best center over a few hundred grand. Doesn't make sense at all for any side.

I think Stepan cracks before the start of the season, but it never should've come to this.

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09-24-2013, 10:05 AM
  #149
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Stepan seems like good kid. The only thing I can come up with is Sather is entrenched in some sort of power play with Stepan's agent.

In the end, it deprives the Rangers of their best center over a few hundred grand. Doesn't make sense at all for any side.

I think Stepan cracks before the start of the season, but it never should've come to this.
Yeah, it's pretty strange. It's so strange that you and I are the ones having a calm reasonable conversation about it in this thread.

The interview with Sather was very interesting last night. A lot of the way that some of us talk about the business side of the sport was reinforced by Sather. Especially the frustration with other teams skipping the bridge deal, which he calls the gap deal. He came across as a curmudgeon, but the meat of what he was saying was pretty on point.

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09-24-2013, 10:05 AM
  #150
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Maybe he hasnt proven that he is a elite number 1 center on most teams or at all because of sample size. He is 100% our Number 1 center though especially after watching Richards again last night.
But then he is a very solid 2nd line center throughout the League and here are the other 2nd line centers in the league with salaries. I get it that he is not Arb eligible so he will not get his true value but at least he has a little bit of a reason to feel mistreated especially after the ridiculous statements by his GM in the press.

Det S. Weiss 4.5
Bos Krejci 5.25, Bergeron 5, C. Kelly 3
Phi Lecavalier 4.5
SJ Pavelski 4
LAK carter 5.25 J stoll 3rd line 3.2
WAS Laich 4.5
EDM Gagner 4.8
STL Roy 4
TOR Bozak 4.2
Car J. Staal 6
MTL desharnais 3.5
CBJ Anisimov 3.3
Van Keslar 5
WPG Jokinen 4.5
Dal Peverly 3.25
TB Fillipula 5
MIN Pominville 4.5
ANA Koivu 3.5

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